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Re: Immunosuppression vs. Immunomodulation

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  • john_scott107
    In my simple, layman s approach to this, I just think of helminths as normalising or balancing our immune responses, turning some things up and others down,
    Message 1 of 5 , Apr 17 11:50 AM
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      In my simple, layman's approach to this, I just think of helminths as "normalising" or balancing our immune responses, turning some things up and others down, in order to keep us well for as long as possible so that we can be productive hosts for our wriggly guests.

      It's easy to get lost in the minutiae of what helminths might be doing, and paranoid that some of this might be somehow harmful to us, but it seems to me that whatever they are doing - at least while they're in small numbers - is likely to be to our benefit.

      A parasite said to its host,
      "Though I'm not trying to boast,
      My favourite trick
      Is making you sick,
      So your health will be better than most".

      --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "donnabeales" <dbeales@...> wrote:
      >
      > I second Marc's distinction between immunosuppression and immunomodulation. He took me (gently!) to task about this awhile ago, and it has since been a reminder to me to be more precise in language.
      >
      > The problem is, even top scientists don't seem to recognize a distinction between the two terms. I ran across it again just recently in a professional HT paper, sorry cite is escaping me at the moment… I read too much.
      >
      > In layman's terms, what we're talking about is this. HT might be thought of as being like a sound system. You can turn up the bass and lower the treble, and you can adjust which speaker the sound comes out of to balance what you're hearing. Not too get too technical with the analogy and detract from the point, which is that helminths may also turn up parts of the immune system in ways that are beneficial as well as damp them down when they get out of control.
      >
      > Specifically speaking, I am IgA deficient, and I had IgA levels within normal limits for the first time in two decades when I hosted HW. It was a shock to realize that I haven't had a cold all winter this year! But it's really hard to say if that's due to HT because I've been uncolonized (is that a word?) for over a year.
      >
      > I'm trying (with great struggle) to compose my thoughts about this into a paper because I think this is a very important aspect of HT that has been overlooked in the deluge of papers on "immunosuppressive" aspects of treatment.
      >
    • don
      Love the Limerick John.
      Message 2 of 5 , Apr 17 3:38 PM
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        Love the Limerick John.

        --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "john_scott107" <j.scott.164@...> wrote:
        >
        > In my simple, layman's approach to this, I just think of helminths as "normalising" or balancing our immune responses, turning some things up and others down, in order to keep us well for as long as possible so that we can be productive hosts for our wriggly guests.
        >
        > It's easy to get lost in the minutiae of what helminths might be doing, and paranoid that some of this might be somehow harmful to us, but it seems to me that whatever they are doing - at least while they're in small numbers - is likely to be to our benefit.
        >
        > A parasite said to its host,
        > "Though I'm not trying to boast,
        > My favourite trick
        > Is making you sick,
        > So your health will be better than most".
        >
        > --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "donnabeales" <dbeales@> wrote:
        > >
        > > I second Marc's distinction between immunosuppression and immunomodulation. He took me (gently!) to task about this awhile ago, and it has since been a reminder to me to be more precise in language.
        > >
        > > The problem is, even top scientists don't seem to recognize a distinction between the two terms. I ran across it again just recently in a professional HT paper, sorry cite is escaping me at the moment… I read too much.
        > >
        > > In layman's terms, what we're talking about is this. HT might be thought of as being like a sound system. You can turn up the bass and lower the treble, and you can adjust which speaker the sound comes out of to balance what you're hearing. Not too get too technical with the analogy and detract from the point, which is that helminths may also turn up parts of the immune system in ways that are beneficial as well as damp them down when they get out of control.
        > >
        > > Specifically speaking, I am IgA deficient, and I had IgA levels within normal limits for the first time in two decades when I hosted HW. It was a shock to realize that I haven't had a cold all winter this year! But it's really hard to say if that's due to HT because I've been uncolonized (is that a word?) for over a year.
        > >
        > > I'm trying (with great struggle) to compose my thoughts about this into a paper because I think this is a very important aspect of HT that has been overlooked in the deluge of papers on "immunosuppressive" aspects of treatment.
        > >
        >
      • Alberto
        Your poem explains why and how inflamation is sometimes good for the body ; the problem appears when it becomes chronic . Good job we have the helminthics to
        Message 3 of 5 , Apr 18 2:03 AM
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          Your poem explains why and how inflamation is sometimes good for the body ; the problem appears when it becomes chronic . Good job we have the helminthics to help us eventually.

          --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "john_scott107" <j.scott.164@...> wrote:
          >
          > In my simple, layman's approach to this, I just think of helminths as "normalising" or balancing our immune responses, turning some things up and others down, in order to keep us well for as long as possible so that we can be productive hosts for our wriggly guests.
          >
          > It's easy to get lost in the minutiae of what helminths might be doing, and paranoid that some of this might be somehow harmful to us, but it seems to me that whatever they are doing - at least while they're in small numbers - is likely to be to our benefit.
          >
          > A parasite said to its host,
          > "Though I'm not trying to boast,
          > My favourite trick
          > Is making you sick,
          > So your health will be better than most".
          >
          > --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "donnabeales" <dbeales@> wrote:
          > >
          > > I second Marc's distinction between immunosuppression and immunomodulation. He took me (gently!) to task about this awhile ago, and it has since been a reminder to me to be more precise in language.
          > >
          > > The problem is, even top scientists don't seem to recognize a distinction between the two terms. I ran across it again just recently in a professional HT paper, sorry cite is escaping me at the moment… I read too much.
          > >
          > > In layman's terms, what we're talking about is this. HT might be thought of as being like a sound system. You can turn up the bass and lower the treble, and you can adjust which speaker the sound comes out of to balance what you're hearing. Not too get too technical with the analogy and detract from the point, which is that helminths may also turn up parts of the immune system in ways that are beneficial as well as damp them down when they get out of control.
          > >
          > > Specifically speaking, I am IgA deficient, and I had IgA levels within normal limits for the first time in two decades when I hosted HW. It was a shock to realize that I haven't had a cold all winter this year! But it's really hard to say if that's due to HT because I've been uncolonized (is that a word?) for over a year.
          > >
          > > I'm trying (with great struggle) to compose my thoughts about this into a paper because I think this is a very important aspect of HT that has been overlooked in the deluge of papers on "immunosuppressive" aspects of treatment.
          > >
          >
        • T C
          Thanks for clarifying the distinction between immunosuppression and immunomodulation. I often use the terms moderate and/or modulate when explaining how HT
          Message 4 of 5 , Apr 18 5:53 AM
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            Thanks for clarifying the distinction between immunosuppression and immunomodulation. I often use the terms "moderate" and/or "modulate" when explaining how HT works; the layman that I am. The music analogy helps a lot. 
            I love the poem. I think we should develop a few limericks! LOL:)

            On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 5:03 AM, Alberto <albertorivas100@...> wrote:
             

            Your poem explains why and how inflamation is sometimes good for the body ; the problem appears when it becomes chronic . Good job we have the helminthics to help us eventually.

            --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "john_scott107" <j.scott.164@...> wrote:
            >
            > In my simple, layman's approach to this, I just think of helminths as "normalising" or balancing our immune responses, turning some things up and others down, in order to keep us well for as long as possible so that we can be productive hosts for our wriggly guests.
            >
            > It's easy to get lost in the minutiae of what helminths might be doing, and paranoid that some of this might be somehow harmful to us, but it seems to me that whatever they are doing - at least while they're in small numbers - is likely to be to our benefit.
            >
            > A parasite said to its host,
            > "Though I'm not trying to boast,
            > My favourite trick
            > Is making you sick,
            > So your health will be better than most".
            >
            > --- In helminthictherapy@yahoogroups.com, "donnabeales" <dbeales@> wrote:
            > >
            > > I second Marc's distinction between immunosuppression and immunomodulation. He took me (gently!) to task about this awhile ago, and it has since been a reminder to me to be more precise in language.
            > >
            > > The problem is, even top scientists don't seem to recognize a distinction between the two terms. I ran across it again just recently in a professional HT paper, sorry cite is escaping me at the moment… I read too much.
            > >
            > > In layman's terms, what we're talking about is this. HT might be thought of as being like a sound system. You can turn up the bass and lower the treble, and you can adjust which speaker the sound comes out of to balance what you're hearing. Not too get too technical with the analogy and detract from the point, which is that helminths may also turn up parts of the immune system in ways that are beneficial as well as damp them down when they get out of control.
            > >
            > > Specifically speaking, I am IgA deficient, and I had IgA levels within normal limits for the first time in two decades when I hosted HW. It was a shock to realize that I haven't had a cold all winter this year! But it's really hard to say if that's due to HT because I've been uncolonized (is that a word?) for over a year.
            > >
            > > I'm trying (with great struggle) to compose my thoughts about this into a paper because I think this is a very important aspect of HT that has been overlooked in the deluge of papers on "immunosuppressive" aspects of treatment.
            > >
            >


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