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Re: [hobbicast] Re: How to ID types of brass

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  • Malcolm Parker-Lisberg
    Silicon Bronze, Copper and Silicon is it a brass or a bronze. An Alcemist just striring it.... ;~) Malcolm I don t suffer from insanity I enjoy it! ... From:
    Message 1 of 13 , Oct 8, 2010
      Silicon Bronze, Copper and Silicon is it a brass or a bronze.

      An Alcemist just striring it.... ;~)

      Malcolm

      I don't suffer from insanity I enjoy it!

      --- On Wed, 10/6/10, James Ward <jamesward@...> wrote:

      From: James Ward <jamesward@...>
      Subject: Re: [hobbicast] Re: How to ID types of brass
      To: "hobbicast@yahoogroups.com" <hobbicast@yahoogroups.com>
      Date: Wednesday, October 6, 2010, 11:50 PM







       









      Remember that brass is not bronze and bronze is not brass. Both are alloys of copper, one of tin the other of zinc.



      On Oct 6, 2010, at 6:42 PM, "Lyle" <creepinogie@...> wrote:



      > That's the same way they sort it here but the problem is yellow brass can be "high strength yellow brass" (mag bronze) or leaded yellow brass, or even silicon brass and they don't always mix so you need chemicals such as silver nitrate, nitic acid, ect and a magnet doesn't hurt either as mag bronze is slightly magnetic. Anything with lead won't mix with anything with silicon. Lots of plumbing valves have silicon bronze seals and leaded yellow brass bodies so you need to be careful.

      >

      > I've found out that it's almost easier to buy certified ingot at 3 to $4/lb rather than scrounge, cut up, clean and sort scrap brass. Although about half the brass I melt is scrap.'

      >

      > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, Ron Thompson <barebooger@...> wrote:

      > >

      > > I used to work in a scrap yard. They sorted as red brass, yellow

      > > brass, copper. If a magnet stuck, it went in the #2 iron pile because it

      > > was plated steel. Your brass lamp probably falls into this last

      > > category, as do many brass beds.

      > >

      > > On 10/6/2010 5:54 PM, Nick Andrews wrote:

      > > >

      > > > So what is the best way to ID types of brass you intend to melt? I have

      > > > several sources I am collecting, such as plumbing fittings and valves, a

      > > > brass lamp, brass statues and figures, old brass pipe from the bottom of

      > > > water windmill pumps, etc.

      > > >

      > > > --

      > > > Nick A

      > > >

      > > > "You know what I wish? I wish that all the scum of the world had but a

      > > > single throat, and I had my hands about it..." Rorschach, 1975

      > > >

      > > > "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary

      > > > safety

      > > > deserve neither liberty nor safety."- Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review

      > > > of Pennsylvania, 1759

      > > >

      > > > "Suburbia is where the developer bulldozes out the trees, then names the

      > > > streets after them." Bill Vaughan

      > > >

      > > > "The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men."

      > > > Plato

      > > >

      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

      > > >

      > > >

      > >

      > > --

      > >

      > >

      > > Ron Thompson

      > > On the Beautiful Florida Space Coast, right beside the Kennedy Space Center, USA

      > >

      > > Sometimes you just gotta do what makes you smile.<GRIN>

      > >

      > > http://www.plansandprojects.com My hobby pages are here:

      > > http://www.plansandprojects.com/My%20Machines/

      > >

      > > Visit the castinghobby FAQ:

      > > http://castinghobbyfaq.bareboogerhost.com/

      > >

      > >

      > >

      > >

      > >

      > >

      > >

      > >

      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

      > >

      >

      >



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    • Lyle
      Here s what I do. I have three brass crucibles, 1 for silicon bronze, one for mag bronze, and one for scrap. When I go to the scrapyard (Gerdue here in Fargo,
      Message 2 of 13 , Oct 8, 2010
        Here's what I do. I have three brass crucibles, 1 for silicon bronze, one for mag bronze, and one for scrap. When I go to the scrapyard (Gerdue here in Fargo, (some Brazilian firm bought out Fargo metal and Iron)) I have a file, a magnet and some silver nitrate. I go to their "yellow brass" pile and grab large thicker pieces (thin pieces will oxidize too much when melting) I file off a little so it's clean and put a drop of silver nitrate on it. if it turns black, and is just barely magnetic, it's some sort of mag bronze and is good stuff. Many plumbing fittings are mag bronze. That's the stuff I use for scrap. The best scrap mag bronze is the large acme threaded rod inside of large plumbing valves such as fire hydrants. My other two crucibles are for certified ingot. Mag bronze ingots are harder and harder to get for some reason. I have been sucessful with melting mag bronze mixed with silicon bronze and silicon bronze mixed with zinc (to give it more of a yellow color and make it easier to cut. When Adding the zinc, it will flair and you will need to skim the dross and degass as the zinc wil boil. I do not use flux but I do degass with a little piece of phospher copper welding rod. You don't need to degass or flux silicon bronze at all.

        Having said all that, I don't mix leaded yellow brass with anything. It will not mix with silicon bronze at all because of the lead silicon reaction with will ruin your crucible to the point of not being able to clean it out. When I first starting doing all this I would melt pretty much anything with varied results, Brass track wedges, aluminum bronze, etc. Scrap brass is easy to find. good usable scrap is another thing. I melt more and more ingot nowdays but that's a hassle too as the place I buy it from dosen't ship and if they did, shipping would kill me so I need to drive to Minneapolis 240 miles away....

        If you have a buch of plumbing fittings, go for it but test them first with the silver nitrate.



        --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, Kerri Duncan <silverforgestudio@...> wrote:
        >
        > Lyle- I get the point for the look and sort method- would there be a difference in the alloys used for the same type of thing? I have about 20 LPG fixtures from BBQ tanks- but from different makers- would the alloy all be compatible?
        >  
        > My noob logic says those items would be spec specific for the type of use... or am I wrong here too (getting used to having to re-think things) ;)!
        >  
        > Thanks
        >
        > --- On Thu, 10/7/10, Lyle <creepinogie@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > From: Lyle <creepinogie@...>
        > Subject: [hobbicast] Re: How to ID types of brass
        > To: hobbicast@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Thursday, October 7, 2010, 7:16 PM
        >
        >
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        > Yes, but sometimes a commercial alloys are called one and actually technically another. The point I was trying to make is not all brass is compatible with other brasses. Same with bronzes. And the "sort by color" method is sure to get you in trouble.
        >
        > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, James Ward <jamesward@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Remember that brass is not bronze and bronze is not brass. Both are alloys of copper, one of tin the other of zinc.
        > >
        > > On Oct 6, 2010, at 6:42 PM, "Lyle" <creepinogie@> wrote:
        > >
        > > > That's the same way they sort it here but the problem is yellow brass can be "high strength yellow brass" (mag bronze) or leaded yellow brass, or even silicon brass and they don't always mix so you need chemicals such as silver nitrate, nitic acid, ect and a magnet doesn't hurt either as mag bronze is slightly magnetic. Anything with lead won't mix with anything with silicon. Lots of plumbing valves have silicon bronze seals and leaded yellow brass bodies so you need to be careful.
        > > >
        > > > I've found out that it's almost easier to buy certified ingot at 3 to $4/lb rather than scrounge, cut up, clean and sort scrap brass. Although about half the brass I melt is scrap.'
        > > >
        > > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, Ron Thompson <barebooger@> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > I used to work in a scrap yard. They sorted as red brass, yellow
        > > > > brass, copper. If a magnet stuck, it went in the #2 iron pile because it
        > > > > was plated steel. Your brass lamp probably falls into this last
        > > > > category, as do many brass beds.
        > > > >
        > > > > On 10/6/2010 5:54 PM, Nick Andrews wrote:
        > > > > >
        > > > > > So what is the best way to ID types of brass you intend to melt? I have
        > > > > > several sources I am collecting, such as plumbing fittings and valves, a
        > > > > > brass lamp, brass statues and figures, old brass pipe from the bottom of
        > > > > > water windmill pumps, etc.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > --
        > > > > > Nick A
        > > > > >
        > > > > > "You know what I wish? I wish that all the scum of the world had but a
        > > > > > single throat, and I had my hands about it..." Rorschach, 1975
        > > > > >
        > > > > > "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
        > > > > > safety
        > > > > > deserve neither liberty nor safety."- Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review
        > > > > > of Pennsylvania, 1759
        > > > > >
        > > > > > "Suburbia is where the developer bulldozes out the trees, then names the
        > > > > > streets after them." Bill Vaughan
        > > > > >
        > > > > > "The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men."
        > > > > > Plato
        > > > > >
        > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > --
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > Ron Thompson
        > > > > On the Beautiful Florida Space Coast, right beside the Kennedy Space Center, USA
        > > > >
        > > > > Sometimes you just gotta do what makes you smile.<GRIN>
        > > > >
        > > > > http://www.plansandprojects.com My hobby pages are here:
        > > > > http://www.plansandprojects.com/My%20Machines/
        > > > >
        > > > > Visit the castinghobby FAQ:
        > > > > http://castinghobbyfaq.bareboogerhost.com/
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
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