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Small Proggy

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  • David Bole
    Guys, Does anyone out there have or know of someone who might have a small proggy that will do the League standings in a Playoff Picture format in html ?
    Message 1 of 11 , Feb 20, 2005
      Guys,
         Does anyone out there have or know of someone who might have
      a small proggy that will do the League standings in a "Playoff Picture"
      format in html ?
      Thanks
      DAVE
       
    • Jud Burkett
      If the NHL starts up the 05-06 season with replacement players (a possibility I read mentioned in an ESPN article) would you guys rate them? How would you rate
      Message 2 of 11 , Feb 21, 2005
        If the NHL starts up the 05-06 season with replacement players (a
        possibility I read mentioned in an ESPN article) would you guys rate
        them? How would you rate them? Would the fastest replacement players
        get 5 speed ratings even though the real NHL players with 5 speed
        ratings would skate circles around them?

        Just curious.

        Jud Burkett
      • Rob Shore
        Doesn t sound like there s much of a chance... Replacement players would pose immigration challenges By Tim Panaccio Knight Ridder Newspapers NEW YORK — When
        Message 3 of 11 , Feb 22, 2005
          Doesn't sound like there's much of a chance...

          Replacement players would pose immigration challenges
          By Tim Panaccio
          Knight Ridder Newspapers
          NEW YORK � When polled by the Edmonton Sun on Saturday night, 18 of 22
          players from the Edmonton Road Runners � the Oilers� American Hockey League
          affiliate � said they would gladly act as ��replacement players�� for their
          parent club at a salary of $500,000.
          So let�s assume a worst-case scenario: There is still no
          collective-bargaining agreement between the National Hockey League and the
          NHL Players� Association by August.
          Will commissioner Gary Bettman and his board of governors attempt to open
          next season with replacement players? Will they at least threaten such a
          move to get a deal? The board meets on March 1.
          Truth is, getting replacement workers into the United States would be a
          rather daunting task. According to one of the nation�s top immigration
          lawyers, who is counsel to the Washington Capitals, the league would be in
          uncharted waters at a time when restrictions imposed by the Department of
          Homeland Security are being applied to severely curtail foreigners in the
          American workplace.
          ��There are a lot of complicated regulations and there are always visa
          issues,�� said Jonathan Avirom, managing partner of Avirom & Associates in
          New York City.
          Avirom, 66, is the former president of the American Immigration Lawyers
          Association (AILA). His firm specializes in every facet of immigration and
          in securing visas, including for entertainers and athletes.
          He has assisted hundreds of NHL players in securing work visas and has been
          immigration counsel to the Capitals for the last four years.
          ��The Department of Labor and Immigration under Homeland Security have
          always said that if there is a labor dispute, they would freeze the
          process,�� Avirom said. ��In other words, new people who want to play in a
          sport where they don�t have visas, they won�t get a visa while the dispute
          is going on.��
          To initiate the process of using replacement players and unilaterally
          implement its own deal, Bettman would have to declare an impasse. He could
          expect to be challenged by the NHL Players� Association and could be forced
          to wait months while the National Labor Relations Board investigated.
          Given that the union moved off its philosophical differences with the
          league by agreeing to a salary cap, however, the only impasse here is the
          dollar amount, although after Saturday�s fractious meeting, it is obvious
          the entire system can�t be agreed upon.
          Bettman said Wednesday that the league would explore its options and
          acknowledged that declaring an impasse was an option. It is a slim option,
          experts say. The labor laws in Canada vary by province. Several ban an
          employer�s right to declare an impasse and replace its work force.
          The use of replacement players would likely be banned in the provinces of
          Ontario, British Columbia and Quebec, which have rules preventing it. While
          it would be possible for the NHL to put replacement players in Alberta �
          home of the Oilers and the Calgary Flames � the league could expect
          considerable legal hurdles using those replacement players on the Ottawa
          Senators, Toronto Maple Leafs, Vancouver Canucks and Montreal Canadiens.
          Hypothetically, the NHL would need two ��divisions�� � one playing in
          Canada with Canadians and one playing in the United States with American
          workers. A split like that would never happen. How could the league compete
          for a Stanley Cup? It�s simply not a workable solution.
          ��The only thing I have been told, not officially, is that in the event of
          replacement players, the American teams may have to use only American
          players,�� said one NHL official, adding that there�s no such discussion
          among the clubs at this point. That could change in March.
          Foreign-born athletes who travel across U.S. borders either carry O-1 or
          P-1 visas. An O-1 visa signifies that the athlete � or singer, physician,
          dancer, entertainer � has reached an elite qualification and is among the
          best in the world.
          The P-1 visas are commonly called ��green cards�� and are issued to
          athletes who compete for teams and live in the United States during their
          seasons. Most hockey players have P-1 visas, including all the Flyers�
          foreign-born players.
          Avirom is uncertain whether U.S. officials would allow NHL clubs to issue
          P-1 visas for foreign replacement players. He doubts the United States would
          issue O-1 visas because the NHL would have to prove that the league�s new,
          replacement players were of elite status. That would be a hard sell in
          court.
          ��Now players who are in the minors with two-way contracts (between the NHL
          and AHL) could conceivably get these O-1 visas,�� Avirom said.
          ��If you come into the United States to work in any capacity, in any sport
          other than tennis and golf, you need a work visa. If you play tennis or
          golf, it�s prize money and you enter on a tourist visa. But if you are to
          play in the U.S. and for a U.S. team, you need a work visa. Who is going to
          qualify?
          ��To get a work visa, whether you are a dancer or singer or in a sport, you
          have to show you are among the best in the world, so you are not taking a
          job away from an American. I don�t know if replacement players would be
          considered such.��
          In other words, the NHL better get a deal because replacement players
          aren�t going to work.
          ���
          (c) 2005, The Philadelphia Inquirer.
          Visit Philadelphia Online, the Inquirer�s World Wide Web site, at
          http://www.philly.com/
          Distributed by Knight Ridder/Tribune Information Services.


          ------------------------------------------------------------
          She sang, "No matter, how funny,
          it hurts so bad that I just can't feel.
          I feel nothing, I feel nothing, drunk or sober."
          And I began to play my reel for I did not know what to say.

          � "Everything's Bad", The Tossers


          >From: Jud Burkett <jnjburkett@...>
          >Reply-To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
          >To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: [hockeydisk] Replacement Players...
          >Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:02:49 -0700
          >
          >
          >If the NHL starts up the 05-06 season with replacement players (a
          >possibility I read mentioned in an ESPN article) would you guys rate
          >them? How would you rate them? Would the fastest replacement players
          >get 5 speed ratings even though the real NHL players with 5 speed
          >ratings would skate circles around them?
          >
          >Just curious.
          >
          >Jud Burkett
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • Photos By Alex
          on the issue of replacement players and visas... Why would any government care if employees from other countries are being replaced with employees from other
          Message 4 of 11 , Feb 22, 2005
            on the issue of replacement players and visas...

            Why would any government care if employees from other countries are being replaced with employees from other countries?  They are not protecting their own citizens well being....

            I don't know what percentage of players comes from each country... but lets just say 50% of the players are from Canada and 25% are from the USA.... just for argument sake for now....

            We will focus on the Canadian clubs first... because there are fewer of them.  If Canadian clubs replace Canadians with Canadians...which isn't a stretch due to the vast talent around at that level.....then a Canadian is still employed.... an if they are from the AHL... then they are guys who would realistically had a shot of coming up to the NHL somehow.  The governments have probably already considered AHL call ups into their greater planning.... The other 50 % are from out side of Canada...  why would the Canadian government care if the other 50% made up of non-Canadians replaced by other players outside of Canada.  Heck, that 50% from outside Canada could just as easily be made up of Canadians.  Isn't generating the taxes from salaries and revenues more important to the government?  I would hope so.

            Lets say the US teams are made up of 25% American players... which I highly doubt the number is that large.   Didn't the US government create enough work visa in their greater planning for team to be made up of 75% NON-American taking employement in the USA?  Ok, the US government would want to protect it's citizens employement.... but in this case they should probably recognize that there would be no league without the players from other countries... so why not provide a place for them to play and scoop up all the taxes for games being played as well as ensuring their limited number of hockey players have a job?

            Yes, both governments would want to get taxes from multi-millionaire-whiners........ but wouldn't they take taxes generated from people making a fraction of what normal NHL players make instead of nothing?

            Oh, let us not forget about the poor people who sell hot dogs who really need the employement just to pay for food, the residual business around hockey and the games played........  Don't you think two governments will see the bigger picture then protecting a bunch of whining players who cannot continue to make 75% of the revenue of a game anymore?


            Alex


            Wouldn't they rather have the taxes generated from games being played?

            Rob Shore wrote:
            Doesn't sound like there's much of a chance...
            
            Replacement players would pose immigration challenges
            	By Tim Panaccio
            	Knight Ridder Newspapers
                 NEW YORK — When polled by the Edmonton Sun on Saturday night, 18 of 22 
            players from the Edmonton Road Runners — the Oilers’ American Hockey League 
            affiliate — said they would gladly act as ‘‘replacement players’’ for their 
            parent club at a salary of $500,000.
            	So let’s assume a worst-case scenario: There is still no 
            collective-bargaining agreement between the National Hockey League and the 
            NHL Players’ Association by August.
            	Will commissioner Gary Bettman and his board of governors attempt to open 
            next season with replacement players? Will they at least threaten such a 
            move to get a deal? The board meets on March 1.
            	Truth is, getting replacement workers into the United States would be a 
            rather daunting task. According to one of the nation’s top immigration 
            lawyers, who is counsel to the Washington Capitals, the league would be in 
            uncharted waters at a time when restrictions imposed by the Department of 
            Homeland Security are being applied to severely curtail foreigners in the 
            American workplace.
            	‘‘There are a lot of complicated regulations and there are always visa 
            issues,’’ said Jonathan Avirom, managing partner of Avirom & Associates in 
            New York City.
            	Avirom, 66, is the former president of the American Immigration Lawyers 
            Association (AILA). His firm specializes in every facet of immigration and 
            in securing visas, including for entertainers and athletes.
            	He has assisted hundreds of NHL players in securing work visas and has been 
            immigration counsel to the Capitals for the last four years.
            	‘‘The Department of Labor and Immigration under Homeland Security have 
            always said that if there is a labor dispute, they would freeze the 
            process,’’ Avirom said. ‘‘In other words, new people who want to play in a 
            sport where they don’t have visas, they won’t get a visa while the dispute 
            is going on.’’
            	To initiate the process of using replacement players and unilaterally 
            implement its own deal, Bettman would have to declare an impasse. He could 
            expect to be challenged by the NHL Players’ Association and could be forced 
            to wait months while the National Labor Relations Board investigated.
            	Given that the union moved off its philosophical differences with the 
            league by agreeing to a salary cap, however, the only impasse here is the 
            dollar amount, although after Saturday’s fractious meeting, it is obvious 
            the entire system can’t be agreed upon.
            	Bettman said Wednesday that the league would explore its options and 
            acknowledged that declaring an impasse was an option. It is a slim option, 
            experts say. The labor laws in Canada vary by province. Several ban an 
            employer’s right to declare an impasse and replace its work force.
            	The use of replacement players would likely be banned in the provinces of 
            Ontario, British Columbia and Quebec, which have rules preventing it. While 
            it would be possible for the NHL to put replacement players in Alberta — 
            home of the Oilers and the Calgary Flames — the league could expect 
            considerable legal hurdles using those replacement players on the Ottawa 
            Senators, Toronto Maple Leafs, Vancouver Canucks and Montreal Canadiens.
            	Hypothetically, the NHL would need two ‘‘divisions’’ — one playing in 
            Canada with Canadians and one playing in the United States with American 
            workers. A split like that would never happen. How could the league compete 
            for a Stanley Cup? It’s simply not a workable solution.
            	‘‘The only thing I have been told, not officially, is that in the event of 
            replacement players, the American teams may have to use only American 
            players,’’ said one NHL official, adding that there’s no such discussion 
            among the clubs at this point. That could change in March.
            	Foreign-born athletes who travel across U.S. borders either carry O-1 or 
            P-1 visas. An O-1 visa signifies that the athlete — or singer, physician, 
            dancer, entertainer — has reached an elite qualification and is among the 
            best in the world.
            	The P-1 visas are commonly called ‘‘green cards’’ and are issued to 
            athletes who compete for teams and live in the United States during their 
            seasons. Most hockey players have P-1 visas, including all the Flyers’ 
            foreign-born players.
            	Avirom is uncertain whether U.S. officials would allow NHL clubs to issue 
            P-1 visas for foreign replacement players. He doubts the United States would 
            issue O-1 visas because the NHL would have to prove that the league’s new, 
            replacement players were of elite status. That would be a hard sell in 
            court.
            	‘‘Now players who are in the minors with two-way contracts (between the NHL 
            and AHL) could conceivably get these O-1 visas,’’ Avirom said.
            	‘‘If you come into the United States to work in any capacity, in any sport 
            other than tennis and golf, you need a work visa. If you play tennis or 
            golf, it’s prize money and you enter on a tourist visa. But if you are to 
            play in the U.S. and for a U.S. team, you need a work visa. Who is going to 
            qualify?
            	‘‘To get a work visa, whether you are a dancer or singer or in a sport, you 
            have to show you are among the best in the world, so you are not taking a 
            job away from an American. I don’t know if replacement players would be 
            considered such.’’
            	In other words, the NHL better get a deal because replacement players 
            aren’t going to work.
            	———
            	(c) 2005, The Philadelphia Inquirer.
            	Visit Philadelphia Online, the Inquirer’s World Wide Web site, at 
            http://www.philly.com/
            	Distributed by Knight Ridder/Tribune Information Services.
            
            
            ------------------------------------------------------------
            She sang, "No matter, how funny,
            it hurts so bad that I just can't feel.
            I feel nothing, I feel nothing, drunk or sober."
            And I began to play my reel for I did not know what to say.
            
            — "Everything's Bad", The Tossers
            
            
              
            From: Jud Burkett <jnjburkett@...>
            Reply-To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
            To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [hockeydisk] Replacement Players...
            Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:02:49 -0700
            
            
            If the NHL starts up the 05-06 season with replacement players (a
            possibility I read mentioned in an ESPN article) would you guys rate
            them? How would you rate them? Would the fastest replacement players
            get 5 speed ratings even though the real NHL players with 5 speed
            ratings would skate circles around them?
            
            Just curious.
            
            Jud Burkett
            
            
            
            
            
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          • D. Atkinson
            ... I doubt we d do a disk with replacement players....the ratings would be too difficult to do with the limited information available on the players.
            Message 5 of 11 , Feb 27, 2005
              Jud Burkett wrote:

              >If the NHL starts up the 05-06 season with replacement players (a
              >possibility I read mentioned in an ESPN article) would you guys rate
              >them? How would you rate them? Would the fastest replacement players
              >get 5 speed ratings even though the real NHL players with 5 speed
              >ratings would skate circles around them?
              >
              >Just curious.
              >
              >Jud Burkett
              >
              >
              >
              >

              I doubt we'd do a disk with replacement players....the ratings would be
              too difficult to do with the limited information available on the players.
            • Peter Dallara
              If anybody has files for the APBA seasons starting in 1981 through 1990, could you please forward them to us. It would be greatly appreciated. Pete Dallara Don
              Message 6 of 11 , Feb 27, 2005
                If anybody has files for the APBA seasons starting in 1981 through 1990, could you please forward them to us. It would be greatly appreciated.
                 
                Pete Dallara
                Don Rettaliata 
              • David Gowdey
                I d be interested to hear how our various leagues are handling this NHL situation. We will be running a Retro League of the 1974-75 season, but we considered
                Message 7 of 11 , Feb 28, 2005

                  I'd be interested to hear how our various leagues are handling this NHL situation. We will be running a Retro League of the 1974-75 season, but we considered several different scenarios:

                  1. keeping the same ratings, freezing 13, running a draft of the free agents 

                  2. keeping the same ratings but saying you could name up to 5 players who would be re-rated at mid-season, based on their first half numbers in 2005-06 (this is assuming they actually start the NHL next season)

                  3.  using projected numbers from one of last year's pre-season magazines for the players- this was rejected pretty fast

                  Has anyone else come up with any ideas?  


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                • Herb Garbutt
                  Hey David, I came up with 11 different scenarios that I presented to our league. In the end, it was decided to use the same disk again with no modifications.
                  Message 8 of 11 , Feb 28, 2005
                    Hey David,
                    I came up with 11 different scenarios that I presented to our league. In the end, it was decided to use the same disk again with no modifications. The main reason for this was that we have contracts which creates a fair bit of turnover. But for those leagues that don't, you might find some of the options interesting. You can read about them and the discussion around them on our message board. http://amazingforums.com/forum1/NNHL/107.html

                    There are some that I presented that I feel are flawed but I presented them as options anyway, because they had either been suggested by league members or just to spark some other ideas. The flaws are discussed either in the original post or in the ensuing discussion.

                    Herb
                     

                    David Gowdey wrote:

                     
                    I'd be interested to hear how our various leagues are handling this NHL situation. We will be running a Retro League of the 1974-75 season, but we considered several different scenarios:

                    1. keeping the same ratings, freezing 13, running a draft of the free agents

                    2. keeping the same ratings but saying you could name up to 5 players who would be re-rated at mid-season, based on their first half numbers in 2005-06 (this is assuming they actually start the NHL next season)

                    3.  using projected numbers from one of last year's pre-season magazines for the players- this was rejected pretty fast

                    Has anyone else come up with any ideas?


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                  • Herb Garbutt
                    Another option that I thought of after our league s discussion was the Back to the Future option. Many people had talked about redrafting teams for one year
                    Message 9 of 11 , Feb 28, 2005
                      Another option that I thought of after our league's discussion was the
                      Back to the Future option. Many people had talked about redrafting teams
                      for one year but I really liked the idea of keeping the league history
                      in tact and not having a gap in that history (something the NHL
                      obviously doesn't care about).

                      Anyway, my thought was, seeing as though there is no disk to go forward,
                      go backwards. We started our league eight years ago with the 1996/97
                      disk. So, to keep the league history consistent, and even add some
                      league history, go back using the league's original teams as your
                      starting point and play the previous season (in our case the 1995/96).

                      You would even be able to hold a draft, drafting players that had never
                      appeared in your league before (instead of young guys, you would be
                      drafting the retirees...a new twist). For instance in our case, someone
                      could draft Glenn Anderson, who played his last year in 95/96. He's
                      never appeared in our league because he retired before we started.

                      Herb
                    • David Gowdey
                      Thanks Herb- I especially like this Back To The Future option, and if the lockout extends further I ll suggest we try it. With our league going back to 74- 75
                      Message 10 of 11 , Feb 28, 2005
                        Thanks Herb- I especially like this Back To The Future option, and if the lockout extends further I'll suggest we try it. With our league going back to '74-'75  for next year we've been drafting the teams the last month or so, and it's been interesting building from scratch- maybe we'll run parallel seasons next year, our previous one from the 90's plus 75-76. At the pace the NHL is going they might meet up around 1987- D
                         
                         
                        Herb Garbutt <herbgarbutt@...> wrote:
                        Another option that I thought of after our league's discussion was the
                        Back to the Future option. Many people had talked about redrafting teams
                        for one year but I really liked the idea of keeping the league history
                        in tact and not having a gap in that history (something the NHL
                        obviously doesn't care about).

                        Anyway, my thought was, seeing as though there is no disk to go forward,
                        go backwards. We started our league eight years ago with the 1996/97
                        disk. So, to keep the league history consistent, and even add some
                        league history, go back using the league's original teams as your
                        starting point and play the previous season (in our case the 1995/96).

                        You would even be able to hold a draft, drafting players that had never
                        appeared in your league before (instead of young guys, you would be
                        drafting the retirees...a new twist). For instance in our case, someone
                        could draft Glenn Anderson, who played his last year in 95/96. He's
                        never appeared in our league because he retired before we started.

                        Herb






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                      • habscrue
                        I would also be very interested in obtaining these files. So if anyone could point me in the right direction that would be greatly appreciated! Randy. ...
                        Message 11 of 11 , Mar 4, 2005
                          I would also be very interested in obtaining these files. So if
                          anyone could point me in the right direction that would be greatly
                          appreciated!

                          Randy.


                          --- In hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com, Peter Dallara <pdallara@o...>
                          wrote:
                          > If anybody has files for the APBA seasons starting in 1981 through
                          1990,
                          > could you please forward them to us. It would be greatly
                          appreciated.
                          >
                          > Pete Dallara
                          > Don Rettaliata
                        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.