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Re: HUM_FORUM: Submarine Communications

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  • David Deming
    ... There are many components to the US Navy submarine communication system. There is the well-known ELF transmitter in Wisconsin that you mention. I do not
    Message 1 of 11 , Jul 12, 2004
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      >
      >From: Patty <sugarpineinc@...>
      >To: humforum@yahoogroups.com
      >Subject: Re: HUM_FORUM: Submarine Communications
      >Date: Mon, Jul 12, 2004, 5:55 PM
      >
      >
      > OKAY, BUT some stations have been identified by their
      > transmission pattern mode and use of frequency by ham
      > operators which leads me to think there IS VARIATION.
      > For example:
      > 00000.076:unid:US NAVY ELF communication facility,
      > Republic Michigan, USA:MSK
      > 00000.076:unid:US NAVY ELF communication facility,
      > Clam Lake Wisconsin, USA:MSK
      > BOTH ACTIVE
      >

      There are many components to the US Navy submarine
      communication system.

      There is the well-known ELF transmitter in Wisconsin
      that you mention. I do not believe this is the source
      of the Hum for the simple reason that no one in Wisconsin
      is complaining of the Hum.

      There are also some fixed VLF transmitters on the east
      and west coasts. The fact that there apparently are no
      Hum complaints near these stations is to my mind the single
      biggest objection to the submarine communications theory.


      >
      > IF SUB COMMUNICATIONS TRANSMIT GLOBAL SURFACE COVERAGE
      > SIGNALS TO SUBMARINES, HOW CAN SOME AREAS BE AVOIDED?
      >

      The third component of the submarine communications system
      are the US Navy TACAMO planes. The broadcast power of these
      planes circa early 1970s was at least 200 kW according to
      open sources. It is probably higher now, but no one knows
      because the power and precise frequencies are classified.

      I do not believe the coverage of any VLF system is "global."
      If that were the case, the Navy would need only one plane,
      but it is known that there are two squadrons, one deployed
      to cover the Atlantic, the other the Pacific. You also must
      not confuse what a radio can hear with what a human can
      "hear". It is probable that only the strongest EM signals
      can be picked up humans.

      >
      > IN ADDITION, BILL CURRY HAS DRIVEN HOME THE POINT THAT
      > MICROWAVE HEARING BEGINS AT 200MHz.
      > SUB COMMUNICATIONS ARE IN THE ELF/VLF RANGE
      > 0-30KHz(30,000Hz).
      >

      There is evidence published in the scientific literature that
      humans can also "hear" EM radiation at frequencies other
      than microwave.

      Keay (1980) exposed 44 subjects to radio transmissions in the 1-8 kHz range.
      He found that three of them (seven percent) "exhibited heightened awareness
      of sounds from an electric field varying at audio frequencies" (Keay, 1998,
      p. 10). Interestingly, Keay (1980, p. 14) also found that sensitivity to
      electrophonic perception varied by at least a factor of 1000 between
      individuals.

      Clearly, we know very little about how this "hearing" takes place,
      or why individuals vary in sensitivity, or what frequencies can
      be "heard" by whom.

      Keay, C. S. L., 1980, Anomalous Sounds from the Entry of Meteor Fireballs:
      Science, v. 210, p. 11-15.

      Keay, C., 1998, Electrophonic Sounds from Large Meteor Fireballs.
      Meteorite, August, 1998, p. 8-10.


      >
      > IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT RADIO SIGNALS IN THE VLF
      > RANGE ARE SET ASIDE FOR SPECIAL COMMUNICATIONS, MOSTLY
      > MILITARY IN ORIGIN. THEY ARE USEFUL AS ONE-WAY CONTROL
      > AND COMMAND LINKS FOR SUBMARINE FORCES BECAUSE THEY
      > PENTRATE WATER. ENCRYPTED TRANSMISSIONS ARE USED FOR
      > OBVIOUS REASONS, BUT NONE OF THESE FACTS EXPLAIN THE
      > HUM. THEY JUST EXPLAIN THAT INFORMATION ABOUT
      > SUBMARINE COMMUNICATIONS ARE KEPT SECRET.
      >

      The fact is that no single hypothesis at the present
      time satisfactorily "explains" all facets of the phenomenon
      known as the Hum. That is often the case in science.

      The best we can do is to employ multiple working hypotheses,
      looking both for supporting evidence and especially for
      falsification.

      >
      > I THINK THERE ARE SOME FACTS THAT FALSIFY THE
      > SUBMARINE COMMUNICATIONS THEORY.
      >

      If so, I'm sure we would all like to know what
      they are.


      >
      > WHAT EVIDENCE
      > SUPPORTS THAT THE HUM IS CAUSED BY ELF/ VLF SIGNALS
      > PRODUCED BY SUBMARINE COMMUNICATIONS?
      > PATTY, CA
      >

      Succinctly:

      1. Without going over old territory for the thousandth time,
      for multiple reasons the Hum does not appear to be an acoustic sound.

      2. If the Hum is not acoustic, then it either must be due to
      perception of EM signals (e.g., radio signals), or something
      unknown to science.

      3. Choosing EM from (2) above, the broadcast sources that are
      best correlated with Hum occurrences in time and space are the
      Navy submarine communications broadcasts from mobile sources,
      e.g., airplanes.

      This is my best "working hypothesis" at the present time.


      --David Deming
      Norman, Oklahoma
    • Alan Stevens
      ... Navy communications airplanes in OKLAHOMA?? A continual presence that makes you hear the Hum for hours at a time? C mon... that is very illogical. That
      Message 2 of 11 , Jul 12, 2004
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        --- In humforum@yahoogroups.com, "David Deming" <profdeming@e...>
        wrote:

        > Succinctly:
        >
        > 1. Without going over old territory for the thousandth time,
        > for multiple reasons the Hum does not appear to be an acoustic
        > sound.
        >
        > 2. If the Hum is not acoustic, then it either must be due to
        > perception of EM signals (e.g., radio signals), or something
        > unknown to science.
        >
        > 3. Choosing EM from (2) above, the broadcast sources that are
        > best correlated with Hum occurrences in time and space are the
        > Navy submarine communications broadcasts from mobile sources,
        > e.g., airplanes.
        >
        > This is my best "working hypothesis" at the present time.
        >
        >
        > --David Deming
        > Norman, Oklahoma

        Navy communications airplanes in OKLAHOMA?? A continual presence that
        makes you hear the Hum for hours at a time?

        C'mon... that is very illogical. That is over 1,500 miles from either
        ocean.

        Alan
      • David Deming
        ... Where I live, the Hum is discontinuous. But when it is around, it is typically on for 8 to 16 hour shifts. ... Yes, believe it or not, Oklahoma City is
        Message 3 of 11 , Jul 12, 2004
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          Re: HUM_FORUM:   Submarine Communications
          >
          > From: "Alan Stevens" <awstevens@...>
          > To: humforum@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: HUM_FORUM:   Submarine Communications
          > Date: Mon, Jul 12, 2004, 6:50 PM
          >
          > Navy communications airplanes in OKLAHOMA??  A continual presence that
          > makes you hear the Hum for hours at a time?
          >

          Where I live, the Hum is discontinuous.  But when it is around, it is
          typically "on" for 8 to 16 hour shifts.

          >
          > C'mon... that is very illogical.  That is over 1,500 miles from either
          > ocean.
          >

          Yes, believe it or not, Oklahoma City is home to something like
          1200 sailors.

          See:  http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/stratcomwingone.htm

          for other links, try a search engine with words like "Tinker" and "TACAMO"

          --David Deming
          Norman, Oklahoma
        • Alan Stevens
          ... that ... is ... either ... http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/stratcomwingone.htm ... TACAMO Most of the states in the US have Naval air
          Message 4 of 11 , Jul 12, 2004
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            --- In humforum@yahoogroups.com, "David Deming" <profdeming@e...>
            wrote:

            > > From: "Alan Stevens" <awstevens@y...>
            > > To: humforum@yahoogroups.com
            > > Subject: Re: HUM_FORUM: Submarine Communications
            > > Date: Mon, Jul 12, 2004, 6:50 PM
            > >
            > > Navy communications airplanes in OKLAHOMA?? A continual presence
            that
            > > makes you hear the Hum for hours at a time?
            >
            > Where I live, the Hum is discontinuous. But when it is around, it
            is
            > typically "on" for 8 to 16 hour shifts.
            >
            > > C'mon... that is very illogical. That is over 1,500 miles from
            either
            > > ocean.
            >
            > Yes, believe it or not, Oklahoma City is home to something like
            > 1200 sailors.
            >
            > See:
            http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/stratcomwingone.htm
            >
            > for other links, try a search engine with words like "Tinker" and
            "TACAMO"

            Most of the states in the US have Naval air stations, I'm not
            questioning that. I just don't understand why TACAMO aircraft would
            be doing extensive ELF communication while flying over the center of
            the country.

            Alan
          • David Deming
            ... TACAMO aircraft do not broadcast on ELF frequencies. They broadcast on VLF frequencies. In the 1990s, TACAMO took over the Looking Glass mission. This is
            Message 5 of 11 , Jul 12, 2004
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              Re: HUM_FORUM:   Submarine Communications

              >
              > From: "Alan Stevens" <awstevens@...>
              > To: humforum@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: HUM_FORUM:   Submarine Communications
              > Date: Mon, Jul 12, 2004, 9:23 PM
              >
              > Most of the states in the US have Naval air stations, I'm not
              > questioning that.  I just don't understand why TACAMO aircraft would
              > be doing extensive ELF communication while flying over the center of
              > the country.
              >
              > Alan
              >

              TACAMO aircraft do not broadcast on ELF frequencies.  They
              broadcast on VLF frequencies.

              In the 1990s, TACAMO took over the Looking Glass mission.

              This is all public-source information.

              --David Deming
              Norman, Oklahoma



            • Alan Stevens
              ... would ... of ... I thought you said before that you thought that the TACAMO aircraft may be responsible for the Hum. Very low frequency (VLF) has
              Message 6 of 11 , Jul 12, 2004
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                --- In humforum@yahoogroups.com, "David Deming" <profdeming@e...>
                wrote:
                >
                > > From: "Alan Stevens" <awstevens@y...>
                > > To: humforum@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: Re: HUM_FORUM: Submarine Communications
                > > Date: Mon, Jul 12, 2004, 9:23 PM
                > >
                > > Most of the states in the US have Naval air stations, I'm not
                > > questioning that. I just don't understand why TACAMO aircraft
                would
                > > be doing extensive ELF communication while flying over the center
                of
                > > the country.
                > >
                > > Alan
                >
                > TACAMO aircraft do not broadcast on ELF frequencies. They
                > broadcast on VLF frequencies.
                >
                > In the 1990s, TACAMO took over the Looking Glass mission.
                >
                > This is all public-source information.

                I thought you said before that you thought that the TACAMO aircraft
                may be responsible for the Hum.

                Very low frequency (VLF) has frequencies ranging from 3 kHz to 30 kHz,
                far higher than the usual "tone" of the Hum (about 40 to 70 Hz).

                Alan


                >
                > --David Deming
                > Norman, Oklahoma
              • Tobypaws2002@aol.com
                In a message dated 13/07/2004 04:40:10 GMT Daylight Time, awstevens@yahoo.com ... That s what puzzles me, too ! R.M. England.
                Message 7 of 11 , Jul 14, 2004
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                  In a message dated 13/07/2004 04:40:10 GMT Daylight Time, awstevens@... writes:

                  I thought you said before that you thought that the TACAMO aircraft
                  may be responsible for the Hum.

                  Very low frequency (VLF) has frequencies ranging from 3 kHz to 30 kHz,
                  far higher than the usual "tone" of the Hum (about 40 to 70 Hz).

                  Alan


                  That's what puzzles me, too !
                  R.M.   England.
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