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Re: [hockeydisk] New disk

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  • Herb Garbutt
    Excellent point Bruce, And I don t see the need to have the disk to do your draft. We did our draft in May. Doing your draft before the disk comes out just
    Message 1 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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      Excellent point Bruce,
      And I don't see the need to have the disk to do your draft. We did our draft
      in May. Doing your draft before the disk comes out just forces the GM to do
      their homework. Read up on the players and you should know what their ratings
      will be (approximately). Everyone seems to want their leagues to be as
      realistic as possible. Well, if you do your draft before the ratings come out
      everyone's on equal terms and whoever does their homework will likely have
      the best draft. Call it scouting. There now you're getting even more
      realistic.
      I guess it all comes down to this: Are you drafting players or are you
      drafting ratings??
      Take your time with the disk guys. I know the longer I wait, the better it
      will be.

      Herb

      Bruce Carriker wrote:

      > Friend,
      >
      > Get some perspective. In light of all that's happened
      > this week, who cares about a hockey disk. Several of
      > the key guys on the disk project team travel as a
      > result of their work. Some of them have been sleeping
      > in airports for three nights.
      >
      > __________________________________________________
      > Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help?
      > Donate cash, emergency relief information
      > http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/
      >
      >
      >
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      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    • Brad Utterstrom
      Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don t think that means the world
      Message 2 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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        Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
        indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
        that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
        for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.

        Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
        is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
        part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
      • Thomas Mertz
        As someone who s business and family was affected, I find your statement terribly insensitive. Look at this way: 1) All major league sports have stopped. 2)
        Message 3 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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          As someone who's business and family was affected, I find your statement terribly insensitive.
           
          Look at this way:
           
          1) All major league sports have stopped.
          2) All capital markets are closed.
           
          But you think work on a fantasy disk should go on as if nothing has happened?
           
          The disk will be done when it is done.
           
          Tom
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 2:45 PM
          Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk

          Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
          indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
          that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
          for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.

          Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
          is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
          part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.


          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
        • Glenn
          ... think ... waiting ... he ... most ... I don t know about you, but with World War III about to start, I m willing to be patient and wait a couple of extra
          Message 4 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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            --- In hockeydisk@y..., "Brad Utterstrom" <butters@s...> wrote:
            > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
            > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't
            think
            > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people
            waiting
            > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
            >
            > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume
            he
            > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the
            most
            > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.


            I don't know about you, but with World War III about to start, I'm
            willing to be patient and wait a couple of extra weeks for the disk
            to come out. The world hasn't stopped, but there are enough ripple
            effects from Tuesday's tragic events that it's going to be a short
            while before it's "business as usual"...

            Glenn
            Founder, NWHL
            Member, BDMMHL, Can-AM, GCHL, NWHL, and RMHL
          • Sean Christian Berends
            I agree. We were told that we d at least hear something on the disk on Sunday night, which was before the tragedy on Tuesday. Maybe I ve missed a post or
            Message 5 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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              I agree. We were told that we'd at least hear something on the disk on
              Sunday night, which was before the tragedy on Tuesday. Maybe I've missed a
              post or two, but I don't recall seeing the progress on it. I'm not trying
              to sound insensitive or ungrateful for the hard work that Jeff, Dave and
              others put into the disk, but it would be nice to know what's up.

              Sean

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Brad Utterstrom <butters@...>
              To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:45 PM
              Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk


              > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
              > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
              > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
              > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
              >
              > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
              > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
              > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
            • Fotiu22Fan@AOL.com
              Gentlemen, The GOHL also has done it s draft (see below). Drafting player s, not ratings does make the GM job more realistic. Anthony In a message dated
              Message 6 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                        Gentlemen,
                                 The GOHL also has done it's draft (see below). Drafting player's, not ratings does make the GM job more realistic.              Anthony


                In a message dated 9/14/01 11:59:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, herbgarbutt@... writes:


                Subj: Re: [hockeydisk] New disk
                Date: 9/14/01 11:59:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time
                From:    herbgarbutt@... (Herb Garbutt)
                Reply-to: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
                To:    hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com




                Excellent point Bruce,
                And I don't see the need to have the disk to do your draft. We did our draft
                in May. Doing your draft before the disk comes out just forces the GM to do
                their homework. Read up on the players and you should know what their ratings
                will be (approximately). Everyone seems to want their leagues to be as
                realistic as possible. Well, if you do your draft before the ratings come out
                everyone's on equal terms and whoever does their homework will likely have
                the best draft. Call it scouting. There now you're getting even more
                realistic.
                I guess it all comes down to this: Are you drafting players or are you
                drafting ratings??
                Take your time with the disk guys. I know the longer I wait, the better it
                will be.

                Herb

                Bruce Carriker wrote:

                > Friend,
                >
                > Get some perspective.  In light of all that's happened
                > this week, who cares about a hockey disk.  Several of
                > the key guys on the disk project team travel as a
                > result of their work.  Some of them have been sleeping
                > in airports for three nights.
                >

                ---------------GOHL  DRAFT------------------
                Round #1  
                1)BRK -Mario Lemieux
                2)MAN-Brad Richards
                3)WIN-Martin Havlat
                4)FOR-Marian Gaborik
                5)LAV-Daniel Sedin
                6)PEL-Mike Comrie
                7)OKA-Roman Cechmanek
                8)SOM-Karel Rachunek
                9)ORO-Brent Johnson
                10)LAV-Henrick Sedin
                11)PEX-Oleg Saprykin
                12)SAN-Lubomir Visnovsky
                13)VAL--Shane Willis
                14)WIN-Justin Williams
                15)BAY-Rick Dipietro
                16)LAV-Taylor Pyatt
                17)ARK-Alexander Khavanov
                18)VBA-Ossi Vaananen
                19)PEX-Milan Kraft
                20)PEX-Dimitri Kalinin
                21)SAN-Johan Hedberg
                22)PEL-Marty Turco
                23)RDR-Daniel Tkaczuk
                24)PEX-Denis Shvidki
                Round #2--------------------------
                25)VBA-David Aebischer
                26)LAV-Scott Hartnell
                27)VBA-Kristian Kucroc
                28)FOR-Andrei Markov
                29)VBA-Jani Hurme
                30)PEX-Branislav Mezei
                31)NOR-Ville Nieminen
                32)VBA-Mathieu Garon
                33)VBA-Steven Reinprecht
                34)ORO-Steve McCarthy
                35)BRK-Ladislav Nagy
                36)PSS-Jean Luc Grand-Pierre
                37)VAL-Filip Kuba
                38)HAM-Lubomir Sekeras
                39)PEL-Mike Mottau
                40)MAN-Ruslan Fedotenko
                41)PSS-Kyle Calder
                42)HIL-Shawn Hurcroff
                43)ARK-Stephane Robidas
                44)FOR-Denis Arkhipov
                45)WIN-Eric Belanger
                46)NEW-Andrew Raycroft
                47)MAN-Manny Legace
                48)NOR-Tomi Kallio
                Round #3------------------------
                49)RDR-Willie Mitchell
                50)LAV-Sheldon Keefe
                51)ARK-Marcus Nilson
                52)FOR-Josef Vasicek
                53)MAN-Toni Lydman
                54)ARK-Martin St Louis
                55)NOR-Daniel Corso
                56)OKA-Epsen Knutsen
                57)ORO-Marian Cisar
                58)RDR-Chris Nielson
                59)HIL-David Vyborny
                60)SAN-Petr Svoboda
                61)VAL-Denis Hamel
                62)HAM-Wes Walz
                63)ORO-Mark Bell
                64)FOR-Juraj Kolnick
                65)FOR-Sami Pahlsson
                66)BRK-Petr Tenkrat
                67)NEW-Adam Mair
                68)PEX-Tomas Kloucek
                69)PEL penalty, no pick
                70)PEX-Tyler Bouck
                71)PSS-Yves Sarault
                72)ORO-Bryce Salvador
                Round #4-----------------------
                73)RDR-Milan Hnilick
                74)LAV-Eric Chouinard
                75)ORO-Alexei Ponikarovsky
                76)FOR-Mike Commodore
                77)MAN-pass
                78)WIN-Steve Staios
                79)NOR-Brent Sopel
                80)FOR-Lance Ward
                81)ORO-Ronald Petrovicky
                82)HIL-Richard Lintner
                83)BAY-Chris Herperger
                84)PEX-Toby Peterson
                85)VAL-Nils Ekman
                86)VAL-Roman Simicek
                87)BAY-Andy Sutton
                88)HIL-Alexander Kharitonov
                89)SCA-Ladislav Benysek
                90)OKA-Peter White
                91)QUA-Michel Riesen
                92)QUA-Maxim Kuznetsov
                93)PSS-Chris Clark
                94)HIL-Peter Smrek
                95)MAN-pass
                96)QUA-Antti-Jussi Niemi
                Round #5-----------------------
                97)RDR-Petteri Nummelin
                98)LAV-Rick Berry
                99)HAM-Jarno Kultanen
                100)HIL-Jaroslav Modry
                101)LAV-Todd Fedoruk
                102)HIL-Aaron Gavey
                103)NOR-Serge Payer
                104)HAM-Johan Witehall
                105)PEL-Niclas Wallin
                106)HIL-Lee Goren
                107)PEX-Trent Whitfield
                108)HIL-Brad Tapper
                109)VAL-Jean Yves Leroux
                110)HAM-Ian Moren
                111)BAY-Stacey Roest
                112)HAM-P.J. Stock
                113)OKA-Scott Parker
                114)PEL-Dan LaCouture
                115)SOM-Jarkko Ruutu
                116)AUS-Dominic Pettis
                117)PSS-Chris McAllister
                118)PEL-Eric Landry
                119)RDR-pass
                120)OKA-Dale Purinton
                Round #6------------------------
                121)RDR-pass
                122)LAV-pass
                123)OKA-Cam Stewart
                124)FOR-pass
                125)MAN-pass
                126)PEL-Yogi Svejkovski
                127)NOR-Xavier Delisle
                128)SOM-Billy Tibbets
                129)BAY-Jeff Finley
                130)HIL-Greg Classen
                131)PEX-pass
                132)SAN-pass
                133)VAL-Steve McKenna
                134)HAM-pass
                135)BAY-Tim Tatlor
                136)OKA-Shane Hnidy
                137)OKA-Dwayne Hay
                138)PEL-Josef Melichar
                139)SOM-pass
                140)AUS-Marc Chouinard
                141)PSS-pass
                142)NEW-Sylvain Blouin
                143)BRK-pass
                144)OKA-pass
              • Stephane S.
                Can t agree more.But maybe it could also sets our minds on something else. ... Please bring some happiness into our lives, lets get the disk! :-))) ... From:
                Message 7 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                  Can't agree more.But maybe it could also sets our minds on something else.
                  :-)

                  Please bring some happiness into our lives, lets get the disk! :-)))
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Ed Hebscher" <hebscher@...>
                  To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 12:49 PM
                  Subject: RE: [hockeydisk] New disk


                  > In my opinion a disk is pretty unimportant this week!
                  >
                  > Ed
                  >
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: jeanden44@... [mailto:jeanden44@...]
                  > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 8:25 AM
                  > To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: [hockeydisk] New disk
                  >
                  >
                  > Well I'be been waiting and waiting, all my leagues are waiting and
                  > waiting. We can't have our drafts until the new disk is out. So I
                  > haven't heard anything in a while. Sorry if I seem impatient, but
                  > I've got to find out!
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  >
                  >
                • Stephane S.
                  Can t agree more.But maybe it could also sets our minds on something else. ... Please bring some happiness into our lives, lets get the disk! :-))) ... From:
                  Message 8 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                    Can't agree more.But maybe it could also sets our minds on something else.
                    :-)

                    Please bring some happiness into our lives, lets get the disk! :-)))
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Ed Hebscher" <hebscher@...>
                    To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 12:49 PM
                    Subject: RE: [hockeydisk] New disk


                    > In my opinion a disk is pretty unimportant this week!
                    >
                    > Ed
                    >
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: jeanden44@... [mailto:jeanden44@...]
                    > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 8:25 AM
                    > To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [hockeydisk] New disk
                    >
                    >
                    > Well I'be been waiting and waiting, all my leagues are waiting and
                    > waiting. We can't have our drafts until the new disk is out. So I
                    > haven't heard anything in a while. Sorry if I seem impatient, but
                    > I've got to find out!
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    >
                    >
                  • Herb Garbutt
                    Jeff told us how close it was. What do you want him to say?? When it s done he ll let us know. He hasn t released it yet because he doesn t feel it s good
                    Message 9 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                      Jeff told us how close it was. What do you want him to say?? When it's done
                      he'll let us know. He hasn't released it yet because he doesn't feel it's good
                      enough yet. What other reason do you need?
                      Even without the events of the past week, the constant questioning just shows a
                      complete lack of respect for Jeff and Dave and their time. The day we start
                      paying them to do this is the day we have the right to ask them when it will be
                      done.

                      Herb

                      Sean Christian Berends wrote:

                      > I agree. We were told that we'd at least hear something on the disk on
                      > Sunday night, which was before the tragedy on Tuesday. Maybe I've missed a
                      > post or two, but I don't recall seeing the progress on it. I'm not trying
                      > to sound insensitive or ungrateful for the hard work that Jeff, Dave and
                      > others put into the disk, but it would be nice to know what's up.
                      >
                      > Sean
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: Brad Utterstrom <butters@...>
                      > To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                      > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:45 PM
                      > Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                      >
                      > > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
                      > > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
                      > > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
                      > > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
                      > >
                      > > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
                      > > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
                      > > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    • PetalPorkChop@cs.com
                      The man was only asking a question on the board ! What is the difference of asking a question on the board OR READING the board ? Everyone handles this tragedy
                      Message 10 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                        The man was only asking a question on the board ! What is the difference of asking a question on the board OR READING the board ?

                        Everyone handles this tragedy in their own way. If I had lost someone in NYC or Washington DC...would I really care if someone asked a question about a hockey disk on a bulletin board? I think NOT ! America needs to look forward not back. I think you owe the man an apology.
                      • Ed Hebscher
                        you forgot approx 5,000 people LOST THEIR LIVES! ... From: Thomas Mertz [mailto:tom@winsocket.com] Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 4:44 PM To:
                        Message 11 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                          you forgot approx 5,000 people LOST THEIR LIVES!
                           
                           
                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: Thomas Mertz [mailto:tom@...]
                          Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 4:44 PM
                          To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk

                          As someone who's business and family was affected, I find your statement terribly insensitive.
                           
                          Look at this way:
                           
                          1) All major league sports have stopped.
                          2) All capital markets are closed.
                           
                          But you think work on a fantasy disk should go on as if nothing has happened?
                           
                          The disk will be done when it is done.
                           
                          Tom
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 2:45 PM
                          Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk

                          Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
                          indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
                          that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
                          for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.

                          Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
                          is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
                          part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.


                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                        • butters@st1.wou.edu
                          You misunderstood me... I am not yelling come on guys, what the hell is the holdup, you owe us! Get the disk out NOW! I am very grateful to Dave and Jeff and
                          Message 12 of 23 , Sep 14, 2001
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                            You misunderstood me...
                            I am not yelling "come on guys, what the hell is the holdup, you owe
                            us! Get the disk out NOW!"

                            I am very grateful to Dave and Jeff and everyone on the disk team for
                            all their hard work and effort to keep APBA alive. I am very sorry to
                            all of the people who were affected by the happenings this week,
                            especially those who lost a loved one.

                            All I am saying is that those of us who are still eager to see the
                            disk, or at least hear of it's progress, are not being insensitive.
                            As mentioned, Jeff was on here a couple days ago with a post, it
                            would have been nice to hear at that point what the status of the
                            disk was. The disk was originally scheduled awhile ago. As all of us
                            know from past experiences, we should and do expect delays. Still, we
                            are curious, and anxiously await the release of the disk. Is that
                            such a terrible crime?

                            I have noticed on various chat rooms and forums, that amidst a crisis
                            such as this, a lot of people tend to point fingers at others for
                            being insensitive. I think a lot of people have serious emotions,
                            anger, hatred, confusion, and sometimes they just don't know what to
                            do with them. So suddenly a person like me is accused of being
                            insensitive for something as inconsequential as a post asking about
                            the status of the project disk?

                            Sorry for the rambling, but I too am confused and frustrated, and
                            just wanted to defend myself and the others here who are anxious to
                            see the new disk. I think generally I am a very sensitive person, and
                            I don't think an issue as small as this one would change that. And I
                            don't mean to rush anyone with the disk, I want it to be as accurate
                            as possible.-Brad

                            --- In hockeydisk@y..., "Thomas Mertz" <tom@w...> wrote:
                            > As someone who's business and family was affected, I find your
                            statement terribly insensitive.
                            >
                            > Look at this way:
                            >
                            > 1) All major league sports have stopped.
                            > 2) All capital markets are closed.
                            >
                            > But you think work on a fantasy disk should go on as if nothing has
                            happened?
                            >
                            > The disk will be done when it is done.
                            >
                            > Tom
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: Brad Utterstrom
                            > To: hockeydisk@y...
                            > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 2:45 PM
                            > Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                            >
                            >
                            > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very
                            sad
                            > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't
                            think
                            > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people
                            waiting
                            > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
                            >
                            > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would
                            assume he
                            > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the
                            most
                            > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
                            >
                            >
                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                            Service.
                          • Stephane S.
                            What about if we offer to pay them? I have no problem to pay for all the hard work that is done by this team.Its the least we can do.In exchange we d like to
                            Message 13 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                              What about if we offer to pay them? I have no problem to pay for all the
                              hard work that is done by this team.Its the least we can do.In exchange we'd
                              like to know "when", to plan our next steps.I'd better have an answer later
                              than sooner so that people dont go asking each day.
                              I don't see any offense in asking "when", with all due respect to what is
                              happening.

                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: "Herb Garbutt" <herbgarbutt@...>
                              To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 7:29 PM
                              Subject: Re: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk


                              > Jeff told us how close it was. What do you want him to say?? When it's
                              done
                              > he'll let us know. He hasn't released it yet because he doesn't feel it's
                              good
                              > enough yet. What other reason do you need?
                              > Even without the events of the past week, the constant questioning just
                              shows a
                              > complete lack of respect for Jeff and Dave and their time. The day we
                              start
                              > paying them to do this is the day we have the right to ask them when it
                              will be
                              > done.
                              >
                              > Herb
                              >
                              > Sean Christian Berends wrote:
                              >
                              > > I agree. We were told that we'd at least hear something on the disk on
                              > > Sunday night, which was before the tragedy on Tuesday. Maybe I've
                              missed a
                              > > post or two, but I don't recall seeing the progress on it. I'm not
                              trying
                              > > to sound insensitive or ungrateful for the hard work that Jeff, Dave and
                              > > others put into the disk, but it would be nice to know what's up.
                              > >
                              > > Sean
                              > >
                              > > ----- Original Message -----
                              > > From: Brad Utterstrom <butters@...>
                              > > To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                              > > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:45 PM
                              > > Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                              > >
                              > > > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
                              > > > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
                              > > > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
                              > > > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
                              > > >
                              > > > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
                              > > > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
                              > > > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                              >
                              >
                            • Vladimir Zhivov
                              Hey, guys, everybody deals with horrific events in their own way - some people think everything should stop, others think that we should move on or want
                              Message 14 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                                Hey, guys, everybody deals with horrific events in their
                                own way - some people think everything should stop, others
                                think that we should move on or want distractions or what-
                                ever. Did everything on this list stop when Palestinian
                                scumbags were blowing up Israeli pizzerias, clubs or buses?
                                No, so let people deal with this one in their own way. Not
                                one of us has a right to tell somebody else how they should
                                react to the Tuesday events. Opinion on whether NFL should
                                play this weekend was split 50/50 for instance, so I would
                                expect about the same on this list, especially given that
                                many here aren't American. Not that it makes me any less
                                angry or vengeful, but I imagine it probably doesn't hit
                                home quite as hard. So, please, don't jump on Jean or the
                                others for thinking about fantasy hockey at a time like
                                this - if you think it's inappropriate to think about APBA
                                at a time like this, why are you reading the list?

                                >you forgot approx 5,000 people LOST THEIR LIVES!
                                >
                                >
                                > -----Original Message-----
                                > From: Thomas Mertz [mailto:tom@...]
                                > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 4:44 PM
                                > To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
                                > Subject: Re: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                                >
                                >
                                > As someone who's business and family was affected, I find your statement
                                >terribly insensitive.
                                >
                                > Look at this way:
                                >
                                > 1) All major league sports have stopped.
                                > 2) All capital markets are closed.
                                >
                                > But you think work on a fantasy disk should go on as if nothing has
                                >happened?
                                >
                                > The disk will be done when it is done.
                                >
                                > Tom
                                > ----- Original Message -----
                                > From: Brad Utterstrom
                                > To: hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com
                                > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 2:45 PM
                                > Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                                >
                                >
                                > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
                                > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
                                > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
                                > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
                                >
                                > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
                                > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
                                > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
                                >
                                >
                                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                                >
                                >
                                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                                >


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                              • Herb Garbutt
                                To those who don t see the offence in asking, let me tell you about my own experience as a commissioner of a league. In the first few years of our league I
                                Message 15 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                                  To those who don't see the offence in asking, let me tell you about my own
                                  experience as a commissioner of a league. In the first few years of our league I
                                  would constantly have people sending e-mail 'How come the site isn't updated
                                  today?? How come there's no player of the week? How come the site has Sergei
                                  Fedorov with only 14 goals, he has 15?
                                  You know what, when you're spending a lot of time doing something for the
                                  enjoyment of everyone, these kind of questions become very tiresome. You end of
                                  defending what you do with your own free time.
                                  I'm seeing the same thing happen with this board as I did from members of my
                                  pool. Prefacing your questions with "I really appreciate your time" doesn't
                                  help. If you really did, you wouldn't be asking the question.
                                  The constant questions diminishes the fun out of what you're doing and in the
                                  end everyone gets a great pool (or disk) and all you get is frustration. If Dave
                                  and Jeff decided to not do the disk next year I wouldn't blame them a bit. Then
                                  where would we be. Then we would truly appreciate their time.
                                  As I said before, Jeff said it was very close. What do you want him to say? Now
                                  it's very, very close. So why don't we all shut up, sit tight and enjoy the disk
                                  when it's ready, whether that's tomorrow or December.

                                  Herb


                                  "Stephane S." wrote:

                                  > What about if we offer to pay them? I have no problem to pay for all the
                                  > hard work that is done by this team.Its the least we can do.In exchange we'd
                                  > like to know "when", to plan our next steps.I'd better have an answer later
                                  > than sooner so that people dont go asking each day.
                                  > I don't see any offense in asking "when", with all due respect to what is
                                  > happening.
                                  >
                                  > ----- Original Message -----
                                  > From: "Herb Garbutt" <herbgarbutt@...>
                                  > To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                                  > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 7:29 PM
                                  > Subject: Re: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                                  >
                                  > > Jeff told us how close it was. What do you want him to say?? When it's
                                  > done
                                  > > he'll let us know. He hasn't released it yet because he doesn't feel it's
                                  > good
                                  > > enough yet. What other reason do you need?
                                  > > Even without the events of the past week, the constant questioning just
                                  > shows a
                                  > > complete lack of respect for Jeff and Dave and their time. The day we
                                  > start
                                  > > paying them to do this is the day we have the right to ask them when it
                                  > will be
                                  > > done.
                                  > >
                                  > > Herb
                                  > >
                                  > > Sean Christian Berends wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > > I agree. We were told that we'd at least hear something on the disk on
                                  > > > Sunday night, which was before the tragedy on Tuesday. Maybe I've
                                  > missed a
                                  > > > post or two, but I don't recall seeing the progress on it. I'm not
                                  > trying
                                  > > > to sound insensitive or ungrateful for the hard work that Jeff, Dave and
                                  > > > others put into the disk, but it would be nice to know what's up.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Sean
                                  > > >
                                  > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                  > > > From: Brad Utterstrom <butters@...>
                                  > > > To: <hockeydisk@yahoogroups.com>
                                  > > > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:45 PM
                                  > > > Subject: [hockeydisk] Re: New disk
                                  > > >
                                  > > > > Not trying to discredit the whole fiasco this week, it is very sad
                                  > > > > indeed and has thrown a huge curveball at us. However, I don't think
                                  > > > > that means the world has to stop. There are still many people waiting
                                  > > > > for this disk to come out, and I don't think that's insensitive.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Jeff came on here the other day and made a post, so I would assume he
                                  > > > > is ok, and he is also the one who has the disk. I think, for the most
                                  > > > > part, we'd just like to know what is going on at least.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                  > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                  > > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                  > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                • Bruce Carriker
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                                    <<<<"Stephane S." wrote:

                                    What about if we offer to pay them? I have no
                                    problem to pay for all the hard work that is done by
                                    this team.Its the least we can do.
                                    In exchange we'd like to know "when", to plan our next
                                    steps. I'd better have an answer later than sooner so
                                    that people dont go asking each day. I don't see any
                                    offense in asking "when", with all due respect to what
                                    is happening.>>>>

                                    Dave and Jeff, nor anyone else associated with the
                                    disk project can accept any money or other
                                    remuneration for their labors, without the consent of
                                    the National Hockey League (and the NHLPA, too, I
                                    think). To get consent requires the DiskProject to
                                    BUY the rights to use the team names, players' names,
                                    NHL, etc.

                                    This has been looked into and even with all the folks
                                    who use the DiskProject disk, the cost of the disk
                                    would become prohibitive if the NHL/NHLPA had to be
                                    paid. The DiskProject team would never see any of the
                                    money, and would lose huge amounts of their own money
                                    on the investment.

                                    You said, "In exchange we'd like to know..." I assume
                                    you mean in exchange for payment, which the
                                    DiskProject team doesn't receive. This then becomes
                                    an "IF-THEN" proposition. "IF, I'm paying
                                    something...THEN, I have the right to inquire..." No
                                    question, that is a valid position. However, since
                                    the IF is not happening, it renders the THEN a moot
                                    point.

                                    What Jeff and Dave and the others do is done because
                                    they like the APBA hockey game and don't want to see
                                    it disappear just because APBA is too cheap to keep
                                    making the disk, but too stingy to sell the rights to
                                    the game.

                                    I am as anxious as anyone to see the new disk. But,
                                    when we're receiving something for free, it takes some
                                    might big cahonas, or some mighty poor manners, to
                                    complain about it.



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                                  • cos90@telusplanet.net
                                    If we offer to pay them, that strips the Disk Project of its not-for-profit status, which would mean that the Disk Project would have to shell out $$$ to the
                                    Message 17 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                                      If we offer to pay them, that strips the Disk Project of its
                                      not-for-profit status, which would mean that the Disk Project
                                      would have to shell out $$$ to the NHLPA, which would mean
                                      we'd have to pay a *lot*, so that the fees would be covered.

                                      As far as asking "when", come on, get real. Given the events
                                      of the past week, I fully expect there to be a delay in the
                                      delivery of the disk, and a hundred messages asking Jeff and
                                      Dave "when?" isn't going to speed up the process. When the
                                      country is facing a national crisis, some things have to go
                                      on the back burner. And continuing to badger the disk project
                                      on the delivery date isn't helping. Do us all a favour and cut
                                      the disk team some slack, will you? And get some perspective.
                                      There are more important things going on out there these days
                                      than getting the disk out. I'm willing to be patient; the disk
                                      gets out when it gets out.

                                      --- In hockeydisk@y..., "Stephane S." <stephane.sylvain@s...> wrote:
                                      > What about if we offer to pay them? I have no problem to pay for
                                      all the
                                      > hard work that is done by this team.Its the least we can do.In
                                      exchange we'd
                                      > like to know "when", to plan our next steps.I'd better have an
                                      answer later
                                      > than sooner so that people dont go asking each day.
                                      > I don't see any offense in asking "when", with all due respect to
                                      > what is happening.
                                    • Jeff Kraus
                                      Wow, looks like I ve missed quite a bit the past two days! Let s see if I can hit all of the points that were brought up... First off, I want to thank
                                      Message 18 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                                        Wow, looks like I've missed quite a bit the past two days!  Let's see if I can hit all of the points that were brought up...
                                         
                                        First off, I want to thank everyone who inquired about my well being over this past week.  By the grace of God, neither my family nor my immediate circle of family & friends was directly affected by this week's attack on the Pentagon & WTC.  But that doesn't change the fact that thousands of lives were either lost or changed for the worse.  I wouldn't be much of a father if it didn't hit home how many children lost parents this week, how many parents lost children, how many people lost spouses and siblings.  So to those of you whose lives were directly affected, I hope you can find at least some comfort in knowing how many people are praying for you and your families.
                                         
                                        My feelings about what happened this week, and how our society is dealing with it (at least here in Loudoun County, Virginia, 30 miles west of the Pentagon), go much deeper than that but I don't believe this is the appropriate forum for discussion.
                                         
                                        Sorry the disk wasn't ready last Sunday as expected, but I just didn't have any time.  Thought I'd have time last Friday to finish it off, but as it turns out, I didn't.  I don't really feel the need to explain beyond that.  If you go back and read the recent posts from Brett, Bruce and Herb, they about summed it up.
                                         
                                        What you really want to know:
                                         
                                        THE DISK WILL BE AVAILABLE LATER THIS EVENING.
                                         
                                        I'll send out another note after the files have been uploaded.
                                        The "replay" version of the disk (multiple cards for guys who got traded) is complete and is ready for upload.  The "league" version of the disk (one card per player) has been assembled but I want to run some sims with it to make sure I didn't miss anything.  But I'm pretty sure it's ready to go so figure it'll be there by 11 PM EDT.
                                         
                                        The hidden ratings are as close as they are going to get.  There are two fairly significant players (12-20 goal range) who are outside our usual acceptable variance of +/- 15% in shots per minute, one high and one low.  They are apparently as close as they are going to get, but coincidentally their scoring % is off just enough to put them within +/- 2 goals from their NHL total.
                                         
                                        I also wanted to point out that besides Dave and myself, Derrick Underwood played a significant role in the early testing of the disk and identifying some problem areas in the subjective ratings.  At the risk of leaving someone out (please don't take offense!), Brett Hall, Bruce Carriker, Herb Garbutt and Luc Labelle all made significant contributions to this year's disk, not to mention the numerous members of the ratings team.  I'm sure there were others whom Dave coordinated with.  I'll post the complete list on the web site (eventually).
                                         
                                        Jeff
                                         


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                                      • Glenn
                                        Glad to hear the good news, Jeff. And glad to hear you re okay. -- Glenn (And to the wing-nut who sent me flame e-mail for basically asking people to stop
                                        Message 19 of 23 , Sep 15, 2001
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                                          Glad to hear the good news, Jeff. And glad to hear you're okay.

                                          -- Glenn

                                          (And to the wing-nut who sent me flame e-mail for basically asking
                                          people to stop complaining about when the disk was coming out, as
                                          if it was something owed to you... grow up. (And next time, I'm
                                          naming names.))


                                          --- In hockeydisk@y..., "Jeff Kraus" <othl@m...> wrote:
                                          > Wow, looks like I've missed quite a bit the past two days! Let's
                                          see if I can hit all of the points that were brought up...
                                          >
                                          > First off, I want to thank everyone who inquired about my well
                                          being over this past week. By the grace of God, neither my family
                                          nor my immediate circle of family & friends was directly affected by
                                          this week's attack on the Pentagon & WTC. But that doesn't change
                                          the fact that thousands of lives were either lost or changed for the
                                          worse. I wouldn't be much of a father if it didn't hit home how many
                                          children lost parents this week, how many parents lost children, how
                                          many people lost spouses and siblings. So to those of you whose
                                          lives were directly affected, I hope you can find at least some
                                          comfort in knowing how many people are praying for you and your
                                          families.
                                          >
                                          > My feelings about what happened this week, and how our society is
                                          dealing with it (at least here in Loudoun County, Virginia, 30 miles
                                          west of the Pentagon), go much deeper than that but I don't believe
                                          this is the appropriate forum for discussion.
                                          >
                                          > Sorry the disk wasn't ready last Sunday as expected, but I just
                                          didn't have any time. Thought I'd have time last Friday to finish it
                                          off, but as it turns out, I didn't. I don't really feel the need to
                                          explain beyond that. If you go back and read the recent posts from
                                          Brett, Bruce and Herb, they about summed it up.
                                          >
                                          > What you really want to know:
                                          >
                                          > THE DISK WILL BE AVAILABLE LATER THIS EVENING.
                                          >
                                          > I'll send out another note after the files have been uploaded.
                                          >
                                          > The "replay" version of the disk (multiple cards for guys who got
                                          traded) is complete and is ready for upload. The "league" version of
                                          the disk (one card per player) has been assembled but I want to run
                                          some sims with it to make sure I didn't miss anything. But I'm
                                          pretty sure it's ready to go so figure it'll be there by 11 PM EDT.
                                          >
                                          > The hidden ratings are as close as they are going to get. There
                                          are two fairly significant players (12-20 goal range) who are outside
                                          our usual acceptable variance of +/- 15% in shots per minute, one
                                          high and one low. They are apparently as close as they are going to
                                          get, but coincidentally their scoring % is off just enough to put
                                          them within +/- 2 goals from their NHL total.
                                          >
                                          > I also wanted to point out that besides Dave and myself, Derrick
                                          Underwood played a significant role in the early testing of the disk
                                          and identifying some problem areas in the subjective ratings. At the
                                          risk of leaving someone out (please don't take offense!), Brett Hall,
                                          Bruce Carriker, Herb Garbutt and Luc Labelle all made significant
                                          contributions to this year's disk, not to mention the numerous
                                          members of the ratings team. I'm sure there were others whom Dave
                                          coordinated with. I'll post the complete list on the web site
                                          (eventually).
                                          >
                                          > JeffGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
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