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Water cart loan questions and plans

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  • tom ochuka
    Dear all, Have attached all anecessary nformation to obtain alan ,hop this questions qualify me togt awatercart loan which will be done soon, I am ready to
    Message 1 of 26 , Aug 18, 2009
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    Dear all,
    Have attached all anecessary nformation to obtain alan ,hop this questions qualify me togt awatercart loan which will be done soon,
    I am ready to awser any mor questions or fill anyforms and means of payment if ts through bank or any means.
    Bye.
    TOM OCHUKA.
  • Andrius Kulikauskas
    Hi Tom, Thank you for writing more about your project. You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community without using water pipes? I
    Message 2 of 26 , Aug 19, 2009
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      Hi Tom,

      Thank you for writing more about your project.

      You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
      without using water pipes?

      I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
      hand cart.

      For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
      something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
      like to learn?

      These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
      supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
      construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
      motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
      social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
      opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
      relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.

      Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
      your project. There can be many questions.

      Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
      never asked you.

      * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
      other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
      * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
      * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?

      This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.

      Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?

      Andrius

      Andrius Kulikauskas
      Minciu Sodas
      http://www.ms.lt
      ms@...
      +370 699 30003



      Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
      I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
      obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
      difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
      medicine,
      It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
      handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
      How this Water cart is made.

      It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
      rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
      car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.

      The cart size:

      This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
      Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that’s depth enough to fit
      the standard size Jeri-canns.
      After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
      each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
      covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
      makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
      Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
      place when water is filled at the collecting points.

      The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
      to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
      pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
      make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
      /Driver.

      Usage/Domestic and Commercially:

      This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
      both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
      prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
      saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.

      There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
      get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
      really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
      clean white or bright clothing.

      This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
      a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
      nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
      the distance.

      Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
      the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
      collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that’s 100 and 6
      Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.

      What will the community learn.
      1Savings and Loan from Water project
      2Health
      3Re use of old car tryres.
      4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
      Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
      making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
      ready for any.

      I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
      I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
      save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.

      Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
      installments.
      This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
      bigger intervention.
      Thanks

      TOM OCHUKA
    • ricardoolpc
      Andrius Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go
      Message 3 of 26 , Aug 19, 2009
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        Andrius

        Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go ahead with the loan and project.

        I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project, so they can do a similar project?

        Ricardo

        -----

        Hi Tom

         I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question that your project will answer.

        I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to real, practical questions, like...

        What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).

        You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar too what Andrius mentioned, such as...

        What design am I using?

        What materials am I using?

        Why did I choose that design?

        The costs of materials.

        The cost of labour to build the handcart.

        The cost of labour to operate the handcart.

        How profitable the water business is.

        I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions will come out of the project.

        But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the project worthwhile?

        I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to ask now, then answer during the project would be...

        What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?

        You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.

        I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly photos, not a lot of english text.

        When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos, then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip).

        I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already. For example, the handcart project may tell us...

        "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the project?" and

        "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build a similar cart)

        We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".

        Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95% photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the Instructables.com website. They have all sorts of projects where people build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom PC'...

        http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to-build-a-Custom-PC/

        As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much help.

        Ricardo


        --- In holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi Tom,
        >
        > Thank you for writing more about your project.
        >
        > You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
        > without using water pipes?
        >
        > I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
        > hand cart.
        >
        > For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
        > something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
        > like to learn?
        >
        > These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
        > supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
        > construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
        > motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
        > social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
        > opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
        > relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
        >
        > Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
        > your project. There can be many questions.
        >
        > Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
        > never asked you.
        >
        > * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
        > other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
        > * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
        > * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
        >
        > This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
        >
        > Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
        >
        > Andrius
        >
        > Andrius Kulikauskas
        > Minciu Sodas
        > http://www.ms.lt
        > ms@...
        > +370 699 30003
        >
        >
        >
        > Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
        > I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
        > obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
        > difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
        > medicine,
        > It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
        > handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
        > How this Water cart is made.
        >
        > It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
        > rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
        > car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.
        >
        > The cart size:
        >
        > This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
        > Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
        > the standard size Jeri-canns.
        > After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
        > each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
        > covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
        > makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
        > Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
        > place when water is filled at the collecting points.
        >
        > The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
        > to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
        > pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
        > make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
        > /Driver.
        >
        > Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
        >
        > This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
        > both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
        > prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
        > saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
        >
        > There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
        > get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
        > really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
        > clean white or bright clothing.
        >
        > This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
        > a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
        > nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
        > the distance.
        >
        > Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
        > the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
        > collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
        > Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
        >
        > What will the community learn.
        > 1Savings and Loan from Water project
        > 2Health
        > 3Re use of old car tryres.
        > 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
        > Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
        > making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
        > ready for any.
        >
        > I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
        > I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
        > save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.
        >
        > Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
        > installments.
        > This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
        > bigger intervention.
        > Thanks
        >
        > TOM OCHUKA
        >

      • Benoit Couture
        Indeed Ricardo,   Let s formulate the questions around Tom s project to reach completion, talking into account that water and life are one and the same
        Message 4 of 26 , Aug 19, 2009
        • 0 Attachment
          Indeed Ricardo,
           
          Let's formulate the questions around Tom's project to reach completion, talking into account that water and life are one and the same essential to existance, where one for all and all for one dwells.
           
          Some of the questions and answers I can think of go something like:
           
          -Who has interest in water?
           
          This will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness.
           
          -Who can produce water aquisition and distribution?
           
          -How do we determine who the distribution need to go to?
           
          -Who will do the aquisitin and who will do the distribution?
           
          -Who has interest in water and life as on?
           
          Perhaps from Tom's one cart project to...
          And also:
           
          -As the venture grows, who and how will safety of the resource and of the people be secured?
           
          Question to be answered from friends to the UN.
           
          -Who and how the economic unfolding of the water's impact gets to be manage in equitable partnership between personal, business and gorvernments?
           
          I could see ChrisMacrae and JeffreySachs and AndriusKulikauskas forming the startt up partnership of such a sustainable economic deployment. 
           
          Any thoughts?
           
          Benoit


          --- On Wed, 8/19/09, ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...> wrote:

          From: ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...>
          Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
          To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
          Received: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, 12:04 PM

           
          Andrius
          Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go ahead with the loan and project.
          I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project, so they can do a similar project?
          Ricardo
          -----
          Hi Tom
           I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question that your project will answer.
          I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to real, practical questions, like...
          What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).
          You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar too what Andrius mentioned, such as...
          What design am I using?
          What materials am I using?
          Why did I choose that design?
          The costs of materials.
          The cost of labour to build the handcart.
          The cost of labour to operate the handcart.
          How profitable the water business is.
          I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions will come out of the project.
          But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the project worthwhile?
          I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to ask now, then answer during the project would be...
          What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?
          You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.
          I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly photos, not a lot of english text.
          When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos, then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip) .
          I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already. For example, the handcart project may tell us...
          "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the project?" and
          "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build a similar cart)
          We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".
          Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95% photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the Instructables. com website. They have all sorts of projects where people build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom PC'...
          As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much help.
          Ricardo

          --- In holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Tom,
          >
          > Thank you for writing more about your project.
          >
          > You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
          > without using water pipes?
          >
          > I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
          > hand cart.
          >
          > For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
          > something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
          > like to learn?
          >
          > These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
          > supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
          > construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
          > motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
          > social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
          > opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
          > relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
          >
          > Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
          > your project. There can be many questions.
          >
          > Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
          > never asked you.
          >
          > * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
          > other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
          > * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
          > * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
          >
          > This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
          >
          > Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
          >
          > Andrius
          >
          > Andrius Kulikauskas
          > Minciu Sodas
          > http://www.ms. lt
          > ms@...
          > +370 699 30003
          >
          >
          >
          > Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
          > I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
          > obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
          > difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
          > medicine,
          > It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
          > handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
          > How this Water cart is made.
          >
          > It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
          > rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
          > car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.
          >
          > The cart size:
          >
          > This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
          > Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
          > the standard size Jeri-canns.
          > After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
          > each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
          > covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
          > makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
          > Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
          > place when water is filled at the collecting points.
          >
          > The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
          > to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
          > pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
          > make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
          > /Driver.
          >
          > Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
          >
          > This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
          > both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
          > prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
          > saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
          >
          > There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
          > get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
          > really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
          > clean white or bright clothing.
          >
          > This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
          > a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
          > nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
          > the distance.
          >
          > Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
          > the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
          > collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
          > Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
          >
          > What will the community learn.
          > 1Savings and Loan from Water project
          > 2Health
          > 3Re use of old car tryres.
          > 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
          > Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
          > making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
          > ready for any.
          >
          > I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
          > I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
          > save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.
          >
          > Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
          > installments.
          > This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
          > bigger intervention.
          > Thanks
          >
          > TOM OCHUKA
          >


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        • Mark Roest
          Hello Benoit, Ricardo and All! You are doing a wonderful job pulling together questions that are important for a process that can also be used for other
          Message 5 of 26 , Aug 19, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            Hello Benoit, Ricardo and All!

            You are doing a wonderful job pulling together questions that are important for a process that can also be used for other problems. I would like to partially answer your question about how to share this effectively.

            I am thinking of seven organizations that can help to disseminate what you are learning. They are Maker Faire Africa (and Maker Fair and Make Magazine in the United States), Wiser Earth, Dreamfish, Designfluence, oneVillage Foundation, and SugarLab / Earth Treasury's digital curricula project.

            Websites and contacts for each of these are:
            www.wiserearth.org    Camilla Burg <camilla@...>   they list over 100,000 organizations working for social justice and the environment
            www.makerfaireafrica.com/    Nii Simmonds <nas146@...>, Mark Grimes <mark.grimes@...> this is all about making things yourself, and they have plans to help commercialize some products in Africa
            www.dreamfish.com/     patty@...    they are about web-based services for micro-entrepreneurs --  and celebrating life while we work
            www.Designfluence.org    David Alan Foster <DALAN@...>   see the Give Bank project http://designer.givebank.org/    it's about getting industrial designers to contribute free time for design support
            www.oneVillageFoundation.org     Joy Tang <unitydrum@...>, Jeff Buderer <jeff@...>,    I think you know them; oneVillage Ghana has an Open Digital Village facility and teaches using the internet, among many other projects
            http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Earth_Treasury   Ed Cherlin <echerlin@...>;   see Ed's video at http://www.linux.com/archive/feature/147070    he is organizing a global effort to create digital curricula that empower children, and can be used on the One Laptop Per Child XO computers (and others, using Sugar On A Stick)
            www.col.org   Krishna Alluri, education specialist, KAlluri@...    strengthening education, especially in poor countries, in the British Commonwealth
            If you can do the video instruction (or still photos -- they can make up a storyboard), you can use COL, or Commonwealth Of Learning, to help you make it into a great Open and Distance Learning (ODL) module, which they can then put into their library, and into their web-based bibliography of over a million items, which have been Google-ized, and which focus mostly on education and sustainability.

            Please let me know if this is confusing, or you have other questions.

            Best regards,

            Mark Roest

            On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@...> wrote:
             

            Indeed Ricardo,
             
            Let's formulate the questions around Tom's project to reach completion, talking into account that water and life are one and the same essential to existance, where one for all and all for one dwells.
             
            Some of the questions and answers I can think of go something like:
             
            -Who has interest in water?
             
            This will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness.
             
            -Who can produce water aquisition and distribution?
             
            -How do we determine who the distribution need to go to?
             
            -Who will do the aquisitin and who will do the distribution?
             
            -Who has interest in water and life as on?
             
            Perhaps from Tom's one cart project to...
            And also:
             
            -As the venture grows, who and how will safety of the resource and of the people be secured?
             
            Question to be answered from friends to the UN.
             
            -Who and how the economic unfolding of the water's impact gets to be manage in equitable partnership between personal, business and gorvernments?
             
            I could see ChrisMacrae and JeffreySachs and AndriusKulikauskas forming the startt up partnership of such a sustainable economic deployment. 
             
            Any thoughts?
             
            Benoit


            --- On Wed, 8/19/09, ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...> wrote:

            From: ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...>

            Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
            To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
            Received: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, 12:04 PM

             
            Andrius
            Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go ahead with the loan and project.
            I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project, so they can do a similar project?
            Ricardo
            -----
            Hi Tom
             I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question that your project will answer.
            I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to real, practical questions, like...
            What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).
            You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar too what Andrius mentioned, such as...
            What design am I using?
            What materials am I using?
            Why did I choose that design?
            The costs of materials.
            The cost of labour to build the handcart.
            The cost of labour to operate the handcart.
            How profitable the water business is.
            I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions will come out of the project.
            But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the project worthwhile?
            I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to ask now, then answer during the project would be...
            What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?
            You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.
            I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly photos, not a lot of english text.
            When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos, then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip) .
            I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already. For example, the handcart project may tell us...
            "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the project?" and
            "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build a similar cart)
            We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".
            Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95% photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the Instructables. com website. They have all sorts of projects where people build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom PC'...
            As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much help.
            Ricardo

            --- In holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Tom,
            >
            > Thank you for writing more about your project.
            >
            > You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
            > without using water pipes?
            >
            > I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
            > hand cart.
            >
            > For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
            > something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
            > like to learn?
            >
            > These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
            > supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
            > construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
            > motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
            > social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
            > opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
            > relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
            >
            > Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
            > your project. There can be many questions.
            >
            > Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
            > never asked you.
            >
            > * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
            > other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
            > * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
            > * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
            >
            > This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
            >
            > Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
            >
            > Andrius
            >
            > Andrius Kulikauskas
            > Minciu Sodas
            > http://www.ms. lt
            > ms@...
            > +370 699 30003
            >
            >
            >
            > Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
            > I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
            > obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
            > difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
            > medicine,
            > It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
            > handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
            > How this Water cart is made.
            >
            > It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
            > rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
            > car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.
            >
            > The cart size:
            >
            > This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
            > Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
            > the standard size Jeri-canns.
            > After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
            > each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
            > covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
            > makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
            > Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
            > place when water is filled at the collecting points.
            >
            > The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
            > to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
            > pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
            > make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
            > /Driver.
            >
            > Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
            >
            > This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
            > both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
            > prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
            > saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
            >
            > There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
            > get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
            > really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
            > clean white or bright clothing.
            >
            > This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
            > a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
            > nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
            > the distance.
            >
            > Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
            > the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
            > collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
            > Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
            >
            > What will the community learn.
            > 1Savings and Loan from Water project
            > 2Health
            > 3Re use of old car tryres.
            > 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
            > Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
            > making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
            > ready for any.
            >
            > I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
            > I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
            > save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.
            >
            > Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
            > installments.
            > This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
            > bigger intervention.
            > Thanks
            >
            > TOM OCHUKA
            >


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          • ms@ms.lt
            Benoit, Who has interest in water? is a great question from my own point of view. I will call Tom Ochuka and talk with him. Thank you, Ricardo for all of
            Message 6 of 26 , Aug 19, 2009
            • 0 Attachment
              Benoit,
              "Who has interest in water?" is a great question from my own point of
              view. I will call Tom Ochuka and talk with him. Thank you, Ricardo for
              all of your help! and Mark for your advice and links.
              Andrius

              Andrius Kulikauskas, Minciu Sodas, http://www.ms.lt, ms@...


              > Indeed Ricardo,
              >  
              > Let's formulate the questions around Tom's project to reach completion,
              > talking into account that water and life are one and the same essential to
              > existance, where one for all and all for one dwells.
              >  
              > Some of the questions and answers I can think of go something like:
              >  
              > -Who has interest in water?
              >  
              > This will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to
              > macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling,
              > spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the
              > network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness.
              >  
              > -Who can produce water aquisition and distribution?
              >  
              > -How do we determine who the distribution need to go to?
              >  
              > -Who will do the aquisitin and who will do the distribution?
              >  
              > -Who has interest in water and life as on?
              >  
              > Perhaps from Tom's one cart project to...
              > http://www.onedrop.org/en/
              > And also:
              > http://abc4all.net:80/globaltoast.htm
              >  
              > -As the venture grows, who and how will safety of the resource and of the
              > people be secured?
              >  
              > Question to be answered from friends to the UN.
              >  
              > -Who and how the economic unfolding of the water's impact gets to be
              > manage in equitable partnership between personal, business and
              > gorvernments?
              >  
              > I could see ChrisMacrae and JeffreySachs and AndriusKulikauskas forming
              > the startt up partnership of such a sustainable economic deployment. 
              >  
              > Any thoughts?
              >  
              > Benoit
              >
              >
              > --- On Wed, 8/19/09, ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > From: ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...>
              > Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
              > To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
              > Received: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, 12:04 PM
              >
              >
              >  
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Andrius
              > Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought
              > the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to
              > go ahead with the loan and project.
              > I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the
              > handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project,
              > so they can do a similar project?
              > Ricardo
              > -----
              > Hi Tom
              >  I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please
              > forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or
              > your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned
              > those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions
              > are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question
              > that your project will answer.
              > I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to
              > real, practical questions, like...
              > What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether
              > your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).
              > You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar
              > too what Andrius mentioned, such as...
              > What design am I using?
              > What materials am I using?
              > Why did I choose that design?
              > The costs of materials.
              > The cost of labour to build the handcart.
              > The cost of labour to operate the handcart.
              > How profitable the water business is.
              > I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He
              > doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before
              > getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions
              > will come out of the project.
              > But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the
              > project worthwhile?
              > I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to
              > tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to
              > ask now, then answer during the project would be...
              > What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?
              > You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.
              > I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project
              > is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in
              > Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly
              > photos, not a lot of english text.
              > When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos,
              > then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text
              > (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip) .
              > I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like
              > 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already.
              > For example, the handcart project may tell us...
              > "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the
              > project?" and
              > "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build
              > a similar cart)
              > We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".
              > Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95%
              > photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for
              > step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the
              > Instructables. com website. They have all sorts of projects where people
              > build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom
              > PC'...
              > http://www.instruct ables.com/ id/How-to- build-a-Custom- PC/
              > As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart
              > project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo
              > Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other
              > people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much
              > help.
              > Ricardo
              >
              > --- In holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...>
              > wrote:
              >>
              >> Hi Tom,
              >>
              >> Thank you for writing more about your project.
              >>
              >> You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
              >> without using water pipes?
              >>
              >> I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
              >> hand cart.
              >>
              >> For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
              >> something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
              >> like to learn?
              >>
              >> These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
              >> supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
              >> construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
              >> motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
              >> social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
              >> opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
              >> relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
              >>
              >> Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
              >> your project. There can be many questions.
              >>
              >> Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
              >> never asked you.
              >>
              >> * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
              >> other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
              >> * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to
              >> answer?
              >> * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
              >>
              >> This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
              >>
              >> Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
              >>
              >> Andrius
              >>
              >> Andrius Kulikauskas
              >> Minciu Sodas
              >> http://www.ms. lt
              >> ms@...
              >> +370 699 30003
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >> Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
              >> I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
              >> obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
              >> difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
              >> medicine,
              >> It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
              >> handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
              >> How this Water cart is made.
              >>
              >> It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
              >> rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
              >> car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before
              >> replacement.
              >>
              >> The cart size:
              >>
              >> This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
              >> Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
              >> the standard size Jeri-canns.
              >> After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
              >> each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
              >> covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
              >> makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
              >> Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
              >> place when water is filled at the collecting points.
              >>
              >> The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
              >> to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
              >> pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
              >> make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
              >> /Driver.
              >>
              >> Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
              >>
              >> This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
              >> both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
              >> prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
              >> saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
              >>
              >> There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
              >> get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
              >> really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
              >> clean white or bright clothing.
              >>
              >> This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
              >> a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
              >> nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
              >> the distance.
              >>
              >> Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
              >> the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
              >> collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
              >> Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
              >>
              >> What will the community learn.
              >> 1Savings and Loan from Water project
              >> 2Health
              >> 3Re use of old car tryres.
              >> 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
              >> Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
              >> making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
              >> ready for any.
              >>
              >> I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
              >> I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
              >> save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is
              >> provided.
              >>
              >> Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
              >> installments.
              >> This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
              >> bigger intervention.
              >> Thanks
              >>
              >> TOM OCHUKA
              >>
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > __________________________________________________________________
              > Get a sneak peak at messages with a handy reading pane with All new Yahoo!
              > Mail: http://ca.promos.yahoo.com/newmail/overview2/
            • Andrius Kulikauskas
              I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now. His deepest value in life is Have an environment where people can adapt to changes . This is very helpful for us all to know
              Message 7 of 26 , Aug 19, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                accountable to himself.

                His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                source?"

                I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                what Tom is learning.

                Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                agree that Samwel release the funds.

                Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                including others as well.

                My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                http://www.akvo.org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                strengthening our network.

                Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                Andrius

                Andrius Kulikauskas
                Minciu Sodas
                http://www.ms.lt
                ms@...
                +370 699 30003
                Dukiskes, Lithuania
              • Janet Feldman
                Dear Tom, Andrius, Ricardo, Benoit, and All, I have been reading through these letters and thinking along some of the same lines as the rest of you, including
                Message 8 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
                • 0 Attachment
                  Dear Tom, Andrius, Ricardo, Benoit, and All,

                  I have been reading through these letters and thinking along some of the
                  same lines as the rest of you, including Tom himself, about
                  "sustainability", self-help, income-generation, and independence.

                  It's very important to recognize the "interactive" and even "interdependent"
                  nature of this project--in an ongoing way--and also to recognize that some
                  aspects may be, and hopefully in time will be, more self-directed and
                  self-sustaining, after initial inputs from outside sources.

                  Tom has spoken in these forums, and also with myself and perhaps others,
                  about a photography business that would be set in a garden, where people
                  could have wedding photos taken, for example.

                  So one question might be: what synergy would or could there be between the
                  handcart project and the photography/garden project? Plants need water,
                  after all: would they be OK with water that is not as clean, and how will
                  that water be transported (would separate carts be used, would it be
                  dangerous to use carts for both, or would there be some other method of
                  irrigation)? Do the plants instead need clean water, the same kind that
                  humans drink?

                  Another question might be: can this enterprise generate income that is
                  self-sustaining for one or two individuals (or more), or that at the least
                  can be directed back into other projects of benefit to Tom (to help improve
                  his livelihood), and/or to the general and Deaf communities in Kisumu, and
                  perhaps beyond?

                  Tom has a variety of ideas, projects, and a wish-list of needs that link to
                  members of the Deaf community he serves in Kisumu. One is for bicycles,
                  another is for mobile phones and ICTs (both equipment and learning about how
                  to use them), though on the latter score Ricardo has been immensely helpful.

                  Can this handcart project be linked in some direct way to your current
                  ICTs-related capacities, Tom? And/or could it be linked to some future
                  needs, ideas, or projects you hope to do, that are ICTs-related?
                  Ricardo's feedback on this matter is also be greatly appreciated!

                  Related to bicycles, Tom, I would be interested to consider stretching my
                  own budget right now to include a loan for a second handcart (you have
                  mentioned needing two), especially if that somehow might help Evelyn to
                  acquire a bicycle. Is that a possible trade-off, or do you think it would be
                  too hard in the short-term to make the $100 needed for a bicycle, from this
                  handcart project?

                  I want to make special note of Benoit's response on this issue, because he
                  frames it in a more transcendent and spiritual way than we have generally
                  been thinking of it. This is crucial, because safe water is or should be a
                  human right, and there is certainly something of the sacred about this
                  resource.

                  Therefore, while it is fine and even important to think of this project in
                  "material" terms, we will hopefully keep in mind that access to clean water
                  is not just a "market" issue, but a human-rights concern. Thanks immensely
                  for helping us to see that larger picture, Brother B!!

                  Several other items:

                  1) I have made contact during this past week with a researcher in the
                  International Program of Gallaudet College, the premier university for
                  people in the Deaf community in the USA. She is in the process of mapping
                  where Deaf organizations and activities are located worldwide. She is very
                  interested to know about Tom and Deaf Impact Ministry, and perhaps the
                  handcart idea and project would be of special value, including if it could
                  be disseminated globally as a source of possible income-generation and
                  independence for people who are deaf. http://cips.gallaudet.edu

                  2) Also this week is a posting from one of the board members of the World
                  AIDS Marathon (www.worldaidsmarathon.com), an event that is held yearly in
                  Kisumu, Kenya (note: I worked on the first WAM in 2004, and this is where
                  Samwel and I got to know each other...I was already at MS, from an intro by
                  Joy Tang of oneVillage Foundation, and told Sam that he too should join
                  us...the rest is history, and herstory :)))). The creator of WAM, Richard
                  Brodsky, remains a friend and fellow member of the Kenyan Diaspora nonprofit
                  I mentioned in my last personal update.

                  This board member was writing to inform those cc'd about the "Safe Water and
                  AIDS Project (SWAP)", and this is what she says:

                  "SWAP has been blessed by many loyal donors and has been able to expand its
                  activities throughout Western and Nyanza Province in Kenya. Over 700 HIV
                  support groups and other community groups have been engaged as vendors of
                  safe water treatment and health products. However, in order to think about
                  its own financial sustainabillity, SWAP has developed a business plan with
                  the help of a business consultant. The implementation of this would generate
                  enough income for the organization to pay for its salaries and overhead
                  costs within three years. This would reduce donor dependancy and achieve
                  self reliance.

                  SWAP has the ambition to design, construct and operate a conference facility
                  and a hotel/guest house and restaurant which would target visitors from
                  oversees and middle class Kenyans. The guesthouse would accommodate the many
                  visitors and researchers visiting SWAP. The conference centre would enable
                  SWAP and many other NGO's to hold their meetings and trainings. It would be
                  combined with a SWAP model village where SWAP will take some of the
                  potential visitors to showcase all the interventions, and where SWAP would
                  put up a water treatment technology to provide water for the
                  neighboring communities. The intervention would create employment for the
                  SWAP groups.

                  For those interested we can send you our business plan. For those who wish
                  to donate, please contact us so that we provide you with our banking
                  details. In the meantime please browse on our website at www.swapkenya.org
                  for more informatin on Safe Water and AIDS Project (SWAP)."

                  It appears that great minds think alike, and that there might be some
                  wonderful synergies between SWAP, Deaf Impact Ministry and other groups in W
                  Kenya and beyond, Minciu Sodas, and others. HIV/AIDS and a focus on clean
                  water is an inspired pairing, as the latter is so essential to health,
                  especially for those with compromised immune systems.

                  Deaf Impact Ministry and so many other groups and individuals in Kenya, in
                  this forum, and globally are deeply concerned and affected by HIV/AIDS, so
                  linkages between health, safe water, sanitation, environmental and human
                  sustainability, ICTs, and more are either already present, or can be easily
                  created. Note the focus on sustainability (Sam, Tom, all), and on tourism!

                  I am thinking that perhaps Tom and his handcarts could somehow be a part of
                  the World AIDS Marathon. Tom is a member of the Kenyan Community Abroad (the
                  Kenyan Diaspora nonprofit I have mentioned), as is Richard, and I am one of
                  its officers. Richard undoubtedly already knows about Tom: now all it takes
                  is a personal introduction!

                  I will close on that note, and look forward to the unfolding of this
                  project, including how it might be helpful to our other MS members, in Kenya
                  and globally.

                  With blessings always and excitement! Janet


                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Andrius Kulikauskas" <ms@...>
                  To: <holistichelping@yahoogroups.com>; <mendenyo@yahoogroups.com>;
                  <socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com>; "learningfromeachother"
                  <learningfromeachother@yahoogroups.com>; <globalvillages@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 2:48 AM
                  Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans


                  >I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.
                  >
                  > His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                  > to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                  > us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                  > natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                  > accountable to himself.
                  >
                  > His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                  > involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                  > for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                  > source?"
                  >
                  > I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                  > from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                  > constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                  > suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                  > my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                  > other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                  > the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                  > others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                  > once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                  > what Tom is learning.
                  >
                  > Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                  > agree that Samwel release the funds.
                  >
                  > Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                  > Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                  > us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                  > can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                  > including others as well.
                  >
                  > My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                  > Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                  > vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                  > questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                  > successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                  > terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                  > others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                  > http://www.akvo.org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                  > project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                  > myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                  > profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                  > strengthening our network.
                  >
                  > Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                  > and how best to distribute and apply our resources.
                  >
                  > Tom, thank you for your initiative,
                  >
                  > Andrius
                  >
                  > Andrius Kulikauskas
                  > Minciu Sodas
                  > http://www.ms.lt
                  > ms@...
                  > +370 699 30003
                  > Dukiskes, Lithuania
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > http://www.worknets.org/wiki.cgi?HolisticHelping
                  >
                  > Please note our rule: Each letter sent to the Holistic Helping group
                  > enters the PUBLIC DOMAIN unless it explicitly states otherwise. Thank
                  > you! http://www.ethicalpublicdomain.org
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



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                  18:06:00
                • Janet Feldman
                  Dear Mark and All, Hello and marvelous to hear from you on this subject, as well as to see old friends cc d (Mark Grimes, Joy, Ed, Jeff, Benoit, and Krishna
                  Message 9 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
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                    Dear Mark and All,
                     
                    Hello and marvelous to hear from you on this subject, as well as to see "old friends" cc'd (Mark Grimes, Joy, Ed, Jeff, Benoit, and Krishna Alluri, formerly of the Commonwealth of Learning!!). I did not see your note when I replied just now to letters from Tom, Andrius, Benoit, and Ricardo. My apologies!
                     
                    I LOVE the idea of turning research on this project into a COL module, as that would quickly disseminate it (or at least give it that capacity) both within Kenya and globally. KAIPPG (www.kaippg.org) and our COL-incubated GRASSUP NOW distance-learning coalition would find this so interesting, as would many others throughout Kenya and the world.
                     
                    I will add, for all cc'd who are not subscribed to Holistic Helping or other Minciu Sodas forums, that two orgs and sites I mentioned in my own note are Gallaudet College (http://cips.gallaudet.edu) and SWAP, or "Safe Water and AIDS Project" in Kenya (www.swapkenya.org).
                     
                    Thanks immensely for the great networking connections and links to individuals and orgs who might be of help with regard to this project, Mark--and in particular the possibility for its broader dissemination--and we look forward to hearing more from one and all. Tom and others can sign up right now with Wiser Earth and Ned, and perhaps others you mention.
                     
                    Mark Grimes of Ned (and formerly Omidyar, which is where we met) has been an enthusiast for solar and youth-related projects in Kenya and elsewhere, which also links to Graham Knight of DIY Solar. A common linkage at one point between Mark, myself, Graham, and OVF was KCYP, the Kibera Community Youth Programme.
                     
                    In fact, broadening the linkages, David Mutua--linked to Pam McLean, Graham Knight, and Krishna Alluri on projects in Nigeria--then cycled back to helping KCYP in Kenya, if I recall correctly. And Krishna, in his COL incarnation, has had links to a number of us: in Nigeria (Pam, John Dada, David); Ghana (OVF); and Kenya (KAIPPG and other nonprofits such as CISSO-EdTec and UCRC, in the MS forums and beyond). OVF was an early partner in the GRASSUP NOW coalition (and ICTs-ODL based initiative in W Kenya), of which COL was our primary partner-supporter, and then OVF went on to partner with COL in Ghana.
                     
                    Krishna and Mark, is it easy to get a module such as Mark describes posted to the COL library? That would be marvelous news for a number of us! And you thought you could quietly retire in peace :))))!
                     
                    With greatest thanks, blessings, and excitement, Janet (KAIPPG International, ActALIVE)
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 12:54 AM
                    Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans

                    Hello Benoit, Ricardo and All!

                    You are doing a wonderful job pulling together questions that are important for a process that can also be used for other problems. I would like to partially answer your question about how to share this effectively.

                    I am thinking of seven organizations that can help to disseminate what you are learning. They are Maker Faire Africa (and Maker Fair and Make Magazine in the United States), Wiser Earth, Dreamfish, Designfluence, oneVillage Foundation, and SugarLab / Earth Treasury's digital curricula project.

                    Websites and contacts for each of these are:
                    www.wiserearth.org    Camilla Burg <camilla@...>   they list over 100,000 organizations working for social justice and the environment
                    www.makerfaireafrica.com/    Nii Simmonds <nas146@...>, Mark Grimes <mark.grimes@...> this is all about making things yourself, and they have plans to help commercialize some products in Africa
                    www.dreamfish.com/     patty@...    they are about web-based services for micro-entrepreneurs --  and celebrating life while we work
                    www.Designfluence.org    David Alan Foster <DALAN@...>   see the Give Bank project http://designer.givebank.org/    it's about getting industrial designers to contribute free time for design support
                    www.oneVillageFoundation.org     Joy Tang <unitydrum@...>, Jeff Buderer <jeff@...>,    I think you know them; oneVillage Ghana has an Open Digital Village facility and teaches using the internet, among many other projects
                    http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Earth_Treasury   Ed Cherlin <echerlin@...>;   see Ed's video at http://www.linux.com/archive/feature/147070    he is organizing a global effort to create digital curricula that empower children, and can be used on the One Laptop Per Child XO computers (and others, using Sugar On A Stick)
                    www.col.org   Krishna Alluri, education specialist, KAlluri@...    strengthening education, especially in poor countries, in the British Commonwealth
                    If you can do the video instruction (or still photos -- they can make up a storyboard), you can use COL, or Commonwealth Of Learning, to help you make it into a great Open and Distance Learning (ODL) module, which they can then put into their library, and into their web-based bibliography of over a million items, which have been Google-ized, and which focus mostly on education and sustainability.

                    Please let me know if this is confusing, or you have other questions.

                    Best regards,

                    Mark Roest

                    On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@...> wrote:
                     

                    Indeed Ricardo,
                     
                    Let's formulate the questions around Tom's project to reach completion, talking into account that water and life are one and the same essential to existance, where one for all and all for one dwells.
                     
                    Some of the questions and answers I can think of go something like:
                     
                    -Who has interest in water?
                     
                    This will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness.
                     
                    -Who can produce water aquisition and distribution?
                     
                    -How do we determine who the distribution need to go to?
                     
                    -Who will do the aquisitin and who will do the distribution?
                     
                    -Who has interest in water and life as on?
                     
                    Perhaps from Tom's one cart project to...
                    And also:
                     
                    -As the venture grows, who and how will safety of the resource and of the people be secured?
                     
                    Question to be answered from friends to the UN.
                     
                    -Who and how the economic unfolding of the water's impact gets to be manage in equitable partnership between personal, business and gorvernments?
                     
                    I could see ChrisMacrae and JeffreySachs and AndriusKulikauskas forming the startt up partnership of such a sustainable economic deployment. 
                     
                    Any thoughts?
                     
                    Benoit


                    --- On Wed, 8/19/09, ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...> wrote:

                    From: ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...>

                    Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
                    To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
                    Received: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, 12:04 PM

                     
                    Andrius
                    Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go ahead with the loan and project.
                    I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project, so they can do a similar project?
                    Ricardo
                    -----
                    Hi Tom
                     I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question that your project will answer.
                    I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to real, practical questions, like...
                    What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).
                    You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar too what Andrius mentioned, such as...
                    What design am I using?
                    What materials am I using?
                    Why did I choose that design?
                    The costs of materials.
                    The cost of labour to build the handcart.
                    The cost of labour to operate the handcart.
                    How profitable the water business is.
                    I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions will come out of the project.
                    But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the project worthwhile?
                    I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to ask now, then answer during the project would be...
                    What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?
                    You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.
                    I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly photos, not a lot of english text.
                    When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos, then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip) .
                    I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already. For example, the handcart project may tell us...
                    "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the project?" and
                    "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build a similar cart)
                    We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".
                    Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95% photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the Instructables. com website. They have all sorts of projects where people build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom PC'...
                    As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much help.
                    Ricardo

                    --- In holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hi Tom,
                    >
                    > Thank you for writing more about your project.
                    >
                    > You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
                    > without using water pipes?
                    >
                    > I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
                    > hand cart.
                    >
                    > For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
                    > something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
                    > like to learn?
                    >
                    > These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
                    > supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
                    > construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
                    > motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
                    > social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
                    > opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
                    > relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
                    >
                    > Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
                    > your project. There can be many questions.
                    >
                    > Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
                    > never asked you.
                    >
                    > * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
                    > other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
                    > * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
                    > * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
                    >
                    > This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
                    >
                    > Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
                    >
                    > Andrius
                    >
                    > Andrius Kulikauskas
                    > Minciu Sodas
                    > http://www.ms. lt
                    > ms@...
                    > +370 699 30003
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
                    > I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
                    > obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
                    > difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
                    > medicine,
                    > It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
                    > handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
                    > How this Water cart is made.
                    >
                    > It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
                    > rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
                    > car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.
                    >
                    > The cart size:
                    >
                    > This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
                    > Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
                    > the standard size Jeri-canns.
                    > After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
                    > each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
                    > covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
                    > makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
                    > Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
                    > place when water is filled at the collecting points.
                    >
                    > The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
                    > to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
                    > pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
                    > make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
                    > /Driver.
                    >
                    > Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
                    >
                    > This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
                    > both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
                    > prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
                    > saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
                    >
                    > There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
                    > get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
                    > really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
                    > clean white or bright clothing.
                    >
                    > This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
                    > a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
                    > nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
                    > the distance.
                    >
                    > Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
                    > the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
                    > collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
                    > Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
                    >
                    > What will the community learn.
                    > 1Savings and Loan from Water project
                    > 2Health
                    > 3Re use of old car tryres.
                    > 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
                    > Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
                    > making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
                    > ready for any.
                    >
                    > I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
                    > I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
                    > save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.
                    >
                    > Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
                    > installments.
                    > This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
                    > bigger intervention.
                    > Thanks
                    >
                    > TOM OCHUKA
                    >


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                  • graham
                    Dear All, I m glad that this chat is becoming more practical. The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most of them
                    Message 10 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
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                      Dear All,
                       
                      I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                       
                      The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                      of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                       
                      I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                      All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                      made into a viable business.
                      If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                       
                      No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                       
                      Graham

                       
                       

                      I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                      His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                      to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                      us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                      natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                      accountable to himself.

                      His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                      involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                      for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                      source?"

                      I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                      from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                      constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                      suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                      my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                      other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                      the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                      others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                      once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                      what Tom is learning.

                      Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                      agree that Samwel release the funds.

                      Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                      Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                      us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                      can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                      including others as well.

                      My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                      Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                      vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                      questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                      successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                      terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                      others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                      http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                      project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                      myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                      profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                      strengthening our network.

                      Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                      and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                      Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                      Andrius

                      Andrius Kulikauskas
                      Minciu Sodas
                      http://www.ms. lt
                      ms@...
                      +370 699 30003
                      Dukiskes, Lithuania

                    • Global Palestine
                      Graham, please resend me your offer ~But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach and not depending micro-financing projects to
                      Message 11 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
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                        Graham, 
                        please resend me your offer ~
                        But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                        Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                        I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism for  sharing resources efficiently and building collective intelligence. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                        Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                        Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                        Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork.mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                        http://sekem.com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                        thanks
                        Wael


                        On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@...> wrote:
                         

                        Dear All,
                         
                        I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                         
                        The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                        of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                         
                        I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                        All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                        made into a viable business.
                        If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                         
                        No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                         
                        Graham

                         
                         

                        I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                        His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                        to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                        us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                        natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                        accountable to himself.

                        His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                        involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                        for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                        source?"

                        I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                        from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                        constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                        suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                        my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                        other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                        the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                        others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                        once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                        what Tom is learning.

                        Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                        agree that Samwel release the funds.

                        Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                        Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                        us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                        can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                        including others as well.

                        My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                        Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                        vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                        questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                        successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                        terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                        others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                        http://www.akvo.org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                        project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                        myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                        profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                        strengthening our network.

                        Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                        and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                        Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                        Andrius

                        Andrius Kulikauskas
                        Minciu Sodas
                        http://www.ms.lt
                        ms@...
                        +370 699 30003
                        Dukiskes, Lithuania


                      • Benoit Couture
                        Dear Wael,   Please allow me...   You wrote: But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing
                        Message 12 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Dear Wael,
                           
                          Please allow me...
                           
                          You wrote:
                          "But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges. "
                           
                          Instead, I offer...
                           
                          ...from micro to macro...
                           
                          Here's why:
                           
                          As I see it, the essence that fuels the quantum's meeting core of socio-cultural sustainable stability between static and dynamic energies of inter-dependency is The Ministry of Reconciliation by the Spirit of God.
                          At the macro level, the movements of the currencies of times such as Israel-Arabs, China-India, French-English, Russian-Ukrainians. ..and on and on...,
                          demonstrate on the one hand, the innate desire for peaceful co-habitation and yet, the constant struggle in actualising sustainable peace. 
                           
                          At the micro level, we see that the present is calling each and all to one, so that unityl may emerge upon the shores of justice, peace and joy in the Creator's Spirit...
                           
                          This movement moves... 
                           
                          ...from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                           
                          As a practical example of such a possible movement, I offered the following suggestion yesterday to Tom's idea of carrying water with a wheel cart in Kenya.  Tom serves and write on behalf of the deaf community.  So my suggestion was:
                           
                          "-Who has interest in water?
                           
                          The answer to such a question will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness. "
                           
                          What I am trying to say here Wael, is that we must recognise the nessecity of seeing the macro's emergence arriving into being from the micro's healthy growth, otherwise, we just end up repeating the defeating model of "top-down - command-control structures" that we are trying to grow away from, but not to destroy away from!
                           
                          ...may all blessings be with us all...
                          Benoit Couture
                          Edmonton, Canada

                          --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...> wrote:

                          From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...>
                          Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                          To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
                          Cc: mendenyo@yahoogroups.com, socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com, globalvillages@yahoogroups.com
                          Received: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 9:31 AM

                           
                          Graham, 
                          please resend me your offer ~
                          But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                          Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                          I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                          Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                          Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                          Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                          http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                          thanks
                          Wael


                          On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                           
                          Dear All,
                           
                          I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                           
                          The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                          of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                           
                          I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                          All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                          made into a viable business.
                          If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                           
                          No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                           
                          Graham

                           
                           
                          I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                          His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                          to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                          us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                          natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                          accountable to himself.

                          His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                          involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                          for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                          source?"

                          I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                          from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                          constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                          suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                          my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                          other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                          the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                          others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                          once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                          what Tom is learning.

                          Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                          agree that Samwel release the funds.

                          Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                          Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                          us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                          can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                          including others as well.

                          My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                          Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                          vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                          questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                          successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                          terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                          others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                          http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                          project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                          myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                          profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                          strengthening our network.

                          Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                          and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                          Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                          Andrius

                          Andrius Kulikauskas
                          Minciu Sodas
                          http://www.ms. lt
                          ms@...
                          +370 699 30003
                          Dukiskes, Lithuania



                          Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer® 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free!
                        • Global Palestine
                          *from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.** *I do agree. my point is that while i think our minds are designed to catch on the
                          Message 13 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
                          • 0 Attachment
                            from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                            I do agree. 
                            my point is that while i think our minds are designed to catch on the global mind, I feel some how very "jealous" about millions they become the impression that their human capability ends with fulfilling  the micro-finance project. they are prisoner of basic needs. We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be.
                            The awaking intelligence and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space. With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction.

                            blessings,
                            Wael

                            On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 10:02 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@...> wrote:
                             

                            Dear Wael,
                             
                            Please allow me...
                             
                            You wrote:
                            "But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges. "
                             
                            Instead, I offer...
                             
                            ...from micro to macro...
                             
                            Here's why:
                             
                            As I see it, the essence that fuels the quantum's meeting core of socio-cultural sustainable stability between static and dynamic energies of inter-dependency is The Ministry of Reconciliation by the Spirit of God.
                            At the macro level, the movements of the currencies of times such as Israel-Arabs, China-India, French-English, Russian-Ukrainians. ..and on and on...,
                            demonstrate on the one hand, the innate desire for peaceful co-habitation and yet, the constant struggle in actualising sustainable peace. 
                             
                            At the micro level, we see that the present is calling each and all to one, so that unityl may emerge upon the shores of justice, peace and joy in the Creator's Spirit...
                             
                            This movement moves... 
                             
                            ...from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                             
                            As a practical example of such a possible movement, I offered the following suggestion yesterday to Tom's idea of carrying water with a wheel cart in Kenya.  Tom serves and write on behalf of the deaf community.  So my suggestion was:
                             
                            "-Who has interest in water?
                             
                            The answer to such a question will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness. "
                             
                            What I am trying to say here Wael, is that we must recognise the nessecity of seeing the macro's emergence arriving into being from the micro's healthy growth, otherwise, we just end up repeating the defeating model of "top-down - command-control structures" that we are trying to grow away from, but not to destroy away from!
                             
                            ...may all blessings be with us all...
                            Benoit Couture
                            Edmonton, Canada

                            --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...> wrote:

                            From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...>
                            Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                             
                            Graham, 
                            please resend me your offer ~
                            But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                            Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                            I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                            Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                            Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                            Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                            http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                            thanks
                            Wael


                            On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                             
                            Dear All,
                             
                            I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                             
                            The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                            of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                             
                            I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                            All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                            made into a viable business.
                            If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                             
                            No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                             
                            Graham

                             
                             
                            I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                            His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                            to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                            us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                            natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                            accountable to himself.

                            His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                            involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                            for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                            source?"

                            I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                            from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                            constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                            suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                            my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                            other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                            the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                            others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                            once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                            what Tom is learning.

                            Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                            agree that Samwel release the funds.

                            Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                            Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                            us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                            can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                            including others as well.

                            My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                            Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                            vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                            questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                            successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                            terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                            others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                            http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                            project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                            myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                            profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                            strengthening our network.

                            Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                            and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                            Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                            Andrius

                            Andrius Kulikauskas
                            Minciu Sodas
                            http://www.ms. lt
                            ms@...
                            +370 699 30003
                            Dukiskes, Lithuania



                            Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer® 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free!


                          • Benoit Couture
                            Wael,   You wrote: The awaking intelligence and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space.   The access and arrival to  open
                            Message 14 of 26 , Aug 20, 2009
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Wael,
                               
                              You wrote:
                              "The awaking intelligence and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space."
                               
                              The access and arrival to "open healthy space" is what I mean with "The Ministry of Reconciliation".  It all starts from within each one of us and amongst us all.  No one can run away from the order of becoming.
                               
                              You also wrote:
                               
                              "With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction."
                               
                              Global healing cannot happen without personal and communal healing moving from local to global by growing through out from micro to macro.
                              To me, by imposing global economy as key measure for collective positive change before looking after our own personal and communal state of being, ends up sounding like the kind of "dictatorial thinking" that takes us back to re-inventing the wheel that goes from top-down - command-structure repeat.
                              The corporate agenda is currently geared to move from local to global at the expense of the personal and communal's investment, exploiting each and all for their own exclusive benefit of taking advantage from micro to macro.
                              Our jod is to toilet train them into the growth from micro to macro, so that the macro global healing takes us away from the exploiting and oppressing that rules with deceit in the name of fairness and justice, feeding the entity of terror-anti-terror to divide and conquer.
                               
                               
                              You also wrote:
                               
                              "We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be."
                               
                              This is why we need to accept the governance of "The Ministry of Reconciliation". 
                               
                              By having all factions accepting the authority of love and wisdom to guide the implementation of justice from personal to communal, then peace and joy will be released to fill all time and space from micro to macro, sprouting from local to global!
                               
                              I apologise to be so redundant, but the simplicity of mutual service in love and truth is how I view humanity's possible future.  Unfortunately, the governng from such honest and genuine service is yet to come for most of humanity.
                               
                              Peace,
                              Benoit Couture
                              Edmonton, Canada


                              --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...> wrote:

                              From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...>
                              Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                              To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
                              Received: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 1:36 PM

                               
                              from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                              I do agree. 
                              my point is that while i think our minds are designed to catch on the global mind, I feel some how very "jealous" about millions they become the impression that their human capability  ends with fulfilling  the micro-finance project. they are prisoner of basic needs. We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be.
                              The awaking intelligence  and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space. With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction.

                              blessings,
                              Wael

                              On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 10:02 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@yahoo. com> wrote:
                               
                              Dear Wael,
                               
                              Please allow me...
                               
                              You wrote:
                              "But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges. "
                               
                              Instead, I offer...
                               
                              ...from micro to macro...
                               
                              Here's why:
                               
                              As I see it, the essence that fuels the quantum's meeting core of socio-cultural  sustainable stability between static and dynamic energies of inter-dependency  is The Ministry of Reconciliation by the Spirit of God.
                              At the macro level, the movements of the currencies of times such as Israel-Arabs, China-India, French-English, Russian-Ukrainians. ..and on and on...,
                              demonstrate on the one hand, the innate desire for peaceful co-habitation and yet, the constant struggle in actualising sustainable peace. 
                               
                              At the micro level, we see that the present is calling each and all to one, so that unityl may emerge upon the shores of justice, peace and joy in the Creator's Spirit...
                               
                              This movement moves... 
                               
                              ...from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                               
                              As a practical example of such a possible movement, I offered the following suggestion yesterday to Tom's idea of carrying water with a wheel cart in Kenya.  Tom serves and write on behalf of the deaf community.  So my suggestion was:
                               
                              "-Who has interest in water?
                               
                              The answer to such a question will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness. "
                               
                              What I am trying to say here Wael, is that we must recognise the nessecity of seeing the macro's emergence arriving  into being from the micro's healthy growth, otherwise, we just end up repeating the defeating model of "top-down - command-control structures" that we are trying to grow away from, but not to destroy away from!
                               
                              ...may all blessings be with us all...
                              Benoit Couture
                              Edmonton, Canada

                              --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com> wrote:

                              From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com>
                              Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                               
                              Graham, 
                              please resend me your offer ~
                              But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                              Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                              I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                              Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                              Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                              Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                              http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                              thanks
                              Wael


                              On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                               
                              Dear All,
                               
                              I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                               
                              The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                              of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                               
                              I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                              All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                              made into a viable business.
                              If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                               
                              No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                               
                              Graham

                               
                               
                              I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                              His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                              to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                              us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                              natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                              accountable to himself.

                              His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                              involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                              for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                              source?"

                              I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                              from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                              constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                              suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                              my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                              other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                              the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                              others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                              once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                              what Tom is learning.

                              Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                              agree that Samwel release the funds.

                              Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                              Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                              us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                              can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                              including others as well.

                              My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                              Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                              vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                              questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                              successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                              terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                              others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                              http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                              project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                              myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                              profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                              strengthening our network.

                              Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                              and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                              Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                              Andrius

                              Andrius Kulikauskas
                              Minciu Sodas
                              http://www.ms. lt
                              ms@...
                              +370 699 30003
                              Dukiskes, Lithuania



                              Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer® 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free!



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                            • Global Palestine
                              Benoit, I have different opinion: The personal healing is a holly process taking place between the self and the mind trying to reach the land of spirit without
                              Message 15 of 26 , Aug 21, 2009
                              • 0 Attachment

                                Benoit, 

                                I have different opinion: The personal healing is a holly process taking place between the self and the mind trying to reach the land of spirit without knowing the road. This process is so holly, unique and personal so that I wont directly touch it at all. But still we can create an environment where this process can smoothly take place. 

                                I think we have different imagination about "healing economy" or  "organic green economic value-network" ~ have you looked at http://www.wiserearth.org/resource/view/f529bcd0176bb10a8898c78188534d71
                                I do imagine a bottom up structure, where the communal mind define its needs and wishes by the "global green mind".
                                To offer the masses new alternative economic space is in many points much better the reality outside we know. People looks mostly for jobs to feed them and here I see the potential to replace these jobs with green-jobs-network. It is very much viewable technical approach then idealogical integral one.

                                What do you think?
                                 



                                On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 12:36 AM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@...> wrote:
                                 

                                Wael,
                                 
                                You wrote:
                                "The awaking intelligence and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space."
                                 
                                The access and arrival to "open healthy space" is what I mean with "The Ministry of Reconciliation".  It all starts from within each one of us and amongst us all.  No one can run away from the order of becoming.
                                 


                                 
                                 
                                 
                                You also wrote:
                                 
                                "With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction."
                                 
                                Global healing cannot happen without personal and communal healing moving from local to global by growing through out from micro to macro.
                                To me, by imposing global economy as key measure for collective positive change before looking after our own personal and communal state of being, ends up sounding like the kind of "dictatorial thinking" that takes us back to re-inventing the wheel that goes from top-down - command-structure repeat.
                                The corporate agenda is currently geared to move from local to global at the expense of the personal and communal's investment, exploiting each and all for their own exclusive benefit of taking advantage from micro to macro.
                                Our jod is to toilet train them into the growth from micro to macro, so that the macro global healing takes us away from the exploiting and oppressing that rules with deceit in the name of fairness and justice, feeding the entity of terror-anti-terror to divide and conquer.
                                 
                                 
                                You also wrote:
                                 
                                "We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be."
                                 
                                This is why we need to accept the governance of "The Ministry of Reconciliation". 
                                 
                                By having all factions accepting the authority of love and wisdom to guide the implementation of justice from personal to communal, then peace and joy will be released to fill all time and space from micro to macro, sprouting from local to global!
                                 
                                I apologise to be so redundant, but the simplicity of mutual service in love and truth is how I view humanity's possible future.  Unfortunately, the governng from such honest and genuine service is yet to come for most of humanity.
                                 
                                Peace,
                                Benoit Couture
                                Edmonton, Canada


                                --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...> wrote:

                                From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...>
                                Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
                                Received: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 1:36 PM

                                 
                                from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                                I do agree. 
                                my point is that while i think our minds are designed to catch on the global mind, I feel some how very "jealous" about millions they become the impression that their human capability  ends with fulfilling  the micro-finance project. they are prisoner of basic needs. We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be.
                                The awaking intelligence  and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space. With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction.

                                blessings,
                                Wael

                                On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 10:02 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@yahoo. com> wrote:
                                 
                                Dear Wael,
                                 
                                Please allow me...
                                 
                                You wrote:
                                "But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges. "
                                 
                                Instead, I offer...
                                 
                                ...from micro to macro...
                                 
                                Here's why:
                                 
                                As I see it, the essence that fuels the quantum's meeting core of socio-cultural  sustainable stability between static and dynamic energies of inter-dependency  is The Ministry of Reconciliation by the Spirit of God.
                                At the macro level, the movements of the currencies of times such as Israel-Arabs, China-India, French-English, Russian-Ukrainians. ..and on and on...,
                                demonstrate on the one hand, the innate desire for peaceful co-habitation and yet, the constant struggle in actualising sustainable peace. 
                                 
                                At the micro level, we see that the present is calling each and all to one, so that unityl may emerge upon the shores of justice, peace and joy in the Creator's Spirit...
                                 
                                This movement moves... 
                                 
                                ...from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                                 
                                As a practical example of such a possible movement, I offered the following suggestion yesterday to Tom's idea of carrying water with a wheel cart in Kenya.  Tom serves and write on behalf of the deaf community.  So my suggestion was:
                                 
                                "-Who has interest in water?
                                 
                                The answer to such a question will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness. "
                                 
                                What I am trying to say here Wael, is that we must recognise the nessecity of seeing the macro's emergence arriving  into being from the micro's healthy growth, otherwise, we just end up repeating the defeating model of "top-down - command-control structures" that we are trying to grow away from, but not to destroy away from!
                                 
                                ...may all blessings be with us all...
                                Benoit Couture
                                Edmonton, Canada

                                --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com> wrote:

                                From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com>
                                Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                 
                                Graham, 
                                please resend me your offer ~
                                But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                                Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                                I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                                Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                                Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                                Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                                http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                                thanks
                                Wael


                                On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                                 
                                Dear All,
                                 
                                I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                                 
                                The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                                of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                                 
                                I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                                made into a viable business.
                                If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                                 
                                No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                                 
                                Graham

                                 
                                 
                                I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                                His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                                to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                                us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                                natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                                accountable to himself.

                                His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                                involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                source?"

                                I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                                from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                                constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                                suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                                my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                                other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                                the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                                others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                                once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                                what Tom is learning.

                                Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                                agree that Samwel release the funds.

                                Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                                us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                including others as well.

                                My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                                Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                                vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                                questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                                successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                                terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                                project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                                myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                                profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                strengthening our network.

                                Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                                and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                                Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                                Andrius

                                Andrius Kulikauskas
                                Minciu Sodas
                                http://www.ms. lt
                                ms@...
                                +370 699 30003
                                Dukiskes, Lithuania



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                              • Benoit Couture
                                Wael,   I went to the site of Wiserear and what I understand from what Global Palestine is going after, seems to put the project on a course to become a
                                Message 16 of 26 , Aug 21, 2009
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Wael,
                                   
                                  I went to the site of Wiserear and what I understand from what Global Palestine is going after, seems to put the project on a course to become a version of the existing Global Israel, which grew as a result of over 1900 years of exile, across the planet like Palestine is today.
                                  Nothing wrong with going in that direction.
                                  The difference I see is in the wide open aproach of Global Palestine instead of the discret, behind the scene, often secret aproach of Global Israel. 
                                  Hopefully, Global Israel business people will see the wisdom of supporting Global Palestine as a means to help establish the Ministry of Reconciliation.
                                  All of humanity would sure benefit from such opportunity to become open and caring.
                                   
                                  Regarding personal healing, I think that this is where "communal life"  begins becuse such healing requires complete honesty and dedication to love and truth.  Although personal, the spiritual life and community's vitality and health has but one Source.  The Source is the essence for the personal bonds that eventually grow to become  community.
                                   
                                  You might like this short thought:
                                   
                                  Benoit


                                  --- On Fri, 8/21/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...> wrote:

                                  From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...>
                                  Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                  To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
                                  Received: Friday, August 21, 2009, 1:20 AM

                                   

                                  Benoit, 

                                  I have different opinion: The personal healing is a holly process taking place between the self and the mind trying to reach the land of spirit without knowing the road. This process is so holly, unique and personal so that I wont directly touch it at all. But still we can create an environment  where this process can smoothly take place. 

                                  I think we have different imagination about "healing economy" or  "organic green economic value-network" ~ have you looked at http://www.wiserear th.org/resource/ view/f529bcd0176 bb10a8898c781885 34d71
                                  I do imagine a bottom up structure, where the communal mind define its needs and wishes by the "global green mind".
                                  To offer the masses new alternative economic space is in many points much better the reality outside we know. People looks mostly for jobs to feed them and here I see the potential  to replace these jobs with green-jobs-network. It is very much viewable  technical  approach then idealogical integral one.

                                  What do you think?
                                   



                                  On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 12:36 AM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@yahoo. com> wrote:
                                   
                                  Wael,
                                   
                                  You wrote:
                                  "The awaking intelligence and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space."
                                   
                                  The access and arrival to "open healthy space" is what I mean with "The Ministry of Reconciliation".  It all starts from within each one of us and amongst us all.  No one can run away from the order of becoming.
                                   


                                   
                                   
                                   
                                  You also wrote:
                                   
                                  "With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction."
                                   
                                  Global healing cannot happen without personal and communal healing moving from local to global by growing through out from micro to macro.
                                  To me, by imposing global economy as key measure for collective positive change before looking after our own personal and communal state of being, ends up sounding like the kind of "dictatorial thinking" that takes us back to re-inventing the wheel that goes from top-down - command-structure repeat.
                                  The corporate agenda is currently geared to move from local to global at the expense of the personal and communal's investment, exploiting each and all for their own exclusive benefit of taking advantage from micro to macro.
                                  Our jod is to toilet train them into the growth from micro to macro, so that the macro global healing takes us away from the exploiting and oppressing that rules with deceit in the name of fairness and justice, feeding the entity of terror-anti- terror to divide and conquer.
                                   
                                   
                                  You also wrote:
                                   
                                  "We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be."
                                   
                                  This is why we need to accept the governance of "The Ministry of Reconciliation". 
                                   
                                  By having all factions accepting the authority of love and wisdom to guide the implementation  of justice from personal to communal, then peace and joy will be released to fill all time and space from micro to macro, sprouting from local to global!
                                   
                                  I apologise to be so redundant, but the simplicity of mutual service in love and truth is how I view humanity's possible future.  Unfortunately, the governng from such honest and genuine service is yet to come for most of humanity.
                                   
                                  Peace,
                                  Benoit Couture
                                  Edmonton, Canada


                                  --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com> wrote:

                                  From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com>
                                  Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                  To: holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com
                                  Received: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 1:36 PM

                                   
                                  from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                                  I do agree. 
                                  my point is that while i think our minds are designed to catch on the global mind, I feel some how very "jealous" about millions they become the impression that their human capability  ends with fulfilling  the micro-finance project. they are prisoner of basic needs. We still can offer the micro support, but as a part of bigger picture drawn by those accepting the support and offering it may be.
                                  The awaking intelligence  and expressive capacity of any human require an open healthy space. With global healing economy as key measure for collective positive change we can open a common practical connection to local interaction.

                                  blessings,
                                  Wael

                                  On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 10:02 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@yahoo. com> wrote:
                                   
                                  Dear Wael,
                                   
                                  Please allow me...
                                   
                                  You wrote:
                                  "But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges. "
                                   
                                  Instead, I offer...
                                   
                                  ...from micro to macro...
                                   
                                  Here's why:
                                   
                                  As I see it, the essence that fuels the quantum's meeting core of socio-cultural  sustainable stability between static and dynamic energies of inter-dependency  is The Ministry of Reconciliation by the Spirit of God.
                                  At the macro level, the movements of the currencies of times such as Israel-Arabs, China-India, French-English, Russian-Ukrainians. ..and on and on...,
                                  demonstrate on the one hand, the innate desire for peaceful co-habitation and yet, the constant struggle in actualising sustainable peace. 
                                   
                                  At the micro level, we see that the present is calling each and all to one, so that unityl may emerge upon the shores of justice, peace and joy in the Creator's Spirit...
                                   
                                  This movement moves... 
                                   
                                  ...from personal to communal, from micro to macro and from local to global.
                                   
                                  As a practical example of such a possible movement, I offered the following suggestion yesterday to Tom's idea of carrying water with a wheel cart in Kenya.  Tom serves and write on behalf of the deaf community.  So my suggestion was:
                                   
                                  "-Who has interest in water?
                                   
                                  The answer to such a question will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness. "
                                   
                                  What I am trying to say here Wael, is that we must recognise the nessecity of seeing the macro's emergence arriving  into being from the micro's healthy growth, otherwise, we just end up repeating the defeating model of "top-down - command-control structures" that we are trying to grow away from, but not to destroy away from!
                                   
                                  ...may all blessings be with us all...
                                  Benoit Couture
                                  Edmonton, Canada

                                  --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com> wrote:

                                  From: Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com>
                                  Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                   
                                  Graham, 
                                  please resend me your offer ~
                                  But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                                  Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                                  I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                                  Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                                  Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                                  Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                                  http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                                  thanks
                                  Wael


                                  On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                                   
                                  Dear All,
                                   
                                  I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                                   
                                  The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                                  of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                                   
                                  I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                  All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                                  made into a viable business.
                                  If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                                   
                                  No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                                   
                                  Graham

                                   
                                   
                                  I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                                  His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                                  to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                                  us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                                  natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                                  accountable to himself.

                                  His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                                  involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                  for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                  source?"

                                  I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                                  from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                                  constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                                  suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                                  my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                                  other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                                  the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                                  others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                                  once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                                  what Tom is learning.

                                  Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                                  agree that Samwel release the funds.

                                  Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                  Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                                  us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                  can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                  including others as well.

                                  My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                                  Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                                  vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                                  questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                                  successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                                  terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                  others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                  http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                                  project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                                  myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                                  profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                  strengthening our network.

                                  Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                                  and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                                  Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                                  Andrius

                                  Andrius Kulikauskas
                                  Minciu Sodas
                                  http://www.ms. lt
                                  ms@...
                                  +370 699 30003
                                  Dukiskes, Lithuania



                                  Make your browsing faster, safer, and easier with the new Internet Explorer® 8. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free!



                                  Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr!



                                  The new Internet Explorer® 8 - Faster, safer, easier. Optimized for Yahoo! Get it Now for Free!
                                • Mark Roest
                                  Hello Wael, Welcome kindred spirit! No time to get into details before going to work, but there are others who share your perspective! I am letting people in
                                  Message 17 of 26 , Aug 21, 2009
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Hello Wael,

                                    Welcome kindred spirit! No time to get into details before going to work, but there are others who share your perspective! I am letting people in other networks know you are speaking out. More later.

                                    Regards,

                                    Mark Roest


                                    On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@...> wrote:
                                     

                                    Graham, 
                                    please resend me your offer ~
                                    But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                                    Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                                    I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism for  sharing resources efficiently and building collective intelligence. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                                    Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                                    Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                                    Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork.mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                                    http://sekem.com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                                    thanks
                                    Wael


                                    On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@...> wrote:
                                     

                                    Dear All,
                                     
                                    I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                                     
                                    The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                                    of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                                     
                                    I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                    All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                                    made into a viable business.
                                    If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                                     
                                    No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                                     
                                    Graham

                                     
                                     

                                    I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                                    His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                                    to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                                    us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                                    natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                                    accountable to himself.

                                    His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                                    involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                    for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                    source?"

                                    I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                                    from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                                    constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                                    suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                                    my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                                    other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                                    the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                                    others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                                    once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                                    what Tom is learning.

                                    Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                                    agree that Samwel release the funds.

                                    Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                    Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                                    us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                    can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                    including others as well.

                                    My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                                    Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                                    vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                                    questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                                    successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                                    terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                    others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                    http://www.akvo.org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                                    project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                                    myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                                    profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                    strengthening our network.

                                    Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                                    and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                                    Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                                    Andrius

                                    Andrius Kulikauskas
                                    Minciu Sodas
                                    http://www.ms.lt
                                    ms@...
                                    +370 699 30003
                                    Dukiskes, Lithuania



                                  • zoneziwoh
                                    Essential First aid for sexual violence victims Assessing the impact of Government, together with some Local & International bodies signing many conventions to
                                    Message 18 of 26 , Aug 21, 2009
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                                      Essential First aid for sexual violence victims


                                      Assessing the impact of Government, together with some Local & International bodies signing many conventions to fight against women’s right, which is still to fully respect these conventions reflected yearly on 8th march to update the women’s statues.

                                      Though in many local regions within Cameroon and in the world, the government and other stakeholders have been unable to empower women economically, politically and legally of which they constitute the engine to development.

                                      For instant, 40% of Cameroonian women who worked receive fewer salaries than their male counterparts who do the same job, meanwhile, efforts to eradicate injustice against women in the domain of training, employment, revenue and food security in tandem with the UN millennium development goals, MDGs to fight discrimination against women’s violence such that, they could play a major role in sustaining prosperity, peace & security in the sub-region seems to be a no action..

                                      So far, the rampant occurrence of girls, married and unmarried women, rarely cases of men except for homosexuals experiencing violent, which could be in force of sexual encounters by husband or boy friends and other forms of domestic violence has been a called for concern. And thus, needs for Essential First aid for sexual violence victims.

                                       

                                      This is an upcoming documentary which serves as an immediate First aid before the victim(s) could go for proper medical checkups, or reporting the incident to any authority.

                                       

                                      Many thanks

                                       Zoneziwoh



                                      www.zoneziwohshow.com

                                      freelance writer
                                      blog www.thesop.org/html/writers.php?writer=zone

                                      http://www.Vision4Plenty.org/zoneziwoh

                                      Response to "NGO Worker Sentenced to Life Imprisonment"
                                      http://newsblaze.com/story/20090108080658zzzz.nb/topstory.html

                                      Response to UN Forum Seeks to Ensure Schooling for Children From Homes
                                      http://newsblaze.com/story/20081012153035tsop.nb/topstory.html

                                      Response to "Australia: Indian Women, Down Under and Tortured"
                                      http://newsblaze.com/story/20081106083032zzzz.nb/topstory.html

                                      Have We Forgotten How to Take Care of Ourselves?
                                      http://newsblaze.com/story/20081027060208zzzz.nb/topstory.html


                                      MERITOCRACY, BE YOUR PRINCIPLE

                                      --- On Fri, 21/8/09, Mark Roest <marklroest@...> wrote:

                                      From: Mark Roest <marklroest@...>
                                      Subject: Re: [globalvillages] Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                      To: globalvillages@yahoogroups.com
                                      Cc: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, mendenyo@yahoogroups.com, socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Phoenix" <Ray.Phoenix@...>, "David Alan Foster" <DALAN@...>, "Edward Cherlin" <echerlin@...>, "Elaine and Ed" <elained1362@...>, "Lynn Fitch" <lynn_fitch@...>, "Chow, Jeffrey" <Jeffrey.Chow@...>, "Douglass Carmichael" <Doug@...>, "Douglas Michael Miller" <doug@...>, "Peter Burgess" <peterbNYC@...>, "Tiffany von Emmel" <vonemmel@...>, "Peggy Duvette" <peggy@...>, "Camilla Burg" <camilla@...>, "Tim Foresman" <foresman@...>, "Marge Elliott" <melliott@...>, "Mimi Hui" <msmimihui@...>
                                      Received: Friday, 21 August, 2009, 5:48 PM

                                       

                                      Hello Wael,

                                      Welcome kindred spirit! No time to get into details before going to work, but there are others who share your perspective! I am letting people in other networks know you are speaking out. More later.

                                      Regards,

                                      Mark Roest


                                      On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com> wrote:
                                       

                                      Graham, 
                                      please resend me your offer ~
                                      But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                                      Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                                      I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                                      Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                                      Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                                      Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                                      http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                                      thanks
                                      Wael


                                      On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                                       

                                      Dear All,
                                       
                                      I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                                       
                                      The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                                      of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                                       
                                      I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                      All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                                      made into a viable business.
                                      If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                                       
                                      No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                                       
                                      Graham

                                       
                                       

                                      I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                                      His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                                      to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                                      us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                                      natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                                      accountable to himself.

                                      His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                                      involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                      for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                      source?"

                                      I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                                      from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                                      constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                                      suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                                      my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                                      other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                                      the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                                      others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                                      once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                                      what Tom is learning.

                                      Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                                      agree that Samwel release the funds.

                                      Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                      Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                                      us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                      can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                      including others as well.

                                      My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                                      Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                                      vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                                      questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                                      successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                                      terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                      others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                      http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                                      project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                                      myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                                      profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                      strengthening our network.

                                      Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                                      and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                                      Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                                      Andrius

                                      Andrius Kulikauskas
                                      Minciu Sodas
                                      http://www.ms. lt
                                      ms@...
                                      +370 699 30003
                                      Dukiskes, Lithuania





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                                    • tom ochuka
                                      Dear all,  Janet thanks you are really intouch with waht we do on the ground,we are happy for your consideration on Everlyne and all we are doing here,lets
                                      Message 19 of 26 , Aug 22, 2009
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                                        Dear all,
                                         Janet thanks you are really intouch with waht we do on the ground,we are happy for your consideration on Everlyne and all we are doing here,lets work together as always.
                                        Thanks
                                        TOM OCHUKA

                                        --- On Thu, 8/20/09, Janet Feldman <kaippg@...> wrote:

                                        From: Janet Feldman <kaippg@...>
                                        Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
                                        To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, "Benoit Couture" <benoitctr@yahoo..com>, "ricardoolpc" <ricardoolpc@...>
                                        Cc: "Camilla Burg" <camilla@...>, "Nii Simmonds" <nas146@...>, "Mark Grimes" <mark.grimes@...>, "David Alan Foster" <DALAN@...>, "Edward Cherlin" <echerlin@...>, "Joy Tang" <unitydrum@...>, patty@..., "jeff buderer" <jeff@...>, "Krishna Alluri" <KAlluri@...>, "Chow, Jeffrey" <Jeffrey.Chow@...>
                                        Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 3:13 AM

                                         
                                        Dear Mark and All,
                                         
                                        Hello and marvelous to hear from you on this subject, as well as to see "old friends" cc'd (Mark Grimes, Joy, Ed, Jeff, Benoit, and Krishna Alluri, formerly of the Commonwealth of Learning!!). I did not see your note when I replied just now to letters from Tom, Andrius, Benoit, and Ricardo. My apologies!
                                         
                                        I LOVE the idea of turning research on this project into a COL module, as that would quickly disseminate it (or at least give it that capacity) both within Kenya and globally. KAIPPG (www.kaippg.org) and our COL-incubated GRASSUP NOW distance-learning coalition would find this so interesting, as would many others throughout Kenya and the world.
                                         
                                        I will add, for all cc'd who are not subscribed to Holistic Helping or other Minciu Sodas forums, that two orgs and sites I mentioned in my own note are Gallaudet College (http://cips. gallaudet. edu) and SWAP, or "Safe Water and AIDS Project" in Kenya (www.swapkenya. org).
                                         
                                        Thanks immensely for the great networking connections and links to individuals and orgs who might be of help with regard to this project, Mark--and in particular the possibility for its broader dissemination- -and we look forward to hearing more from one and all. Tom and others can sign up right now with Wiser Earth and Ned, and perhaps others you mention.
                                         
                                        Mark Grimes of Ned (and formerly Omidyar, which is where we met) has been an enthusiast for solar and youth-related projects in Kenya and elsewhere, which also links to Graham Knight of DIY Solar. A common linkage at one point between Mark, myself, Graham, and OVF was KCYP, the Kibera Community Youth Programme.
                                         
                                        In fact, broadening the linkages, David Mutua--linked to Pam McLean, Graham Knight, and Krishna Alluri on projects in Nigeria--then cycled back to helping KCYP in Kenya, if I recall correctly. And Krishna, in his COL incarnation, has had links to a number of us: in Nigeria (Pam, John Dada, David); Ghana (OVF); and Kenya (KAIPPG and other nonprofits such as CISSO-EdTec and UCRC, in the MS forums and beyond). OVF was an early partner in the GRASSUP NOW coalition (and ICTs-ODL based initiative in W Kenya), of which COL was our primary partner-supporter, and then OVF went on to partner with COL in Ghana.
                                         
                                        Krishna and Mark, is it easy to get a module such as Mark describes posted to the COL library? That would be marvelous news for a number of us! And you thought you could quietly retire in peace :))))!
                                         
                                        With greatest thanks, blessings, and excitement, Janet (KAIPPG International, ActALIVE)
                                        ----- Original Message -----
                                        Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 12:54 AM
                                        Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans

                                        Hello Benoit, Ricardo and All!

                                        You are doing a wonderful job pulling together questions that are important for a process that can also be used for other problems. I would like to partially answer your question about how to share this effectively.

                                        I am thinking of seven organizations that can help to disseminate what you are learning. They are Maker Faire Africa (and Maker Fair and Make Magazine in the United States), Wiser Earth, Dreamfish, Designfluence, oneVillage Foundation, and SugarLab / Earth Treasury's digital curricula project.

                                        Websites and contacts for each of these are:
                                        www.wiserearth. org    Camilla Burg <camilla@wiserearth. org>   they list over 100,000 organizations working for social justice and the environment
                                        www.makerfaireafric a.com/    Nii Simmonds <nas146@yahoo. com>, Mark Grimes <mark.grimes@ ned.com> this is all about making things yourself, and they have plans to help commercialize some products in Africa
                                        www.dreamfish. com/     patty@dreamfish. org    they are about web-based services for micro-entrepreneurs --  and celebrating life while we work
                                        www.Designfluence. org    David Alan Foster <DALAN@...>   see the Give Bank project http://designer. givebank. org/    it's about getting industrial designers to contribute free time for design support
                                        www.oneVillageFound ation.org     Joy Tang <unitydrum@gmail. com>, Jeff Buderer <jeff@onevillagefoun dation.org>,    I think you know them; oneVillage Ghana has an Open Digital Village facility and teaches using the internet, among many other projects
                                        http://wiki. sugarlabs. org/go/Earth_ Treasury   Ed Cherlin <echerlin@gmail. com>;   see Ed's video at http://www.linux. com/archive/ feature/147070    he is organizing a global effort to create digital curricula that empower children, and can be used on the One Laptop Per Child XO computers (and others, using Sugar On A Stick)
                                        www.col.org   Krishna Alluri, education specialist, KAlluri@col. org    strengthening education, especially in poor countries, in the British Commonwealth
                                        If you can do the video instruction (or still photos -- they can make up a storyboard), you can use COL, or Commonwealth Of Learning, to help you make it into a great Open and Distance Learning (ODL) module, which they can then put into their library, and into their web-based bibliography of over a million items, which have been Google-ized, and which focus mostly on education and sustainability.

                                        Please let me know if this is confusing, or you have other questions.

                                        Best regards,

                                        Mark Roest

                                        On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@yahoo. com> wrote:
                                         
                                        Indeed Ricardo,
                                         
                                        Let's formulate the questions around Tom's project to reach completion, talking into account that water and life are one and the same essential to existance, where one for all and all for one dwells.
                                         
                                        Some of the questions and answers I can think of go something like:
                                         
                                        -Who has interest in water?
                                         
                                        This will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness..
                                         
                                        -Who can produce water aquisition and distribution?
                                         
                                        -How do we determine who the distribution need to go to?
                                         
                                        -Who will do the aquisitin and who will do the distribution?
                                         
                                        -Who has interest in water and life as on?
                                         
                                        Perhaps from Tom's one cart project to...
                                        And also:
                                         
                                        -As the venture grows, who and how will safety of the resource and of the people be secured?
                                         
                                        Question to be answered from friends to the UN.
                                         
                                        -Who and how the economic unfolding of the water's impact gets to be manage in equitable partnership between personal, business and gorvernments?
                                         
                                        I could see ChrisMacrae and JeffreySachs and AndriusKulikauskas forming the startt up partnership of such a sustainable economic deployment. 
                                         
                                        Any thoughts?
                                         
                                        Benoit


                                        --- On Wed, 8/19/09, ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@ yahoo.co. uk> wrote:

                                        From: ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@ yahoo.co. uk>

                                        Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
                                        To: holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com
                                        Received: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, 12:04 PM

                                         
                                        Andrius
                                        Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go ahead with the loan and project.
                                        I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project, so they can do a similar project?
                                        Ricardo
                                        -----
                                        Hi Tom
                                         I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question that your project will answer.
                                        I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to real, practical questions, like...
                                        What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).
                                        You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar too what Andrius mentioned, such as...
                                        What design am I using?
                                        What materials am I using?
                                        Why did I choose that design?
                                        The costs of materials.
                                        The cost of labour to build the handcart.
                                        The cost of labour to operate the handcart.
                                        How profitable the water business is.
                                        I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions will come out of the project.
                                        But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the project worthwhile?
                                        I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to ask now, then answer during the project would be...
                                        What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?
                                        You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.
                                        I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly photos, not a lot of english text.
                                        When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos, then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip) .
                                        I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already. For example, the handcart project may tell us...
                                        "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the project?" and
                                        "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build a similar cart)
                                        We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".
                                        Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95% photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the Instructables. com website. They have all sorts of projects where people build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom PC'...
                                        As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much help.
                                        Ricardo

                                        --- In holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Hi Tom,
                                        >
                                        > Thank you for writing more about your project.
                                        >
                                        > You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
                                        > without using water pipes?
                                        >
                                        > I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
                                        > hand cart.
                                        >
                                        > For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
                                        > something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
                                        > like to learn?
                                        >
                                        > These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
                                        > supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
                                        > construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
                                        > motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
                                        > social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
                                        > opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
                                        > relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
                                        >
                                        > Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
                                        > your project. There can be many questions.
                                        >
                                        > Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
                                        > never asked you.
                                        >
                                        > * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
                                        > other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
                                        > * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
                                        > * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
                                        >
                                        > This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
                                        >
                                        > Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
                                        >
                                        > Andrius
                                        >
                                        > Andrius Kulikauskas
                                        > Minciu Sodas
                                        > http://www.ms. lt
                                        > ms@...
                                        > +370 699 30003
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
                                        > I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
                                        > obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
                                        > difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
                                        > medicine,
                                        > It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
                                        > handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
                                        > How this Water cart is made.
                                        >
                                        > It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
                                        > rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
                                        > car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.
                                        >
                                        > The cart size:
                                        >
                                        > This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
                                        > Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
                                        > the standard size Jeri-canns..
                                        > After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
                                        > each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
                                        > covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
                                        > makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
                                        > Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
                                        > place when water is filled at the collecting points.
                                        >
                                        > The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
                                        > to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
                                        > pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
                                        > make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
                                        > /Driver.
                                        >
                                        > Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
                                        >
                                        > This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
                                        > both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
                                        > prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
                                        > saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
                                        >
                                        > There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
                                        > get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
                                        > really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
                                        > clean white or bright clothing.
                                        >
                                        > This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
                                        > a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
                                        > nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
                                        > the distance.
                                        >
                                        > Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
                                        > the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
                                        > collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
                                        > Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
                                        >
                                        > What will the community learn.
                                        > 1Savings and Loan from Water project
                                        > 2Health
                                        > 3Re use of old car tryres.
                                        > 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
                                        > Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
                                        > making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
                                        > ready for any.
                                        >
                                        > I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
                                        > I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
                                        > save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.
                                        >
                                        > Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
                                        > installments.
                                        > This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
                                        > bigger intervention.
                                        > Thanks
                                        >
                                        > TOM OCHUKA
                                        >


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                                      • Mark Roest
                                        Dear Janet and All, Thank you, Janet -- you made my day! I am including-in Ray Phoenix, who is looking at initiating a project to bring the key programming
                                        Message 20 of 26 , Aug 23, 2009
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                                          Dear Janet and All,

                                          Thank you, Janet -- you made my day!

                                          I am including-in Ray Phoenix, who is looking at initiating a project to bring the key programming languages and platforms together. Ray, this it the kind of network we need to be able to support, from the grassroots up and from the communities of science down (rather than from the corporate power structure down), with the project I am talking about.

                                          I am also including-in Jack Park, who is creating knowledge gardens that support federating knowledge. While others are working to release V2 of the Compendium software for capturing group process, mind-mapping, and displaying complex systems while databasing the reference materials, Jack is designing and building V3, to manifest his philosophy of knowledge and information more fully.

                                          Ray and Jack, I think it would be wonderful for the world, and interesting for you, for you two to get to know each other, and the network that Janet has described below.

                                          I am also including-in Eileen Clegg, a pioneer and leader in using visual communication to elicit and harness the insight of groups. Eileen, you have a lot to offer a systematic fusion of the knowledge of the world, in all its fractal and ecological and cultural diversity, by contributing to its display systems, and by creating Open and Distance Learning (ODL) modules to teach your methodology to those in the world who have your talent and motivation, but not your mastery of the medium and its uses. Janet and Krishna can guide you in the discovery of ODL modules as a medium of education outside formal institutions. Krishna has been our contact in the Commonwealth Of Learning <www.col.org>, the institution of the British Commonwealth that supports improvements in education, especially in low-income nations of the Commonwealth, and has helped us get two grants from them for creating ODL modules, over the years.

                                          Regards,

                                          Mark Roest

                                          MarkLRoest@...
                                          mobile: +1-510-461-6405

                                          On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 3:13 AM, Janet Feldman <kaippg@...> wrote:
                                           

                                          Dear Mark and All,
                                           
                                          Hello and marvelous to hear from you on this subject, as well as to see "old friends" cc'd (Mark Grimes, Joy, Ed, Jeff, Benoit, and Krishna Alluri, formerly of the Commonwealth of Learning!!). I did not see your note when I replied just now to letters from Tom, Andrius, Benoit, and Ricardo. My apologies!
                                           
                                          I LOVE the idea of turning research on this project into a COL module, as that would quickly disseminate it (or at least give it that capacity) both within Kenya and globally. KAIPPG (www.kaippg.org) and our COL-incubated GRASSUP NOW distance-learning coalition would find this so interesting, as would many others throughout Kenya and the world.
                                           
                                          I will add, for all cc'd who are not subscribed to Holistic Helping or other Minciu Sodas forums, that two orgs and sites I mentioned in my own note are Gallaudet College (http://cips.gallaudet.edu) and SWAP, or "Safe Water and AIDS Project" in Kenya (www.swapkenya.org).
                                           
                                          Thanks immensely for the great networking connections and links to individuals and orgs who might be of help with regard to this project, Mark--and in particular the possibility for its broader dissemination--and we look forward to hearing more from one and all. Tom and others can sign up right now with Wiser Earth and Ned, and perhaps others you mention.
                                           
                                          Mark Grimes of Ned (and formerly Omidyar, which is where we met) has been an enthusiast for solar and youth-related projects in Kenya and elsewhere, which also links to Graham Knight of DIY Solar. A common linkage at one point between Mark, myself, Graham, and OVF was KCYP, the Kibera Community Youth Programme.
                                           
                                          In fact, broadening the linkages, David Mutua--linked to Pam McLean, Graham Knight, and Krishna Alluri on projects in Nigeria--then cycled back to helping KCYP in Kenya, if I recall correctly. And Krishna, in his COL incarnation, has had links to a number of us: in Nigeria (Pam, John Dada, David); Ghana (OVF); and Kenya (KAIPPG and other nonprofits such as CISSO-EdTec and UCRC, in the MS forums and beyond). OVF was an early partner in the GRASSUP NOW coalition (and ICTs-ODL based initiative in W Kenya), of which COL was our primary partner-supporter, and then OVF went on to partner with COL in Ghana.
                                           
                                          Krishna and Mark, is it easy to get a module such as Mark describes posted to the COL library? That would be marvelous news for a number of us! And you thought you could quietly retire in peace :))))!
                                           
                                          With greatest thanks, blessings, and excitement, Janet (KAIPPG International, ActALIVE)
                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: Mark Roest
                                          Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 12:54 AM
                                          Subject: Re: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans

                                          Hello Benoit, Ricardo and All!

                                          You are doing a wonderful job pulling together questions that are important for a process that can also be used for other problems. I would like to partially answer your question about how to share this effectively.

                                          I am thinking of seven organizations that can help to disseminate what you are learning. They are Maker Faire Africa (and Maker Fair and Make Magazine in the United States), Wiser Earth, Dreamfish, Designfluence, oneVillage Foundation, and SugarLab / Earth Treasury's digital curricula project.

                                          Websites and contacts for each of these are:
                                          www.wiserearth.org    Camilla Burg <camilla@...>   they list over 100,000 organizations working for social justice and the environment
                                          www.makerfaireafrica.com/    Nii Simmonds <nas146@...>, Mark Grimes <mark.grimes@...> this is all about making things yourself, and they have plans to help commercialize some products in Africa
                                          www.dreamfish.com/     patty@...    they are about web-based services for micro-entrepreneurs --  and celebrating life while we work
                                          www.Designfluence.org    David Alan Foster <DALAN@...>   see the Give Bank project http://designer.givebank.org/    it's about getting industrial designers to contribute free time for design support
                                          www.oneVillageFoundation.org     Joy Tang <unitydrum@...>, Jeff Buderer <jeff@...>,    I think you know them; oneVillage Ghana has an Open Digital Village facility and teaches using the internet, among many other projects
                                          http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Earth_Treasury   Ed Cherlin <echerlin@...>;   see Ed's video at http://www.linux.com/archive/feature/147070    he is organizing a global effort to create digital curricula that empower children, and can be used on the One Laptop Per Child XO computers (and others, using Sugar On A Stick)
                                          www.col.org   Krishna Alluri, education specialist, KAlluri@...    strengthening education, especially in poor countries, in the British Commonwealth
                                          If you can do the video instruction (or still photos -- they can make up a storyboard), you can use COL, or Commonwealth Of Learning, to help you make it into a great Open and Distance Learning (ODL) module, which they can then put into their library, and into their web-based bibliography of over a million items, which have been Google-ized, and which focus mostly on education and sustainability.

                                          Please let me know if this is confusing, or you have other questions.

                                          Best regards,

                                          Mark Roest

                                          On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 4:07 PM, Benoit Couture <benoitctr@...> wrote:
                                           

                                          Indeed Ricardo,
                                           
                                          Let's formulate the questions around Tom's project to reach completion, talking into account that water and life are one and the same essential to existance, where one for all and all for one dwells.
                                           
                                          Some of the questions and answers I can think of go something like:
                                           
                                          -Who has interest in water?
                                           
                                          This will bring to full view the scope of the project from micro to macro and provide a vision for the assembling, spreading, scaling, spiralling and viraling parts that do get attrackted by the network's emergence of the coming into being of togetherness.
                                           
                                          -Who can produce water aquisition and distribution?
                                           
                                          -How do we determine who the distribution need to go to?
                                           
                                          -Who will do the aquisitin and who will do the distribution?
                                           
                                          -Who has interest in water and life as on?
                                           
                                          Perhaps from Tom's one cart project to...
                                          And also:
                                           
                                          -As the venture grows, who and how will safety of the resource and of the people be secured?
                                           
                                          Question to be answered from friends to the UN.
                                           
                                          -Who and how the economic unfolding of the water's impact gets to be manage in equitable partnership between personal, business and gorvernments?
                                           
                                          I could see ChrisMacrae and JeffreySachs and AndriusKulikauskas forming the startt up partnership of such a sustainable economic deployment. 
                                           
                                          Any thoughts?
                                           
                                          Benoit


                                          --- On Wed, 8/19/09, ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...> wrote:

                                          From: ricardoolpc <ricardoolpc@...>

                                          Subject: [holistichelping] Re: Water cart loan questions and plans
                                          To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com
                                          Received: Wednesday, August 19, 2009, 12:04 PM

                                           
                                          Andrius
                                          Tom emailed me, as he finds writing a lot of english hard and he thought the work would be too much. I wrote this reply below to encourage him to go ahead with the loan and project.
                                          I came up with a suggestion for something new we could learn from the handcart project - What is the best way to tell people about the project, so they can do a similar project?
                                          Ricardo
                                          -----
                                          Hi Tom
                                           I don't think you have to write a lot for this loan to go ahead. Please forget what I said about Andrius's interest in philosophical questions or your values. I put too much emphasis on that. I shouldn't have mentioned those. I mis-understood what andrius was asking. The 'Values' questions are just something Andrius is interested in, but not the main question that your project will answer.
                                          I think, the only things you need to do for the loan to go ahead relate to real, practical questions, like...
                                          What will you and other people learn from the handcart project? (whether your design is a good one, the materials costs, etc).
                                          You could just provide a list of things the project will find out, similar too what Andrius mentioned, such as...
                                          What design am I using?
                                          What materials am I using?
                                          Why did I choose that design?
                                          The costs of materials.
                                          The cost of labour to build the handcart.
                                          The cost of labour to operate the handcart.
                                          How profitable the water business is.
                                          I think Andrius only needs a list like that, before the project starts. He doesn't need you to write a detailed plan to answer those questions before getting the loan or starting the project. The answers to those questions will come out of the project.
                                          But Andrius also asked, is there 'something new' we can learn, to make the project worthwhile?
                                          I was thinking, since you find it quite hard to write a lot in English, to tell people about the progress of the project, maybe a good question to ask now, then answer during the project would be...
                                          What is the easiest way for you to tell people about the handcart project?
                                          You can get the loan, start the project, then think about that question.
                                          I'm just guessing, but maybe the best way to tell people about the project is to use a style like my Camera Course Notes for Fantsuam Foundation in Nigeria, where I taught people to use a digital camera using mostly photos, not a lot of english text.
                                          When you build and operate the handcart, you could take a lot of photos, then tell people about the project using 95% photos and just 5% text (1 sentence for each photo, like caption in a newspaper cartoon-strip) .
                                          I think Andrius wants to see if the handcart project can be like 'research', where it tells us something new, that we don't know already. For example, the handcart project may tell us...
                                          "Is using 95% photos and 5% text a good way to tell other people about the project?" and
                                          "Is that the best way to tell people about a project?" (so they can build a similar cart)
                                          We may also find out "Should other projects be run in the same way?".
                                          Tom, you've already seen the camera course notes as an example of the 95% photos/5% text teaching method. Another example of using photos for step-by-step instructions or to tell people about a project is the Instructables. com website. They have all sorts of projects where people build or modify something, such as this one about 'How to build a custom PC'...
                                          As I said, Tom, I hope you will go ahead with the loan and the water-cart project. It would be good if you can post your own photos to the Yahoo Group, but I can assist a little if needed. That would show that other people could do similar projects and tell people about it, without much help.
                                          Ricardo

                                          --- In holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > Hi Tom,
                                          >
                                          > Thank you for writing more about your project.
                                          >
                                          > You write that your question is: How to obtain water to help community
                                          > without using water pipes?
                                          >
                                          > I think you already have an answer to this question: You will build a
                                          > hand cart.
                                          >
                                          > For this project to make sense for Minciu Sodas, we need to learn
                                          > something new. What is it that you don't know already that you would
                                          > like to learn?
                                          >
                                          > These could be questions regarding the economics of your project (the
                                          > supply and the demand, the prices, the workers, the business model), the
                                          > construction of your cart (how to build it, how to improve it), the
                                          > motivation of your workers (what is an optimal work load for them), the
                                          > social impact (additional services or value that you can add, your
                                          > opportunity to organize people), the replicability (where might this be
                                          > relevant elsewhere and what is required) and so on.
                                          >
                                          > Please be more specific, what might be interesting to you and us about
                                          > your project. There can be many questions.
                                          >
                                          > Also, please, I don't have a list of your deepest value in life. Maybe I
                                          > never asked you.
                                          >
                                          > * Do you have a deepest value in your life that includes all of your
                                          > other values? (This helps me and others organize around you.)
                                          > * What is a question that you don't know the answer to, but wish to answer?
                                          > * And how might that question relate to your hand cart project?
                                          >
                                          > This is key for our success together. Thank you for your dedication.
                                          >
                                          > Samwel and all, do you have any questions or ideas?
                                          >
                                          > Andrius
                                          >
                                          > Andrius Kulikauskas
                                          > Minciu Sodas
                                          > http://www.ms. lt
                                          > ms@...
                                          > +370 699 30003
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Dear Andrius ,Ricardo ,Samuel, Pam and all,
                                          > I have one question that is difficult to answer and that is how to
                                          > obtain water to help community ,without using water Pipes ,its indeed a
                                          > difficult question Water apart from being a source of livelihood is
                                          > medicine,
                                          > It cures both human beings and livestock, I would like to have two Water
                                          > handcarts from Aloan provided by Andrius.
                                          > How this Water cart is made.
                                          >
                                          > It requires the Z tubes of iron bars and some flat iron ,its a
                                          > rectangular Iron made water cart pulled by two old car tryres ,this old
                                          > car tyres will last for several months perhaps one year before replacement.
                                          >
                                          > The cart size:
                                          >
                                          > This cart is made of running length is 5.6ft while the width is 2.26ft
                                          > Going down to the carriage its 1.5ft in size that's depth enough to fit
                                          > the standard size Jeri-canns.
                                          > After completion timber of 3 lengths is added at the bottom of 1.6 fit
                                          > each they need to spaced so that when water leaks when the lead is
                                          > covered dry up at the bottom preventing the rubbing or friction and
                                          > makes nice resting place for Jeri -cans.
                                          > Apiece of metal to act as stands are made to Both Ends to make a resting
                                          > place when water is filled at the collecting points.
                                          >
                                          > The handles are made using pipes of 2inches diameter and 1ft length bent
                                          > to form a bend for easy hands to push both sides and we have Rubber
                                          > pipes fitted to prevent fiction when one is pushing or sweat which can
                                          > make the hands to sleep of so that there is total control for the user
                                          > /Driver.
                                          >
                                          > Usage/Domestic and Commercially:
                                          >
                                          > This water is used with the community around Nyamasaria slums and serves
                                          > both houses and schools within, with this provision diseases are
                                          > prevented ,congestion at the water drawing point controlled livelihoods
                                          > saved both ANIMALS AND HUMAN beings.
                                          >
                                          > There are other local methods which pose risk to the community, they can
                                          > get untreated water, where others use for wash nearby the river but
                                          > really Dangerous, with Diarrhea, typhoid/skin infections and cannot
                                          > clean white or bright clothing.
                                          >
                                          > This water cart saves time and money many travel kilometers for
                                          > a20litres while its easy to ferry the 12 Jeri cans of 20 liters each to
                                          > nay destination ,for me I will save 7ksh per 20 liters ,it depends on
                                          > the distance.
                                          >
                                          > Those who drive them are paid ksh 100 each day and keep 50 to save for
                                          > the water cart for maintenance and loans repay. From this saving will
                                          > collect ksh 50 from every cart each day multiplied by 2 that's 100 and 6
                                          > Days is ksh 600 and minus 100 for greasing because it has bearings.
                                          >
                                          > What will the community learn.
                                          > 1Savings and Loan from Water project
                                          > 2Health
                                          > 3Re use of old car tryres.
                                          > 4It will also offer Employment to youths around.
                                          > Andrius will provide methods of paying this loan whether online by
                                          > making postings to yahoo-groups or any other means provided, ill be
                                          > ready for any.
                                          >
                                          > I plan to pay the Loan monthly for the next 5 months
                                          > I will open local bank account costing ksh 3000 for this project and
                                          > save in order to payback to Andrius maybe if the paying process is provided.
                                          >
                                          > Am interested in the next Project upon finishing the final loan
                                          > installments.
                                          > This is particular community not Nyanza as a province that requires a
                                          > bigger intervention.
                                          > Thanks
                                          >
                                          > TOM OCHUKA
                                          >


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                                        • zoneziwoh
                                          your say?  i appreciate your support in contributing for the success of this initiative thk u   Essential First aid for sexual violence victims Assessing the
                                          Message 21 of 26 , Aug 23, 2009
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                                            your say?
                                             i appreciate your support in contributing for the success of this initiative
                                            thk u


                                             

                                            Essential First aid for sexual violence victims


                                            Assessing the impact of Government, together with some Local & International bodies signing many conventions to fight against women’s right, which is still to fully respect these conventions reflected yearly on 8th march to update the women’s statues.

                                            Though in many local regions within Cameroon and in the world, the government and other stakeholders have been unable to empower women economically, politically and legally of which they constitute the engine to development.

                                            For instant, 40% of Cameroonian women who worked receive fewer salaries than their male counterparts who do the same job, meanwhile, efforts to eradicate injustice against women in the domain of training, employment, revenue and food security in tandem with the UN millennium development goals, MDGs to fight discrimination against women’s violence such that, they could play a major role in sustaining prosperity, peace & security in the sub-region seems to be a no action..

                                            So far, the rampant occurrence of girls, married and unmarried women, rarely cases of men except for homosexuals experiencing violent, which could be in force of sexual encounters by husband or boy friends and other forms of domestic violence has been a called for concern. And thus, needs for Essential First aid for sexual violence victims.

                                             

                                            This is an upcoming documentary which serves as an immediate First aid before the victim(s) could go for proper medical checkups, or reporting the incident to any authority.

                                             

                                            Many thanks

                                             Zoneziwoh



                                            www.zoneziwohshow. com

                                            freelance writer
                                            blog www.thesop.org/ html/writers. php?writer= zone

                                            http://www.Vision4P lenty.org/ zoneziwoh

                                            Response to "NGO Worker Sentenced to Life Imprisonment"
                                            http://newsblaze. com/story/ 20090108080658zz zz.nb/topstory. html

                                            Response to UN Forum Seeks to Ensure Schooling for Children From Homes
                                            http://newsblaze. com/story/ 20081012153035ts op.nb/topstory. html

                                            Response to "Australia: Indian Women, Down Under and Tortured"
                                            http://newsblaze. com/story/ 20081106083032zz zz.nb/topstory. html

                                            Have We Forgotten How to Take Care of Ourselves?
                                            http://newsblaze. com/story/ 20081027060208zz zz.nb/topstory. html


                                            MERITOCRACY, BE YOUR PRINCIPLE

                                            --- On Fri, 21/8/09, Mark Roest <marklroest@gmail. com> wrote:

                                            From: Mark Roest <marklroest@gmail. com>
                                            Subject: Re: [globalvillages] Re: [holistichelping] Re: How to Power the Community
                                            To: globalvillages@ yahoogroups. com
                                            Cc: holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, mendenyo@yahoogroup s.com, socialagriculture@ yahoogroups. com, "Ray Phoenix" <Ray.Phoenix@ gmail.com>, "David Alan Foster" <DALAN@...>, "Edward Cherlin" <echerlin@gmail. com>, "Elaine and Ed" <elained1362@ att.net>, "Lynn Fitch" <lynn_fitch@comcast. net>, "Chow, Jeffrey" <Jeffrey.Chow@ morganstanley. com>, "Douglass Carmichael" <Doug@dougcarmichael .com>, "Douglas Michael Miller" <doug@gjentara. com>, "Peter Burgess" <peterbNYC@gmail. com>, "Tiffany von Emmel" <vonemmel@dreamfish. com>, "Peggy Duvette" <peggy@wiserearth. org>, "Camilla Burg" <camilla@wiserearth. org>, "Tim Foresman" <foresman@earthparty .org>, "Marge Elliott" <melliott@lalunavent ures.com>, "Mimi Hui" <msmimihui@gmail. com>
                                            Received: Friday, 21 August, 2009, 5:48 PM

                                             

                                            Hello Wael,

                                            Welcome kindred spirit! No time to get into details before going to work, but there are others who share your perspective! I am letting people in other networks know you are speaking out. More later.

                                            Regards,

                                            Mark Roest


                                            On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Global Palestine <globalpalestine@ googlemail. com> wrote:
                                             

                                            Graham, 
                                            please resend me your offer ~
                                            But in general, I think the time is ripe to follow large scale approach  and not depending micro-financing projects to empower individual micro-challenges.
                                            Even many people are looking for survival, they are born for something bigger than that and they would love to be part of bigger challenge  and vision sharing it with other. So imagine we network the becoming resilient communities in one organic economic body, where we share appropriate  technology, know-how in developing green products and services we want and we need freely without being slaves to the traditional market obligations. 
                                            I think we can use economy, healing economy, as vehicle for it. Like the lungs providing body life with Oxygen, economy can be the mechanism  for  sharing resources efficientl y and building collective intellige nce. And instead of destructive economy for human and earth, we can develop a model for cooperative  green collective healing one and getting it to be part of the global market showing the masses global alternatives.
                                            Such an organic economic body has its own ecology in terms of functions and processes. Its own logistics veins and exchange code. 

                                            Any known sweet spots for these thoughts? Any initiatives do exists? 
                                            Beside mine for Global Palestine I know http://fairwork. mixxt.org/ mentioned by Franz on other thread. 
                                            http://sekem. com/ is doing good work but depending on local resources and capital as part of the traditional market. 

                                            thanks
                                            Wael


                                            On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 5:08 PM, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                                             

                                            Dear All,
                                             
                                            I'm glad that this chat is becoming more practical.
                                             
                                            The questions raised below cover other projects than just water but at the heart of most
                                            of them is the problem of getting people to become independent.
                                             
                                            I have offered more than once to give small loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                            All I ask is that an effort is first made by that person to work out how it can be
                                            made into a viable business.
                                            If it fails later there is no requirement that the loan is repaid!
                                             
                                            No-one has yet taken up my offer!
                                             
                                            Graham

                                             
                                             

                                            I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.

                                            His deepest value in life is "Have an environment where people can adapt
                                            to changes". This is very helpful for us all to know because it helps
                                            us understand and support him, know where his leadership is most
                                            natural, understand the personal relevance of his projects and hold him
                                            accountable to himself.

                                            His question is "How to empower the community?" and specifically "How to
                                            involve people to make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                            for themselves?" as in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                            source?"

                                            I approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about 111.40 USD)
                                            from my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is for
                                            constructing one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that I
                                            suggest are that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan per
                                            my instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold further. The
                                            other 25% is for research on this project that Tom will do and share on
                                            the questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit, I and
                                            others might ask. This research will include regular updates (at least
                                            once a month) by email and photos of how the project is unfolding and
                                            what Tom is learning.

                                            Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write us and I
                                            agree that Samwel release the funds.

                                            Samwel, do you have any questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                            Tom on research aspects, what we can all learn and what might interest
                                            us. This project will be part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                            can build further on that around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                            including others as well.

                                            My suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and other
                                            Worknets labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So it's
                                            vital for our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own values,
                                            questions and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too. A
                                            successful research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more in
                                            terms of the relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                            others. For example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                            http://www.akvo. org "open source for water and sanitation". The
                                            project needs to stand on such merits for it to be worth me investing
                                            myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or not it makes a
                                            profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                            strengthening our network.

                                            Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to thinking through more such loans
                                            and how best to distribute and apply our resources.

                                            Tom, thank you for your initiative,

                                            Andrius

                                            Andrius Kulikauskas
                                            Minciu Sodas
                                            http://www.ms. lt
                                            ms@...
                                            +370 699 30003
                                            Dukiskes, Lithuania





                                            Find local businesses and services in your area with Yahoo!7 Local. Get started.



                                            Find local businesses and services in your area with Yahoo!7 Local. Get started.
                                          • Samwel Kongere
                                            Ok Andrius and Tom, I will be more happy with you as we all agree, good! I am coming to Kisumu the second week of September to calculate the distance, give you
                                            Message 22 of 26 , Aug 23, 2009
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Ok Andrius and Tom,
                                              I will be more happy with you as we all agree, good! I am coming to Kisumu the second week of September to calculate the distance, give you an outline and learn with you! We will visit the bank and see that i finalise the payment for the first hand cart.
                                              Samwel.


                                              --- On Thu, 8/20/09, graham <DIYSolar@...> wrote:

                                              > From: graham <DIYSolar@...>
                                              > Subject: [mendenyo] Re: How to Power the Community
                                              > To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, mendenyo@yahoogroups.com, socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com, globalvillages@yahoogroups.com
                                              > Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 2:08 AM
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >  
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > Dear All,
                                              >  
                                              > I'm glad that this
                                              > chat is becoming more
                                              > practical.
                                              >  
                                              > The questions raised
                                              > below cover other
                                              > projects than just water but at the heart of
                                              > most
                                              > of them is the
                                              > problem of getting people to become
                                              > independent.
                                              >  
                                              > I have offered more than
                                              > once to give small
                                              > loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                              > All I ask is that an
                                              > effort is first made by that
                                              > person to work out how it can be
                                              > made into a viable
                                              > business.
                                              > If it fails later there is
                                              > no requirement that the
                                              > loan is repaid!
                                              >  
                                              > No-one has yet taken up my
                                              > offer!
                                              >  
                                              > Graham
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >   
                                              >
                                              > I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.
                                              >
                                              > His deepest value in life is "Have
                                              > an environment where people can adapt
                                              > to changes". This is very helpful
                                              > for us all to know because it helps
                                              > us understand and support him, know
                                              > where his leadership is most
                                              > natural, understand the personal relevance of
                                              > his projects and hold him
                                              > accountable to himself.
                                              >
                                              > His question is
                                              > "How to empower the community?" and
                                              > specifically "How to
                                              > involve people to
                                              > make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                              > for themselves?" as
                                              > in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                              >
                                              > source?"
                                              >
                                              > I
                                              > approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about
                                              > 111.40 USD)
                                              > from
                                              > my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is
                                              > for
                                              > constructing
                                              > one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that
                                              > I
                                              > suggest are
                                              > that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan
                                              > per
                                              > my
                                              > instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold
                                              > further. The
                                              > other 25%
                                              > is for research on this project that Tom will do and
                                              > share on
                                              > the
                                              > questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit,
                                              > I and
                                              > others
                                              > might ask. This research will include regular updates (at
                                              > least
                                              > once a
                                              > month) by email and photos of how the project is
                                              > unfolding and
                                              > what Tom is
                                              > learning.
                                              >
                                              > Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write
                                              > us
                                              > and I
                                              > agree that Samwel release the funds.
                                              >
                                              > Samwel, do you have any
                                              > questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                              > Tom on research aspects,
                                              > what we can all learn and what might interest
                                              > us. This project will be
                                              > part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                              > can build further on that
                                              > around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                              > including others as well.
                                              >
                                              > My
                                              > suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and
                                              > other
                                              > Worknets
                                              > labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So
                                              > it's
                                              > vital for
                                              > our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own
                                              > values,
                                              > questions
                                              > and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too.
                                              > A
                                              > successful
                                              > research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more
                                              > in
                                              > terms of the
                                              > relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                              >
                                              > others. For
                                              > example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                              >
                                              > http://www.akvo org
                                              > "open source for water
                                              > and sanitation". The
                                              > project needs to stand on such merits for it to be
                                              > worth me investing
                                              > myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or
                                              > not it makes a
                                              > profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > strengthening our network.
                                              >
                                              > Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to
                                              > thinking through more such loans
                                              > and how best to distribute and apply our
                                              > resources.
                                              >
                                              > Tom, thank you for your
                                              > initiative,
                                              >
                                              > Andrius
                                              >
                                              > Andrius Kulikauskas
                                              > Minciu Sodas
                                              > http://www.ms lt
                                              > ms@...
                                              > +370 699 30003
                                              > Dukiskes,
                                              > Lithuania
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                            • Andrius Kulikauskas
                                              Samwel, Please send Tom the money right away. He and I have agreed. I want him to start as soon as he can. I don t want him to wait three weeks or to wonder
                                              Message 23 of 26 , Aug 23, 2009
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                Samwel,

                                                Please send Tom the money right away. He and I have agreed. I want him
                                                to start as soon as he can. I don't want him to wait three weeks or to
                                                wonder whether you will approve.

                                                I look forward to your observations on how his project is going.

                                                Andrius

                                                Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                Minciu Sodas
                                                http://www.ms.lt
                                                ms@...
                                                +370 699 30003

                                                Samwel Kongere wrote:
                                                > Ok Andrius and Tom,
                                                > I will be more happy with you as we all agree, good! I am coming to Kisumu the second week of September to calculate the distance, give you an outline and learn with you! We will visit the bank and see that i finalise the payment for the first hand cart.
                                                > Samwel.
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > --- On Thu, 8/20/09, graham <DIYSolar@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >> From: graham <DIYSolar@...>
                                                >> Subject: [mendenyo] Re: How to Power the Community
                                                >> To: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, mendenyo@yahoogroups.com, socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com, globalvillages@yahoogroups.com
                                                >> Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 2:08 AM
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >> Dear All,
                                                >>
                                                >> I'm glad that this
                                                >> chat is becoming more
                                                >> practical.
                                                >>
                                                >> The questions raised
                                                >> below cover other
                                                >> projects than just water but at the heart of
                                                >> most
                                                >> of them is the
                                                >> problem of getting people to become
                                                >> independent.
                                                >>
                                                >> I have offered more than
                                                >> once to give small
                                                >> loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                                >> All I ask is that an
                                                >> effort is first made by that
                                                >> person to work out how it can be
                                                >> made into a viable
                                                >> business.
                                                >> If it fails later there is
                                                >> no requirement that the
                                                >> loan is repaid!
                                                >>
                                                >> No-one has yet taken up my
                                                >> offer!
                                                >>
                                                >> Graham
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >> I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.
                                                >>
                                                >> His deepest value in life is "Have
                                                >> an environment where people can adapt
                                                >> to changes". This is very helpful
                                                >> for us all to know because it helps
                                                >> us understand and support him, know
                                                >> where his leadership is most
                                                >> natural, understand the personal relevance of
                                                >> his projects and hold him
                                                >> accountable to himself.
                                                >>
                                                >> His question is
                                                >> "How to empower the community?" and
                                                >> specifically "How to
                                                >> involve people to
                                                >> make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                                >> for themselves?" as
                                                >> in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                                >>
                                                >> source?"
                                                >>
                                                >> I
                                                >> approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about
                                                >> 111.40 USD)
                                                >> from
                                                >> my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is
                                                >> for
                                                >> constructing
                                                >> one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that
                                                >> I
                                                >> suggest are
                                                >> that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan
                                                >> per
                                                >> my
                                                >> instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold
                                                >> further. The
                                                >> other 25%
                                                >> is for research on this project that Tom will do and
                                                >> share on
                                                >> the
                                                >> questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit,
                                                >> I and
                                                >> others
                                                >> might ask. This research will include regular updates (at
                                                >> least
                                                >> once a
                                                >> month) by email and photos of how the project is
                                                >> unfolding and
                                                >> what Tom is
                                                >> learning.
                                                >>
                                                >> Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write
                                                >> us
                                                >> and I
                                                >> agree that Samwel release the funds.
                                                >>
                                                >> Samwel, do you have any
                                                >> questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                                >> Tom on research aspects,
                                                >> what we can all learn and what might interest
                                                >> us. This project will be
                                                >> part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                                >> can build further on that
                                                >> around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                                >> including others as well.
                                                >>
                                                >> My
                                                >> suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and
                                                >> other
                                                >> Worknets
                                                >> labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So
                                                >> it's
                                                >> vital for
                                                >> our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own
                                                >> values,
                                                >> questions
                                                >> and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too.
                                                >> A
                                                >> successful
                                                >> research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more
                                                >> in
                                                >> terms of the
                                                >> relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                                >>
                                                >> others. For
                                                >> example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                                >>
                                                >> http://www.akvo org
                                                >> "open source for water
                                                >> and sanitation". The
                                                >> project needs to stand on such merits for it to be
                                                >> worth me investing
                                                >> myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or
                                                >> not it makes a
                                                >> profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >> strengthening our network.
                                                >>
                                                >> Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to
                                                >> thinking through more such loans
                                                >> and how best to distribute and apply our
                                                >> resources.
                                                >>
                                                >> Tom, thank you for your
                                                >> initiative,
                                                >>
                                                >> Andrius
                                                >>
                                                >> Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                >> Minciu Sodas
                                                >> http://www.ms lt
                                                >> ms@...
                                                >> +370 699 30003
                                                >> Dukiskes,
                                                >> Lithuania
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >>
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > ------------------------------------
                                                >
                                                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                              • tom ochuka
                                                Dear Andrius and Sam ,  Thanks am waiting Tom ... From: Andrius Kulikauskas Subject: [holistichelping] Samwel, please send Tom the money now To:
                                                Message 24 of 26 , Aug 24, 2009
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  Dear Andrius and Sam ,
                                                   Thanks am waiting
                                                  Tom

                                                  --- On Sun, 8/23/09, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:

                                                  From: Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...>
                                                  Subject: [holistichelping] Samwel, please send Tom the money now
                                                  To: socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Cc: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, mendenyo@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:19 PM

                                                   

                                                  Samwel,

                                                  Please send Tom the money right away. He and I have agreed. I want him
                                                  to start as soon as he can. I don't want him to wait three weeks or to
                                                  wonder whether you will approve.

                                                  I look forward to your observations on how his project is going..

                                                  Andrius

                                                  Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                  Minciu Sodas
                                                  http://www.ms. lt
                                                  ms@...
                                                  +370 699 30003

                                                  Samwel Kongere wrote:
                                                  > Ok Andrius and Tom,
                                                  > I will be more happy with you as we all agree, good! I am coming to Kisumu the second week of September to calculate the distance, give you an outline and learn with you! We will visit the bank and see that i finalise the payment for the first hand cart.
                                                  > Samwel.
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > --- On Thu, 8/20/09, graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >> From: graham <DIYSolar@btinternet .com>
                                                  >> Subject: [mendenyo] Re: How to Power the Community
                                                  >> To: holistichelping@ yahoogroups. com, mendenyo@yahoogroup s.com, socialagriculture@ yahoogroups. com, globalvillages@ yahoogroups. com
                                                  >> Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 2:08 AM
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Dear All,
                                                  >>
                                                  >> I'm glad that this
                                                  >> chat is becoming more
                                                  >> practical.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> The questions raised
                                                  >> below cover other
                                                  >> projects than just water but at the heart of
                                                  >> most
                                                  >> of them is the
                                                  >> problem of getting people to become
                                                  >> independent.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> I have offered more than
                                                  >> once to give small
                                                  >> loans for personal microsolar projects.
                                                  >> All I ask is that an
                                                  >> effort is first made by that
                                                  >> person to work out how it can be
                                                  >> made into a viable
                                                  >> business.
                                                  >> If it fails later there is
                                                  >> no requirement that the
                                                  >> loan is repaid!
                                                  >>
                                                  >> No-one has yet taken up my
                                                  >> offer!
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Graham
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >> I spoke with Tom Ocuka just now.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> His deepest value in life is "Have
                                                  >> an environment where people can adapt
                                                  >> to changes". This is very helpful
                                                  >> for us all to know because it helps
                                                  >> us understand and support him, know
                                                  >> where his leadership is most
                                                  >> natural, understand the personal relevance of
                                                  >> his projects and hold him
                                                  >> accountable to himself.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> His question is
                                                  >> "How to empower the community?" and
                                                  >> specifically "How to
                                                  >> involve people to
                                                  >> make them independent so they can find water solutions
                                                  >> for themselves?" as
                                                  >> in "How to get water without depending on the common
                                                  >>
                                                  >> source?"
                                                  >>
                                                  >> I
                                                  >> approve a loan of 8500 Kenyan shilling (currently about
                                                  >> 111.40 USD)
                                                  >> from
                                                  >> my Minciu Sodas funds that Samwel is holding. The loan is
                                                  >> for
                                                  >> constructing
                                                  >> one hand cart for water as Tom described. The terms that
                                                  >> I
                                                  >> suggest are
                                                  >> that Tom be ready in 6 months to return 75% of the loan
                                                  >> per
                                                  >> my
                                                  >> instructions, either to return to Samwel or to hold
                                                  >> further. The
                                                  >> other 25%
                                                  >> is for research on this project that Tom will do and
                                                  >> share on
                                                  >> the
                                                  >> questions above and other questions that Ricardo, Benoit,
                                                  >> I and
                                                  >> others
                                                  >> might ask. This research will include regular updates (at
                                                  >> least
                                                  >> once a
                                                  >> month) by email and photos of how the project is
                                                  >> unfolding and
                                                  >> what Tom is
                                                  >> learning.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Tom, do you agree to these terms? If you do, please write
                                                  >> us
                                                  >> and I
                                                  >> agree that Samwel release the funds.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Samwel, do you have any
                                                  >> questions? My thought is that Samwel will coach
                                                  >> Tom on research aspects,
                                                  >> what we can all learn and what might interest
                                                  >> us. This project will be
                                                  >> part of Samwel's worknets lab and I hope we
                                                  >> can build further on that
                                                  >> around Samwel's and Tom's leadership,
                                                  >> including others as well.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> My
                                                  >> suggested terms show my economic logic. Minciu Sodas and
                                                  >> other
                                                  >> Worknets
                                                  >> labs are about organizing around independent thinkers. So
                                                  >> it's
                                                  >> vital for
                                                  >> our investments that we know Tom and focus on his own
                                                  >> values,
                                                  >> questions
                                                  >> and growth. That is what builds our economic assets, too.
                                                  >> A
                                                  >> successful
                                                  >> research project like this is easily worth $1,000 or more
                                                  >> in
                                                  >> terms of the
                                                  >> relationships that it builds amongst us and opens up with
                                                  >>
                                                  >> others. For
                                                  >> example, it can link up connections with Mark Chambers of
                                                  >>
                                                  >> http://www.akvo. org
                                                  >> "open source for water
                                                  >> and sanitation". The
                                                  >> project needs to stand on such merits for it to be
                                                  >> worth me investing
                                                  >> myself in, for it to be self-sustainable. Whether or
                                                  >> not it makes a
                                                  >> profit or even covers costs is, for me, secondary, if it is
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >> strengthening our network.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Samwel, Tom and all, I look forward to
                                                  >> thinking through more such loans
                                                  >> and how best to distribute and apply our
                                                  >> resources.
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Tom, thank you for your
                                                  >> initiative,
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Andrius
                                                  >>
                                                  >> Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                  >> Minciu Sodas
                                                  >> http://www.ms. lt
                                                  >> ms@...
                                                  >> +370 699 30003
                                                  >> Dukiskes,
                                                  >> Lithuania
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >>
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > ------------ --------- --------- ------
                                                  >
                                                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  >


                                                • zoneziwoh
                                                  The World March will begin in New Zealand on October 2, 2009, the anniversary of Gandhi’s birth, declared the “International Day of Nonviolence” by the
                                                  Message 25 of 26 , Aug 25, 2009
                                                  • 0 Attachment


                                                    The World March will begin in New Zealand on October 2, 2009, the anniversary of Gandhi’s birth, declared the “International Day of Nonviolence” by the United Nations. It will conclude in the Andes Mountains (Punta de Vacas, Aconcagua, Argentina) on January 2, 2010. The March will last 90 days, three long months of travel. It will pass through all climates and seasons, from the hot summer of the tropics and the deserts, to the winter of Siberia. The American and Asian stages will be the longest, both almost a month. A permanent base of a hundred people of different nationalities will complete the journey.

                                                    offical website:www.theworldmarch.org

                                                    links to all national cordinator, scroll and contact your country cordinator:http://www.theworldmarch.org/index.php?secc=link

                                                     mapping of the peaceful march, check if they world marching will pass through your home town: http://www.theworldmarch.org/index.php?secc=recorrido


                                                    and if your institution, organisation...wants to endorse:http://www.theworldmarch.org/index.php?secc=join

                                                    hint on those endorsement personalities:http://www.theworldmarch.org/index.php?secc=adhesiones


                                                    expliot the site, wishing us all a memorable peace march


                                                    zoneziwoh



                                                    Find local businesses and services in your area with Yahoo!7 Local. Get started.
                                                  • Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                    Samwel wrote a letter to explain that he will send the money to Tom soon. Thank you, Ricardo, also for your help. Tom, I look forward to your reports and
                                                    Message 26 of 26 , Aug 26, 2009
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      Samwel wrote a letter to explain that he will send the money to Tom
                                                      soon. Thank you, Ricardo, also for your help. Tom, I look forward to
                                                      your reports and photos! I'm glad we are working together. Thank you
                                                      also Graham for your letters. Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                      -------------------------------------

                                                      tom ochuka wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > Dear Andrius and Sam ,
                                                      > Thanks am waiting
                                                      > Tom
                                                      >
                                                      > --- On Sun, 8/23/09, Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > From: Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...>
                                                      > Subject: [holistichelping] Samwel, please send Tom the money now
                                                      > To: socialagriculture@yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Cc: holistichelping@yahoogroups.com, mendenyo@yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Date: Sunday, August 23, 2009, 8:19 PM
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > Samwel,
                                                      >
                                                      > Please send Tom the money right away. He and I have agreed. I
                                                      want him
                                                      > to start as soon as he can. I don't want him to wait three weeks
                                                      or to
                                                      > wonder whether you will approve.
                                                      >
                                                      > I look forward to your observations on how his project is going..
                                                      >
                                                      > Andrius
                                                      >
                                                      > Andrius Kulikauskas
                                                      > Minciu Sodas
                                                      > http://www.ms lt
                                                      > ms@...
                                                      > +370 699 30003
                                                      >
                                                      > Samwel Kongere wrote:
                                                      > > Ok Andrius and Tom,
                                                      > > I will be more happy with you as we all agree, good! I am
                                                      coming to Kisumu the second week of September to calculate the distance,
                                                      give you an outline and learn with you! We will visit the bank and see
                                                      that i finalise the payment for the first hand cart.
                                                      > > Samwel.
                                                      > >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
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