[Illuminati New World Order] Re: Dead dead dead
> Personally I don't think that any of the cards were broken (thoughWell, I guess it wasn't that they wewre broken, it's that they
> there is a very powerful plotr or two) - and I actually like a lot
> of the cards for what they do. It would just have been so much
> cooler if they hadn't been CotSG-based.
> My INWO friends dislike the cards for being nonsensical and
> decidedly unfunny. We all got into INWO because of the whole
> political satire thing, and CotSG definately isn't it.
were...well boring. Aside from about maybe 10%-15% of the cards,
most of the Plots and Groups were simple rehashes of cards that are
already made. This, of course, was necessary since CotSG was a
standalone game, so stuff like "Murphy's Law" was translated into a
different CotSB-based card with the same ability (and, usually, a
slightly different cost). Yes, the primary selling point of INWO
(and, I might add, Illuminati) was the political satire. And CotSG
> Mind you, we weren't too fond of the assassins set either. We allActually, aside from the "broken" cards, Assassins was welcome in
> love group based decks, and Assassins had few interesting groups -
> and none of them common. And the common plots weren't even that
> Zaps, paralyzes, freezes? ZZzzzZZ Zzz!
our group, because it filled in a few gaps and left a lot of new
options. I do wish, like you, of course, that more Groups were
added, though I'm also glad they weren't Common (I have enough
copies of the Telephone Psychics, thank you, and I don't need an
equal number of Swingers).
I, personally, like Zaps, Freezes, and Paralysises (eses?) but find
they're too expensive to power. If a few more Plot cards/special
abilities allowed different ways to power these types of cards, I
think they'd be viable.
> My dream expansion would contain this in 1 box:I agree. And I know plenty that will shell out the cash for such a
> The 100 BFD cards
> The 100 Assassins cards
> The ~15 German Uniques
set. Likewise, I don't mind if they add CotSB cards, but I'd only
welcome them if they were "translated"--i.e., they were converted
from CotSB to political satire, which, quite frankly, wouldn't be
*that* hard to do. As much as I dislike CotSB, there *were* a few
good cards in the set.
- Hi again,
I went ahead and created a list of which CotSG cards I consider to be
worth keeping/translating. I posted it to the INWO list so as not to
run the discussion in 2 places. I hope you are on the list too.
Everyone is welcome to give feedback or create their own list.
If you are not on the inwo mailing list, then you can see past
- Dear Martin,
Okay, it has taken me several minutes to back-trace this message
topic to find this one message that spells out what the "BFD deck"
is. (I thought it might be the Big F*ing Deck, but that is the One
With Everything- grin.) For clarity's sake, maybe we could all agree
to avoid using initials that refer back to messages from 7 months
ago? Please !
I called myself keeping up with all the rumors about INWO and
Illuminati the game, and I had never heard of the Bavarian Fire Drill
deck. It does appear that there is a new INWO-based deck coming out
(see the SJ Games website) - but nothing is said about BFD. What can
you tell us (me) about it?
And, no, the game is not "dead" -- it just requires a certain
awareness of politics for the satire to be meaningful, and a certain
twisted mentality to get the jokes. In short, it is not for the
average "rule player" gamer, nor for the MTV-generation computer
gamer who expects lights, bells, whistles, and impossibly-built-yet-
scantily-clad females in their games.
-- Tim G in Memphis, the land of dead and living Kings and Pyramids,
an Illuminati player since 1985 or so
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, plasmoid_dk
> Hi all,
> is it just me or is INWO finally dead in the water.
> Was it because Assassins was weak?
> Was it because SubGenius was worse?
> Was it because Bavarian Fire Drill never came out?
> Or was it simply because the learning curve was too steep?
> You tell me,
> if anyone is still here that is :/
> It does appear that there is a new INWO-based deck coming outcan
> (see the SJ Games website) - but nothing is said about BFD. What
> you tell us (me) about it?The game promoted on the INWO home page is Illuminati: Crime Lords,
which is not compatible with either Illuminati or INWO. It is
designed as a standalone game, much like the horrid SubGenius, and
it uses many of the same mechanics as Illuminati and INWO, but it is
an entirely different game.
There *is* a page for BFD, but it's less than informative:
Also, Steve Jackson has gone on record stating that INWO is no
longer being actively supported. Granted, Deluxe INWO came out after
he said that, so perhaps the interest in Deluxe INWO will tell him
whether it's worth releasing BFD. (Deluxe INWO is, in fact, out of
print, and did so in what seems to be a short amount of time.
Whether that is due to hightened interest or a simple clearing out
of the existing stock, I don't know.)
> And, no, the game is not "dead" -- it just requires a certaincertain
> awareness of politics for the satire to be meaningful, and a
> twisted mentality to get the jokes. In short, it is not for theyet-
> average "rule player" gamer, nor for the MTV-generation computer
> gamer who expects lights, bells, whistles, and impossibly-built-
> scantily-clad females in their games.I'll say it's one of the most intelligent games out there, and yet
still fun...which might be part of its apparent lull. It's good
social satire, but it can be dated, and the cards desperately need
to be updated to keep it fresh. Unfortunately, the market draw
of "updating" the cards is largely expensive for a game with such a
dwindling fan base.
Although I still expect impossible-built-yet-scandily-clad females
in all of my games.
- Hi Smac,
>Deluxe INWO is, in fact, out of print, and did so in what seems toWhat? Aw man :/
>be a short amount of time.
I recently sold an INWO article to Pyramid and decided to get paid
in store credit just to get Deluxe INWO. Then they sat on my voucher
for a few months, and now you're telling me it's out of print.
- --- In email@example.com, plasmoid_dk
> Hi again,be
> I went ahead and created a list of which CotSG cards I consider to
> worth keeping/translating. I posted it to the INWO list so as notto
> run the discussion in 2 places. I hope you are on the list too.Thanks, Martin. I agree mostly with your choices with cards to keep,
> Everyone is welcome to give feedback or create their own list.
> If you are not on the inwo mailing list, then you can see past
> messages here:
> Martin :)
though personally I would just drop the SubGenius attribute and all
cards that deal directly with just affecting SubGenius groups.
"Translating" the cards are a bit harder than I thought, especially
if we're trying to keep the same Power/Alignments/Attributes/etc. I
have made a few changes, but not many, and I've noted these changes
and other alternate ideas below the cards.
I'm certainly not going to do each one--in fact, below are only six.
I'll leave you all to do the others.) By no means are
these "translations" all that good--I did it in about ten minutes
pretty much off the top of my head--so please add your own ideas,
Text: If an attack to destroy against this group succeeds, they are
returned to the owning player's hand and do not count as destroyed.
Arrows: L, R, B
[This was turned into a Place; the Xists are an Organization. This
makes its large Power (this group has the largest Global Power for
an Organization except for the Democrats) a little bit weaker,
though quite frankly it's still out of proportion. I would lower it
to maybe 3/3 and give it an actual useful ability.]
Name: Church of Middle America (same title)
Text: Any Straight or Conservative group that directly controls the
Church of Middle America gets +2 to its Power (and Global Power, if
it already had it).
Alignments: Straight, Conservative, Peaceful
Arrows: L, R
Name: Blogs (replaces Divine Mail Order)
Text: You may spend its action to draw a Plot card. You may spend
its action, along with an Illuminati action, to draw three Plot
Attributes: Media, Computer
Arrows: L, R, B
[Added the Computer attribute. www.subgenius.com would seem to be a
better "translation," but since that card's special ability is
already duplicated in the original INWO I don't see much of a need
to translate it. I thought about "Daily Newspapers" as an
alternative but it didn't seem conspiratorial enough to suggest,
though it could work like the Local Police Departments and be unable
to be destroyed.]
Name: Raeliens (replaces League for Obvious Decency)
Text: By spending their action, you may force a player to return two
exposed Plots to the top of the owning player's Plot deck.
Alignments: Weird, Conservative
[They should probably also be Church. I'm not sure if I would
consider them Conservative, either, though they are definitely
Weird. This group should have a better special ability, though.]
Name: Utah (replaces Speakers in Tongues)
Text: You get a +3 for any attempt to control a Church group.
Alignments: Weird, Conservative, Fanatic
[This was also turned into a Place. I'm not sure if I would consider
Utah "Weird" though, and I hesitate to just make the Group
the "Mormons". I can't think of any popular religion that would have
a wide enough influence to grant a bonus to any attempt to control a
Church but that is also out of mainstream enough to be considered
Weird. If we dropped "Weird" we probably can come up with some good
Name: Drug Informants (replaces S.L.A.K.)
Text: If this group does not have an Action Token at the beginning
of any player's turn, they get one.
Alignments: Violent, Fanatic
[I'd like to add something like "School of Protest,"
or "Protestors," but that's an obviously made up name. There's a
cottage industry, at least in America and Europe, of people who hold
seminars and classes to protest things like the IMF and other global
organizations; this was most prominent for Americans during the
Seattle protests a few years ago. It's actually quite an advanced
network of people, and it's ripe for a conspiracy theory, but
there's no actual name or organization that is funny/well-known
enough to translate or parody. Someday there may.]