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Question about Boundary conditions in groundwater model

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  • dr_haron
    Hi there I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin. Obviously, the outer
    Message 1 of 9 , Jan 10, 2008
      Hi there

      I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any
      surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin. Obviously,
      the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the head
      might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary conditions?
      I appreciate any help.
    • Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
      Dr.Haron, The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain. regards BVN Sharma
      Message 2 of 9 , Jan 10, 2008
        Dr.Haron,

        The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.

        regards
        BVN Sharma


        dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote:
        Hi there

        I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any
        surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin. Obviously,
        the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the head
        might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary conditions?
        I appreciate any help.
      • dr_haron
        Thanks Sharma But what values of initial head should I give for steady state simulation?? ... to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
        Message 3 of 9 , Jan 10, 2008
          Thanks Sharma

          But what values of initial head should I give for steady state
          simulation??

          --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
          <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dr.Haron,
          >
          > The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is
          to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
          >
          > regards
          > BVN Sharma
          >
          >
          > dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote:
          > Hi there
          >
          > I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any
          > surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin.
          Obviously,
          > the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the
          head
          > might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary
          conditions?
          > I appreciate any help.
          >
        • Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
          Dr.Haron, You must know some values of potential at the boundary nodes to simulate, which could be obtained from measuring water levels in observation wells.
          Message 4 of 9 , Jan 10, 2008
            Dr.Haron,

            You must know some values of potential at the boundary nodes to simulate, which could be obtained from measuring water levels in observation wells. How many obserbation wells a basin have, sufficency of collected data depends on what.

            thank you
            Dr.Haron


            dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote: Thanks Sharma

            But what values of initial head should I give for steady state
            simulation??

            --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
            <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
            >
            > Dr.Haron,
            >
            > The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is
            to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
            >
            > regards
            > BVN Sharma
            >
            >
            > dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote:
            > Hi there
            >
            > I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any
            > surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin.
            Obviously,
            > the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the
            head
            > might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary
            conditions?
            > I appreciate any help.
            >
          • Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
            Dr.Haron, are you following boundary element numerical analysis? thank you sharma Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma wrote: Dr.Haron, You
            Message 5 of 9 , Jan 13, 2008
              Dr.Haron,

              are you following boundary element numerical analysis?

              thank you
              sharma


              Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
              Dr.Haron,

              You must know some values of potential at the boundary nodes to simulate, which could be obtained from measuring water levels in observation wells. How many obserbation wells a basin have, sufficency of collected data depends on what.

              thank you
              Dr.Haron

              dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote: Thanks Sharma

              But what values of initial head should I give for steady state
              simulation??

              --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
              <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
              >
              > Dr.Haron,
              >
              > The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is
              to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
              >
              > regards
              > BVN Sharma
              >
              >
              > dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote:
              > Hi there
              >
              > I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any
              > surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin.
              Obviously,
              > the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the
              head
              > might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary
              conditions?
              > I appreciate any help.
            • dr_haron
              No, I am using finite difference method. But I believe using monitoring data is not valid in this case. I need some reference to be used as initial head for
              Message 6 of 9 , Jan 16, 2008
                No, I am using finite difference method. But I believe using
                monitoring data is not valid in this case. I need some "reference"
                to be used as initial head for steady state simulation. Otherwise,
                there will be more than one solution.


                --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                >
                > Dr.Haron,
                >
                > are you following boundary element numerical analysis?
                >
                > thank you
                > sharma
                >
                >
                > Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                > Dr.Haron,
                >
                > You must know some values of potential at the boundary nodes to
                simulate, which could be obtained from measuring water levels in
                observation wells. How many obserbation wells a basin have,
                sufficency of collected data depends on what.
                >
                > thank you
                > Dr.Haron
                >
                > dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote: Thanks Sharma
                >
                > But what values of initial head should I give for steady state
                > simulation??
                >
                > --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                > <bvn_sharma@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Dr.Haron,
                > >
                > > The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is
                > to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
                > >
                > > regards
                > > BVN Sharma
                > >
                > >
                > > dr_haron <dr_haron@> wrote:
                > > Hi there
                > >
                > > I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with
                any
                > > surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin.
                > Obviously,
                > > the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the
                > head
                > > might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary
                > conditions?
                > > I appreciate any help.
                >
              • Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                Dr.Haron, This is a case of potential problems. you may use finite differences, finite elements, boundary elements. in first the two are domain discretization
                Message 7 of 9 , Jan 18, 2008
                  Dr.Haron,

                  This is a case of potential problems. you may use finite differences, finite elements, boundary elements. in first the two are domain discretization is followed and the solution domain and problem domain are same. in the other method the solution domain and the problem domain are different.

                  I remeber an author HUNT priduced a book MATHEMATICAL MODELING OF GROUNDWATER FLOW published by BUTTERWORTHS.

                  bvn SHARMA


                  dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote:

                  No, I am using finite difference method. But I believe using
                  monitoring data is not valid in this case. I need some "reference"
                  to be used as initial head for steady state simulation. Otherwise,
                  there will be more than one solution.

                  --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                  <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Dr.Haron,
                  >
                  > are you following boundary element numerical analysis?
                  >
                  > thank you
                  > sharma
                  >
                  >
                  > Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                  > Dr.Haron,
                  >
                  > You must know some values of potential at the boundary nodes to
                  simulate, which could be obtained from measuring water levels in
                  observation wells. How many obserbation wells a basin have,
                  sufficency of collected data depends on what.
                  >
                  > thank you
                  > Dr.Haron
                  >
                  > dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote: Thanks Sharma
                  >
                  > But what values of initial head should I give for steady state
                  > simulation??
                  >
                  > --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                  > <bvn_sharma@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Dr.Haron,
                  > >
                  > > The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is
                  > to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
                  > >
                  > > regards
                  > > BVN Sharma
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > dr_haron <dr_haron@> wrote:
                  > > Hi there
                  > >
                  > > I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with
                  any
                  > > surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin.
                  > Obviously,
                  > > the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the
                  > head
                  > > might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary
                  > conditions?
                  > > I appreciate any help.
                • pkm
                  In reality there is an outlet point in the basin or there is change in recharge/discharge conditions. This would take care. majumdar ... From: dr_haron To:
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jan 22, 2008
                    In reality there is an outlet point in the basin or there is change in recharge/discharge conditions. This would take care.

                    majumdar


                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: dr_haron
                    To: hydforum@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 2:01 PM
                    Subject: [hydforum] Question about Boundary conditions in groundwater model


                    Hi there

                    I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with any
                    surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin. Obviously,
                    the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the head
                    might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary conditions?
                    I appreciate any help.
                  • Ayman Ahmed
                    Hello I think you could assign no-flow boundary at the borders of the model domain. The two parameters that will determine the behavior of the system are
                    Message 9 of 9 , Jan 25, 2008
                      Hello
                      I think you could assign no-flow boundary at the borders of the model domain. The two parameters that will determine the behavior of the system are Recharge and Extraction from the system. So, you need more details about recharge and extraction.

                      Regards
                      Ayman

                      Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                      Dr.Haron,

                      This is a case of potential problems. you may use finite differences, finite elements, boundary elements. in first the two are domain discretization is followed and the solution domain and problem domain are same. in the other method the solution domain and the problem domain are different.

                      I remeber an author HUNT priduced a book MATHEMATICAL MODELING OF GROUNDWATER FLOW published by BUTTERWORTHS.

                      bvn SHARMA

                      dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote:

                      No, I am using finite difference method. But I believe using
                      monitoring data is not valid in this case. I need some "reference"
                      to be used as initial head for steady state simulation. Otherwise,
                      there will be more than one solution.

                      --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                      <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Dr.Haron,
                      >
                      > are you following boundary element numerical analysis?
                      >
                      > thank you
                      > sharma
                      >
                      >
                      > Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma <bvn_sharma@...> wrote:
                      > Dr.Haron,
                      >
                      > You must know some values of potential at the boundary nodes to
                      simulate, which could be obtained from measuring water levels in
                      observation wells. How many obserbation wells a basin have,
                      sufficency of collected data depends on what.
                      >
                      > thank you
                      > Dr.Haron
                      >
                      > dr_haron <dr_haron@...> wrote: Thanks Sharma
                      >
                      > But what values of initial head should I give for steady state
                      > simulation??
                      >
                      > --- In hydforum@yahoogroups.com, Bulusu Venkata Narasimha Sharma
                      > <bvn_sharma@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Dr.Haron,
                      > >
                      > > The problem may be treated Dirichlet problem where solution is
                      > to find head(potential) in the interior of the problem domain.
                      > >
                      > > regards
                      > > BVN Sharma
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > dr_haron <dr_haron@> wrote:
                      > > Hi there
                      > >
                      > > I will model a closed basin area, which does not interact with
                      any
                      > > surface water bodies or groundwater from out of the basin.
                      > Obviously,
                      > > the outer boundary is no flow boundary. However, in reality the
                      > head
                      > > might be changing with time. So how to assign the boundary
                      > conditions?
                      > > I appreciate any help.





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