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Re: Cans; Where did everyone go

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  • Lyle
    Why do you need flux? LL ... crucible ... they ... can ... (e.g. ... aids ... me. ... the
    Message 1 of 18 , Mar 9, 2006
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      Why do you need flux?
      LL
      --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Horne" <chris@...> wrote:
      >
      > Ray,
      > thats very interesting..
      >
      > I have added copper to my 'canium' but not considered glass to add
      > silicon.
      >
      > How much glass would you add per Kilo?
      >
      > I have a pneumatic cylinder rigged up to crush the cans into lumps
      > that will fit in the crucible and I also add a flux made from 50%
      > sodium chloride and 50% potassium chloride.
      > The other precautions I take are to melt some ingot into the
      crucible
      > first and then melt the cans with a slightly reducing flame.
      > I'm not sure which of these has the greatest effect but together
      they
      > made a big difference, from nearly 50% dross down to about 25% dross
      > by weight and far less dissoved hydrogen in the melt.
      >
      > Chris
      >
      > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Ray" <pemby200@> wrote:
      > >
      > > First off, bash the cans (when dry) as flat as possible with a
      can
      > > crusher and/or hammer. This reduces surface oxidation.
      > >
      > > Having made some ingots with the molten cans (ie. muffin trays),
      > > remelt with some broken (clear?) glass and about 45 gm copper
      (e.g.
      > > pipe) for each kilogram of aluminum. This produces an alloy with
      > > silicon (which improves mold flow), magnesium (which reduces
      > > tarnishing) and 4% or so of copper which improves the alloy and
      aids
      > > in machining. A bit of tin etc and you would have something like
      > > aircraft aluminum 2218.
      > >
      > > Ray (Perth Australia).
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, Jeshua Lacock <jeshua@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > On Feb 27, 2006, at 7:30 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
      > > >
      > > > >> Melting Al cans is a waste of time and energy.
      > > > >
      > > > > ah. I understand now.
      > > > > too bad, since I have several truckloads worth available to
      me.
      > > Oh
      > > > > well,
      > > > > just have to take them down to the recycler one of these
      > > decades... :)
      > > >
      > > > Greetings,
      > > >
      > > > Actually, you can get good quality Aluminum, with minimal
      > > oxidization
      > > > loss, with a little care.
      > > >
      > > > The trick with cans is to start with a pool of molten aluminum
      > > (not
      > > > from cans ideally). Then you can instantaneously immerse the
      > > entire
      > > > can; mostly eliminating the surface area exposed to oxygen.
      > > >
      > > > There is garbage on the cans, obviously. The nastiest part is
      the
      > > > plastic liner, and the paint is not great either.
      > > >
      > > > And be warned, according to the Department of Environmental
      > > quality
      > > > official that visited me, melting cans is considered burning
      > > garbage
      > > > and is illegal.
      > > >
      > > > At any rate I wish I had a truck full of cans! Email me if you
      > > have
      > > > them still...
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Cheers,
      > > >
      > > > Jeshua Lacock, Owner
      > > > <http://OpenOSX.com>
      > > > phone: 877.240.1364
      > > >
      > >
      >
    • Chris Horne
      Lyle I don t know that it s needed, but it seems to help the dross seperate from the metal. Without it, there is more dross which visibly has more metal in it.
      Message 2 of 18 , Mar 9, 2006
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        Lyle

        I don't know that it's needed,
        but it seems to help the dross seperate from the metal.
        Without it, there is more dross which visibly has more metal in it.

        Chris (-=Spiyda=-)

        --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Lyle" <creepinogie@...> wrote:
        >
        > Why do you need flux?
        > LL
        > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Horne" <chris@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Ray,
        > > thats very interesting..
        > >
        > > I have added copper to my 'canium' but not considered glass to add
        > > silicon.
        > >
        > > How much glass would you add per Kilo?
        > >
        > > I have a pneumatic cylinder rigged up to crush the cans into lumps
        > > that will fit in the crucible and I also add a flux made from 50%
        > > sodium chloride and 50% potassium chloride.
        > > The other precautions I take are to melt some ingot into the
        > crucible
        > > first and then melt the cans with a slightly reducing flame.
        > > I'm not sure which of these has the greatest effect but together
        > they
        > > made a big difference, from nearly 50% dross down to about 25% dross
        > > by weight and far less dissoved hydrogen in the melt.
        > >
        > > Chris
        > >
        > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Ray" <pemby200@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > First off, bash the cans (when dry) as flat as possible with a
        > can
        > > > crusher and/or hammer. This reduces surface oxidation.
        > > >
        > > > Having made some ingots with the molten cans (ie. muffin trays),
        > > > remelt with some broken (clear?) glass and about 45 gm copper
        > (e.g.
        > > > pipe) for each kilogram of aluminum. This produces an alloy with
        > > > silicon (which improves mold flow), magnesium (which reduces
        > > > tarnishing) and 4% or so of copper which improves the alloy and
        > aids
        > > > in machining. A bit of tin etc and you would have something like
        > > > aircraft aluminum 2218.
        > > >
        > > > Ray (Perth Australia).
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, Jeshua Lacock <jeshua@> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > On Feb 27, 2006, at 7:30 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > >> Melting Al cans is a waste of time and energy.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > ah. I understand now.
        > > > > > too bad, since I have several truckloads worth available to
        > me.
        > > > Oh
        > > > > > well,
        > > > > > just have to take them down to the recycler one of these
        > > > decades... :)
        > > > >
        > > > > Greetings,
        > > > >
        > > > > Actually, you can get good quality Aluminum, with minimal
        > > > oxidization
        > > > > loss, with a little care.
        > > > >
        > > > > The trick with cans is to start with a pool of molten aluminum
        > > > (not
        > > > > from cans ideally). Then you can instantaneously immerse the
        > > > entire
        > > > > can; mostly eliminating the surface area exposed to oxygen.
        > > > >
        > > > > There is garbage on the cans, obviously. The nastiest part is
        > the
        > > > > plastic liner, and the paint is not great either.
        > > > >
        > > > > And be warned, according to the Department of Environmental
        > > > quality
        > > > > official that visited me, melting cans is considered burning
        > > > garbage
        > > > > and is illegal.
        > > > >
        > > > > At any rate I wish I had a truck full of cans! Email me if you
        > > > have
        > > > > them still...
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > Cheers,
        > > > >
        > > > > Jeshua Lacock, Owner
        > > > > <http://OpenOSX.com>
        > > > > phone: 877.240.1364
        > > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
      • Ray
        -Chris, I have a charcoal furnace (although I have been using BBQ briquettes up till now). Recently, I bought a different brand of BBQ fuel (Red Head from
        Message 3 of 18 , Mar 9, 2006
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          -Chris,

          I have a charcoal furnace (although I have been using BBQ briquettes
          up till now). Recently, I bought a different brand of BBQ fuel (Red
          Head from Shell garages in Australia) and found that it is charcoal -
          extruded in some way into chunks like big chook food pellets.

          This seems to burn much hotter and cleaner and I have read somewhere
          that charcoal has a reducing flame which can inhibit the oxidation
          (and hence the amount of dross). As aluminium (and brass) doesn't
          react with charcoal, apparently you can even add small lumps into
          the crucible to enhance the reducing atmosphere.

          As I am melting up again tonight, I intend to give that a go as the
          cans produce a fair heap of c..p that is hard to get out of the
          crucible.

          Ray
          Perth Weatern Australia


          -- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Horne" <chris@...> wrote:
          >
          > Lyle
          >
          > I don't know that it's needed,
          > but it seems to help the dross seperate from the metal.
          > Without it, there is more dross which visibly has more metal in it.
          >
          > Chris (-=Spiyda=-)
          >
          > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Lyle" <creepinogie@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Why do you need flux?
          > > LL
          > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Horne" <chris@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Ray,
          > > > thats very interesting..
          > > >
          > > > I have added copper to my 'canium' but not considered glass to
          add
          > > > silicon.
          > > >
          > > > How much glass would you add per Kilo?
          > > >
          > > > I have a pneumatic cylinder rigged up to crush the cans into
          lumps
          > > > that will fit in the crucible and I also add a flux made from
          50%
          > > > sodium chloride and 50% potassium chloride.
          > > > The other precautions I take are to melt some ingot into the
          > > crucible
          > > > first and then melt the cans with a slightly reducing flame.
          > > > I'm not sure which of these has the greatest effect but
          together
          > > they
          > > > made a big difference, from nearly 50% dross down to about 25%
          dross
          > > > by weight and far less dissoved hydrogen in the melt.
          > > >
          > > > Chris
          > > >
          > > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, "Ray" <pemby200@> wrote:
          > > > >
          > > > > First off, bash the cans (when dry) as flat as possible with
          a
          > > can
          > > > > crusher and/or hammer. This reduces surface oxidation.
          > > > >
          > > > > Having made some ingots with the molten cans (ie. muffin
          trays),
          > > > > remelt with some broken (clear?) glass and about 45 gm
          copper
          > > (e.g.
          > > > > pipe) for each kilogram of aluminum. This produces an alloy
          with
          > > > > silicon (which improves mold flow), magnesium (which reduces
          > > > > tarnishing) and 4% or so of copper which improves the alloy
          and
          > > aids
          > > > > in machining. A bit of tin etc and you would have something
          like
          > > > > aircraft aluminum 2218.
          > > > >
          > > > > Ray (Perth Australia).
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > --- In hobbicast@yahoogroups.com, Jeshua Lacock <jeshua@>
          wrote:
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > > > On Feb 27, 2006, at 7:30 PM, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
          > > > > >
          > > > > > >> Melting Al cans is a waste of time and energy.
          > > > > > >
          > > > > > > ah. I understand now.
          > > > > > > too bad, since I have several truckloads worth available
          to
          > > me.
          > > > > Oh
          > > > > > > well,
          > > > > > > just have to take them down to the recycler one of these
          > > > > decades... :)
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Greetings,
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Actually, you can get good quality Aluminum, with minimal
          > > > > oxidization
          > > > > > loss, with a little care.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > The trick with cans is to start with a pool of molten
          aluminum
          > > > > (not
          > > > > > from cans ideally). Then you can instantaneously immerse
          the
          > > > > entire
          > > > > > can; mostly eliminating the surface area exposed to oxygen.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > There is garbage on the cans, obviously. The nastiest part
          is
          > > the
          > > > > > plastic liner, and the paint is not great either.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > And be warned, according to the Department of
          Environmental
          > > > > quality
          > > > > > official that visited me, melting cans is considered
          burning
          > > > > garbage
          > > > > > and is illegal.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > At any rate I wish I had a truck full of cans! Email me if
          you
          > > > > have
          > > > > > them still...
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Cheers,
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Jeshua Lacock, Owner
          > > > > > <http://OpenOSX.com>
          > > > > > phone: 877.240.1364
          > > > > >
          > > > >
          > > >
          > >
          >
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