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Re: [hreg] Still more on the solar house

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  • Marjorie N Wood
    How solar does a solar house have to be? Could a solar house be passive solar, with great insulation and perfect windows? Could it be a house with a solar
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 16, 2000
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      How solar does a solar house have to be? Could a solar house be passive
      solar, with great insulation and perfect windows? Could it be a house
      with a solar water heater and maybe skylights and a solar cooker in the
      yard? Everyone loves solar houses that get prizes but some folks might
      like to see ordinary folks who try to pay their bills not with lots of
      money, using a variety of solar applications. If that is so, I am told
      that there are whole subdivisions in Houston with solar water heaters
      installed. My friend Jube Dankworth, a home schooler, has had a solar
      water heater on her house in Houston for 20 years. How about writing a
      letter to the editor in the Houston paper, asking for responses from
      folks with solar houses? Do you think that might get some interesting
      responses?
      Marge

      On Wed, 16 Aug 2000 11:10:55 EDT ChasMauch@... writes:
      > Hello everyone,
      >
      > Thanks for all the feedback so far, most positive. However, I was a
      > little
      > disturbed by several of Kevin's comments.
      >
      > For one, I was not aware that award winning solar demonstration
      > homes have
      > been build in Houston (or that Mike has a solar home). If that is
      > the case,
      > why couldn't we have a solar home show here? I thought we discussed
      > that once
      > but decided that there wern't any such homes available and you have
      > to go to
      > Austin for that kind of thing. Would like to know where these homes
      > are so I
      > could go see them.
      >
      > Also the comment that I am expecting the professional members of the
      > HREG to
      > contribute their time and expertise, basically asking them to work
      > for free,
      > and that will not be well received, it will be up to me to make this
      > happen,
      > my will, money, etc. It was never my intent to ask anyone to do
      > anything that
      > they are not willing and even anxious to do out of pure interest in
      > the
      > project and promoting HREG and solar in general in the Houston area.
      >
      > Obviously I would pay for the house, using any discounts, grants, or
      > other
      > help that I can find, but would not ask for help from anyone who
      > feels they
      > need to be paid for just talking about such a project, since I
      > thought that
      > was what HREG was all about. Maybe I'm confused on this.
      >
      > But I do appreciate all the comments so far, and am serious about
      > the whole
      > thing. Oral's suggestion that we might find some funding to help out
      > with it
      > sounds interesting. Let's look at it this way. If we did research on
      > an
      > absolutely state of the art house of the future - not only energy
      > efficient
      > but healthy (filtered air to remove pollen and Houston's infamous
      > pollution,
      > clean water - carbon bed, reverse osmosis, etc) and made it as nice
      > yet as
      > economical as possible, and then actually built it, then maybe more
      > people
      > would build such houses too. I think that is an interesting project
      > in
      > itself, and probably there is lots of literature available that some
      > of our
      > members know about. Then I might be the first to build such a house,
      > which
      > would be a benefit to me, but hopefully everyone would enjoy being
      > involved.
      > Then again I might decide for one reason or another I don't want to
      > do it
      > after all - which I would need to reserve the right to do, but it
      > would not
      > have been a waste. At least, I don't think it would be.
      >
      > Anyway, would like to continue the discussion here and see what kind
      > of
      > consensus we can come to, if any. Hope everyone will contribute to
      > the
      > conversation.
      >
      > Charlie
      >
      >

      >
      >
      >
    • Dan from Texas
      Marjorie: I know what you mean. The subdivision my sistem lives in in the Katy area has Solar water heaters, but most of them don t work. They were
      Message 2 of 7 , Aug 16, 2000
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        Marjorie: I know what you mean. The subdivision my sistem lives in in the
        Katy area has Solar water heaters, but most of them don't work. They were
        installed when the houses were built and 20 years ago, the technology was
        pretty new and the systems did not have the quality and engineering to make
        them easy to maintain and last this long. I will have to check to see what
        my sister did with the system she had on her house. Maybe I could get it to
        work again withg some repair work and modifications.

        I think a solar house could be both passive an active. If a house was built
        with passive's for the heating and cooling, a small PV system could be used
        with low voltage flouresents for lighting and some of the lower amperage
        appliances.

        There are three types of houses that can be built economically and highly
        efficent. These being concrete monolithic domes, wooden geodesic domes with
        at least R45 insulation, and late 19th century Texas style ranch house made
        of straw and adobe with wide porches and overhangs.

        On a side note, does anyone have experience using PV panels?

        Dan Stuettgen

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Marjorie N Wood [mailto:othermother6@...]
        Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 6:29 PM
        To: hreg@egroups.com
        Subject: Re: [hreg] Still more on the solar house


        How solar does a solar house have to be? Could a solar house be passive
        solar, with great insulation and perfect windows? Could it be a house
        with a solar water heater and maybe skylights and a solar cooker in the
        yard? Everyone loves solar houses that get prizes but some folks might
        like to see ordinary folks who try to pay their bills not with lots of
        money, using a variety of solar applications. If that is so, I am told
        that there are whole subdivisions in Houston with solar water heaters
        installed. My friend Jube Dankworth, a home schooler, has had a solar
        water heater on her house in Houston for 20 years. How about writing a
        letter to the editor in the Houston paper, asking for responses from
        folks with solar houses? Do you think that might get some interesting
        responses?
        Marge

        On Wed, 16 Aug 2000 11:10:55 EDT ChasMauch@... writes:
        > Hello everyone,
        >
        > Thanks for all the feedback so far, most positive. However, I was a
        > little
        > disturbed by several of Kevin's comments.
        >
        > For one, I was not aware that award winning solar demonstration
        > homes have
        > been build in Houston (or that Mike has a solar home). If that is
        > the case,
        > why couldn't we have a solar home show here? I thought we discussed
        > that once
        > but decided that there wern't any such homes available and you have
        > to go to
        > Austin for that kind of thing. Would like to know where these homes
        > are so I
        > could go see them.
        >
        > Also the comment that I am expecting the professional members of the
        > HREG to
        > contribute their time and expertise, basically asking them to work
        > for free,
        > and that will not be well received, it will be up to me to make this
        > happen,
        > my will, money, etc. It was never my intent to ask anyone to do
        > anything that
        > they are not willing and even anxious to do out of pure interest in
        > the
        > project and promoting HREG and solar in general in the Houston area.
        >
        > Obviously I would pay for the house, using any discounts, grants, or
        > other
        > help that I can find, but would not ask for help from anyone who
        > feels they
        > need to be paid for just talking about such a project, since I
        > thought that
        > was what HREG was all about. Maybe I'm confused on this.
        >
        > But I do appreciate all the comments so far, and am serious about
        > the whole
        > thing. Oral's suggestion that we might find some funding to help out
        > with it
        > sounds interesting. Let's look at it this way. If we did research on
        > an
        > absolutely state of the art house of the future - not only energy
        > efficient
        > but healthy (filtered air to remove pollen and Houston's infamous
        > pollution,
        > clean water - carbon bed, reverse osmosis, etc) and made it as nice
        > yet as
        > economical as possible, and then actually built it, then maybe more
        > people
        > would build such houses too. I think that is an interesting project
        > in
        > itself, and probably there is lots of literature available that some
        > of our
        > members know about. Then I might be the first to build such a house,
        > which
        > would be a benefit to me, but hopefully everyone would enjoy being
        > involved.
        > Then again I might decide for one reason or another I don't want to
        > do it
        > after all - which I would need to reserve the right to do, but it
        > would not
        > have been a waste. At least, I don't think it would be.
        >
        > Anyway, would like to continue the discussion here and see what kind
        > of
        > consensus we can come to, if any. Hope everyone will contribute to
        > the
        > conversation.
        >
        > Charlie
        >
        >

        >
        >
        >
      • Steve Stelzer
        Hi there Marjorie: Great idea. I d like to talk to your friend Jube about his solar water heater, and I would be very interested to learn about a subdivision
        Message 3 of 7 , Aug 17, 2000
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          Hi there Marjorie: Great idea. I'd like to talk to your friend Jube about
          his solar water heater, and I would be very interested to learn about a
          subdivision here with solar water heaters. Could you track that down?
          Believe it or not, there are organizations that have built normal homes in
          hot/humid climates that use 50% less energy to run, without any bizarre or
          incredibly expensive technological improvements. If you or anyone are
          interested in reading about them, I can forward the websites.

          Steve Stelzer

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Marjorie N Wood [mailto:othermother6@...]
          Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 6:29 PM
          To: hreg@egroups.com
          Subject: Re: [hreg] Still more on the solar house


          How solar does a solar house have to be? Could a solar house be passive
          solar, with great insulation and perfect windows? Could it be a house
          with a solar water heater and maybe skylights and a solar cooker in the
          yard? Everyone loves solar houses that get prizes but some folks might
          like to see ordinary folks who try to pay their bills not with lots of
          money, using a variety of solar applications. If that is so, I am told
          that there are whole subdivisions in Houston with solar water heaters
          installed. My friend Jube Dankworth, a home schooler, has had a solar
          water heater on her house in Houston for 20 years. How about writing a
          letter to the editor in the Houston paper, asking for responses from
          folks with solar houses? Do you think that might get some interesting
          responses?
          Marge

          On Wed, 16 Aug 2000 11:10:55 EDT ChasMauch@... writes:
          > Hello everyone,
          >
          > Thanks for all the feedback so far, most positive. However, I was a
          > little
          > disturbed by several of Kevin's comments.
          >
          > For one, I was not aware that award winning solar demonstration
          > homes have
          > been build in Houston (or that Mike has a solar home). If that is
          > the case,
          > why couldn't we have a solar home show here? I thought we discussed
          > that once
          > but decided that there wern't any such homes available and you have
          > to go to
          > Austin for that kind of thing. Would like to know where these homes
          > are so I
          > could go see them.
          >
          > Also the comment that I am expecting the professional members of the
          > HREG to
          > contribute their time and expertise, basically asking them to work
          > for free,
          > and that will not be well received, it will be up to me to make this
          > happen,
          > my will, money, etc. It was never my intent to ask anyone to do
          > anything that
          > they are not willing and even anxious to do out of pure interest in
          > the
          > project and promoting HREG and solar in general in the Houston area.
          >
          > Obviously I would pay for the house, using any discounts, grants, or
          > other
          > help that I can find, but would not ask for help from anyone who
          > feels they
          > need to be paid for just talking about such a project, since I
          > thought that
          > was what HREG was all about. Maybe I'm confused on this.
          >
          > But I do appreciate all the comments so far, and am serious about
          > the whole
          > thing. Oral's suggestion that we might find some funding to help out
          > with it
          > sounds interesting. Let's look at it this way. If we did research on
          > an
          > absolutely state of the art house of the future - not only energy
          > efficient
          > but healthy (filtered air to remove pollen and Houston's infamous
          > pollution,
          > clean water - carbon bed, reverse osmosis, etc) and made it as nice
          > yet as
          > economical as possible, and then actually built it, then maybe more
          > people
          > would build such houses too. I think that is an interesting project
          > in
          > itself, and probably there is lots of literature available that some
          > of our
          > members know about. Then I might be the first to build such a house,
          > which
          > would be a benefit to me, but hopefully everyone would enjoy being
          > involved.
          > Then again I might decide for one reason or another I don't want to
          > do it
          > after all - which I would need to reserve the right to do, but it
          > would not
          > have been a waste. At least, I don't think it would be.
          >
          > Anyway, would like to continue the discussion here and see what kind
          > of
          > consensus we can come to, if any. Hope everyone will contribute to
          > the
          > conversation.
          >
          > Charlie
          >
          >

          >
          >
          >
        • Richard G. Morgan
          Web sites wanted. RGMorgan, Mobile, AL ... From: Steve Stelzer To: Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 8:43 AM Subject:
          Message 4 of 7 , Aug 17, 2000
          • 0 Attachment
            Web sites wanted. RGMorgan, Mobile, AL
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Steve Stelzer" <steve@...>
            To: <hreg@egroups.com>
            Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 8:43 AM
            Subject: RE: [hreg] Still more on the solar house


            > Hi there Marjorie: Great idea. I'd like to talk to your friend Jube
            about
            > his solar water heater, and I would be very interested to learn about a
            > subdivision here with solar water heaters. Could you track that down?
            > Believe it or not, there are organizations that have built normal homes in
            > hot/humid climates that use 50% less energy to run, without any bizarre or
            > incredibly expensive technological improvements. If you or anyone are
            > interested in reading about them, I can forward the websites.
            >
            > Steve Stelzer
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: Marjorie N Wood [mailto:othermother6@...]
            > Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 6:29 PM
            > To: hreg@egroups.com
            > Subject: Re: [hreg] Still more on the solar house
            >
            >
            > How solar does a solar house have to be? Could a solar house be passive
            > solar, with great insulation and perfect windows? Could it be a house
            > with a solar water heater and maybe skylights and a solar cooker in the
            > yard? Everyone loves solar houses that get prizes but some folks might
            > like to see ordinary folks who try to pay their bills not with lots of
            > money, using a variety of solar applications. If that is so, I am told
            > that there are whole subdivisions in Houston with solar water heaters
            > installed. My friend Jube Dankworth, a home schooler, has had a solar
            > water heater on her house in Houston for 20 years. How about writing a
            > letter to the editor in the Houston paper, asking for responses from
            > folks with solar houses? Do you think that might get some interesting
            > responses?
            > Marge
            >
            > On Wed, 16 Aug 2000 11:10:55 EDT ChasMauch@... writes:
            > > Hello everyone,
            > >
            > > Thanks for all the feedback so far, most positive. However, I was a
            > > little
            > > disturbed by several of Kevin's comments.
            > >
            > > For one, I was not aware that award winning solar demonstration
            > > homes have
            > > been build in Houston (or that Mike has a solar home). If that is
            > > the case,
            > > why couldn't we have a solar home show here? I thought we discussed
            > > that once
            > > but decided that there wern't any such homes available and you have
            > > to go to
            > > Austin for that kind of thing. Would like to know where these homes
            > > are so I
            > > could go see them.
            > >
            > > Also the comment that I am expecting the professional members of the
            > > HREG to
            > > contribute their time and expertise, basically asking them to work
            > > for free,
            > > and that will not be well received, it will be up to me to make this
            > > happen,
            > > my will, money, etc. It was never my intent to ask anyone to do
            > > anything that
            > > they are not willing and even anxious to do out of pure interest in
            > > the
            > > project and promoting HREG and solar in general in the Houston area.
            > >
            > > Obviously I would pay for the house, using any discounts, grants, or
            > > other
            > > help that I can find, but would not ask for help from anyone who
            > > feels they
            > > need to be paid for just talking about such a project, since I
            > > thought that
            > > was what HREG was all about. Maybe I'm confused on this.
            > >
            > > But I do appreciate all the comments so far, and am serious about
            > > the whole
            > > thing. Oral's suggestion that we might find some funding to help out
            > > with it
            > > sounds interesting. Let's look at it this way. If we did research on
            > > an
            > > absolutely state of the art house of the future - not only energy
            > > efficient
            > > but healthy (filtered air to remove pollen and Houston's infamous
            > > pollution,
            > > clean water - carbon bed, reverse osmosis, etc) and made it as nice
            > > yet as
            > > economical as possible, and then actually built it, then maybe more
            > > people
            > > would build such houses too. I think that is an interesting project
            > > in
            > > itself, and probably there is lots of literature available that some
            > > of our
            > > members know about. Then I might be the first to build such a house,
            > > which
            > > would be a benefit to me, but hopefully everyone would enjoy being
            > > involved.
            > > Then again I might decide for one reason or another I don't want to
            > > do it
            > > after all - which I would need to reserve the right to do, but it
            > > would not
            > > have been a waste. At least, I don't think it would be.
            > >
            > > Anyway, would like to continue the discussion here and see what kind
            > > of
            > > consensus we can come to, if any. Hope everyone will contribute to
            > > the
            > > conversation.
            > >
            > > Charlie
            > >
            > >
            >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
          • Marjorie N Wood
            My friend Jube has a twenty year old solar water heater in Houston and hers has never given her any trouble. Just wanted y all to know that. And talk to Andrew
            Message 5 of 7 , Aug 17, 2000
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              My friend Jube has a twenty year old solar water heater in Houston and
              hers has never given her any trouble. Just wanted y'all to know that. And
              talk to Andrew McCalla at 512 477 3050 for PV design and installation if
              you want it done professionally.
              Marge
            • Robert Johnston
              I like that idea (of the letter to the paper). What if the letter included a link to our website, and what if Jonathan set up a place (bulletin board) where
              Message 6 of 7 , Aug 21, 2000
              • 0 Attachment
                I like that idea (of the letter to the paper). What if the letter included
                a link to our website, and what if Jonathan set up a place (bulletin board)
                where people could post their responses (e.g., tell us about their homes and
                features)?

                Robert Johnston


                -----Original Message-----
                From: Marjorie N Wood [mailto:othermother6@...]
                Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 6:29 PM
                To: hreg@egroups.com
                Subject: Re: [hreg] Still more on the solar house


                How solar does a solar house have to be? Could a solar house be passive
                solar, with great insulation and perfect windows? Could it be a house
                with a solar water heater and maybe skylights and a solar cooker in the
                yard? Everyone loves solar houses that get prizes but some folks might
                like to see ordinary folks who try to pay their bills not with lots of
                money, using a variety of solar applications. If that is so, I am told
                that there are whole subdivisions in Houston with solar water heaters
                installed. My friend Jube Dankworth, a home schooler, has had a solar
                water heater on her house in Houston for 20 years. How about writing a
                letter to the editor in the Houston paper, asking for responses from
                folks with solar houses? Do you think that might get some interesting
                responses?
                Marge

                On Wed, 16 Aug 2000 11:10:55 EDT ChasMauch@... writes:
                > Hello everyone,
                >
                > Thanks for all the feedback so far, most positive. However, I was a
                > little
                > disturbed by several of Kevin's comments.
                >
                > For one, I was not aware that award winning solar demonstration
                > homes have
                > been build in Houston (or that Mike has a solar home). If that is
                > the case,
                > why couldn't we have a solar home show here? I thought we discussed
                > that once
                > but decided that there wern't any such homes available and you have
                > to go to
                > Austin for that kind of thing. Would like to know where these homes
                > are so I
                > could go see them.
                >
                > Also the comment that I am expecting the professional members of the
                > HREG to
                > contribute their time and expertise, basically asking them to work
                > for free,
                > and that will not be well received, it will be up to me to make this
                > happen,
                > my will, money, etc. It was never my intent to ask anyone to do
                > anything that
                > they are not willing and even anxious to do out of pure interest in
                > the
                > project and promoting HREG and solar in general in the Houston area.
                >
                > Obviously I would pay for the house, using any discounts, grants, or
                > other
                > help that I can find, but would not ask for help from anyone who
                > feels they
                > need to be paid for just talking about such a project, since I
                > thought that
                > was what HREG was all about. Maybe I'm confused on this.
                >
                > But I do appreciate all the comments so far, and am serious about
                > the whole
                > thing. Oral's suggestion that we might find some funding to help out
                > with it
                > sounds interesting. Let's look at it this way. If we did research on
                > an
                > absolutely state of the art house of the future - not only energy
                > efficient
                > but healthy (filtered air to remove pollen and Houston's infamous
                > pollution,
                > clean water - carbon bed, reverse osmosis, etc) and made it as nice
                > yet as
                > economical as possible, and then actually built it, then maybe more
                > people
                > would build such houses too. I think that is an interesting project
                > in
                > itself, and probably there is lots of literature available that some
                > of our
                > members know about. Then I might be the first to build such a house,
                > which
                > would be a benefit to me, but hopefully everyone would enjoy being
                > involved.
                > Then again I might decide for one reason or another I don't want to
                > do it
                > after all - which I would need to reserve the right to do, but it
                > would not
                > have been a waste. At least, I don't think it would be.
                >
                > Anyway, would like to continue the discussion here and see what kind
                > of
                > consensus we can come to, if any. Hope everyone will contribute to
                > the
                > conversation.
                >
                > Charlie
                >
                >

                >
                >
                >
              • Kevin L. Conlin
                I like Roberts comments on a local appropriate design guide for the steamy Gulf Coast climate, which is the biggest barrier to solarization in the Houston
                Message 7 of 7 , Aug 22, 2000
                • 0 Attachment
                  I like Roberts comments on a local appropriate design guide for the steamy
                  Gulf Coast climate, which is the biggest barrier to solarization in the
                  Houston area. So many technologies that work elsewhere aren't effective
                  here. I think some of this work may have been done by TX-SES (greenhouse
                  guide), HL&P (energy conservation tips) and TX A&M Energy extension service
                  (renewable technologies) Combined with some of the FSEC information, which
                  is appropriate, a pretty comprehensive guide could be developed. I think
                  HL&P is often receptive to these types of projects, they funded some of the
                  old Houston Solar Energy Society's publications, and even distributed them.
                  I think this type of project fits the purpose of the HREG, the hard part is
                  finding the champion to see it through. HSES used to publish design tips
                  in their monthly newsletter, a compilation of these articles might be an
                  easy way to get the project underway. Anyway, good idea, good luck!

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Robert Johnston <rjohnsto@...>
                  To: <hreg@egroups.com>
                  Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 6:58 PM
                  Subject: RE: [hreg] Still more on the solar house


                  > I was in agreement with Kevin until I read Charles latest note below.
                  E.g.
                  > I had an
                  > uneasy feeling about the proposal, in that it appeared self-serving (not
                  > that it wouldn't
                  > help others, but certainly would be of greatest benefit to Charles) and
                  > would make
                  > the professionals in our group feel taken advantage of, which I certainly
                  > would hate
                  > to see since they are such terrific resources for all of us (though
                  > hopefully we provide
                  > something of value to them in return).
                  >
                  > However, I like the way Charles puts it below. The idea of working
                  > collectively to put
                  > together a catalog of all the best ideas for the Houston area, and
                  > incorporating that into
                  > a house design, seems to me like a fun idea we could all contribute to.
                  Do
                  > it as a group
                  > exercise, without Charles' needs specifically in mind, but then he or
                  anyone
                  > else can build
                  > it later if desired, or use elements of the design. I'd propose that our
                  > professionals
                  > help in the process, but that when it comes to the stage of actually
                  drawing
                  > up plans, and
                  > then later, actually building one, we pay them for professional services
                  > rendered, perhaps
                  > encouraging our professional members to work together on the project as a
                  > team, or making
                  > them bid on it, for fairness (e.g., not to discriminate any one particular
                  > professional
                  > member in our group). I'm thinking mostly here of architects. Taking it
                  to
                  > the design
                  > and/or building stages would depend, of course, upon obtaining funding.
                  >
                  > If the first stage was a catalog of ideas, e.g., giving various options
                  for
                  > each element of
                  > the structure, such as papercrete, adobe, strawbale, aerated concrete,
                  > faswall, etc., for
                  > the walls, another list for the windows, another list for the roof,
                  cooling
                  > system, etc.,
                  > and giving pros/cons specifically for the Houston area (with references),
                  > that would be a
                  > terrific resource. If this were done as part of our website, it could be
                  a
                  > living document
                  > that evolves with time.
                  >
                  > My 2 cents...
                  >
                  > Robert
                  >
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: ChasMauch@... [mailto:ChasMauch@...]
                  > Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 10:11 AM
                  > To: hreg@egroups.com
                  > Subject: [hreg] Still more on the solar house
                  >
                  >
                  > Hello everyone,
                  >
                  > Thanks for all the feedback so far, most positive. However, I was a little
                  > disturbed by several of Kevin's comments.
                  >
                  > For one, I was not aware that award winning solar demonstration homes have
                  > been build in Houston (or that Mike has a solar home). If that is the
                  case,
                  > why couldn't we have a solar home show here? I thought we discussed that
                  > once
                  > but decided that there wern't any such homes available and you have to go
                  to
                  > Austin for that kind of thing. Would like to know where these homes are so
                  I
                  > could go see them.
                  >
                  > Also the comment that I am expecting the professional members of the HREG
                  to
                  > contribute their time and expertise, basically asking them to work for
                  free,
                  > and that will not be well received, it will be up to me to make this
                  happen,
                  > my will, money, etc. It was never my intent to ask anyone to do anything
                  > that
                  > they are not willing and even anxious to do out of pure interest in the
                  > project and promoting HREG and solar in general in the Houston area.
                  > Obviously I would pay for the house, using any discounts, grants, or other
                  > help that I can find, but would not ask for help from anyone who feels
                  they
                  > need to be paid for just talking about such a project, since I thought
                  that
                  > was what HREG was all about. Maybe I'm confused on this.
                  >
                  > But I do appreciate all the comments so far, and am serious about the
                  whole
                  > thing. Oral's suggestion that we might find some funding to help out with
                  it
                  > sounds interesting. Let's look at it this way. If we did research on an
                  > absolutely state of the art house of the future - not only energy
                  efficient
                  > but healthy (filtered air to remove pollen and Houston's infamous
                  pollution,
                  > clean water - carbon bed, reverse osmosis, etc) and made it as nice yet as
                  > economical as possible, and then actually built it, then maybe more people
                  > would build such houses too. I think that is an interesting project in
                  > itself, and probably there is lots of literature available that some of
                  our
                  > members know about. Then I might be the first to build such a house, which
                  > would be a benefit to me, but hopefully everyone would enjoy being
                  involved.
                  > Then again I might decide for one reason or another I don't want to do it
                  > after all - which I would need to reserve the right to do, but it would
                  not
                  > have been a waste. At least, I don't think it would be.
                  >
                  > Anyway, would like to continue the discussion here and see what kind of
                  > consensus we can come to, if any. Hope everyone will contribute to the
                  > conversation.
                  >
                  > Charlie
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
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