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Trade Question from 1969-70

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  • craig_1965ca
    I have a question relating to a trade made late in the 1969-70 season between Los Angeles and Chicago. The Kings sent goalie Gerry Desjardins, defenseman Bill
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 30, 2008
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      I have a question relating to a trade made late in the 1969-70 season
      between Los Angeles and Chicago. The Kings sent goalie Gerry
      Desjardins, defenseman Bill White and forward Brian Campbell to the
      Black Hawks for goalie Denis DeJordy, defensemen Gilles Marotte and
      forward Jim Stanfield.

      My question is; does anyone have an idea of why on earth did the
      Kings make this deal? At this point in time Desjardins was considered
      one of the best young goalies in the NHL. He had had a very good
      rookie season in 1968-69, helping the Kings into the semi-finals. His
      numbers in 43 games in 1969-70 for a brutal LA team were quite
      respectable. Denis DeJordy on the other hand was a decent veteran but
      I believe he had been a real disappointment for Chicago who had been
      looking to him to replace Glen Hall. Why would LA give up on
      Desjardins at this time for DeJordy?

      Giving up Bill White for Gilles Marotte could not have been seen as a
      real improvement. I realize that White's career really took off in
      Chicago when he was teamed up with Pat Stapleton, but even in LA he
      was a well-respected defenseman. Why give him up for Marotte who was
      a solid veteran but really nothing special. And Brian Campbell while
      no star was a useful forward. Jim Stanfield wasn't even a great minor-
      leaguer and he ended up playing less than a dozen games with the
      Kings.

      Where the Kings simply trying to shake up their team who were having
      a horrible year? To me this trade simply didn't make sense.

      Craig
    • francz
      I was going to suggest moving back in time to a 1970 context ... Bill White was a minor leaguer stuck in Springfield until the Kings rescued him by buying the
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 30, 2008
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        I was going to suggest moving back in time to a 1970 context ...

        Bill White was a minor leaguer stuck in Springfield until the Kings rescued him by buying the Springfield Indians franchise; his star was rising as he was traded and you hit the nail on the head, playing with the Hawks, with Whitey Stapleton, he blossomed.

        Marotte, people forget, was more than just a Doug Jarrett type of journeyman. I still recall the great piece Andy O'Brien wrote in a Star Weekly magazine, how he had avoided predicting stardom for any junior player since Maurice Richard, but he was finally prepared to break his silence and make an exception for this strapping youngster named Gilles Marotte. He came with that kind of pedigree (about two years before that Orr kid).

        It's amazing ... I think I read where Matt Ravlich had two six-goal games in the same OHA season (probably 1957-58). Stuff like that is long forgotten, but for the scouts of the day, they would remember things like that and give a little more benefit of the doubt to him than to the guy who never did anything superhuman. I am sure there are a few examples in recent times of players who just keep on getting chances handed to them on a silver platter (Dan Quinn) ... scouts love the guy from something he did in junior or a tournament they saw him play in and will put in a good word for him.

        Yeah, Desjardins for DeJordy looks bad ... but remember, as a 23-year old DeJordy was brought in to back up Glenn Hall during the Hawks' 1961 Cup run. He was thought of that highly. And Desjardins was one of those Ron Tugnutt / Gilles Meloche goalies who looked great because they faced 45 shots a game with a weak team in front of them. History shows Desjardins in the 1970's actually had a couple of seasons in Buffalo at the elite level. (Curious that the Hawks did the reverse with Meloche, had him and then traded him to a team where he would face 45 shots a game.)

        But still, I have to agree, the Kings traded guys with huge upside for a couple of early 1960's pheenoms who by 1970 still hadn't lived up to their press (and never did).

        Rob in 905

        craig_1965ca <bflynn3@...> wrote:
        I have a question relating to a trade made late in the 1969-70 season
        between Los Angeles and Chicago. The Kings sent goalie Gerry
        Desjardins, defenseman Bill White and forward Brian Campbell to the
        Black Hawks for goalie Denis DeJordy, defensemen Gilles Marotte and
        forward Jim Stanfield.

        My question is; does anyone have an idea of why on earth did the
        Kings make this deal? At this point in time Desjardins was considered
        one of the best young goalies in the NHL. He had had a very good
        rookie season in 1968-69, helping the Kings into the semi-finals. His
        numbers in 43 games in 1969-70 for a brutal LA team were quite
        respectable. Denis DeJordy on the other hand was a decent veteran but
        I believe he had been a real disappointment for Chicago who had been
        looking to him to replace Glen Hall. Why would LA give up on
        Desjardins at this time for DeJordy?

        Giving up Bill White for Gilles Marotte could not have been seen as a
        real improvement. I realize that White's career really took off in
        Chicago when he was teamed up with Pat Stapleton, but even in LA he
        was a well-respected defenseman. Why give him up for Marotte who was
        a solid veteran but really nothing special. And Brian Campbell while
        no star was a useful forward. Jim Stanfield wasn't even a great minor-
        leaguer and he ended up playing less than a dozen games with the
        Kings.

        Where the Kings simply trying to shake up their team who were having
        a horrible year? To me this trade simply didn't make sense.

        Craig






        ---------------------------------
        Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Swanrvr80@aol.com
        In The Hockey News, Desjardins ability was about egqual to that of DeJordy but Chicago got a big edge in getting White for Marotte. Chicago had been trying
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 31, 2008
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          In The Hockey News, Desjardins' ability was about egqual to that of DeJordy
          but Chicago got a big edge in getting White for Marotte. Chicago had been
          trying to get White all year and Boston was also interested. "According to
          reports", they had offered Gary Doak and LW Don Marcotte for White and another
          player but LA Manager Larry Regan wanted Fred Stanfield. Boston didn't want
          to give up Stanfield. And Chicago almost got White earlier in the year but LA
          decided "that they weren't really as bad as they seemed and they could make
          the West Divison playoffs as they were". The paper also saidoston turnmed
          down a trade of Desjardins and White for Ken Hodge, Gary Doak and ed Johnston.

          A quote from LA owner Jack Kent Cooke as his team headed for the worst
          record in NHL history - "Never in my wildest dreams did I expect these
          developments. I am bitterly disappointed. We are going to have to re-evaluate our
          entire approach and make some drastic changes, but at this time I can't say what
          these might be." And later that day - "We are about to make two major
          trades. I think they will be the first steps in the remaking of the character of
          our club".

          The Kings also traded away Dale Rolfe to Detroit a few hours after this
          trade for LW Gary Monahan and the right to claim veteran defenseman Matt Ravlich.

          The Hockey News stated that Desjardins, 25, had been the Kings most valuable
          player and is "the quickest goalie in the league and could become the
          greatest. We would not have traded him under any circumstances".

          Sounds like LA was just making a trade for change, to shake things up.

          Jay in MIlford

          In a message dated 1/30/2008 2:12:17 PM Eastern Standard Time,
          bflynn3@... writes:

          I have a question relating to a trade made late in the 1969-70 season
          between Los Angeles and Chicago. The Kings sent goalie Gerry
          Desjardins, defenseman Bill White and forward Brian Campbell to the
          Black Hawks for goalie Denis DeJordy, defensemen Gilles Marotte and
          forward Jim Stanfield.

          My question is; does anyone have an idea of why on earth did the
          Kings make this deal? At this point in time Desjardins was considered
          one of the best young goalies in the NHL. He had had a very good
          rookie season in 1968-69, helping the Kings into the semi-finals. His
          numbers in 43 games in 1969-70 for a brutal LA team were quite
          respectable. Denis DeJordy on the other hand was a decent veteran but
          I believe he had been a real disappointment for Chicago who had been
          looking to him to replace Glen Hall. Why would LA give up on
          Desjardins at this time for DeJordy?

          Giving up Bill White for Gilles Marotte could not have been seen as a
          real improvement. I realize that White's career really took off in
          Chicago when he was teamed up with Pat Stapleton, but even in LA he
          was a well-respected defenseman. Why give him up for Marotte who was
          a solid veteran but really nothing special. And Brian Campbell while
          no star was a useful forward. Jim Stanfield wasn't even a great minor-
          leaguer and he ended up playing less than a dozen games with the
          Kings.

          Where the Kings simply trying to shake up their team who were having
          a horrible year? To me this trade simply didn't make sense.

          Craig







          **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.
          http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • arnilate99
          I know that some Sabres (Perreault among them) thought that a weakness Buffalo had in the mid-70 s was their goaltending (Desjardin included). Buff later got
          Message 4 of 5 , Feb 1, 2008
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            I know that some Sabres (Perreault among them) thought that a
            weakness Buffalo had in the mid-70's was their goaltending (Desjardin
            included). Buff later got Don Edwards/Bob Suave/Tom Barrasso but by
            then they had lost the explosive firepower of the French Connection.

            I've seen some stats (cultivated from newspaper reports - - I think
            Klein & Reif's 2nd stats book) published that had Desjardin with a
            below-avg save pct while with Buffalo... can't remember which yr in
            particular.



            --- In hockhist@yahoogroups.com, francz <francz39@...> wrote:
            >
            > I was going to suggest moving back in time to a 1970 context ...
            >
            > Bill White was a minor leaguer stuck in Springfield until the
            Kings rescued him by buying the Springfield Indians franchise; his
            star was rising as he was traded and you hit the nail on the head,
            playing with the Hawks, with Whitey Stapleton, he blossomed.
            >
            > Marotte, people forget, was more than just a Doug Jarrett type of
            journeyman. I still recall the great piece Andy O'Brien wrote in a
            Star Weekly magazine, how he had avoided predicting stardom for any
            junior player since Maurice Richard, but he was finally prepared to
            break his silence and make an exception for this strapping youngster
            named Gilles Marotte. He came with that kind of pedigree (about two
            years before that Orr kid).
            >
            > It's amazing ... I think I read where Matt Ravlich had two six-
            goal games in the same OHA season (probably 1957-58). Stuff like
            that is long forgotten, but for the scouts of the day, they would
            remember things like that and give a little more benefit of the doubt
            to him than to the guy who never did anything superhuman. I am sure
            there are a few examples in recent times of players who just keep on
            getting chances handed to them on a silver platter (Dan Quinn) ...
            scouts love the guy from something he did in junior or a tournament
            they saw him play in and will put in a good word for him.
            >
            > Yeah, Desjardins for DeJordy looks bad ... but remember, as a 23-
            year old DeJordy was brought in to back up Glenn Hall during the
            Hawks' 1961 Cup run. He was thought of that highly. And Desjardins
            was one of those Ron Tugnutt / Gilles Meloche goalies who looked
            great because they faced 45 shots a game with a weak team in front of
            them. History shows Desjardins in the 1970's actually had a couple
            of seasons in Buffalo at the elite level. (Curious that the Hawks
            did the reverse with Meloche, had him and then traded him to a team
            where he would face 45 shots a game.)
            >
            > But still, I have to agree, the Kings traded guys with huge
            upside for a couple of early 1960's pheenoms who by 1970 still hadn't
            lived up to their press (and never did).
            >
            > Rob in 905
            >
            > craig_1965ca <bflynn3@...> wrote:
            > I have a question relating to a trade made late in the
            1969-70 season
            > between Los Angeles and Chicago. The Kings sent goalie Gerry
            > Desjardins, defenseman Bill White and forward Brian Campbell to the
            > Black Hawks for goalie Denis DeJordy, defensemen Gilles Marotte and
            > forward Jim Stanfield.
            >
            > My question is; does anyone have an idea of why on earth did the
            > Kings make this deal? At this point in time Desjardins was
            considered
            > one of the best young goalies in the NHL. He had had a very good
            > rookie season in 1968-69, helping the Kings into the semi-finals.
            His
            > numbers in 43 games in 1969-70 for a brutal LA team were quite
            > respectable. Denis DeJordy on the other hand was a decent veteran
            but
            > I believe he had been a real disappointment for Chicago who had
            been
            > looking to him to replace Glen Hall. Why would LA give up on
            > Desjardins at this time for DeJordy?
            >
            > Giving up Bill White for Gilles Marotte could not have been seen as
            a
            > real improvement. I realize that White's career really took off in
            > Chicago when he was teamed up with Pat Stapleton, but even in LA he
            > was a well-respected defenseman. Why give him up for Marotte who
            was
            > a solid veteran but really nothing special. And Brian Campbell
            while
            > no star was a useful forward. Jim Stanfield wasn't even a great
            minor-
            > leaguer and he ended up playing less than a dozen games with the
            > Kings.
            >
            > Where the Kings simply trying to shake up their team who were
            having
            > a horrible year? To me this trade simply didn't make sense.
            >
            > Craig
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo!
            Search.
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • goaliedave
            I noted your Dan Quinn comment and agree that he was given ample opportunities. He did have above average stats and career. Dan was a neighbour of mine growing
            Message 5 of 5 , Feb 2, 2008
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              I noted your Dan Quinn comment and agree that he was given ample opportunities. He did have above average stats and career. Dan was a neighbour of mine growing up, they had the neighbourhood outdoor rink which his Dad kept up dutifully. His Dad guided him through minor and junior hockey with a Lindros- like approach. Danny and Stevie Y were neck and neck the 2 best in our neighbourhood.

              The difference between Danny and Stevie was their Dads. Peter Quinn was a former pro football player and not a nice family man in many ways; the specifics are irrelevant. He did not benefit from great family support or guidance, and so like many before and after him, found support in the wrong things too many times. He also got lied to by ex-Ottawa GM Randy Sexton which basically ended his career. I saw him at a golf tournament a while ago and he is now a focussed guy and living a good life.

              What I don't get is, why do teams not put more effort into identifying and supporting these guys? They are investing tons of money and team success in each player and it would cost them a small percentage of that to have formal mentoring / guidance systems in place.

              Dave in Whitby



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