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## Combat Example Clarification?

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• I ve seen several combat examples around the net, but still slightly confused, so I ll ask a few questions here. 1) A PC attacks a NPC (We ll say PRO vs PRO,
Message 1 of 7 , Jan 3, 2012
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I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.

1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll since it's a Reaction?

I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that NPCs don't get saving throws?

2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?

I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.

Thanks!
• 1) No. You take the static value of the NPC s PRO as the target number for the PC attack. PC PRO + (1d6-1d6) = NPC PRO is required for a hit. 2) Nope. When an
Message 2 of 7 , Jan 3, 2012
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1) No. You take the static value of the NPC's PRO as the target number for the PC attack.

PC PRO + (1d6-1d6) >= NPC PRO is required for a hit.

2) Nope. When an NPC attacks a PC, you take the NPCs static PRO score as the target for the PC roll his Evasion.

PC PRO + (1d6-1d6) >= NPC PRO is required for PC to evade being hit.

So basically only one dice roll is made to resolve the attack and it's always the player that makes the roll. If it helps, think of it as NPCs always roll zero on 1d6 - 1d6.

The same applies for Strength Tests which may be required on Major or Massive successes.

To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
From: bford83@...
Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2012 21:52:05 +0000
Subject: [icons-rpg] Combat Example Clarification?

I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.

1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll since it's a Reaction?

I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that NPCs don't get saving throws?

2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?

I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.

Thanks!

• Thanks a lot, that pretty much cleaned up all issues I had!
Message 3 of 7 , Jan 3, 2012
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Thanks a lot, that pretty much cleaned up all issues I had!

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, Soylent Green <gsoylent@...> wrote:
>
>
> 1) No. You take the static value of the NPC's PRO as the target number for the PC attack.
> PC PRO + (1d6-1d6) >= NPC PRO is required for a hit.
> 2) Nope. When an NPC attacks a PC, you take the NPCs static PRO score as the target for the PC roll his Evasion.
> PC PRO + (1d6-1d6) >= NPC PRO is required for PC to evade being hit.
>
> So basically only one dice roll is made to resolve the attack and it's always the player that makes the roll. If it helps, think of it as NPCs always roll zero on 1d6 - 1d6.
> The same applies for Strength Tests which may be required on Major or Massive successes.
>
> To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
> From: bford83@...
> Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2012 21:52:05 +0000
> Subject: [icons-rpg] Combat Example Clarification?
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> I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.
> 1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll since it's a Reaction?
> I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that NPCs don't get saving throws?
> 2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?
> I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.
> Thanks!
>
• The thing to remember is that the player rolls all the dice (most of the time). When a hero attacks a villain, his PRO is rolled, and the opponent s PRO is the
Message 4 of 7 , Jan 3, 2012
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The thing to remember is that the player rolls all the dice (most of the time). When a hero attacks a villain, his PRO is rolled, and the opponent's PRO is the target number. On the flip side when a villain attacks, it's up to the Hero to evade, using his or her PRO to beat the PRO of the bad guy.

Think about it this way. The onus is on the player. It's up to him to hit just like it's up to him to get out of the way.

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, "prodezigner" <bford83@...> wrote:
>
> I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly
> confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.
> 1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running
> numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll
> since it's a Reaction?
> I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that
> NPCs don't get saving throws?
> 2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the
> Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is
> going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?
> I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some
> examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we
> round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the
> others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.
> Thanks!
>
• Eh shoot, had another question that I forgot about earlier Slamming and Stunning and the likes of successful damage, do they take the damage before this gets
Message 5 of 7 , Jan 3, 2012
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Eh shoot, had another question that I forgot about earlier Slamming and Stunning and the likes of successful damage, do they take the damage before this gets rolled or after the Slamming and Stunning is figured out?

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, "prodezigner" <bford83@...> wrote:
>
> I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly
> confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.
> 1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running
> numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll
> since it's a Reaction?
> I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that
> NPCs don't get saving throws?
> 2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the
> Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is
> going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?
> I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some
> examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we
> round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the
> others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.
> Thanks!
>
• Off hand I m not sure it is specified or that it matters. I deal with the damage first and generally only check for Slams and Stuns if the target is still
Message 6 of 7 , Jan 4, 2012
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Off hand I'm not sure it is specified or that it matters. I deal with the damage first and generally only check for Slams and Stuns if the target is still conscious.

With potential Kill and Stun results one can argue it might make senses to do the Strength test first because if it fails the target's Stamina reduced to zero anyway and Stamina doesn't go into negative numbers. Either way it doesn't seem to matter.

Where things might get a little ambiguous is with Kill results. As I understand it, characters in Icons don't die from simple Stamina damage even if the source of the damage is a lethal - shooting or slashing - attack, Life Drain being perhaps the one notable exception. So if a character had 6 Stamina and was shot twice with Moderate hits each doing 4 points of damage, the character would be unconscious but still alive.

To kill a target requires a Massive success on a lethal attack (and even then the target as to fail his Strength test to get it to the losing Strength points stage).

So with a Kill result you always want to do the Strength test even if the target would be taken out by the Stamina damage alone.

Anyway that's how I see it.

To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
From: bford83@...
Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 01:39:04 +0000
Subject: [icons-rpg] Re: Combat Example Clarification?

Eh shoot, had another question that I forgot about earlier Slamming and Stunning and the likes of successful damage, do they take the damage before this gets rolled or after the Slamming and Stunning is figured out?

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, "prodezigner" <bford83@...> wrote:
>
> I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly
> confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.
> 1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running
> numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll
> since it's a Reaction?
> I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that
> NPCs don't get saving throws?
> 2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the
> Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is
> going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?
> I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some
> examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we
> round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the
> others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.
> Thanks!
>

• The way you do combat was how I imagined it in my mind also, so that ll be the way I do it!
Message 7 of 7 , Jan 4, 2012
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The way you do combat was how I imagined it in my mind also, so that'll be the way I do it!

--- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, Soylent Green <gsoylent@...> wrote:
>
>
> Off hand I'm not sure it is specified or that it matters. I deal with the damage first and generally only check for Slams and Stuns if the target is still conscious.
>
> With potential Kill and Stun results one can argue it might make senses to do the Strength test first because if it fails the target's Stamina reduced to zero anyway and Stamina doesn't go into negative numbers. Either way it doesn't seem to matter.
>
> Where things might get a little ambiguous is with Kill results. As I understand it, characters in Icons don't die from simple Stamina damage even if the source of the damage is a lethal - shooting or slashing - attack, Life Drain being perhaps the one notable exception. So if a character had 6 Stamina and was shot twice with Moderate hits each doing 4 points of damage, the character would be unconscious but still alive.
>
> To kill a target requires a Massive success on a lethal attack (and even then the target as to fail his Strength test to get it to the losing Strength points stage).
>
> So with a Kill result you always want to do the Strength test even if the target would be taken out by the Stamina damage alone.
>
> Anyway that's how I see it.
>
>
>
>
> To: icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com
> From: bford83@...
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 01:39:04 +0000
> Subject: [icons-rpg] Re: Combat Example Clarification?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Eh shoot, had another question that I forgot about earlier Slamming and Stunning and the likes of successful damage, do they take the damage before this gets rolled or after the Slamming and Stunning is figured out?
>
> --- In icons-rpg@yahoogroups.com, "prodezigner" <bford83@> wrote:
> >
> > I've seen several combat examples around the 'net, but still slightly
> > confused, so I'll ask a few questions here.
> > 1) A PC attacks a NPC (We'll say PRO vs PRO, don't feel like running
> > numbers and mucking up the question). Does the NPC get an Evasion roll
> > since it's a Reaction?
> > I've read that someone house ruled that they do, but I've also read that
> > NPCs don't get saving throws?
> > 2) If a NPC attacks a PC, the PC rolls for both the attack and the
> > Evasion (if capable, obvious if bound or hindered no Evasion roll is
> > going to be allowed without some Determination involved)?
> > I was really hoping for the ICONS: Team-Up! book and hoping for some
> > examples before I started running, but I'm at the plate on Sunday (we
> > round robin different game systems so we don't get bored and give the
> > others time to prepare), and just need some clarification.
> > Thanks!
> >
>
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