Franz and Andrius chat about Marcin and art
- Marcin Jakubowski of Factor E Farm http://openfarmtech.org/weblog/ is
touring Austrian villages thanks to Franz Nahrada who leads our Global
Villages working group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/globalvillages/
Marcin and I think Samuel Rose were invited to showcase their work at
http://subversivmesse.net Suversiv Messe (subversive fair) in Linz,
Thanks to Ben de Vries and Jeremy Maso at the farm in Missouri, and thanks
to their agreeing to work for our Mornflake project, we've taken some real
practical steps that Minciu Sodas might highlight and organize around
Factor E Farm, including their blog. Franz and I chat about Marcin's
priorities and how Minciu Sodas might support him. Marcin is a key person
in our world and (as with so many of us) it takes years to learn how we
might support each other. And it's definitely worth it. We also mention
supporting something analogous in Africa, especially around Samwel Kongere
in Rusinga Island.
Franz and I also chat about my first art show which took place in the
"Republic of Uzhupis", an artistic neighborhood of Vilnius, Lithuania. It
was based on my drawings of my algebra students in Bosnia which I drew
when they would take my exams. Tomas Cepaitis and Vygantas Vejas liked my
drawings and invited me to do an art show at http://www.umi.lt/galera.php
and encouraged me to do new works. Thank you to Ana Ilic of Serbia (of
Baby Tumbler and Public Domain Fashion) who, with help from Zdenka and
Sasha Mrkailo, provided me with video and photos of her cutting, sewing,
painting, so that she could be my muse of problem-solving. I painted six
paintings (the six days of creation) and one big one (2,5 m high and 2 m
wide) of the 5th day of creation where the Muse (or Jesus) cuts the paths
for the birds to swim and the fish to fly. Then Anuch and I took this
painting to various locations outdoors in the city to see how it would
look. You can see it all here:
and Gintaras Jaronis made a video:
in Lithuanian, of course! And Ruta Sakaliene of the village of
Marcinkonys, whose little daughter I drew (as the "inner muse"), is
inspired to start an art gallery (as she's wished for many years) and will
take my paintings for keeping there. So I share my excitement, too. I
know that we have many artists and I'm glad to join you! and invite
Andrius Kulikauskas, Minciu Sodas, http://www.ms.lt, ms@...
35:41 Andrius: hi!
35:47 Franz: finally
35:50 Andrius: thank you for your blog posts and comments
35:53 Andrius: and hi to Marcin!
35:57 Franz: OK
36:09 Andrius: and it's going well with Factor E Farm I'm glad they're
working for us on Mornflake
36:15 Andrius: and it seems Markus Petz will, too
36:17 Franz: Marcin told me
36:56 Franz: I discussed a lot of strategy with Marcin
37:22 Franz: and I think there is a clear need to overcome current
37:44 Andrius: yes?
37:48 Franz: The visit here could be a giant leap rorward
37:52 Andrius: great
37:56 Andrius: what are the limitations?
38:10 Andrius: the work with Factor E Farm is very helpful
38:20 Andrius: because it means that we'll be able to feature their
blog at our sites
38:25 Andrius: and link up more closely
38:46 Franz: Yes. But here is the catch. Marcin told me that he found out
that there is no person that has the technical skills to carry on the
39:12 Franz: There is a serious limitation because there are no people on
the farm with real technical skills
39:38 Franz: We discussed a five point plan and I dont know if I can get
all things together
40:14 Franz: 1. organize around people who can cooperate remotedly
because they have the skills required
40:45 Franz: 2. find more places already existing with skilled people
that can take part of the work
41:13 Andrius: yes
41:17 Franz: 3. make it easier for people to move in, for example tell
them to rent a trailer
41:29 Franz: instead of teling them to live spartanic
41:58 Franz: these are three of the five points we discussed
42:33 Franz: and all of them boil down to start resource mapping for OSE
42:58 Franz: Marcin is overwhelmed with requests, but somebody should map
and filter skills and needs of people
43:42 Franz: so that it is possible to magage projects better
44:17 Franz: also, when I asked him about if he would take sponsoring
corporate money he said he had no problem with that
44:42 Andrius: we can provide a online assistant for him
44:50 Franz: when we arrived in Vienna and I took him to a walk on Danube
Island, we had another exciting encounter
44:51 Andrius: and create a reply system
44:54 Andrius: yes?
45:02 Andrius: and the other two points of five?
45:15 Franz: Wow, yes. OK, the point four emerged from that encounter
45:30 Franz: there were two youn men with an ambulance on the island
45:41 Franz: waiting for cases of first aid
46:06 Franz: and I had the idea of having a chat with them
46:23 Franz: it turned out they are people who took civil service
46:39 Franz: which is an alternative to going to the army in Austria
47:02 Andrius: yes
47:03 Franz: they said the army is a joke anyway
47:27 Franz: and so instead of six months army service they prefer nine
months civil service
47:49 Franz: they get employed by NGOs and the ste pays these NGOs for
work in the public good
48:06 Franz: but not much since its a duty
48:27 Franz: so they do hospitals, building, office works and many other
48:56 Franz: some of them going to Africa doing development work
49:18 Franz: so young people with technical skills could also one day be
doing their civil service with OSE
50:06 Franz: that was the fourth idea. Get volunteers for whom OSE is an
50:15 Andrius: yes
50:23 Franz: the fifth idea was far fledged:
50:38 Franz: lets build technical skills by our own education system
50:54 Franz: lets have a technical university of the villages
51:03 Andrius: yes!
51:12 Andrius: yes I think that's very to the point
51:21 Andrius: and that way we attract people with technical skills
51:24 Franz: because we are confronted with a lack of technical education
all around society
51:28 Andrius: and we grow in technical literacy (including math)
51:32 Andrius: yes!
51:39 Andrius: I'm thinking of what to add...
51:43 Franz: and people do not even know how to fix things
52:01 Andrius: but one is to have an analogous farm/center in Africa, I
think Samwel Kongere is very interested
52:10 Andrius: yes
52:16 Franz: We almost already agreed on that
52:21 Franz: in London
52:21 Andrius: great
52:37 Franz: But there needs to be information flow....
52:46 Andrius: and with Marcin's blog in our network we have the
startign point for a "global villages blog" aggregation.
52:56 Andrius: well there's so much we can do if we work together
53:01 Andrius: we can provide aggregation tools
53:07 Andrius: and online assistants and response systems
53:21 Andrius: and we can help lead open source technology manuals and
53:28 Andrius: and we can reach out to include experts
53:35 Andrius: and if we worked together
53:40 Andrius: we could also encourage volunteers
53:45 Franz: but when we are thinking about a second, third.... place,
someone has to go to see Marcin and immerse. Maybe even assistants should
53:46 Andrius: And maybe we can think of business ideas.
53:55 Andrius: sure that's a good idea.
54:00 Franz: We must think of business ideas
54:05 Andrius: If we're working together then it's possible
54:11 Franz: because we got to finance that
54:21 Andrius: it just takes a bit of acknowledgement / interest from
54:29 Andrius: Well we do what we can for free
54:35 Andrius: and then we look for business opportunities
54:37 Andrius: yes
54:38 Franz: I was surprised that he was totally open to it
54:41 Andrius: good
54:48 Andrius: You know that I'm supportive
55:27 Franz: And we made a little bit fun out of the Mornflake affair,
not in a bad way, but also putting it into perspective....
55:39 Franz: So that of course the idea is great
56:02 Franz: But Ben and Jeremy are working all day with the tractor and
56:33 Franz: and they were discussing it, really nicely
56:43 Andrius: Ben and Jeremy are very interested and we're in touch
57:00 Franz: Yes, it worked out well...
57:15 Andrius: yes it's a good example (and KeimForm is too) how
57:20 Andrius: money brings people together
57:28 Andrius: I feel better connected to KeimForm
57:32 Andrius: thanks to that incident
57:37 Andrius: then I would have otherwise
57:39 Franz: but sometimes you need a kind of humour to understand how
contradictory things are
57:44 Andrius: certainly!
13:39 Andrius: what else regarding Marcin?
13:44 Andrius: how can we be most supportive?
13:51 Andrius: also what is his central goal?
13:54 Andrius: because he has so many!
14:02 Andrius: what does he want to focus on
14:06 Andrius: and what can he have others do?
14:29 Franz: His central goal is to have words and deeds unite
14:52 Franz: not just talking about freedom but creating it
15:15 Andrius: yes
15:28 Franz: that is very precious
15:37 Andrius: I wish he'd notice that more broadly
15:38 Franz: he is a hero
15:41 Andrius: yes
15:43 Andrius: for example
15:49 Andrius: I just had my first art exhibit
15:56 Andrius: and it really had a great impact for the Uzhupis community
15:57 Franz: saw it
16:01 Andrius: people really felt freed by it
16:16 Franz: how exactly?
16:34 Andrius: that they felt i was a "free person"
16:39 Andrius: that it was clear that
16:49 Andrius: I could produce moving works
17:18 Franz: ambivalence of art, was always so disturbing to me
17:31 Franz: the artist represents freedom in an abstract way
18:01 Franz: materializing signs of freedom
18:37 Franz: while in most circumstances of life we are only free to
18:47 Andrius: with no formal training at all
18:50 Franz: that we never created in freedom
19:12 Franz: dont be disturbed, I see your point but I also have to
19:15 Andrius: that I made everything of the freedom they gave me - I
appreciated it enormously - they invited me to do this show and I never
would have otherwise
19:32 Andrius: and then I did everything to encourage others - I was
there during the day talking to people about my work
19:42 Andrius: and encouraging them - and listening for their impressions
19:55 Franz: that is beautiful. maybe thats the best an artist can do
20:06 Andrius: and my work is very positively energetic
20:16 Andrius: so for example my colors are extremely bright
20:53 Andrius: whereas in Lithuanian art they are brown yellow, brown
red, brown blue etc.
21:04 Andrius: and my painting fills up the largest city square!
21:08 Andrius: if you saw the picture!
21:14 Franz: yes
21:17 Andrius: it was quite surprising, people didn't expect it could
21:27 Andrius: it's not supposed to be possible for such a "small work"
21:33 Andrius: 2,5 meters
21:42 Andrius: and the square is maybe 200 m
22:03 Andrius: and it's meaningful work - there are a lot of ideas in
it and about it
22:15 Andrius: so people liked that enormously - tourists, artists,
22:18 Andrius: and I'm very welcome there
22:24 Andrius: and it's beent here all month long.
22:42 Andrius: So I learned a lot about "global villages" from that
22:46 Andrius: About the centrality of art.
22:54 Andrius: and so when we think of "technology"
22:58 Andrius: art is a big aspect of that
23:03 Andrius: technology for art's sake
23:09 Andrius: and artistic applications of technology
23:10 Franz: Did you see Arcosanti?
23:14 Andrius: yes
23:22 Andrius: yes that's a good example indeed
23:27 Franz: that is something I consider ultimate art
23:29 Andrius: of how somethign like concrete becomes an art form
23:36 Andrius: or the bells
23:42 Franz: art is in everything
23:44 Andrius: that technology serves art
23:46 Franz: there
23:58 Franz: and art is an expression of the culture
23:59 Andrius: and art opens up new applications of technology
24:02 Andrius: yes
24:10 Andrius: and I miss that dimension in Factor E Farm
24:18 Franz: right....that separation does not exist
24:26 Franz: Marcin is an engineer
24:32 Andrius: and I imagine Marcin is a very artistic person inside
24:38 Andrius: and we don't get to see that
24:39 Franz: he is not a community designer
24:45 Andrius: he is in a way
24:52 Andrius: in some ways very successful
24:55 Franz: but maybe he is as you say
25:03 Andrius: but not in a sharing way
25:16 Franz: I have this image
25:23 Franz: which is very talikng
25:26 Andrius: he's not a sharing person - and I say that constructively
25:51 Andrius: because he can grow I think regarding that and he is and
26:21 Andrius: I think his idea of freedom
26:22 Franz: look at that
26:35 Andrius: is very much linked to independence
26:40 Franz: yes
26:42 Andrius: and so that can conflict with sharing
26:49 Franz: yes
26:53 Andrius: because you can think - why should I share? - you should
27:01 Franz: look at the foto!
27:07 Andrius: I was in the bike store this week - I bought a nice bike
for the village
27:21 Franz: comment on the foto!
27:42 Andrius: what book is that?
27:52 Franz: that is Marcins sketchbook
27:57 Andrius: oh wow!
28:03 Andrius: Alex Rollin und Marcin Jakubowski und das Medium ist
(manchmal doch nicht ganz) die Botschaft
28:14 Franz: yes, that is so funny
28:14 Andrius: that's right, I remember in Vienna
28:26 Andrius: what is Botschaft?
29:07 Franz: MArcin has this artistic need - Botschaft is message - and I
say: the meedium is the message, but sometimes not quite...
29:15 Franz: thats my comment
29:22 Andrius: oh
29:36 Andrius: I really benefited from the show I did
29:41 Andrius: I really grew
29:45 Franz: I was taken by that artistic subtext and its lack of
29:59 Andrius: in my self-awareness
30:04 Franz: OK
30:24 Andrius: of what role I can
30:24 Franz: dont get an artist character thought!
30:31 Andrius: play just
30:32 Franz: though
30:51 Andrius: I think people liked
30:55 Andrius: that I was very
31:00 Andrius: open to engagement
31:12 Andrius: very much receptive to people
31:18 Andrius: yet strong in my own instincts
31:35 Andrius: that I could be apart from the entire system
31:50 Andrius: but I could care what any person might have to say
32:04 Andrius: and that was very freeing for people, very encouraging
32:11 Andrius: that they could do it too
32:25 Andrius: the artist character is opposite of that? or what do you
32:39 Andrius: I was surprised that I inspired a lot of people
33:05 Franz: The society as it is has a reverence for artists which I
dont really feel connected to... I feel like the guy beside the victorius
General on the triumph wagon coming back to Rome... the artist character
is an icon of freedom wheras people normally use their freedom in
33:24 Andrius: and that it was so easy for them to get something from
my art whereas it is almost impossible for them to get anything from my
33:40 Andrius: and that my art can be a tool for getting across my
ideas - they said it really made them think
33:54 Andrius: it was like being a healthy person
33:59 Andrius: among the ill in a hospital
34:04 Andrius: and people being happy for that
34:09 Andrius: to see what is health.
34:16 Andrius: it was very strange.
34:41 Franz: good. I thank you for sharing that with me
34:43 Andrius: because I was quite tentative because I have no training
34:47 Andrius: yes
34:53 Andrius: and you have that effect on me
35:02 Andrius: with your vision and your passion and your drive
35:13 Andrius: it's very helpful thank you!
35:25 Franz: Thank you
35:44 Franz: so we close for today...
35:50 Andrius: so these are dimensions for the global village
35:54 Andrius: yes may I share our chat
35:55 Andrius: deleting
36:07 Franz: right
36:17 Andrius: thank you!
36:19 Andrius: good nigh!
36:32 Andrius: congratulations to you and Marcin on his travels!
36:33 Franz: seems it needs a lot of editing---up to you!
37:10 Franz: and maybe a lot of sensitivity where not to include personal
37:27 Franz: but you will do it well I think
37:35 Andrius: I don't know how much to worry
37:38 Andrius: it is how it is
38:11 Franz: well I alsways worry about how things will turn out ...
38:19 Franz: thats a different perspective
38:23 Andrius: I "live by truth" ;)
38:33 Andrius: so I watch what i say
39:22 Andrius: I will double check what you wrote
39:33 Franz: thank you!
39:39 Andrius: good night
39:45 Franz: Good night
43:22 Franz: The sentence "I feel like the guy beside the victorius
general on the triumph wagon coming back to Rome... " meant: I dont want
to bring you down in that feeling but I feel that I remind you we are
easily taken up by our own success to a distorted viewpoint. Of course
your experiences are a gift and wonderful.
43:44 Andrius: sure
43:59 Andrius: I didn't understand so it had no effect! ;)
44:09 Franz: :)
44:37 Andrius: I've had many different experiences
44:41 Andrius: so it's not the only kind!
44:49 Andrius: it's funny because
45:01 Andrius: I've so often been treated as knowing nothign about art.
45:11 Andrius: and now people compare me to Van Gogh and Picasso
45:25 Andrius: so what can we do
45:56 Andrius: but it's nice people are warm and friendly
46:09 Andrius: and I try to give it all back
46:41 Franz: Its good. its a privilege. and I think it can be used in a
good way. as I said the reverence for the artist
46:56 Franz: maybe the expression of an inner desire that cannot be lived
47:14 Franz: so in the normal case
47:29 Andrius: and I seem to open that reality up for a lot of people -
they find a thread in themselves
47:32 Andrius: and that's wonderful
47:48 Andrius: because they recognize the artist in themselves when
they see my work
48:03 Andrius: and it's not a question of whether they are "good"
48:06 Andrius: but of their impact
48:28 Andrius: which is evidently very real, positive, liberating and
as an artist told me
48:44 Andrius: because I care it all has meaning so much more
49:11 Andrius: it's hard not to exaggerate
49:18 Andrius: but it's exciting to see
49:19 Franz: well - I totally understand that feeling.
49:28 Andrius: they took my posters for permanent exhibit upstairs
49:34 Andrius: and Ruta Sakalien
49:40 Andrius: Ruta Sakalas
49:50 Andrius: is opening a gallery she decided starting with my works
49:56 Andrius: so they will have a home
50:03 Andrius: so I'm very grateful
50:08 Andrius: in Marcinkonys
50:15 Franz: I am very happy for you
50:21 Andrius: thank you!
50:32 Andrius: I'm tired of art!
50:36 Andrius: let's move on to music!
50:55 Andrius: good night, Franz
51:01 Franz: good night!