Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: LISTEN UP People

Expand Messages
  • willbefree25
    Thank you for the pointer, Kathi. Sadly, after watching her excellent interview (at 14:00 here):
    Message 1 of 7 , Oct 18, 2011
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      Thank you for the pointer, Kathi.

      Sadly, after watching her excellent interview (at 14:00 here):

      http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/mon-october-17-2011-ellen-schultz

      or

      http://tinyurl.com/3ggz6tn

      my reaction is................ so what?

      Other than confirming what we here have known since 1999, what will change after Ellen is no longer the sound bite of the day?

      Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to retirees?

      Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to their current employees?

      Will IBM retirees do anything?

      Will IBM employees do anything?

      Will the corporate apologists cease their lies?

      Will the politicians do anything?

      So, so what?




      --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, justa_bean_counter <no_reply@...> wrote:
      >
      > LISTEN UP PEOPLE
      >
      > Watch the Daily Show tonight. Ellen is being interviewed. Pass on to your friends.
      >
      > http://www.thedailyshow.com/guests
      >
      > Kathi
      >
    • justa_bean_counter
      Hey, I sued them last time. You take the ball this time. Kathi
      Message 2 of 7 , Oct 18, 2011
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        Hey, I sued them last time. You take the ball this time.

        Kathi

        --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, willbefree25 <no_reply@...> wrote:
        >
        > Thank you for the pointer, Kathi.
        >
        > Sadly, after watching her excellent interview (at 14:00 here):
        >
        > http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/mon-october-17-2011-ellen-schultz
        >
        > or
        >
        > http://tinyurl.com/3ggz6tn
        >
        > my reaction is................ so what?
        >
        > Other than confirming what we here have known since 1999, what will change after Ellen is no longer the sound bite of the day?
        >
        > Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to retirees?
        >
        > Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to their current employees?
        >
        > Will IBM retirees do anything?
        >
        > Will IBM employees do anything?
        >
        > Will the corporate apologists cease their lies?
        >
        > Will the politicians do anything?
        >
        > So, so what?
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, justa_bean_counter <no_reply@> wrote:
        > >
        > > LISTEN UP PEOPLE
        > >
        > > Watch the Daily Show tonight. Ellen is being interviewed. Pass on to your friends.
        > >
        > > http://www.thedailyshow.com/guests
        > >
        > > Kathi
        > >
        >
      • donwshuper50
        ... my reaction is................ so what? Your list of so whats and and will the . . . remind me of a famous comment by a former slave named
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 18, 2011
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
          ' ...> my reaction is................ so what?"

          Your list of ' so whats " and and " will the . . ." remind me of a famous comment by a " former slave named Frederick Douglass many years ago.

          "Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them."

          Wonder if that poster was hanging above the CEO-President- and Board Chair in IBM Board conference room? Or maybe it was part of the secret handshake to be followed by a group chant ?

          Of course one might consider those yet to retire or hire in to Big Blue.

          How about Asking " watson " ? watson would probably blow a server and scatter bits and bytes all over . . .

          While the real Watson is no doubt spinning in his grave fast enough to light a whole city if properly wired . .

          ++++++



          --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, willbefree25 <no_reply@...> wrote:
          >
          > Thank you for the pointer, Kathi.
          >
          > Sadly, after watching her excellent interview (at 14:00 here):
          >
          > http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/mon-october-17-2011-ellen-schultz
          >
          > or
          >
          > http://tinyurl.com/3ggz6tn
          >
          > my reaction is................ so what?
          >
          > Other than confirming what we here have known since 1999, what will change after Ellen is no longer the sound bite of the day?
          >
          > Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to retirees?
          >
          > Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to their current employees?
          >
          > Will IBM retirees do anything?
          >
          > Will IBM employees do anything?
          >
          > Will the corporate apologists cease their lies?
          >
          > Will the politicians do anything?
          >
          > So, so what?
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, justa_bean_counter <no_reply@> wrote:
          > >
          > > LISTEN UP PEOPLE
          > >
          > > Watch the Daily Show tonight. Ellen is being interviewed. Pass on to your friends.
          > >
          > > http://www.thedailyshow.com/guests
          > >
          > > Kathi
          > >
          >
        • justa_bean_counter
          I just want to mention one more thing. NEVER EVER blame an IBM employee for what happened to us. It was IBM management. It was IBM directors. It was
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 18, 2011
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment
            I just want to mention one more thing.

            NEVER EVER blame an IBM employee for what happened to us.

            It was IBM management.
            It was IBM directors.
            It was politicians.
            It was the courts.

            Employee's are the victims, regardless of what anyone thinks they shoulda, woulda, or coulda done.

            Kathi

            --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, willbefree25 <no_reply@...> wrote:
            >
            > Thank you for the pointer, Kathi.
            >
            > Sadly, after watching her excellent interview (at 14:00 here):
            >
            > http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/mon-october-17-2011-ellen-schultz
            >
            > or
            >
            > http://tinyurl.com/3ggz6tn
            >
            > my reaction is................ so what?
            >
            > Other than confirming what we here have known since 1999, what will change after Ellen is no longer the sound bite of the day?
            >
            > Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to retirees?
            >
            > Will IBM do anything to amend what they did to their current employees?
            >
            > Will IBM retirees do anything?
            >
            > Will IBM employees do anything?
            >
            > Will the corporate apologists cease their lies?
            >
            > Will the politicians do anything?
            >
            > So, so what?
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, justa_bean_counter <no_reply@> wrote:
            > >
            > > LISTEN UP PEOPLE
            > >
            > > Watch the Daily Show tonight. Ellen is being interviewed. Pass on to your friends.
            > >
            > > http://www.thedailyshow.com/guests
            > >
            > > Kathi
            > >
            >
          • fhawontcutit
            ... I would add the consulting firms to this list. Ellen Schultz has pointed this out in her book and her interviews.
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 18, 2011
            View Source
            • 0 Attachment
              --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, justa_bean_counter <no_reply@...> wrote:
              >
              > I just want to mention one more thing.
              >
              > NEVER EVER blame an IBM employee for what happened to us.
              >
              > It was IBM management.
              > It was IBM directors.
              > It was politicians.
              > It was the courts.
              >

              I would add the consulting firms to this list. Ellen Schultz has pointed this out in her book and her interviews.

              http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2011-10-06/ellen-schultz-retirement-heist/transcript

              -------
              I think a large amount of this was -- could be attributed to consulting firms, the large accounting and actuarial firms that developed very aggressive techniques to help employers cut benefits. It was at that time when employers realized that by cutting benefits, even if it wasn't costing them anything to provide, they could pump up their profits. So this is what really put the squeeze on retirement plans and you could see companies cannibalizing their plans bit by bit.
              --------
            • willbefree25
              Of course the consulting firms had a hand in it, no question. Wasn t it Watson Wyatt who was caught on tape laughing about what the employees/retirees would do
              Message 6 of 7 , Oct 19, 2011
              View Source
              • 0 Attachment
                Of course the consulting firms had a hand in it, no question. Wasn't it Watson Wyatt who was caught on tape laughing about what the employees/retirees would do when they found out what was being done to them?

                As donshuper said:

                "Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have the exact measure of the injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them."

                Sadly, the IBM employees and retirees, with the exception of a few (of course, Kathi, I applaud you for suing and no, there aren't many others who will) went away quietly and thus IBM was able to perpetrate the thefts that they did. Even today, when I talk to those who were screwed, they whisper that all they want now is to keep collecting their pension checks, reduced though they are and further reduced by paying for medical they SHOULD have gotten for life, understandably for a fee. Some are actually surprised when they read about the level of thefts in Ellen's book, can you imagine? Where have they been since 1999? You tell me.

                Kathi, I place the blame on the employee who said to me: "I got mine". I place the blame on the employees who sat in the auditoriums and asked polite little questions while I asked about the inequity of the cash balance plan and the other 'gotchas' that were hidden in the takeaways of 1991 and 1995 and 1999. I place the blame on the employees who were overwhelmed by the corporate apologists on the boards and the subliminal (some not so subliminal) threats at their workplaces, so that many did not even SPEAK of Lee Conrad, much less demand a union.

                Yes, Kathi, I do place the blame on the employees who were cowed and frightened and threatened and fired into silence.

                But of COURSE, I place the majority of the blame on the politicians and the CEOS and the consulting firms and the justice system and the managers and the team leaders who did what they did, and made it possible to silence a work force that, if marshalled and collected, had a voice that would have been heard around the world in 1999.

                Again, so what? It's too late now.



                --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, fhawontcutit <no_reply@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                >
                > --- In ibmpension@yahoogroups.com, justa_bean_counter <no_reply@> wrote:
                > >
                > > I just want to mention one more thing.
                > >
                > > NEVER EVER blame an IBM employee for what happened to us.
                > >
                > > It was IBM management.
                > > It was IBM directors.
                > > It was politicians.
                > > It was the courts.
                > >
                >
                > I would add the consulting firms to this list. Ellen Schultz has pointed this out in her book and her interviews.
                >
                > http://thedianerehmshow.org/shows/2011-10-06/ellen-schultz-retirement-heist/transcript
                >
                > -------
                > I think a large amount of this was -- could be attributed to consulting firms, the large accounting and actuarial firms that developed very aggressive techniques to help employers cut benefits. It was at that time when employers realized that by cutting benefits, even if it wasn't costing them anything to provide, they could pump up their profits. So this is what really put the squeeze on retirement plans and you could see companies cannibalizing their plans bit by bit.
                > --------
                >
              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.