Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Wichita-OKC Lovefests (was: Ten Worst)

Expand Messages
  • Kristopher Crook
    At 06:05 AM 10/21/99 -0500, you wrote: --cut-- ... I distinctly recall that it was Perry, because Gosselin was called to the bench after the fights had wound
    Message 1 of 7 , Oct 20, 1999
    • 0 Attachment
      At 06:05 AM 10/21/99 -0500, you wrote:

      --cut--

      >The two teams played six more games that season, but only one seems to
      >have been that goony. On Jan 30 the two combined for 183 minutes. I
      >don't know if that's got game Kris. I was played in State Fair, but
      >Krake and Gosselin are listed as the goalies of record. These mini
      >boxscores I use don't show goalie changes though. OKC won 5-1, so it's
      >unlikely Perry got knocked out of net.

      I distinctly recall that it was Perry, because Gosselin was called to the
      bench after the fights had wound down, and Perry shot the puck into
      Gosselin's empty net, prompting a "Perry, Perry, Perry" chant. Now that
      you bring it up, I do think that Krake started, but was pulled for some
      reason - perhaps he was tossed as a result of one of the many fights that
      night?

      >Now now Kris... there ARE some Tulsa people on the list... :)

      You forget where I live? Actually, I talked to a friend on the TPD about
      that incident, and he said most of the officers involved were Reserve
      officers - sort of a glorified security guard - they normally work the
      Maxwell and other public events. They go through the academy, but don't
      have to have the degree like regular officers. We've had some problems
      with reserve officers as of late, there was one who shot at a kid in a road
      rage incident - it doesn't seem that the reserve officers are as
      well-trained or as well-disciplined as the regular officers.

      >Actually, during one OKC-Wichita game (it may have been Jan 10) an OKC
      >PD officer came onto the ice from the SW corner doors after most of the
      >battles were over. He was wandering over to the scorers table when in
      >no uncertain terms PA announcer Ben Buckland and the rest of the officials
      >told him to get the hell off the ice.

      I've seen officers go on the ice before, but it was always under the
      accompaniment of an official - they were called on the ice, in other words,
      to assist with something. I saw one Fort Worth cop go on the ice at a Fire
      game, but he went to assist an injured player - I guess he was also a
      paramedic, lots of cities require officers to have some level of EMT training.

      Kris
      Best Regards,
      Kristopher Crook,
      Chairman and CEO,
      Braniff International Virtual Airways

      http://members.tripod.com/BIVA_2/BIVA.html

      "When you've got it - flaunt it!"
    • Marc Foster
      ... The first Wichita-OKC Apocalypse game was January 10, 1993. Doug Shedden had been Wichita s coach since December 29th. I had seen Wichita in Fort Worth
      Message 2 of 7 , Oct 21, 1999
      • 0 Attachment
        > From: Kristopher Crook <CROOKK@...>
        >
        > At 09:20 PM 10/20/99 -0500, you wrote:
        > >From: "Marc Foster" <mfoster@...>
        >
        > --cut--
        >
        > >The Thunder and Gator teams were goon teams though, without question.
        > >
        > >Oh, and 160 doesn't even compare to your average OKC-Wichita lovefest.
        >
        > Oh, Lord, no - what was the total out of that game during the first CHL
        > season that, as legend has it, begat Buckland's "Are you ready to rumble?"
        > call - 320 minutes or so? And if that game wasn't bad enough, they
        > followed it up with one that had nearly as many minutes (if not more) about
        > a month later. I recall sitting in the stands at State Fair Arena with
        > Scott and Angie (Marc is probably the only one who knows them...) watching
        > the fights going on everywhere but between the goalies. Alan Perry and
        > Yannick Gosselin were just shooting pucks at each other. IIRC, Craig
        > Johnson and some Wichita goon (there were so many) touched the whole mess off.

        The first Wichita-OKC Apocalypse game was January 10, 1993. Doug Shedden
        had been Wichita's coach since December 29th. I had seen Wichita in Fort
        Worth the night before and knew this was a much different team.

        When OKC went up 5-1 in the first, the trouble began. With one Thunder
        already in the box, someone went out to pick a fight with Sylvain Fleury,
        the league's leading scorer and most non-physical player. Fleury brought
        him in close, them just picked him up and bodyslammed him onto the ice.

        It went downhill from there.

        I know some people came off the bench, because I have a picture of the
        ice (which looked like a tornado hit the locker rooms) and can count
        anywhere between 13 and 15 sticks (depending on if you squint). Mind
        you this picture only covers about 60% of the ice as I shot it from the
        penalty box.

        So the game was stopped with about 3:30 left in the first so that Chris
        Cozzan could sort out the penalties. I actually forget if there were
        any more battles that night, because the big show was Blazer Steve
        Simoni scoring five goals on the was to a 13-3 thrashing.

        12,672 fans got to see 208 minutes in penalties (that sounds low, but it's
        what's listed in the league media guide).

        The two teams played six more games that season, but only one seems to
        have been that goony. On Jan 30 the two combined for 183 minutes. I
        don't know if that's got game Kris. I was played in State Fair, but
        Krake and Gosselin are listed as the goalies of record. These mini
        boxscores I use don't show goalie changes though. OKC won 5-1, so it's
        unlikely Perry got knocked out of net.

        > >Marc - who once spent about half an hour in the penalty box with a half-
        > >dozen moderately irritated Wichita players.
        >
        > Yeah, but at least the OCPD or the WPD never decided to choke-hold or
        > mace a player, unlike another police department we know of...

        Now now Kris... there ARE some Tulsa people on the list... :)

        Actually, during one OKC-Wichita game (it may have been Jan 10) an OKC
        PD officer came onto the ice from the SW corner doors after most of the
        battles were over. He was wandering over to the scorers table when in
        no uncertain terms PA announcer Ben Buckland and the rest of the officials
        told him to get the hell off the ice.

        Marc - but hey, what's a little pepper spray among friends?

        --
        **************************************************************************
        * Marc Foster ICQ #18755448 *
        * President mfoster@... *
        * The Hockey Research Association http://www.hockeyresearch.com *
        * End the frustration of stats collecting, donate to the HRA archive. *
        **************************************************************************
      • Kristopher Crook
        ... Well, there isn t a whole lot to tell, and my memory is a bit fuzzy on this, as I didn t witness it myself. Shoebottom was penalized and sent to the box.
        Message 3 of 7 , Oct 21, 1999
        • 0 Attachment
          At 07:42 PM 10/21/99 -0500, you wrote:
          >From: "Marc Foster" <mfoster@...>
          >
          >"Patricia C. Anderson" wrote:
          >>
          >> At a Richmond Renegades game a few years ago ('95-96 maybe?) an opponent
          >> from the Roanoke Express who was in the penalty box grew tired of the
          >> home fans taunting him, so he decided to douse them with his water
          >> bottle. The fans responded by throwing trash into the box, so he
          >> started trying to get at them with his stick. Unfortunately for him,
          >> there was a uniformed City of Richmond police officer nearby, who
          >> responded by spraying mace into the box. It was so bad that even the
          >> off-ice officials and PA announcer (who are between the penalty boxes)
          >> had to evacuate and hit the ice.
          >
          >Fan around a visiting box should expect to get doused with water when
          >the taunting starts getting a little wild. Raising the stick in anger
          >usually just makes the fans laugh and taunt more.
          >
          >> Richmond fans are reminded of that incident by Roanoke fans on a regular
          >> basis.
          >
          >> So what happened with the Tulsa PD?
          >
          >It's the Bruce Shoebottom incident. I think I've told it so many times
          >I'm going to put a version in the FAQ, LOL... Kris, care to take this
          >one? My version of the story is getting a little stale.

          Well, there isn't a whole lot to tell, and my memory is a bit fuzzy on
          this, as I didn't witness it myself. Shoebottom was penalized and sent to
          the box. While he was in the box, he began to be taunted by a Tulsa player
          on the ice. Shoebottom tried to leave the box, and the gate keeper tried
          to stop him. Shoebottom may or may not have slammed the gate keeper -
          there's two versions: Shoebottom claimed he only nudged the guy, but the
          keeper claims Shoebottom essentially checked him. Shoebottom is a large
          guy, and the keeper was elderly, IIRC - so even a gentle shove from someone
          of Shoebottom's size could easily bowl over a small, elderly man. Anyway,
          the way the Maxwell is set up - or at least the way it was set up then (as
          it looks like they've changed it.) - is that there is no barrier between
          the penalty box and the scorer's table. Apparently there were some
          officers close enough to the box that they entered the box from the
          scorer's table area and began to try and restrain Shoebottom. In the
          process, they put him in a choke hold and sprayed him with mace.
          Shoebottom eventually passed out and was airlifted to a hospital across
          town (why they flew him to St. Francis instead of taking him to Tulsa
          Regional less than 1/2 mile away has always remained a mystery to me.)
          There were three officers involved, two reserve officers and one regular
          officer, IIRC. While they were trying to restrain Shoebottom, the Blazers
          began an assault of sorts on the penalty box. I recall seeing the footage
          of the incident on the news where Alan Perry is banging his goalie stick
          violently against the glass, and one player (Steve Simoni?) is on the
          dasher boards actually trying to pull the glass down near the scorer's
          table, I guess to gain access to the penalty box. The police later charged
          Shoebottom with what amounted to some trumped up charges, but I believe
          some of them were dropped when the gate keeper refused to prosecute. I
          don't recall the final disposition of the charges, but I believe he did
          have to pay some fines. The officers were never charged, but a civil suit
          was considered for a while. AFAIK, it never came to pass. Unfortunately,
          the online archives of the Tulsa World only go back to 1996, and this
          happened in 1994. The Daily Oklahoman's may go back that far, but I'm not
          going to pay them to download the stories.

          Kris
          Best Regards,
          Kristopher Crook,
          Chairman and CEO,
          Braniff International Virtual Airways

          http://members.tripod.com/BIVA_2/BIVA.html

          "When you've got it - flaunt it!"
        • Patricia C. Anderson
          Marc Foster wrote: [snip] ... [snip] ... At a Richmond Renegades game a few years ago ( 95-96 maybe?) an opponent from the Roanoke Express who was in the
          Message 4 of 7 , Oct 21, 1999
          • 0 Attachment
            Marc Foster wrote:
            [snip]
            > > Yeah, but at least the OCPD or the WPD never decided to choke-hold or
            > > mace a player, unlike another police department we know of...
            >
            > Now now Kris... there ARE some Tulsa people on the list... :)
            [snip]
            > Marc - but hey, what's a little pepper spray among friends?

            At a Richmond Renegades game a few years ago ('95-96 maybe?) an opponent
            from the Roanoke Express who was in the penalty box grew tired of the
            home fans taunting him, so he decided to douse them with his water
            bottle. The fans responded by throwing trash into the box, so he
            started trying to get at them with his stick. Unfortunately for him,
            there was a uniformed City of Richmond police officer nearby, who
            responded by spraying mace into the box. It was so bad that even the
            off-ice officials and PA announcer (who are between the penalty boxes)
            had to evacuate and hit the ice.

            Richmond fans are reminded of that incident by Roanoke fans on a regular
            basis.

            So what happened with the Tulsa PD?

            Pattie
            ------
            Patricia C. Anderson
            http://home.att.net/~patricia.c.anderson/
            patricia.c.anderson@... ICQ: 8935067
            -----------------------------------------
            Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
            ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
          • William Underwood
            Nothing like Old Time hockey is there? ... From: Patricia C. Anderson [mailto:patricia.c.anderson@worldnet.att.net] Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 7:47 PM
            Message 5 of 7 , Oct 21, 1999
            • 0 Attachment
              Nothing like "Old Time" hockey is there?

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Patricia C. Anderson [mailto:patricia.c.anderson@...]
              Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 7:47 PM
              To: hockhist@onelist.com
              Subject: Re: [hockhist] Wichita-OKC Lovefests (was: Ten Worst)

              From: "Patricia C. Anderson" <patricia.c.anderson@...>

              Marc Foster wrote:
              [snip]
              > > Yeah, but at least the OCPD or the WPD never decided to choke-hold or
              > > mace a player, unlike another police department we know of...
              >
              > Now now Kris... there ARE some Tulsa people on the list... :)
              [snip]
              > Marc - but hey, what's a little pepper spray among friends?

              At a Richmond Renegades game a few years ago ('95-96 maybe?) an opponent
              from the Roanoke Express who was in the penalty box grew tired of the
              home fans taunting him, so he decided to douse them with his water
              bottle. The fans responded by throwing trash into the box, so he
              started trying to get at them with his stick. Unfortunately for him,
              there was a uniformed City of Richmond police officer nearby, who
              responded by spraying mace into the box. It was so bad that even the
              off-ice officials and PA announcer (who are between the penalty boxes)
              had to evacuate and hit the ice.

              Richmond fans are reminded of that incident by Roanoke fans on a regular
              basis.

              So what happened with the Tulsa PD?

              Pattie
              ------
              Patricia C. Anderson
              http://home.att.net/~patricia.c.anderson/
              patricia.c.anderson@... ICQ: 8935067
              -----------------------------------------
              Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm.
              ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

              This has been a Hockey History List mailing
              <A HREF=http://www.enol.com/~liebmann/hockey/hockhist.htm>Our Homepage</A>
              The Hockey History List is the official mailing list of the Hockey Research
              Association (HRA)
            • Marc Foster
              ... Fan around a visiting box should expect to get doused with water when the taunting starts getting a little wild. Raising the stick in anger usually just
              Message 6 of 7 , Oct 21, 1999
              • 0 Attachment
                "Patricia C. Anderson" wrote:
                >
                > At a Richmond Renegades game a few years ago ('95-96 maybe?) an opponent
                > from the Roanoke Express who was in the penalty box grew tired of the
                > home fans taunting him, so he decided to douse them with his water
                > bottle. The fans responded by throwing trash into the box, so he
                > started trying to get at them with his stick. Unfortunately for him,
                > there was a uniformed City of Richmond police officer nearby, who
                > responded by spraying mace into the box. It was so bad that even the
                > off-ice officials and PA announcer (who are between the penalty boxes)
                > had to evacuate and hit the ice.

                Fan around a visiting box should expect to get doused with water when
                the taunting starts getting a little wild. Raising the stick in anger
                usually just makes the fans laugh and taunt more.

                > Richmond fans are reminded of that incident by Roanoke fans on a regular
                > basis.

                > So what happened with the Tulsa PD?

                It's the Bruce Shoebottom incident. I think I've told it so many times
                I'm going to put a version in the FAQ, LOL... Kris, care to take this
                one? My version of the story is getting a little stale.

                Marc

                --
                **************************************************************************
                * Marc Foster ICQ #18755448 *
                * President mfoster@... *
                * The Hockey Research Association http://www.hockeyresearch.com *
                * End the frustration of stats collecting, donate to the HRA archive. *
                **************************************************************************
              • Kenneth R. Holdren
                ... a little wild. Raising the stick in anger usually just makes the fans laugh and taunt more. ** I, unfortunately, was at a large bench clearing/fan
                Message 7 of 7 , Oct 21, 1999
                • 0 Attachment
                  On 10/21/99--Marc wrote:

                  >Fan around a visiting box should expect to get doused with water when the taunting starts getting
                  a little wild. Raising the stick in anger usually just makes the fans laugh and taunt more.

                  **

                  I, unfortunately, was at a large bench clearing/fan involved brawl that took place late in the
                  1996-97 CHL season between Columbus and Nashville. What made the whole thing rather strange was
                  that Nashville was in the middle of something like 20 straight losses, so them even having
                  interest in fighting was surprising.

                  What made a bad thing worse was that there were some Columbus fans taunting the Nashville bench
                  and some items, as best as I can remember, were thrown into the bench. A Nashville player took a
                  water bottle and threw it at the offending party. However, the bottle hit this woman who was not
                  involved in the incident and her husband went crazy.

                  Through all this, I'm sitting in my seat two rows above the entrance to the Nashville dressing
                  room. The next little bit I will never forget. A fan came down from the upper sections to the
                  rail area and threw is beer at the Nashville players leaving the ice. This "brave" fan then
                  hightailed it back to the upperdeck. That's courage for ya. At this moment, I was expecting the
                  worst but nothing happened. No players came over the rail. The Columbus GM even came over to the
                  Nashville dressing room and stood there the rest of the night to prevent further trouble.

                  I've been going to hockey games for over 20 years now and have seen some major brawls in that time
                  (Hampton/Charlotte from the SHL days and Tallahassee/Louisiana from a couple of years ago) but I
                  can honestly say that was the only time I have actually been scared to be at a game.

                  =====
                  Kenneth (krholdren@...)
                  ---------------------------------------
                  Beethoven. They've unearthed a long-lost score by the great composer. It's called "Let's Party Like It's 1799."

                  Jim Mullen's Hotsheet...Entertainment Weekly
                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.