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Re: HUM_FORUM: Hum Intensity/ Loran-C/GPS

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  • lbcallaway@yahoo.com
    Hi Patty! GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a long time since we ve been sailing. My symptoms started in 2000, long after we had these nav
    Message 1 of 19 , Aug 7, 2004
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      Hi Patty!
      GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a long time since we've been sailing.  My symptoms started in 2000, long after we had these nav tools right over our heads.  Have they been augmented?  We do appreciate your input!
      Food for thought.
       
      Thank you,
      Alabama

      Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
      Carole, Thank you for the info about the Loran-C
      transmitter in Lake County, CA. I'll check it out.
      It's my understanding that Loran-C is now used in
      conjunction with GPS for greater accuracy. GPS
      transmits vertically, while Loran-C covers the
      horizon.
      In addition, there is another system named WAAS. It
      enhances GPS over the US and Canada.

      I found some initial info about one of the original
      radionav system named OMEGA that is interesting--"...a
      Navigation Message is a 50 Hz signal consisting of
      data bits that describe the GPS satellite orbits,
      clock corrections, and other system parameters."
                         KEYWORD, 50Hz

      GPS could be the source of the hum for this and other
      reasons.
      Patty, CA





      --- Carole Carriker <ccarrike@...> wrote:

      > Hi Patty!  Thanks for responding.  I'm wondering if
      > this could possibly lead us back to LORAN-C as a
      > possible source of the hum.  There's a LORAN-C
      > transmitter in Middletown (Lake County), west of
      > where you are.  You are quite a bit closer to it
      > than I am, which may explain why your experience was
      > so much worse.

      > Just a thought   ~ Carole
      >
      > Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
      > Hi Carole,
      > Patty here in northern California near Colfax--I
      > want
      > to confirm that your description of a bad hum last
      > night in central CA happened here where I live too.
      > Around midnight last night the hum intensified
      > horribly (back to level 8) and continued through
      > most
      > of this morning through today. Last night, I also
      > experienced an exceptionally loud, high pitch
      > ringing
      > in my ears in addition to the low-pitched pulsing
      > hum
      > after several weeks of low/medium, tolerable levels.
      > My ears hurt all day from the pressure I feel in
      > them
      > as a result of the increased intensity. Pressure
      > like
      > being under water feeling. I have been physically
      > exhausted all day, cranky, clumsy, unable to think
      > straight, etc.
      >
      > The similarities in our locations means something.
      > Patty, CA
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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    • Carole Carriker
      Hey Alabama ! Good to hear from you. My symptoms started in the mid-1990 s; however, I read something in one of the articles about the hum I found on the
      Message 2 of 19 , Aug 7, 2004
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        Hey "Alabama"!  Good to hear from you.  My symptoms started in the mid-1990's; however, I read something in one of the articles about the hum I found on the internet (can't remember which one), that may explain why we haven't heard it all along.  Some of the data regarding "hearers" indicated that they are more than 50% women, and most of them over the age of 50.  It could be that we become more sensitive as we grow older.  My mom also hears it, and she just turned 86. 
         
        Just a thought   ~ Carole

        "lbcallaway@..." <lbcallaway@...> wrote:
        Hi Patty!
        GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a long time since we've been sailing.  My symptoms started in 2000, long after we had these nav tools right over our heads.  Have they been augmented?  We do appreciate your input!
        Food for thought.
         
        Thank you,
        Alabama


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      • Patty
        My 7 yr old granddaughter hears it, and I remember a forum post from a teacher who reported teens hearing it, so age could be a factor for some but not all,
        Message 3 of 19 , Aug 7, 2004
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          My 7 yr old granddaughter hears it, and I remember a
          forum post from a teacher who reported teens hearing
          it, so age could be a factor for some but not all,
          right?
          Patty, CA

          --- Carole Carriker <ccarrike@...> wrote:

          > Hey "Alabama"! Good to hear from you. My symptoms
          > started in the mid-1990's; however, I read something
          > in one of the articles about the hum I found on the
          > internet (can't remember which one), that may
          > explain why we haven't heard it all along. Some of
          > the data regarding "hearers" indicated that they are
          > more than 50% women, and most of them over the age
          > of 50. It could be that we become more sensitive as
          > we grow older. My mom also hears it, and she just
          > turned 86.
          >
          > Just a thought ~ Carole
          >
          > "lbcallaway@..." <lbcallaway@...> wrote:
          > Hi Patty!
          > GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a
          > long time since we've been sailing. My symptoms
          > started in 2000, long after we had these nav tools
          > right over our heads. Have they been augmented? We
          > do appreciate your input!
          > Food for thought.
          >
          > Thank you,
          > Alabama
          >
          >
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          > > Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download
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          > > ideas and theories is welcome.
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        • Patty
          I ve spent hours tonight researching GPS, Loran, WAAS, etc. Here s a new technology added to these systems in 2003 (taken from a pdf file entitled The
          Message 4 of 19 , Aug 7, 2004
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            I've spent hours tonight researching GPS, Loran, WAAS,
            etc.
            Here's a new technology added to these systems in 2003
            (taken from a pdf file entitled "The Modernized L2
            Civil Signal") at
            <http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/gps/gpsnotices/default.htm>


            "A funny thing happened on the road to GPS
            modernization: a signal suddenly changed.
            After years of preparation, modernization
            called for: implementing military (M) code on the
            L1 and L2 frequencies for the Department of
            Defense (DoD); providing a new L5 frequency in an
            aeronautical radio navigation service (ARNS) band
            with a signal structure designed to enhance
            aviation applications; adding the C/A code to L2.

            Implementation was underway when the
            System Program Director for the GPS Joint
            Program Office (JPO) asked whether it was
            wise simply to replicate the 20th-century C/A
            code in a 21st-century �modernized� GPS.
            Responding to this challenge, a truly modern
            L2 civil (L2C) signal was designed in a
            remarkably short time to meet a much wider
            range of applications. The first launch of a Block
            IIR-M satellite in 2003 will carry the new signal,
            as will all subsequent GPS satellites."

            I hope other forum members will look at GPS and Loran
            as possible hum sources. GPS/Loran technology is being
            integrated. Also there is eLoran (enhanced Loran);
            DGPS (Differential GPS); EGNOS (the European system);
            etc. and GNNS (Global Nav Sat Sys) pending.

            A few bits of general info I found: GPS is not good at
            penetrating urban environments; Loran propagation
            velocity changes over the ground that result from
            variations in Earth's conductivity over the signal
            path;
            GPS-Loran antennas are being designed as H-Field
            (magnetic) antennas to reduce antenna size and need
            for a ground. GPS and Loran are two RF signal sources
            quite dissimilar in frequency band, power, and
            propagation characteristics: and the government
            performs outages of both systems which involve major
            operations, hundreds of people, the DOD, etc.

            More...
            The International Loran Association's
            2004 Convention and Technical Symposium
            October 25-27, 2004
            Tokyo, Japan

            ��this year's event promises to offer unparalleled
            discussion, planning and networking opportunities.
            Perhaps more than any year in its history, 2004 marks
            a critical time in the lifecycle of Loran.�

            ��The 33rd Annual ILA convention will include sessions
            on all aspects of Loran-C with an emphasis on topics
            relating to eLoran (enhanced Loran).� Other info
            states 120 million has been spent on eLoran research
            as of July 2004.

            I think GPS and/or Loran fit much of the hum criteria.
            Patty, CA


            --- "lbcallaway@..." <lbcallaway@...>
            wrote:

            > Hi Patty!
            > GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a
            > long time since we've been sailing. My symptoms
            > started in 2000, long after we had these nav tools
            > right over our heads. Have they been augmented? We
            > do appreciate your input!
            > Food for thought.
            >
            > Thank you,
            > Alabama
            >
            > Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
            > Carole, Thank you for the info about the Loran-C
            > transmitter in Lake County, CA. I'll check it out.
            > It's my understanding that Loran-C is now used in
            > conjunction with GPS for greater accuracy. GPS
            > transmits vertically, while Loran-C covers the
            > horizon.
            > In addition, there is another system named WAAS. It
            > enhances GPS over the US and Canada.
            >
            > I found some initial info about one of the original
            > radionav system named OMEGA that is
            > interesting--"...a
            > Navigation Message is a 50 Hz signal consisting of
            > data bits that describe the GPS satellite orbits,
            > clock corrections, and other system parameters."
            > KEYWORD, 50Hz
            >
            > GPS could be the source of the hum for this and
            > other
            > reasons.
            > Patty, CA
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- Carole Carriker <ccarrike@...> wrote:
            >
            > > Hi Patty! Thanks for responding. I'm wondering
            > if
            > > this could possibly lead us back to LORAN-C as a
            > > possible source of the hum. There's a LORAN-C
            > > transmitter in Middletown (Lake County), west of
            > > where you are. You are quite a bit closer to it
            > > than I am, which may explain why your experience
            > was
            > > so much worse.
            > >
            > > Just a thought ~ Carole
            > >
            > > Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
            > > Hi Carole,
            > > Patty here in northern California near Colfax--I
            > > want
            > > to confirm that your description of a bad hum last
            > > night in central CA happened here where I live
            > too.
            > > Around midnight last night the hum intensified
            > > horribly (back to level 8) and continued through
            > > most
            > > of this morning through today. Last night, I also
            > > experienced an exceptionally loud, high pitch
            > > ringing
            > > in my ears in addition to the low-pitched pulsing
            > > hum
            > > after several weeks of low/medium, tolerable
            > levels.
            > > My ears hurt all day from the pressure I feel in
            > > them
            > > as a result of the increased intensity. Pressure
            > > like
            > > being under water feeling. I have been physically
            > > exhausted all day, cranky, clumsy, unable to think
            > > straight, etc.
            > >
            > > The similarities in our locations means something.
            > > Patty, CA
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > _______________________________
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            > > Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download
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            > > ideas and theories is welcome.
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            > > 4. Limit posts to those that are necessary and
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          • David Deming
            ... Any explanation of the Hum will ultimately have to explain the occurrence of the phenomenon in both space and time. I am not sure when GPS started, but I m
            Message 5 of 19 , Aug 8, 2004
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              >
              > I hope other forum members will look at GPS and Loran
              > as possible hum sources. GPS/Loran technology is being
              > integrated. Also there is eLoran (enhanced Loran);
              > DGPS (Differential GPS); EGNOS (the European system);
              > etc. and GNNS (Global Nav Sat Sys) pending.
              >

              Any explanation of the Hum will ultimately have
              to explain the occurrence of the phenomenon in
              both space and time.

              I am not sure when GPS started, but I'm pretty
              sure it was not around in the early 1970s when
              the Hum was.

              The problems with LORAN have been discussed before.
              In brief, the problem with LORAN is that there
              is no correlation between the location of LORAN
              transmitters and Hum reports. LORAN is also on
              24 hours a day, 365 days a year. But for most
              people, the Hum is an intermittent problem.

              So we keep re-inventing the wheel, over and over
              again.

              Sometime in the next few weeks, I'm going to post
              here the revised (and presumably final) version of
              my Hum paper which will be published in the J. of
              Sci. Exploration. I discuss each of the major hypotheses
              that have been proposed as explanations for the Hum
              (including delusion and tinnitus), and mention the
              weaknesses and strengths of each hypothesis.

              I hope this can serve as the basis for fruitful
              discussion.

              --David Deming
              Norman, Oklahom
            • Alan Stevens
              ... The first eleven spacecraft (GPS Block 1) were used to demonstrate the feasibility of the GPS system, and were launched between 1978 and 1985. GPS Block 2
              Message 6 of 19 , Aug 8, 2004
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                --- In humforum@yahoogroups.com, David Deming <profdeming@e...> wrote:
                > >
                > > I hope other forum members will look at GPS and Loran
                > > as possible hum sources. GPS/Loran technology is being
                > > integrated. Also there is eLoran (enhanced Loran);
                > > DGPS (Differential GPS); EGNOS (the European system);
                > > etc. and GNNS (Global Nav Sat Sys) pending.
                >
                > Any explanation of the Hum will ultimately have
                > to explain the occurrence of the phenomenon in
                > both space and time.
                >
                > I am not sure when GPS started, but I'm pretty
                > sure it was not around in the early 1970s when
                > the Hum was.

                The first eleven spacecraft (GPS Block 1) were used to demonstrate the
                feasibility of the GPS system, and were launched between 1978 and
                1985.

                GPS Block 2 is the Operational system, following the Demonstration
                system comprised of Block 1 spacecraft. The Block 2A are "Advanced"
                versions of this spacecraft. GPS Block 2 comprised 27 launches
                between 1989 and 1996.

                The complete constellation has 24 spacecraft in 6 high-altitude orbit
                planes.

                http://leonardo.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/Programs/gps.html


                Alan
              • Carole Carriker
                Seems likely. I think that the article just said that the average age of hears was over 50. I actually started hearing it in my mid-40 s. ~ Carole Patty
                Message 7 of 19 , Aug 8, 2004
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                  Seems likely.  I think that the article just said that the average age of hears was over 50.
                   
                  I actually started hearing it in my mid-40's.   ~ Carole

                  Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
                  My 7 yr old granddaughter hears it, and I remember a
                  forum post from a teacher who reported teens hearing
                  it, so age could be a factor for some but not all,
                  right?
                  Patty, CA

                  --- Carole Carriker <ccarrike@...> wrote:

                  > Hey "Alabama"!  Good to hear from you.  My symptoms
                  > started in the mid-1990's; however, I read something
                  > in one of the articles about the hum I found on the
                  > internet (can't remember which one), that may
                  > explain why we haven't heard it all along.  Some of
                  > the data regarding "hearers" indicated that they are
                  > more than 50% women, and most of them over the age
                  > of 50.  It could be that we become more sensitive as
                  > we grow older.  My mom also hears it, and she just
                  > turned 86. 

                  > Just a thought   ~ Carole
                  >
                  > "lbcallaway@..." <lbcallaway@...> wrote:
                  > Hi Patty!
                  > GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a
                  > long time since we've been sailing.  My symptoms
                  > started in 2000, long after we had these nav tools
                  > right over our heads.  Have they been augmented?  We
                  > do appreciate your input!
                  > Food for thought.

                  > Thank you,
                  > Alabama
                  >
                  >
                  > > Do you Yahoo!?
                  > > Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download
                  > > now.
                  > > http://messenger.yahoo.com
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Posting Guidelines:
                  > >
                  > > 1.  No personal attacks.  But reasoned criticism
                  > of
                  > > ideas and theories is welcome.
                  > >
                  > > 2.  No gratuitous profanity.
                  > >
                  > > 3.  No "kook" posts.
                  > >
                  > > 4.  Limit posts to those that are necessary and
                  > have
                  > > substantive content.  In general, no more than
                  > three
                  > > per person per day.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ---------------------------------
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                  > >    To visit your group on the web, go to:
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                • Carole Carriker
                  Is it possible that different people are hearing hums from different sources? My experience of the hum is 24-7-365. P.S. Congratulations on getting
                  Message 8 of 19 , Aug 8, 2004
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                    Is it possible that different people are hearing "hums" from different sources?  My experience of the hum is 24-7-365.  
                     
                    P.S.  Congratulations on getting published!    ~ Carole 

                    David Deming <profdeming@...> wrote:


                    The problems with LORAN have been discussed before.
                    In brief, the problem with LORAN is that there
                    is no correlation between the location of LORAN
                    transmitters and Hum reports.  LORAN is also on
                    24 hours a day, 365 days a year.  But for most
                    people, the Hum is an intermittent problem.



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                  • Carole Carriker
                    I just wanted to add to that, that I do recognize there is a difference between most hearers being over 50 and the average age being over 50 . A couple of
                    Message 9 of 19 , Aug 8, 2004
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                      I just wanted to add to that, that I do recognize there is a difference between "most hearers being over 50" and "the average age being over 50".  A couple of people in their 90's could skew the average quite a bit.    ~ C

                      Carole Carriker <ccarrike@...> wrote:
                      Seems likely.  I think that the article just said that the average age of hears was over 50.
                       
                      I actually started hearing it in my mid-40's.   ~ Carole

                       
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                    • Patty
                      GPS DOES FIT INTO THE HUM TIMEFRAME THEN ESP. IF THE FOLLOWING STILL APPLIES: The first reference I have that explicitly memtionw the hum as such is an
                      Message 10 of 19 , Aug 8, 2004
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                        GPS DOES FIT INTO THE HUM TIMEFRAME THEN ESP. IF THE
                        FOLLOWING STILL APPLIES:
                        "The first reference I have that explicitly memtionw
                        the hum as such is an article that was published in
                        the New Scientist on Dec. 13 1979. The New Scientist
                        article mentions an earlier article that appeared in
                        the Sunday Mirror "18 month ago". It said the Mirror
                        story received 800 letters from people who reported
                        hearing the hum...." (Deming MSN post 3/25/04)

                        "The problems with LORAN have been discussed before.
                        In brief, the problem with LORAN is that there
                        is no correlation between the location of LORAN
                        transmitters and Hum reports. LORAN is also on
                        24 hours a day, 365 days a year. But for most
                        people, the Hum is an intermittent problem." (Deming
                        8/8/04 post)

                        LORAN-C STARTED IN 1958.
                        A MAP OF LORAN-C TRANSMISSION COVERAGE AT
                        <http://webhome.idirect.com/%7Ejproc/hyperbolic/loran_c_xmitter.html>
                        SHOWS NEARLY GLOBAL COVERAGE (EXCEPT OVER SOUTH
                        AMERICA, AFRICA, AUSTRALIA)

                        CONCERNING 24/7-365, THE HUM COULD BE INTERMITTENT DUE
                        TO PROPOGATION VARIATIONS, OR OTHER VARIABLES.
                        PATTY, CA


                        --- Alan Stevens <awstevens@...> wrote:

                        > --- In humforum@yahoogroups.com, David Deming
                        > <profdeming@e...> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > I hope other forum members will look at GPS and
                        > Loran
                        > > > as possible hum sources. GPS/Loran technology is
                        > being
                        > > > integrated. Also there is eLoran (enhanced
                        > Loran);
                        > > > DGPS (Differential GPS); EGNOS (the European
                        > system);
                        > > > etc. and GNNS (Global Nav Sat Sys) pending.
                        > >
                        > > Any explanation of the Hum will ultimately have
                        > > to explain the occurrence of the phenomenon in
                        > > both space and time.
                        > >
                        > > I am not sure when GPS started, but I'm pretty
                        > > sure it was not around in the early 1970s when
                        > > the Hum was.
                        >
                        > The first eleven spacecraft (GPS Block 1) were used
                        > to demonstrate the
                        > feasibility of the GPS system, and were launched
                        > between 1978 and
                        > 1985.
                        >
                        > GPS Block 2 is the Operational system, following the
                        > Demonstration
                        > system comprised of Block 1 spacecraft. The Block
                        > 2A are "Advanced"
                        > versions of this spacecraft. GPS Block 2 comprised
                        > 27 launches
                        > between 1989 and 1996.
                        >
                        > The complete constellation has 24 spacecraft in 6
                        > high-altitude orbit
                        > planes.
                        >
                        > http://leonardo.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/Programs/gps.html
                        >
                        >
                        > Alan
                        >
                        >







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                      • Tobypaws2002@aol.com
                        In a message dated 08/08/2004 22:22:59 GMT Daylight Time, ccarrike@yahoo.com ... I was 39..... R.M. England.
                        Message 11 of 19 , Aug 9, 2004
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                          In a message dated 08/08/2004 22:22:59 GMT Daylight Time, ccarrike@... writes:

                          I actually started hearing it in my mid-40's.   ~ Carole



                          I was 39.....
                          R.M.  England.
                        • Tobypaws2002@aol.com
                          In a message dated 08/08/2004 22:43:02 GMT Daylight Time, ccarrike@yahoo.com ... That s my opinion....Different but maybe similar sources. Must be huge numbers
                          Message 12 of 19 , Aug 9, 2004
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                            In a message dated 08/08/2004 22:43:02 GMT Daylight Time, ccarrike@... writes:

                            Is it possible that different people are hearing "hums" from different sources?  My experience of the hum is 24-7-365.  



                            That's my opinion....Different but maybe similar sources. Must be huge numbers .....
                            R.M.    England
                          • David Deming
                            Message 13 of 19 , Aug 9, 2004
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                              Re: HUM_FORUM:   Re: GPS and LORAN
                              >
                              > GPS DOES FIT INTO THE HUM TIMEFRAME THEN ESP. IF THE
                              > FOLLOWING STILL APPLIES:
                              > "The first reference I have that explicitly memtionw
                              > the hum as such is an article that was published in
                              > the New Scientist on Dec. 13 1979. The New Scientist
                              > article mentions an earlier article that appeared in
                              > the Sunday Mirror "18 month ago". It said the Mirror
                              > story received 800 letters from people who reported
                              > hearing the hum...." (Deming MSN post 3/25/04)  
                              >

                              Subsequent research on my part shows that there is
                              documentation that the Hum was a widespread problem
                              in the UK by no later than the very early 1970s.
                              For example, there is a research paper in the scientific
                              literature published in 1973 where the authors report
                              people having symptoms identical with the Hum.  There
                              is also one well-documented case of an individual who
                              claims to have first heard the Hum in the mid 1960s.

                              >
                              > "The problems with LORAN have been discussed before.
                              > In brief, the problem with LORAN is that there
                              > is no correlation between the location of LORAN
                              > transmitters and Hum reports.  LORAN is also on
                              > 24 hours a day, 365 days a year.  But for most
                              > people, the Hum is an intermittent problem." (Deming
                              > 8/8/04 post)
                              >
                              > LORAN-C STARTED IN 1958.
                              > A MAP OF LORAN-C TRANSMISSION COVERAGE AT
                              > <http://webhome.idirect.com/%7Ejproc/hyperbolic/loran_c_xmitter.html>
                              > SHOWS NEARLY GLOBAL COVERAGE (EXCEPT OVER SOUTH
                              > AMERICA, AFRICA, AUSTRALIA)
                              >
                              > CONCERNING 24/7-365, THE HUM COULD BE INTERMITTENT DUE
                              > TO PROPOGATION VARIATIONS, OR OTHER VARIABLES.
                              > PATTY, CA
                              >

                              For many of us when the Hum goes on, it's just as
                              if someone had thrown a a switch.  It doesn't fade
                              in or out as it would if natural factors were responsible.

                              I stand by my remarks concerning location.  There are no
                              known reports of Hum problems near LORAN towers.

                              --DD


                            • Patty
                              Prof Deming, Prior to the development of the GPS system, the first satellite system was called Transit and was operational beginning in 1964. Patty ...
                              Message 14 of 19 , Aug 14, 2004
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                                Prof Deming,
                                Prior to the development of the GPS system, the first
                                satellite system was called Transit and was
                                operational beginning in 1964. Patty

                                --- David Deming <profdeming@...> wrote:

                                > >> >
                                > >> > GPS DOES FIT INTO THE HUM TIMEFRAME THEN ESP.
                                > IF THE
                                > >> > FOLLOWING STILL APPLIES:
                                > >> > "The first reference I have that explicitly
                                > memtionw
                                > >> > the hum as such is an article that was
                                > published in
                                > >> > the New Scientist on Dec. 13 1979. The New
                                > Scientist
                                > >> > article mentions an earlier article that
                                > appeared in
                                > >> > the Sunday Mirror "18 month ago". It said the
                                > Mirror
                                > >> > story received 800 letters from people who
                                > reported
                                > >> > hearing the hum...." (Deming MSN post 3/25/04)
                                > >> >
                                > >
                                > > Subsequent research on my part shows that there is
                                > > documentation that the Hum was a widespread
                                > problem
                                > > in the UK by no later than the very early 1970s.
                                > > For example, there is a research paper in the
                                > scientific
                                > > literature published in 1973 where the authors
                                > report
                                > > people having symptoms identical with the Hum.
                                > There
                                > > is also one well-documented case of an individual
                                > who
                                > > claims to have first heard the Hum in the mid
                                > 1960s.
                                > >
                                > >> >
                                > >> > "The problems with LORAN have been discussed
                                > before.
                                > >> > In brief, the problem with LORAN is that there
                                > >> > is no correlation between the location of LORAN
                                > >> > transmitters and Hum reports. LORAN is also on
                                > >> > 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. But for most
                                > >> > people, the Hum is an intermittent problem."
                                > (Deming
                                > >> > 8/8/04 post)
                                > >> >
                                > >> > LORAN-C STARTED IN 1958.
                                > >> > A MAP OF LORAN-C TRANSMISSION COVERAGE AT
                                > >> >
                                >
                                <http://webhome.idirect.com/%7Ejproc/hyperbolic/loran_c_xmitter.html>
                                > >> > SHOWS NEARLY GLOBAL COVERAGE (EXCEPT OVER SOUTH
                                > >> > AMERICA, AFRICA, AUSTRALIA)
                                > >> >
                                > >> > CONCERNING 24/7-365, THE HUM COULD BE
                                > INTERMITTENT DUE
                                > >> > TO PROPOGATION VARIATIONS, OR OTHER VARIABLES.
                                > >> > PATTY, CA
                                > >> >
                                > >
                                > > For many of us when the Hum goes on, it's just as
                                > > if someone had thrown a a switch. It doesn't fade
                                > > in or out as it would if natural factors were
                                > responsible.
                                > >
                                > > I stand by my remarks concerning location. There
                                > are no
                                > > known reports of Hum problems near LORAN towers.
                                > >
                                > > --DD

                                Prof Deming,
                                There are correlations between locations of Loran-C
                                transmitter chains (towers) in the US and the Schatzie
                                Hubbell map; and hum intermittency could be caused by
                                automated local correction signals (ASF's; DLoran-C)
                                that are transmitted to compensate for propagation
                                anomalies.

                                Concerning ASF, I found "..ASF values depend mainly on
                                the conductivity of the earth's surface along the
                                signal paths. Sea water has high conductivity, and the
                                ASFs of sea water are, by definition, zero. Dry soil,
                                mountains or ice generally have low conductivity and
                                radio signals travel over them more slowly, giving
                                rise to substantial ASF delays and hence degradation
                                of absolute accuracy.
                                Fortunately, ASFs vary little with time, and it is
                                possible to calibrate the Loran-C service by measuring
                                ASF values throughout the coverage area. A program for
                                mapping of ASF in northern Europe is the basis for the
                                production of ASF corrections. These corrections will
                                be distributed as electronic databases.."

                                Concerning DLoran-C: "...Substantial improvement in
                                the accuracy of Loran-C service is technically
                                possible by the measurement and broadcast of local
                                corrections in a technique known as differential
                                Loran-C (DLoran-C). (This is similar to what is
                                achieved with GPS using GPS differential corrections
                                known as DGPScorrections may improve the absolute
                                accuracy of the Loran-C service in positions where the
                                received Loran-C signal passes over anything but sea
                                water on its way from transmitter to receiver.)"

                                Although Loran-C is 24/7/365, I'm wondering if
                                automated corrections could cause increases and
                                decreases in signal strengths at different times to
                                explain hum changes, even seeming to be on and off.

                                GPS and/or Loran-C systems seem like a good working
                                hypothesis to me.
                                Patty, CA




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                              • Patty
                                Carole, Here s a possible explanation about the point you make: On May 1, 2000 President Clinton announced that the government will no longer scramble signals
                                Message 15 of 19 , Aug 14, 2004
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                                  Carole,
                                  Here's a possible explanation about the point you
                                  make:
                                  On May 1, 2000 President Clinton announced that the
                                  government will no longer scramble signals from the
                                  GPS satellites. This means that civilians will be able
                                  to enjoy the high accuracy that the military has had
                                  for years.
                                  Even though the system was originally developed for
                                  military purposes, civil sales now exceed military
                                  sales.
                                  C/A code -The standard (Course/Acquisition) GPS code.
                                  A sequence of 1023 pseudo-random, binary, biphase
                                  modulations on the GPS carrier at a chip rate of 1.023
                                  MHz. Also known as the "civilian code.
                                  Patty, CA (who has jibed a spinnaker pole or two under
                                  the Golden Gate Bridge, and learned from sailing that
                                  there is no bravery without fear)

                                  --- "lbcallaway@..." <lbcallaway@...>
                                  wrote:

                                  > Hi Patty!
                                  > GPS, Loran-C, and WAAS corrected have been around a
                                  > long time since we've been sailing. My symptoms
                                  > started in 2000, long after we had these nav tools
                                  > right over our heads. Have they been augmented? We
                                  > do appreciate your input!
                                  > Food for thought.
                                  >
                                  > Thank you,
                                  > Alabama
                                  >
                                  > Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
                                  > Carole, Thank you for the info about the Loran-C
                                  > transmitter in Lake County, CA. I'll check it out.
                                  > It's my understanding that Loran-C is now used in
                                  > conjunction with GPS for greater accuracy. GPS
                                  > transmits vertically, while Loran-C covers the
                                  > horizon.
                                  > In addition, there is another system named WAAS. It
                                  > enhances GPS over the US and Canada.
                                  >
                                  > I found some initial info about one of the original
                                  > radionav system named OMEGA that is
                                  > interesting--"...a
                                  > Navigation Message is a 50 Hz signal consisting of
                                  > data bits that describe the GPS satellite orbits,
                                  > clock corrections, and other system parameters."
                                  > KEYWORD, 50Hz
                                  >
                                  > GPS could be the source of the hum for this and
                                  > other
                                  > reasons.
                                  > Patty, CA
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > --- Carole Carriker <ccarrike@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > > Hi Patty! Thanks for responding. I'm wondering
                                  > if
                                  > > this could possibly lead us back to LORAN-C as a
                                  > > possible source of the hum. There's a LORAN-C
                                  > > transmitter in Middletown (Lake County), west of
                                  > > where you are. You are quite a bit closer to it
                                  > > than I am, which may explain why your experience
                                  > was
                                  > > so much worse.
                                  > >
                                  > > Just a thought ~ Carole
                                  > >
                                  > > Patty <sugarpineinc@...> wrote:
                                  > > Hi Carole,
                                  > > Patty here in northern California near Colfax--I
                                  > > want
                                  > > to confirm that your description of a bad hum last
                                  > > night in central CA happened here where I live
                                  > too.
                                  > > Around midnight last night the hum intensified
                                  > > horribly (back to level 8) and continued through
                                  > > most
                                  > > of this morning through today. Last night, I also
                                  > > experienced an exceptionally loud, high pitch
                                  > > ringing
                                  > > in my ears in addition to the low-pitched pulsing
                                  > > hum
                                  > > after several weeks of low/medium, tolerable
                                  > levels.
                                  > > My ears hurt all day from the pressure I feel in
                                  > > them
                                  > > as a result of the increased intensity. Pressure
                                  > > like
                                  > > being under water feeling. I have been physically
                                  > > exhausted all day, cranky, clumsy, unable to think
                                  > > straight, etc.
                                  > >
                                  > > The similarities in our locations means something.
                                  > > Patty, CA
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
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