Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

[agade] NEWS: Syriac ms confiscated

Expand Messages
  • George Kiraz
    From : [Go there for pict] ======================================== Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac
    Message 1 of 7 , May 3, 2013
    • 0 Attachment
      From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
      [Go there for pict]
      ========================================

      Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
      eastern province

      A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
      the eastern province of Van.

      The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
      police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
      receiving a tip on the matter.

      The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
      covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

      Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
      an initial examination.

      Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.
    • Hidemi Takahashi
      Dear all, You ll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:
      Message 2 of 7 , May 3, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        Dear all,

        You'll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:

        http://www.habertakip.com/component/habertakip/cluster/2720332-van&apos%3Bda_300_yillik_suryanice_kitap.html

        including one of the opening page at a higher resolution here:

        http://www.haberler.com/van-da-300-yillik-tarihi-kitap-4572913-haberi/

        HT

        -------------------------

        From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
        [Go there for pict]
        ========================================

        Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
        eastern province

        A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
        the eastern province of Van.

        The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
        police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
        receiving a tip on the matter.

        The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
        covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

        Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
        an initial examination.

        Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.
      • Steven Ring
        It looks like an East Syrian liturgical Ms. Perhaps liturgical prayers extracted from the East Syrian Shhima for the period between the Nativity and the
        Message 3 of 7 , May 4, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          It looks like an East Syrian liturgical Ms. Perhaps liturgical prayers extracted from the East Syrian Shhima for the period between the Nativity and the Epiphany (December - January), Regards, S.


          On 04/05/2013 04:02, Hidemi Takahashi wrote:
           

          Dear all,

          You'll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:

          http://www.habertakip.com/component/habertakip/cluster/2720332-van&apos%3Bda_300_yillik_suryanice_kitap.html

          including one of the opening page at a higher resolution here:

          http://www.haberler.com/van-da-300-yillik-tarihi-kitap-4572913-haberi/

          HT

          -------------------------

          >From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
          [Go there for pict]
          ========================================

          Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
          eastern province

          A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
          the eastern province of Van.

          The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
          police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
          receiving a tip on the matter.

          The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
          covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

          Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
          an initial examination.

          Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.

          No virus found in this message.
          Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
          Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6292 - Release Date: 05/02/13


        • Todd Godwin
          does anyone know of any research which may have been done on the issues of saints in early shi ism and possible connections to 7th and 8th century syriac
          Message 4 of 7 , May 4, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            does anyone know of any research which may have been done on the issues of saints in early shi'ism and possible connections to 7th and 8th century syriac christianity and its politics in eastern Abbasid empire?   shia-ism moved away from Arab Muslim emphasis on the Hajj.  The last Abbasid caliph to lead the Hajj was I believe in the early 9th century.  This is tied Iranian indepedence movements from Abbasid control in Transoxiania and in Persia.  I am wondering if a connection to Syriac christianity, which is heavily focused on saints and saints' relics and holy men in its East Syriac form (where the saint may have been a charisma holder like the Shi' holy man), can be found and if so how?   Good research on early shi'ism and its saints and politics would be appreciated too, if anyone knows of any.
             
             
             
            thanks, Todd
             
              



             

            To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
            From: steven.ring@...
            Date: Sat, 4 May 2013 08:28:51 +0100
            Subject: Re: [hugoye-list] [agade] NEWS: Syriac ms confiscated

             
            It looks like an East Syrian liturgical Ms. Perhaps liturgical prayers extracted from the East Syrian Shhima for the period between the Nativity and the Epiphany (December - January), Regards, S.


            On 04/05/2013 04:02, Hidemi Takahashi wrote:
             

            Dear all,

            You'll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:

            http://www.habertakip.com/component/habertakip/cluster/2720332-van&apos%3Bda_300_yillik_suryanice_kitap.html

            including one of the opening page at a higher resolution here:

            http://www.haberler.com/van-da-300-yillik-tarihi-kitap-4572913-haberi/

            HT

            -------------------------

            >From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
            [Go there for pict]
            ========================================

            Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
            eastern province

            A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
            the eastern province of Van.

            The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
            police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
            receiving a tip on the matter.

            The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
            covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

            Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
            an initial examination.

            Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.


            No virus found in this message.
            Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
            Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6292 - Release Date: 05/02/13



          • Sean Anthony
            Hi Todd, There is a great deal of overlap between Shi ism and Syriac Christianity (and other religions of the Near East as well) on all fronts. Kufah, the
            Message 5 of 7 , May 5, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              Hi Todd, 


              There is a great deal of overlap between Shi'ism and Syriac Christianity (and other religions of the Near East as well) on all fronts. Kufah, the epicenter of Shi'ism, was a giant assimilation engine for bringing non-Arabs into Islamicate culture and, of course, many of the earliest non-Arabs brought their beliefs, stories, culture, etc. with them. Really, it's just a matter of connecting the dots historically, but the lines aren't always straight. 

              There is scant evidence, however, that Syriac speaking Christians had anything to do with the nativist and restorationist movements among the non-urban populations of the eastern lands of the caliphate. These are nearly exclusively Khurram-diniyya/'Neo-Mazdakite'. (Intellectual history is another matter though. This is a good place to start: http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/korramis).

              No one has done a direct comparison of Shi'ite ziyarat and Christian pilgrimage to shrines, to my knowledge, though I may be forgetting something.  Diem and Schoeller's 3 volume study, The Living and the Dead in Islam (2005) is a good place to start though:



              And Leor Halevi's excellent monograph, Muhammad's Grave (2011), contains many comparative observations on burial practices among Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians:


              The Hajj is a massive subject that  I can't address briefly here, but you might be interested in look at the Christian physician Qusta ibn Luqa's treatise on his advised medical regime for Muslim pilgrims on Hajj edited by Gerrit Bos.

              Hope that helps. 

              Sean 


              =====================
              Sean W. Anthony
              Assistant Professor of Islamic History
              390 MacKenzie Hall
              1288 University of Oregon
              Eugene, OR 97403





              From: Todd Godwin <toddgodwin@...>
              To: "hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com" <hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Sat, May 4, 2013 9:21:56 AM
              Subject: [hugoye-list] RE: Shi'ism, Saints, Syriacs and Transoxiana

               

              does anyone know of any research which may have been done on the issues of saints in early shi'ism and possible connections to 7th and 8th century syriac christianity and its politics in eastern Abbasid empire?   shia-ism moved away from Arab Muslim emphasis on the Hajj.  The last Abbasid caliph to lead the Hajj was I believe in the early 9th century.  This is tied Iranian indepedence movements from Abbasid control in Transoxiania and in Persia.  I am wondering if a connection to Syriac christianity, which is heavily focused on saints and saints' relics and holy men in its East Syriac form (where the saint may have been a charisma holder like the Shi' holy man), can be found and if so how?   Good research on early shi'ism and its saints and politics would be appreciated too, if anyone knows of any.
               
               
               
              thanks, Todd
               
                



               

              To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
              From: steven.ring@...
              Date: Sat, 4 May 2013 08:28:51 +0100
              Subject: Re: [hugoye-list] [agade] NEWS: Syriac ms confiscated

               
              It looks like an East Syrian liturgical Ms. Perhaps liturgical prayers extracted from the East Syrian Shhima for the period between the Nativity and the Epiphany (December - January), Regards, S.


              On 04/05/2013 04:02, Hidemi Takahashi wrote:
               

              Dear all,

              You'll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:

              http://www.habertakip.com/component/habertakip/cluster/2720332-van&apos%3Bda_300_yillik_suryanice_kitap.html

              including one of the opening page at a higher resolution here:

              http://www.haberler.com/van-da-300-yillik-tarihi-kitap-4572913-haberi/

              HT

              -------------------------

              >From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
              [Go there for pict]
              ========================================

              Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
              eastern province

              A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
              the eastern province of Van.

              The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
              police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
              receiving a tip on the matter.

              The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
              covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

              Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
              an initial examination.

              Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.


              No virus found in this message.
              Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
              Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6292 - Release Date: 05/02/13



            • Todd Godwin
              thank you Sean! I may have to come back and pick your brain a bit later on this after giving it some more thought and following up on these references. Todd
              Message 6 of 7 , May 6, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                thank you Sean!  I may have to come back and pick your brain a bit later on this after giving it some more thought and following up on these references. 
                 
                Todd



                 

                To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
                From: tron_honto@...
                Date: Sun, 5 May 2013 10:04:52 -0700
                Subject: Re: [hugoye-list] RE: Shi'ism, Saints, Syriacs and Transoxiana

                 
                Hi Todd, 


                There is a great deal of overlap between Shi'ism and Syriac Christianity (and other religions of the Near East as well) on all fronts. Kufah, the epicenter of Shi'ism, was a giant assimilation engine for bringing non-Arabs into Islamicate culture and, of course, many of the earliest non-Arabs brought their beliefs, stories, culture, etc. with them. Really, it's just a matter of connecting the dots historically, but the lines aren't always straight. 

                There is scant evidence, however, that Syriac speaking Christians had anything to do with the nativist and restorationist movements among the non-urban populations of the eastern lands of the caliphate. These are nearly exclusively Khurram-diniyya/'Neo-Mazdakite'. (Intellectual history is another matter though. This is a good place to start: http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/korramis).

                No one has done a direct comparison of Shi'ite ziyarat and Christian pilgrimage to shrines, to my knowledge, though I may be forgetting something.  Diem and Schoeller's 3 volume study, The Living and the Dead in Islam (2005) is a good place to start though:



                And Leor Halevi's excellent monograph, Muhammad's Grave (2011), contains many comparative observations on burial practices among Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians:


                The Hajj is a massive subject that  I can't address briefly here, but you might be interested in look at the Christian physician Qusta ibn Luqa's treatise on his advised medical regime for Muslim pilgrims on Hajj edited by Gerrit Bos.

                Hope that helps. 

                Sean 


                =====================
                Sean W. Anthony
                Assistant Professor of Islamic History
                390 MacKenzie Hall
                1288 University of Oregon
                Eugene, OR 97403





                From: Todd Godwin <toddgodwin@...>
                To: "hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com" <hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Sat, May 4, 2013 9:21:56 AM
                Subject: [hugoye-list] RE: Shi'ism, Saints, Syriacs and Transoxiana

                 


                does anyone know of any research which may have been done on the issues of saints in early shi'ism and possible connections to 7th and 8th century syriac christianity and its politics in eastern Abbasid empire?   shia-ism moved away from Arab Muslim emphasis on the Hajj.  The last Abbasid caliph to lead the Hajj was I believe in the early 9th century.  This is tied Iranian indepedence movements from Abbasid control in Transoxiania and in Persia.  I am wondering if a connection to Syriac christianity, which is heavily focused on saints and saints' relics and holy men in its East Syriac form (where the saint may have been a charisma holder like the Shi' holy man), can be found and if so how?   Good research on early shi'ism and its saints and politics would be appreciated too, if anyone knows of any.
                 
                 
                 
                thanks, Todd
                 
                  



                 

                To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
                From: steven.ring@...
                Date: Sat, 4 May 2013 08:28:51 +0100
                Subject: Re: [hugoye-list] [agade] NEWS: Syriac ms confiscated

                 
                It looks like an East Syrian liturgical Ms. Perhaps liturgical prayers extracted from the East Syrian Shhima for the period between the Nativity and the Epiphany (December - January), Regards, S.


                On 04/05/2013 04:02, Hidemi Takahashi wrote:
                 
                Dear all,

                You'll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:

                http://www.habertakip.com/component/habertakip/cluster/2720332-van&apos%3Bda_300_yillik_suryanice_kitap.html

                including one of the opening page at a higher resolution here:

                http://www.haberler.com/van-da-300-yillik-tarihi-kitap-4572913-haberi/

                HT

                -------------------------

                >From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
                [Go there for pict]
                ========================================

                Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
                eastern province

                A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
                the eastern province of Van.

                The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
                police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
                receiving a tip on the matter.

                The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
                covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

                Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
                an initial examination.

                Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.



                No virus found in this message.
                Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6292 - Release Date: 05/02/13




              • Guy Trolliet
                Hi Todd, You may want to look at the work done by Mohammad-Ali Amir-Moezzi, particularly if you are French conversant, with his two books, “Le guide divin
                Message 7 of 7 , May 13, 2013
                • 0 Attachment

                  Hi Todd,

                  You may want to look at the work done by Mohammad-Ali Amir-Moezzi, particularly if you are French conversant, with his two books, “Le guide divin dans le shî'isme originel : Aux sources de l'ésotérisme en islam” and “Le Coran silencieux et le Coran parlant”.

                  All the best,

                   

                  Guy

                  From: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com [mailto:hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Todd Godwin
                  Sent: Monday, May 06, 2013 11:08 AM
                  To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [hugoye-list] RE: Shi'ism, Saints, Syriacs and Transoxiana

                   

                   

                  thank you Sean!  I may have to come back and pick your brain a bit later on this after giving it some more thought and following up on these references. 
                   
                  Todd


                   


                  To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
                  From: tron_honto@...
                  Date: Sun, 5 May 2013 10:04:52 -0700
                  Subject: Re: [hugoye-list] RE: Shi'ism, Saints, Syriacs and Transoxiana

                   

                  Hi Todd, 

                   

                   

                  There is a great deal of overlap between Shi'ism and Syriac Christianity (and other religions of the Near East as well) on all fronts. Kufah, the epicenter of Shi'ism, was a giant assimilation engine for bringing non-Arabs into Islamicate culture and, of course, many of the earliest non-Arabs brought their beliefs, stories, culture, etc. with them. Really, it's just a matter of connecting the dots historically, but the lines aren't always straight. 

                   

                  There is scant evidence, however, that Syriac speaking Christians had anything to do with the nativist and restorationist movements among the non-urban populations of the eastern lands of the caliphate. These are nearly exclusively Khurram-diniyya/'Neo-Mazdakite'. (Intellectual history is another matter though. This is a good place to start: http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/korramis).

                   

                  No one has done a direct comparison of Shi'ite ziyarat and Christian pilgrimage to shrines, to my knowledge, though I may be forgetting something.  Diem and Schoeller's 3 volume study, The Living and the Dead in Islam (2005) is a good place to start though:

                   

                   

                   

                  And Leor Halevi's excellent monograph, Muhammad's Grave (2011), contains many comparative observations on burial practices among Muslims, Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians:

                   

                   

                  The Hajj is a massive subject that  I can't address briefly here, but you might be interested in look at the Christian physician Qusta ibn Luqa's treatise on his advised medical regime for Muslim pilgrims on Hajj edited by Gerrit Bos.

                   

                  Hope that helps. 

                   

                  Sean 

                   

                   

                  =====================

                  Sean W. Anthony

                  Assistant Professor of Islamic History

                  390 MacKenzie Hall

                  1288 University of Oregon

                  Eugene, OR 97403

                   

                   

                   

                   


                  From: Todd Godwin <toddgodwin@...>
                  To: "hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com" <hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Sat, May 4, 2013 9:21:56 AM
                  Subject: [hugoye-list] RE: Shi'ism, Saints, Syriacs and Transoxiana

                   

                   

                  does anyone know of any research which may have been done on the issues of saints in early shi'ism and possible connections to 7th and 8th century syriac christianity and its politics in eastern Abbasid empire?   shia-ism moved away from Arab Muslim emphasis on the Hajj.  The last Abbasid caliph to lead the Hajj was I believe in the early 9th century.  This is tied Iranian indepedence movements from Abbasid control in Transoxiania and in Persia.  I am wondering if a connection to Syriac christianity, which is heavily focused on saints and saints' relics and holy men in its East Syriac form (where the saint may have been a charisma holder like the Shi' holy man), can be found and if so how?   Good research on early shi'ism and its saints and politics would be appreciated too, if anyone knows of any.
                   
                   
                   
                  thanks, Todd
                   
                    


                   


                  To: hugoye-list@yahoogroups.com
                  From: steven.ring@...
                  Date: Sat, 4 May 2013 08:28:51 +0100
                  Subject: Re: [hugoye-list] [agade] NEWS: Syriac ms confiscated

                   

                  It looks like an East Syrian liturgical Ms. Perhaps liturgical prayers extracted from the East Syrian Shhima for the period between the Nativity and the Epiphany (December - January), Regards, S.

                  On 04/05/2013 04:02, Hidemi Takahashi wrote:

                   

                  Dear all,

                  You'll find a few more, different, photos of the manuscript starting from here:

                  http://www.habertakip.com/component/habertakip/cluster/2720332-van&apos%3Bda_300_yillik_suryanice_kitap.html

                  including one of the opening page at a higher resolution here:

                  http://www.haberler.com/van-da-300-yillik-tarihi-kitap-4572913-haberi/

                  HT

                  -------------------------

                  >From <http://tinyurl.com/c7lsuef>:
                  [Go there for pict]
                  ========================================

                  Priceless 300-year-old religious manuscript in Syriac discovered in
                  eastern province

                  A 300-year-old religious manuscript has been seized by the police in
                  the eastern province of Van.

                  The Anti-Smuggling and Organized Crime Department units of the Van
                  police have detained one suspect and seized the manuscript after
                  receiving a tip on the matter.

                  The manuscript, which is written in Syriac on watermarked paper and
                  covered with goat skin, is around 300 years old, according to experts.

                  Experts confirmed that the manuscript is original and priceless after
                  an initial examination.

                  Further investigation of the matter is ongoing.


                  No virus found in this message.
                  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                  Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6292 - Release Date: 05/02/13

                   

                   

                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.