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Re: [hreg] An analysis of the future of hydrogen fuel, NOT

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  • Jim & Janet
    MJ wrote: Here is a public education page on the hydrogen economy as seen through the eyes of a think tank Depressing. Sure it s depressing. And what s sad,
    Message 1 of 4 , Dec 31, 2003
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      MJ wrote:
      Here is a public education page on the hydrogen economy as seen through the eyes of a "think tank" Depressing.
       
      Sure it's depressing. And what's sad, most people who read article this are going to believe it ! You read the paragraphs in the article and not much more. The whole piece is on the website of the Reason Public Policy Institute. If you poke around the site, it doesn't take long to find the link to their home page and a list of Reason Foundations Business Advisory Board. If you take a few minutes to read the names and associations of those board members, you find they represent everything that we don't represent.
      I did a quick cut n paste of about 1/3 of the names there and a little more www searching several of the names I wasn't familiar with. It took about 15 minutes to find who influences Reasons policies. It so happens that I had rebuked one of the Reason Foundations editorials in the FWST a year or two back. I have known about their basic philosophy ever since.
      Here are a few of their associations or companies or organizations that board members represent:
      **********
      Board of Directors of the Overseas Private Investment Corporation.
      Federal Reserve Bank of Cleveland
      Western States Petroleum Association
       investment bank and institutional securities firm
      Philip Morris
      Procter & Gamble
      Tennenbaum & Co., LLC, a Los Angeles-based investment firm, (big Bush supporter)
      PricewaterhouseCoopers
      Prudential Capital
      Eli Lilly & Company
      Pfizer Inc.
      Gilder Foundation...Beware of anti-public education initiatives (not my words)
      *************
      I read a rant/posting that Wyldon sent to NTREG a few weeks ago titled "gov't pull back". Chuckles replied saying how acquaintances of his were outraged with govt. corruption or something along those lines; rather a strong statement for Chuck, I thought. He implied that too many people are sheep. Simply follow the one in front.
      My reply was SPEAK UP. People won't hear us if we don't shout louder than those supporters of the status-quo. All we can do is tell the truth. Respond to crap like the Reason Foundations support of... well, what did they support?
       NOT renewable sources of electric power to create hydrogen. Their quote was "Reformation of hydrogen still means using hydrocarbons such as natural gas as a source of hydrogen...". By not endorsing the more cost-effective option, renewable energy, they are supporting big oil. If you just sit back and moan that the nation is going to hell in a handbasket, it will. I have always liked the bumper sticker that says: Question Authority. Make it a New Years resolution to publically promote Renewables, or whatever else you believe in. The sheep will be listening.
      Peace, Jim Duncan
       
       
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 9:47 PM
      Subject: [hreg] An analysis of the future of hydrogen fuel

      Hi,
         Here is a public education page on the hydrogen economy as seen through the eyes of a "think tank"
      Depressing.
      MJ


      Yahoo! Groups Links

    • Mike Ewert
      I did notice they said water was scarce and didn t point out that you get the water back in a fuel cell. Using renewable energy to drive a hydrogen economy is
      Message 2 of 4 , Jan 1, 2004
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        I did notice they said water was scarce and didn't point out that you get the water back in a fuel cell.  Using renewable energy to drive a hydrogen economy is sustainable.
        -----Original Message-----
        From: Jim & Janet [mailto:jhd1@...]
        Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 11:28 PM
        To: hreg@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [hreg] An analysis of the future of hydrogen fuel, NOT

        MJ wrote:
        Here is a public education page on the hydrogen economy as seen through the eyes of a "think tank" Depressing.
         
        Sure it's depressing. And what's sad, most people who read article this are going to believe it ! You read the paragraphs in the article and not much more. The whole piece is on the website of the Reason Public Policy Institute. If you poke around the site, it doesn't take long to find the link to their home page and a list of Reason Foundations Business Advisory Board. If you take a few minutes to read the names and associations of those board members, you find they represent everything that we don't represent.
        I did a quick cut n paste of about 1/3 of the names there and a little more www searching several of the names I wasn't familiar with. It took about 15 minutes to find who influences Reasons policies. It so happens that I had rebuked one of the Reason Foundations editorials in the FWST a year or two back. I have known about their basic philosophy ever since.
        Here are a few of their associations or companies or organizations that board members represent:
        **********
        Board of Directors of the Overseas Private Investment Corporation.
        Federal Reserve Bank of Cleveland
        Western States Petroleum Association
         investment bank and institutional securities firm
        Philip Morris
        Procter & Gamble
        Tennenbaum & Co., LLC, a Los Angeles-based investment firm, (big Bush supporter)
        PricewaterhouseCoopers
        Prudential Capital
        Eli Lilly & Company
        Pfizer Inc.
        Gilder Foundation...Beware of anti-public education initiatives (not my words)
        *************
        I read a rant/posting that Wyldon sent to NTREG a few weeks ago titled "gov't pull back". Chuckles replied saying how acquaintances of his were outraged with govt. corruption or something along those lines; rather a strong statement for Chuck, I thought. He implied that too many people are sheep. Simply follow the one in front.
        My reply was SPEAK UP. People won't hear us if we don't shout louder than those supporters of the status-quo. All we can do is tell the truth. Respond to crap like the Reason Foundations support of... well, what did they support?
         NOT renewable sources of electric power to create hydrogen. Their quote was "Reformation of hydrogen still means using hydrocarbons such as natural gas as a source of hydrogen...". By not endorsing the more cost-effective option, renewable energy, they are supporting big oil. If you just sit back and moan that the nation is going to hell in a handbasket, it will. I have always liked the bumper sticker that says: Question Authority. Make it a New Years resolution to publically promote Renewables, or whatever else you believe in. The sheep will be listening.
        Peace, Jim Duncan
         
         
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 9:47 PM
        Subject: [hreg] An analysis of the future of hydrogen fuel

        Hi,
           Here is a public education page on the hydrogen economy as seen through the eyes of a "think tank"
        Depressing.
        MJ


        Yahoo! Groups Links




        Yahoo! Groups Links

      • Mike Johnston
        Hi Jim, You are correct in your analysis. But that is the rub isn t it? These (usually) conservative think tanks seem to be wallowing in funding and exist for
        Message 3 of 4 , Jan 1, 2004
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          Hi Jim,
             You are correct in your analysis. But that is the rub isn't it? These (usually) conservative think tanks seem to be wallowing in funding and exist for the purpose of promoting a "political" agenda not for making well thought out policy recommendations which will benefit everyone equally. And yet they get unfettered access to the media and to the minds of the "man in the street" populace.
             I saw a point/counterpoint set of editorials in our local newspaper a while back which dealt with alternative energy. On the one side was an environmental type who calmly outlined the choices of wind, solar and hydrogen and the benefits of each. On the other was a think tank "expert" who pooh poohed all of the alternative energy sources and said the only possible source of hydrogen was hydrocarbons and so we are eternally bound to hydrocarbon fuels no matter what we do.
             And so the population at large remains uneducated and from a misinformed standpoint makes decisions. I am so proud.
             As to question authority; I do. Of course I also like the one that says "Question Reality" . That one just might get you a bit further.
          MJ
           
          Message: 3
             Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 23:27:50 -0600
             From: "Jim & Janet" <jhd1@...>
          Subject: Re: An analysis of the future of hydrogen fuel, NOT
           
          MJ wrote:
          Here is a public education page on the hydrogen economy as seen through the eyes of a "think tank" Depressing.
           
          Sure it's depressing. And what's sad, most people who read article this are going to believe it ! You read the paragraphs in the article and not much more. The whole piece is on the website of the Reason Public Policy Institute. If you poke around the site, it doesn't take long to find the link to their home page and a list of Reason Foundations Business Advisory Board. If you take a few minutes to read the names and associations of those board members, you find they represent everything that we don't represent.
          I did a quick cut n paste of about 1/3 of the names there and a little more www searching several of the names I wasn't familiar with. It took about 15 minutes to find who influences Reasons policies. It so happens that I had rebuked one of the Reason Foundations editorials in the FWST a year or two back. I have known about their basic philosophy ever since.
          Here are a few of their associations or companies or organizations that board members represent:
          **********
          Board of Directors of the Overseas Private Investment Corporation.
          Federal Reserve Bank of Cleveland
          Western States Petroleum Association
           investment bank and institutional securities firm
          Philip Morris
          Procter & Gamble
          Tennenbaum & Co., LLC, a Los Angeles-based investment firm, (big Bush supporter)
          PricewaterhouseCoopers
          Prudential Capital
          Eli Lilly & Company
          Pfizer Inc.
          Gilder Foundation...Beware of anti-public education initiatives (not my words)
          *************
          I read a rant/posting that Wyldon sent to NTREG a few weeks ago titled "gov't pull back". Chuckles replied saying how acquaintances of his were outraged with govt. corruption or something along those lines; rather a strong statement for Chuck, I thought. He implied that too many people are sheep. Simply follow the one in front.
          My reply was SPEAK UP. People won't hear us if we don't shout louder than those supporters of the status-quo. All we can do is tell the truth. Respond to crap like the Reason Foundations support of... well, what did they support?
           NOT renewable sources of electric power to create hydrogen. Their quote was "Reformation of hydrogen still means using hydrocarbons such as natural gas as a source of hydrogen...". By not endorsing the more cost-effective option, renewable energy, they are supporting big oil. If you just sit back and moan that the nation is going to hell in a handbasket, it will. I have always liked the bumper sticker that says: Question Authority. Make it a New Years resolution to publically promote Renewables, or whatever else you believe in. The sheep will be listening.
          Peace, Jim Duncan
           
           
        • Steven M. Stelzer
          HREG : In the spirit of the new year, I’d like to share a book list with you. I call it the Blind Men and the Elephant Reading List, because each author’s
          Message 4 of 4 , Jan 14, 2004
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            HREG : In the spirit of the new year, I’d like to share a book list with you. I call it the Blind Men and the Elephant Reading List, because each author’s views, like perceptions of blind men, have combined to give me a much better picture of the elephant. It started with environmental subjects and spread to sociological and spiritual as I saw how they began to compliment each other.

            Stephen Hawking The Universe in a Nutshell

            Edward O. Wilson The Future of Life

            Paul Hawken The Ecology of Commerce

            Hawken & Lovins Natural Capitalism

            Malcolm Beck The Gardenville Method

            Weinberg, Pellow, & SchnaibergUrban Recycling& the Search for Sustainable Community Development

            WorldWatch Institute -  The State of the World 2004

            Bill McKibben Enough

            Gregg Easterbrook - The Progress Paradox

            Lester Brown -  The Earth Policy Reader

            David Quinn  - My Ishmael

            James Kunstler Home from Nowhere

            Sarah SusankaThe Not So Big House

            Robert Prechter - The Wave Principle of Human Social Behavior

            Malcolm Gladwell  - The Tipping Point

            Lipsky & Abrams - Late Bloomers

            Wayne Dyer  - Manifest Your Destiny

            Deepak Chopra  - The Seven Spiritual Laws of Success

            Robert Sardello - Freeing the Soul from Fear

            John Gray Mars & Venus on a Date

            Wiley & Formley -  Lights Out

            Barry Sears - The Age Free Zone

            If you’d like to share any book titles that left a mark on you, I’d love to hear about them. Please email me at stelman@..., rather than replying to the list. Have a great New Year.

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