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Re: [ImmigrationQuebec] Visa issued - then what's next ?

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  • Ravi Rao
    On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:43:00 -0000, ducthanhcanada ... Yes, I am here. Read the archives -- gokul posted about this, and I don t see why I should re-post.
    Message 1 of 11 , Dec 11, 2004
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      On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:43:00 -0000, ducthanhcanada
      <ducthanhcanada@...> wrote:

      > Could someone describe the steps that I need to do after the PR visa
      > issued. Experience appreciated ! Ravi, are you still there ?

      Yes, I am here. Read the archives -- gokul posted about this, and I
      don't see why I should re-post. Infact, I recall posting about my
      landing experiences too. In any case, there's nothing special to be
      done. Go to the border and come back in. That's all the landing
      process is about. It would help to carry updated bank statements, and
      certainly, your CSQ.

      If you have specific questions, ask. Yes, I am here, and yes, I read
      most every message except I have grown tired of answering FAQ. I would
      have ignored this message if you didn't mention my name. Questions
      that have been already answered won't get any more responses or
      answers from me. The search feature (on top of list archives) on
      Yahoo! Groups exists for a reason -- please use it.

      cheers,
      --ravi.
    • ducthanhcanada
      If you don t like for name calling, then sorry and it won t happen again ... I was asking about the steps following the issued visa to settle down : like heath
      Message 2 of 11 , Dec 12, 2004
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        If you don't like for name calling, then sorry and it won't happen
        again ...

        I was asking about the steps following the issued visa to settle
        down : like heath care and other benefit ...

        The way you answer isn't helpful and impolite. Being smart doesn't
        mean making others look stupid. I darn know "basic internet for
        dummy". And yes, I did search. If you want to make any assumption,
        please don't.

        About you are tired or not, basically I don't care. Just ignore the
        message if you don't want to answer or send me an email about the
        name calling. I also contribute advices to this mailing list as well.

        That's it. If you want to talk more about this, send me email at
        ducthanhcanada@...


        --- In immigrationquebec@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Rao <ravi.rao@g...>
        wrote:
        > On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:43:00 -0000, ducthanhcanada
        > <ducthanhcanada@y...> wrote:
        >
        > > Could someone describe the steps that I need to do after the PR
        visa
        > > issued. Experience appreciated ! Ravi, are you still there ?
        >
        > Yes, I am here. Read the archives -- gokul posted about this, and I
        > don't see why I should re-post. Infact, I recall posting about my
        > landing experiences too. In any case, there's nothing special to be
        > done. Go to the border and come back in. That's all the landing
        > process is about. It would help to carry updated bank statements,
        and
        > certainly, your CSQ.
        >
        > If you have specific questions, ask. Yes, I am here, and yes, I read
        > most every message except I have grown tired of answering FAQ. I
        would
        > have ignored this message if you didn't mention my name. Questions
        > that have been already answered won't get any more responses or
        > answers from me. The search feature (on top of list archives) on
        > Yahoo! Groups exists for a reason -- please use it.
        >
        > cheers,
        > --ravi.
      • Wesley Cannon
        I do agree with Ducthanhcanada, Ravi. Your message below does kind of sound like a I-am-holier-than-thou sermon. Your reply sounds like we should bow down
        Message 3 of 11 , Dec 12, 2004
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          I do agree with Ducthanhcanada, Ravi. Your message
          below does kind of sound like a
          "I-am-holier-than-thou" sermon. Your reply sounds
          like we should bow down and be thankful for whenever
          you decide to grace us with your advice! You must
          take heart to know that you were one of these same
          people who were just starting out in this immigration
          process not too long ago. I do remember Gokul and I
          having our confrontations on the same topic. However,
          I was in your shoes. I had the same view point of you
          and he called me on it. I saw that I may have been a
          little harsh. Sometimes we don't see it until someone
          else points it out to us. I am not attacking you,
          but I must say that your message was quite arrogant.

          In the future, I would suggest you do as
          Ducthanhcanada suggests below. If you are irritated
          that someone has asked something already posted, or
          you just aren't in the "mood" to respond, it is better
          not to say anything at all. Yes, I had the same
          complaint a while back about people not doing their
          research before coming to the group and asking
          questions that already been addressed. But, I
          realized that it makes people feel better to post and
          get a response. The FAQs can be quite inpersonal and
          to have a nother person physically respond to you is
          awesome. So, just try to view it that way.

          Don't forget where you came from. And anyways, it's
          the holidays; be a little cheerful:)

          Again, I am not attacking you Ravi, I just wanted to
          support Ducthanhcanada on this because when I read
          your posting I was kind of taken aback by its
          harshness.

          Good luck to all.

          Wes
          --- ducthanhcanada <ducthanhcanada@...> wrote:

          >
          > If you don't like for name calling, then sorry and
          > it won't happen
          > again ...
          >
          > I was asking about the steps following the issued
          > visa to settle
          > down : like heath care and other benefit ...
          >
          > The way you answer isn't helpful and impolite. Being
          > smart doesn't
          > mean making others look stupid. I darn know "basic
          > internet for
          > dummy". And yes, I did search. If you want to make
          > any assumption,
          > please don't.
          >
          > About you are tired or not, basically I don't care.
          > Just ignore the
          > message if you don't want to answer or send me an
          > email about the
          > name calling. I also contribute advices to this
          > mailing list as well.
          >
          > That's it. If you want to talk more about this, send
          > me email at
          > ducthanhcanada@...
          >
          >
          > --- In immigrationquebec@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Rao
          > <ravi.rao@g...>
          > wrote:
          > > On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:43:00 -0000, ducthanhcanada
          > > <ducthanhcanada@y...> wrote:
          > >
          > > > Could someone describe the steps that I need to
          > do after the PR
          > visa
          > > > issued. Experience appreciated ! Ravi, are you
          > still there ?
          > >
          > > Yes, I am here. Read the archives -- gokul posted
          > about this, and I
          > > don't see why I should re-post. Infact, I recall
          > posting about my
          > > landing experiences too. In any case, there's
          > nothing special to be
          > > done. Go to the border and come back in. That's
          > all the landing
          > > process is about. It would help to carry updated
          > bank statements,
          > and
          > > certainly, your CSQ.
          > >
          > > If you have specific questions, ask. Yes, I am
          > here, and yes, I read
          > > most every message except I have grown tired of
          > answering FAQ. I
          > would
          > > have ignored this message if you didn't mention my
          > name. Questions
          > > that have been already answered won't get any more
          > responses or
          > > answers from me. The search feature (on top of
          > list archives) on
          > > Yahoo! Groups exists for a reason -- please use
          > it.
          > >
          > > cheers,
          > > --ravi.
          >
          >
          >
          >




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        • Ravi Rao
          On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:14:50 -0000, ducthanhcanada ... And what you said was: Could someone describe the steps that I need to do after the PR visa issued.
          Message 4 of 11 , Dec 13, 2004
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            On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:14:50 -0000, ducthanhcanada
            <ducthanhcanada@...> wrote:

            > I was asking about the steps following the issued visa to settle
            > down : like heath care and other benefit ...

            And what you said was: "Could someone describe the steps that I need
            to do after the PR visa issued." ==> the next step to me naturally, is
            the landing process. You cannot get health care or whatever before
            landing. So how am I supposed to read your mind? You cannot spend 5
            minutes to write a clear email or look at the RAMQ website (which is
            also available in english if you don't speak enough french) ... yet
            you want me to read your mind? That is what annoys me.

            If you ask a specific question, "What is the specific wait period to
            receive (a) coverage (b) health card in the mail , after registering
            with RAMQ?", I can give you a one line response, "2 months + delta to
            both" ... but your question is something that I could write a 20 page
            document as a response to. "what should i do after visa is issued" can
            address 20 different things. That is the problem - you ask a specific
            question, you get a specific answer. You ask a general "essay type
            question", you don't get an answer.

            Again, to re-iterate, *all* of this (post-visa, pre-landing,
            post-landing stuff like RAMQ/blah blah) are *all* previously
            discussed. If you want to challenge me, I will spend an hour and find
            them in the archives. I am 100% sure they are in the archives because
            I asked the same questions and updated the databases etc. and sent in
            my input on stuff too.


            > The way you answer isn't helpful and impolite. Being smart doesn't

            Impolite: Yes, I agree and I apologize.
            Helpful: Disagree. I am not your paid consultant to write a 20 page
            FAQ document. I told you very clearly that I will be happy to answer
            specific questions. Re-read my response:

            "If you have specific questions, ask. Yes, I am here, and yes, I read
            most every message except I have grown tired of answering FAQ."

            I *did* offer to help, and I *again* offer to help.

            Tell me honestly, if someone said to you, "How do I become a permanent
            resident of canada?" what would your response be? I would just say,
            "go start at www.cic.gc.ca and at immigration-quebec if you want to go
            to quebec and come back with specific questions" but never anything
            like "ok, step 1, fill out IMM-008" ... maybe that's what you do, but
            I don't. I just dont have the time for stuff like that.

            > mean making others look stupid. I darn know "basic internet for

            Sorry - it is not my problem if you choose to read more than what I
            write. I just said, "look, I'm busy, and I dont have the energy to
            answer an FAQ with no specific question it, but I STILL OFFER TO
            ANSWER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS" and yet you want to read malice and
            mal-intention. I don't know what to say.

            > About you are tired or not, basically I don't care. Just ignore the
            > message if you don't want to answer or send me an email about the
            > name calling. I also contribute advices to this mailing list as well.

            What name calling? Do you want to back this up and cite an instance,
            quote me where I called you (or anyone else) any names in this thread?

            > That's it. If you want to talk more about this, send me email at
            > ducthanhcanada@...

            No, I don't take orders from anyone. If you re-read my first response,
            you will notice the usage of "please" .... if you want to take this
            private, do so -- if you set a reply-to to the list address, then that
            is where I will send the response. The Reply-To header was invented
            for a reason -- let us please use it.

            --ravi.
          • Wesley Cannon
            You are right Ravi in that you should not feel like you should have to write a 20-page response to someone. I do believe that everyone should check in the
            Message 5 of 11 , Dec 13, 2004
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              You are right Ravi in that you should not feel like you should have to write a 20-page response to someone. I do believe that everyone should check in the archives because I am certain as well that there is a document or a pertinent response there.

              Take care Ravi.

              Wes

              Ravi Rao <ravi.rao@...> wrote:
              On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:14:50 -0000, ducthanhcanada
              <ducthanhcanada@...> wrote:

              > I was asking about the steps following the issued visa to settle
              > down : like heath care and other benefit ...

              And what you said was: "Could someone describe the steps that I need
              to do after the PR visa issued." ==> the next step to me naturally, is
              the landing process. You cannot get health care or whatever before
              landing. So how am I supposed to read your mind? You cannot spend 5
              minutes to write a clear email or look at the RAMQ website (which is
              also available in english if you don't speak enough french) ... yet
              you want me to read your mind? That is what annoys me.

              If you ask a specific question, "What is the specific wait period to
              receive (a) coverage (b) health card in the mail , after registering
              with RAMQ?", I can give you a one line response, "2 months + delta to
              both" ... but your question is something that I could write a 20 page
              document as a response to. "what should i do after visa is issued" can
              address 20 different things. That is the problem - you ask a specific
              question, you get a specific answer. You ask a general "essay type
              question", you don't get an answer.

              Again, to re-iterate, *all* of this (post-visa, pre-landing,
              post-landing stuff like RAMQ/blah blah) are *all* previously
              discussed. If you want to challenge me, I will spend an hour and find
              them in the archives. I am 100% sure they are in the archives because
              I asked the same questions and updated the databases etc. and sent in
              my input on stuff too.


              > The way you answer isn't helpful and impolite. Being smart doesn't

              Impolite: Yes, I agree and I apologize.
              Helpful: Disagree. I am not your paid consultant to write a 20 page
              FAQ document. I told you very clearly that I will be happy to answer
              specific questions. Re-read my response:

              "If you have specific questions, ask. Yes, I am here, and yes, I read
              most every message except I have grown tired of answering FAQ."

              I *did* offer to help, and I *again* offer to help.

              Tell me honestly, if someone said to you, "How do I become a permanent
              resident of canada?" what would your response be? I would just say,
              "go start at www.cic.gc.ca and at immigration-quebec if you want to go
              to quebec and come back with specific questions" but never anything
              like "ok, step 1, fill out IMM-008" ... maybe that's what you do, but
              I don't. I just dont have the time for stuff like that.

              > mean making others look stupid. I darn know "basic internet for

              Sorry - it is not my problem if you choose to read more than what I
              write. I just said, "look, I'm busy, and I dont have the energy to
              answer an FAQ with no specific question it, but I STILL OFFER TO
              ANSWER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS" and yet you want to read malice and
              mal-intention. I don't know what to say.

              > About you are tired or not, basically I don't care. Just ignore the
              > message if you don't want to answer or send me an email about the
              > name calling. I also contribute advices to this mailing list as well.

              What name calling? Do you want to back this up and cite an instance,
              quote me where I called you (or anyone else) any names in this thread?

              > That's it. If you want to talk more about this, send me email at
              > ducthanhcanada@...

              No, I don't take orders from anyone. If you re-read my first response,
              you will notice the usage of "please" .... if you want to take this
              private, do so -- if you set a reply-to to the list address, then that
              is where I will send the response. The Reply-To header was invented
              for a reason -- let us please use it.

              --ravi.

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            • Ravi Rao
              On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 18:42:48 -0800 (PST), Wesley Cannon ... So do I. I do NOT dispute that my message was arguable rude . Please, let us not waste time
              Message 6 of 11 , Dec 13, 2004
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                On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 18:42:48 -0800 (PST), Wesley Cannon
                <wncannon@...> wrote:

                > I do agree with Ducthanhcanada, Ravi. Your message
                > below does kind of sound like a
                > "I-am-holier-than-thou" sermon. Your reply sounds

                So do I. I do NOT dispute that my message was arguable "rude".

                Please, let us not waste time debating this, especially when I *agree* with you.

                > like we should bow down and be thankful for whenever
                > you decide to grace us with your advice! You must

                Hardly. I am only saying, "look, I am godamn busy, but I am still
                making an effort to stay here and respond to stuff which hasn't been
                responded here in the past" and it does NOT help me if people refuse
                to spend 5 minutes to do their background research.

                A prime example is the other thread in progress by "Prady Nilson"

                (s)he sent in a 6 line x 72 character email and at the end of it, I
                don't know who the "them" is, and yet I guess what *might* be the
                likely possibility and advice him/her accordingly. I said,

                QUOTE
                "them" ? If "them" == SIQ NY, well, bad idea. Re-send to MRCI at the
                Montreal office. The best way is to fax them, or go in person and
                submit a letter in an envelope with the security guy at the ground
                floor level at the MRCI office in Montreal."
                END QUOTE

                So where is the trouble? I said, if you applied to SIQ NY, then
                re-send a fax or go in person to MRCI Montreal" -- do any of you have
                any trouble understanding this english? Yet, prady nilson comes back
                and replies with it, "Oh, but I applied to SIQ NY"

                I mean - is this some kinda joke, or do people refuse to read their
                email or understand simple english? This is what freaks me out. This
                was exactly what ducthanhcanada was doing, albeit in a slightly
                different manner. Do you care to explain prady nilson's behavior here?
                How am I expected to respond? "Oh dear prady nilson, we all love you,
                and yes, I know you didn't read my response or understand it, but
                since I have nothing better to do with my time, I Am gonna tell you
                again to please go to MRCI Montreal and hand in a godamn transfer
                request EVEN THOUGH you applied to SIQ NY, like I correctly guessed
                the first time even with the limited useful information you
                transmitted in a one page email" ? Or what? Is that what you do? Is
                that what ducthanhcanada does? Ducthanhcanada claims (s)he also
                responds to list mail and answers question -- bullshit. The list
                archives are sufficient evidence against the same.

                > take heart to know that you were one of these same
                > people who were just starting out in this immigration
                > process not too long ago. I do remember Gokul and I

                What's your point?

                > In the future, I would suggest you do as
                > Ducthanhcanada suggests below. If you are irritated
                > that someone has asked something already posted, or
                > you just aren't in the "mood" to respond, it is better
                > not to say anything at all. Yes, I had the same

                I disagree. That is your point of view. Whether I am angry or not, to
                *ME* getting a "useful response" or a pointer in the right direction
                is more important. This is just a cultural difference. I pay more
                emphasis to being "useful" and "productive" and of course, you could
                argue I am focussing on the wrong things.

                > complaint a while back about people not doing their
                > research before coming to the group and asking
                > questions that already been addressed. But, I
                > realized that it makes people feel better to post and
                > get a response. The FAQs can be quite inpersonal and
                > to have a nother person physically respond to you is
                > awesome. So, just try to view it that way.

                Well, I understand what you mean. However, I just don't have the man
                hours. I am on over 20 mailing lists, maintain two full time jobs, am
                a full time student, and have a personal life outside of this.

                Think of it this way -- How difficult is it for me to be like Rich aka
                umkumiut00 and quit the list the day he gets his passport request? Do
                you see Rich here? Or Karen? Or Gokul? Or anyone else who was
                successful with their stuff? Did I or did I not give a "useful"
                response to prady nilson? If ducthanhcanada had the insight to ask a
                specific question, I would have saved the sermon and given a direct
                answer (assuming it wasn't answered on the FAQ). Instead, I am not
                about to type essay type answers, sorry.

                Finally, while I would like to have a hand-tailored response on every
                mailing list everyday, it just isn't possible. Please realize that I
                am also human, and write a polite email asking you to spend 2 minutes
                to read the archives before posting something on the list, and yet *I*
                get a personalized sermon giving me orders (ducthanhcanada tells me
                where to mail him, and you tell me to not forget where I come from) --
                what bullshit? Do I ever tell you to not forget where you come from?
                What's with all this preaching anyway?

                > Don't forget where you came from. And anyways, it's

                Oh, and that is? How exactly is this relevant and why are we getting
                into personal stuff here?

                > the holidays; be a little cheerful:)

                And that is to suggest it is OK to be an asshole outside of the
                holiday season? I would rather be a "friendly guy" all through the
                year or be an asshole all through the year. I don't enjoy "chameleon"
                like behavior, sorry.

                > Again, I am not attacking you Ravi, I just wanted to
                > support Ducthanhcanada on this because when I read
                > your posting I was kind of taken aback by its
                > harshness.

                Excellent. I give up trying to make sense of this whole thread.

                If you want me to leave, let me know and I will leave in peace.
                Seriously. How much ever you guys try, you cannot make me give you
                sugar-coated hand-tailored responses to 165 people subscribed to this
                list. It doesn't work that way. I am an engineer, and I am trained to
                read documentation before I ask the support system for help.
                Ducthanhcanada claims to be an engineer too -- if he is too busy to be
                bothered spending 2 minutes to read the godamn RAMQ website, I am
                equally busy to spend the extra 2 minutes to type a sugar coated
                response. My only response is, "go see the ramq website and ask a
                specific question if you dont get the answer"

                To all
                ====

                Anyways -- I guess you must all hate me enough for this and I only
                fear that my stay here can be counter-productive. I hate you guys
                getting personal. I have NEVER gotten personal, yet both of you who
                responded have. Why? If I was being an asshole, there was no reason
                why you should be one too, right? "Practice what you preach" comes to
                mind.

                So yeah, please have fun exchanging sugar-coated responses, and I
                sincerely wish you luck, whether you believe it or not. I do not carry
                any bad intentions. I am just busy, and too impatient with
                laziness/stupidity. If you are lazy and/or stupid, I refuse to help. I
                will be happy to check 3 months from now and see how many questions
                get hand-made responses and how many cases get told to look at a
                website ... and to also see how many of you stay on this mailing list
                answering questions after becoming immigrants ...


                --ravi, very tired, and very annoyed.
              • Wesley Cannon
                As I am busy as well, I will have to respond later. But, I must admit how your second email confirms the first. I want to add Ravi that I have respected your
                Message 7 of 11 , Dec 13, 2004
                • 0 Attachment
                  As I am busy as well, I will have to respond later. But, I must admit how your second email confirms the first.

                  I want to add Ravi that I have respected your input ever since joining this group. My email to you was not attacking you or making anything personal. I just felt the need to voice my concern over the tone of your email. That is all. I must stop here or else I will continue on and I haven't the time right now. I will address your questions later.

                  Till then...,
                  Wes

                  Ravi Rao <ravi.rao@...> wrote:
                  On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 18:42:48 -0800 (PST), Wesley Cannon
                  <wncannon@...> wrote:

                  > I do agree with Ducthanhcanada, Ravi. Your message
                  > below does kind of sound like a
                  > "I-am-holier-than-thou" sermon. Your reply sounds

                  So do I. I do NOT dispute that my message was arguable "rude".

                  Please, let us not waste time debating this, especially when I *agree* with you.

                  > like we should bow down and be thankful for whenever
                  > you decide to grace us with your advice! You must

                  Hardly. I am only saying, "look, I am godamn busy, but I am still
                  making an effort to stay here and respond to stuff which hasn't been
                  responded here in the past" and it does NOT help me if people refuse
                  to spend 5 minutes to do their background research.

                  A prime example is the other thread in progress by "Prady Nilson"

                  (s)he sent in a 6 line x 72 character email and at the end of it, I
                  don't know who the "them" is, and yet I guess what *might* be the
                  likely possibility and advice him/her accordingly. I said,

                  QUOTE
                  "them" ? If "them" == SIQ NY, well, bad idea. Re-send to MRCI at the
                  Montreal office. The best way is to fax them, or go in person and
                  submit a letter in an envelope with the security guy at the ground
                  floor level at the MRCI office in Montreal."
                  END QUOTE

                  So where is the trouble? I said, if you applied to SIQ NY, then
                  re-send a fax or go in person to MRCI Montreal" -- do any of you have
                  any trouble understanding this english? Yet, prady nilson comes back
                  and replies with it, "Oh, but I applied to SIQ NY"

                  I mean - is this some kinda joke, or do people refuse to read their
                  email or understand simple english? This is what freaks me out. This
                  was exactly what ducthanhcanada was doing, albeit in a slightly
                  different manner. Do you care to explain prady nilson's behavior here?
                  How am I expected to respond? "Oh dear prady nilson, we all love you,
                  and yes, I know you didn't read my response or understand it, but
                  since I have nothing better to do with my time, I Am gonna tell you
                  again to please go to MRCI Montreal and hand in a godamn transfer
                  request EVEN THOUGH you applied to SIQ NY, like I correctly guessed
                  the first time even with the limited useful information you
                  transmitted in a one page email" ? Or what? Is that what you do? Is
                  that what ducthanhcanada does? Ducthanhcanada claims (s)he also
                  responds to list mail and answers question -- bullshit. The list
                  archives are sufficient evidence against the same.

                  > take heart to know that you were one of these same
                  > people who were just starting out in this immigration
                  > process not too long ago. I do remember Gokul and I

                  What's your point?

                  > In the future, I would suggest you do as
                  > Ducthanhcanada suggests below. If you are irritated
                  > that someone has asked something already posted, or
                  > you just aren't in the "mood" to respond, it is better
                  > not to say anything at all. Yes, I had the same

                  I disagree. That is your point of view. Whether I am angry or not, to
                  *ME* getting a "useful response" or a pointer in the right direction
                  is more important. This is just a cultural difference. I pay more
                  emphasis to being "useful" and "productive" and of course, you could
                  argue I am focussing on the wrong things.

                  > complaint a while back about people not doing their
                  > research before coming to the group and asking
                  > questions that already been addressed. But, I
                  > realized that it makes people feel better to post and
                  > get a response. The FAQs can be quite inpersonal and
                  > to have a nother person physically respond to you is
                  > awesome. So, just try to view it that way.

                  Well, I understand what you mean. However, I just don't have the man
                  hours. I am on over 20 mailing lists, maintain two full time jobs, am
                  a full time student, and have a personal life outside of this.

                  Think of it this way -- How difficult is it for me to be like Rich aka
                  umkumiut00 and quit the list the day he gets his passport request? Do
                  you see Rich here? Or Karen? Or Gokul? Or anyone else who was
                  successful with their stuff? Did I or did I not give a "useful"
                  response to prady nilson? If ducthanhcanada had the insight to ask a
                  specific question, I would have saved the sermon and given a direct
                  answer (assuming it wasn't answered on the FAQ). Instead, I am not
                  about to type essay type answers, sorry.

                  Finally, while I would like to have a hand-tailored response on every
                  mailing list everyday, it just isn't possible. Please realize that I
                  am also human, and write a polite email asking you to spend 2 minutes
                  to read the archives before posting something on the list, and yet *I*
                  get a personalized sermon giving me orders (ducthanhcanada tells me
                  where to mail him, and you tell me to not forget where I come from) --
                  what bullshit? Do I ever tell you to not forget where you come from?
                  What's with all this preaching anyway?

                  > Don't forget where you came from. And anyways, it's

                  Oh, and that is? How exactly is this relevant and why are we getting
                  into personal stuff here?

                  > the holidays; be a little cheerful:)

                  And that is to suggest it is OK to be an asshole outside of the
                  holiday season? I would rather be a "friendly guy" all through the
                  year or be an asshole all through the year. I don't enjoy "chameleon"
                  like behavior, sorry.

                  > Again, I am not attacking you Ravi, I just wanted to
                  > support Ducthanhcanada on this because when I read
                  > your posting I was kind of taken aback by its
                  > harshness.

                  Excellent. I give up trying to make sense of this whole thread.

                  If you want me to leave, let me know and I will leave in peace.
                  Seriously. How much ever you guys try, you cannot make me give you
                  sugar-coated hand-tailored responses to 165 people subscribed to this
                  list. It doesn't work that way. I am an engineer, and I am trained to
                  read documentation before I ask the support system for help.
                  Ducthanhcanada claims to be an engineer too -- if he is too busy to be
                  bothered spending 2 minutes to read the godamn RAMQ website, I am
                  equally busy to spend the extra 2 minutes to type a sugar coated
                  response. My only response is, "go see the ramq website and ask a
                  specific question if you dont get the answer"

                  To all
                  ====

                  Anyways -- I guess you must all hate me enough for this and I only
                  fear that my stay here can be counter-productive. I hate you guys
                  getting personal. I have NEVER gotten personal, yet both of you who
                  responded have. Why? If I was being an asshole, there was no reason
                  why you should be one too, right? "Practice what you preach" comes to
                  mind.

                  So yeah, please have fun exchanging sugar-coated responses, and I
                  sincerely wish you luck, whether you believe it or not. I do not carry
                  any bad intentions. I am just busy, and too impatient with
                  laziness/stupidity. If you are lazy and/or stupid, I refuse to help. I
                  will be happy to check 3 months from now and see how many questions
                  get hand-made responses and how many cases get told to look at a
                  website ... and to also see how many of you stay on this mailing list
                  answering questions after becoming immigrants ...


                  --ravi, very tired, and very annoyed.

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                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • ducthanhcanada
                  Thanks for the response. I ve received advices from people before me, including you. And I would help other after me in the same way. That s all I want to say
                  Message 8 of 11 , Dec 13, 2004
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                    Thanks for the response.

                    I've received advices from people before me, including you. And I
                    would help other after me in the same way. That's all I want to say
                    for now.

                    --- In immigrationquebec@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Rao <ravi.rao@g...>
                    wrote:
                    > On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:14:50 -0000, ducthanhcanada
                    > <ducthanhcanada@y...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > I was asking about the steps following the issued visa to settle
                    > > down : like heath care and other benefit ...
                    >
                    > And what you said was: "Could someone describe the steps that I need
                    > to do after the PR visa issued." ==> the next step to me naturally,
                    is
                    > the landing process. You cannot get health care or whatever before
                    > landing. So how am I supposed to read your mind? You cannot spend 5
                    > minutes to write a clear email or look at the RAMQ website (which is
                    > also available in english if you don't speak enough french) ... yet
                    > you want me to read your mind? That is what annoys me.
                    >
                    > If you ask a specific question, "What is the specific wait period to
                    > receive (a) coverage (b) health card in the mail , after registering
                    > with RAMQ?", I can give you a one line response, "2 months + delta
                    to
                    > both" ... but your question is something that I could write a 20
                    page
                    > document as a response to. "what should i do after visa is issued"
                    can
                    > address 20 different things. That is the problem - you ask a
                    specific
                    > question, you get a specific answer. You ask a general "essay type
                    > question", you don't get an answer.
                    >
                    > Again, to re-iterate, *all* of this (post-visa, pre-landing,
                    > post-landing stuff like RAMQ/blah blah) are *all* previously
                    > discussed. If you want to challenge me, I will spend an hour and
                    find
                    > them in the archives. I am 100% sure they are in the archives
                    because
                    > I asked the same questions and updated the databases etc. and sent
                    in
                    > my input on stuff too.
                    >
                    >
                    > > The way you answer isn't helpful and impolite. Being smart doesn't
                    >
                    > Impolite: Yes, I agree and I apologize.
                    > Helpful: Disagree. I am not your paid consultant to write a 20 page
                    > FAQ document. I told you very clearly that I will be happy to answer
                    > specific questions. Re-read my response:
                    >
                    > "If you have specific questions, ask. Yes, I am here, and yes, I
                    read
                    > most every message except I have grown tired of answering FAQ."
                    >
                    > I *did* offer to help, and I *again* offer to help.
                    >
                    > Tell me honestly, if someone said to you, "How do I become a
                    permanent
                    > resident of canada?" what would your response be? I would just say,
                    > "go start at www.cic.gc.ca and at immigration-quebec if you want to
                    go
                    > to quebec and come back with specific questions" but never anything
                    > like "ok, step 1, fill out IMM-008" ... maybe that's what you do,
                    but
                    > I don't. I just dont have the time for stuff like that.
                    >
                    > > mean making others look stupid. I darn know "basic internet for
                    >
                    > Sorry - it is not my problem if you choose to read more than what I
                    > write. I just said, "look, I'm busy, and I dont have the energy to
                    > answer an FAQ with no specific question it, but I STILL OFFER TO
                    > ANSWER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS" and yet you want to read malice and
                    > mal-intention. I don't know what to say.
                    >
                    > > About you are tired or not, basically I don't care. Just ignore
                    the
                    > > message if you don't want to answer or send me an email about the
                    > > name calling. I also contribute advices to this mailing list as
                    well.
                    >
                    > What name calling? Do you want to back this up and cite an
                    instance,
                    > quote me where I called you (or anyone else) any names in this
                    thread?
                    >
                    > > That's it. If you want to talk more about this, send me email at
                    > > ducthanhcanada@y...
                    >
                    > No, I don't take orders from anyone. If you re-read my first
                    response,
                    > you will notice the usage of "please" .... if you want to take this
                    > private, do so -- if you set a reply-to to the list address, then
                    that
                    > is where I will send the response. The Reply-To header was invented
                    > for a reason -- let us please use it.
                    >
                    > --ravi.
                  • Naughty Jimmy
                    ... Gentlemen, Please calm down and stop quarrelling over this. Ravi, please don t quit this mailing list, as I m sure your advice is appreciated by everyone
                    Message 9 of 11 , Dec 17, 2004
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                      > sincerely wish you luck, whether you believe it or not. I do not carry
                      > any bad intentions. I am just busy, and too impatient with
                      > laziness/stupidity. If you are lazy and/or stupid, I refuse to help. I
                      > will be happy to check 3 months from now and see how many questions
                      > get hand-made responses and how many cases get told to look at a
                      > website ... and to also see how many of you stay on this mailing list
                      > answering questions after becoming immigrants ...
                      >
                      >
                      > --ravi, very tired, and very annoyed.



                      Gentlemen,


                      Please calm down and stop quarrelling over this.

                      Ravi, please don't quit this mailing list, as I'm sure your advice is
                      appreciated by everyone including Wesley and Ducthanhcanada!

                      We should all post messages calmly and politely in this group as wise
                      men would do!


                      Cheers,

                      Jimmy
                    • Ravi Rao
                      On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 12:00:25 -0000, Naughty Jimmy ... Some wise man once said, Never ruin an apology with an excuse , and I will try to abide by that. I
                      Message 10 of 11 , Dec 17, 2004
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                        On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 12:00:25 -0000, Naughty Jimmy
                        <anxiousman80@...> wrote:

                        > Ravi, please don't quit this mailing list, as I'm sure your advice is
                        > appreciated by everyone including Wesley and Ducthanhcanada!

                        Some wise man once said, "Never ruin an apology with an excuse", and I
                        will try to abide by that. I realize that I might have hurt one or
                        more people in this exchange over the past couple days, and I regret
                        that. My intention was never to hurt anyone, but to help, and I am
                        glad that atleast some of you recognized it correctly. I also realized
                        that the internet and the written medium are only so effective as a
                        means of communication.

                        I believe that this group has been exceedingly nice and friendly in
                        the past, and that remains the spirit of the group. I have tried to be
                        a part of this, except that in the past few days I realized that from
                        a completely neutral standpoint, my words were not exactly "kind".
                        While I am disappointed that many people were quick to assume malice
                        and mal-intent, I also recognize that from a third-person perspective,
                        I would probably place the fault on me having been the guy to initiate
                        the exchange. I think it is only correct at this point that I
                        apologize for hurting any feelings and thus I do so.

                        I also realize that it is impossible for me to "reform" overnight. I
                        have my own writing stye, for good or for bad, and I cannot thus
                        guarantee that I will write "pleasantly" for the rest of my life, and
                        since that is in direct contravention of this group's interests, I
                        think it is only a direct consequence that I should leave this group.
                        [Note to self: stay off public lists] I feel even more a "weight" and
                        "burden" being a moderator - I don't want onlookers to think that the
                        "official" people running this list are rude. That is absolutely false
                        (except probably in my case). Besides, as someone pointed out, it is
                        not like I have something insanely useful to contribute.

                        In summary, I wish you guys luck and success, and speedy processing in
                        your cases. I bid you farewell at this point, and thank you for making
                        my ride here enjoyable and fun. In case you had any thing to tell me,
                        please Cc: me at my address because I will be off this list in a few
                        more seconds. And yes, Quebec is definitely worth it. Don't lose hope,
                        and do go all the way. This is a wonderful province in a wonderful
                        country and I am sure you guys will enjoy this place as much as I do.

                        Cheers,

                        --ravi.
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