- Dear Group,A way that we can recognize what a thing is, is through consciousness. That is, consciousness is a necessary condition for recognizing things. Consciousness structures the thing. The thing thus takes on its own conceived form and is subject to the imperfections of what things appear to be, but are not what they seem. Consciousness thus exercises an experience, a being for itself. This is an absolute negation, overcoming itself; that is, to have, in this cognitive sense, its essence in another. The point is that since being for itself negates all other being, it negates its own self, simply because it is in the mode of negation, and that its own essence is to be found in the determinations of other things. This indicates that no determinate being is just for itself, but is dependent upon the characteristics of other beings.Regards,Bob Fanelli
Bob, is consciousness something? Is your consciousness something?
Is a sunset that seems red a thing that appears red to consciousness? Is there a scientific explanation for this appearing-red-thing? Isn't this appearing red a property of the singular red sunset, namely that it can appear red to some?
"Ideality can be called the quality of the infinite; but it is essentially the process of becoming, and hence a transition – like the transition of becoming into existence. We must now explicate this transition. This immanent turning back, as the sublating of finitude – that is, of finitude as such and equally of the negative finitude that only stands opposite to it, is only negative finitude – is self-reference, being. Since there is negation in this being, the latter is existence; but, further, since the negation is essentially negation of the negation, self-referring negation, it is the existence that carries the name of being-for-itself." (SL, di Giovanni, 120)"First, being-for-itself is immediately an existent-for-itself, the one.Second, the one passes over into a multiplicity of ones – repulsion or the otherness of the one which sublates itself into its ideality, attraction.Third, we have the alternating determination of repulsion and attraction in which the two sink into a state of equilibrium; and quality, driven to a head in being-for-itself, passes over into quantity." (SL, di Giovanni, 126)Reading sublation where you have negation works miracles.
As a moment of the whole, any finite existence reflects (true) infinity and is for itself with other beings.
Bill
Everything speaks in its own way. (Bloom)
This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly prohibited.From: hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of robert fanelli robertfanelli2001@... [hegel] <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2018 3:12:43 PM
To: Hegel Hegel; Chris Fanelli
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan; Paul Castrataro; michael peliogrino; Cory; Darin Lee; gregory gregory; rob rob; rob; Hilary; Jayne Fanelli; Joe Colombo; kevin christiano; Mark Burrell; mike chappelle; gym teacher; shawn wood; todd cornish; Ted Humphrey; vinnie; Katherine
Subject: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126Unsubscribe
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Dear Group,A way that we can recognize what a thing is, is through consciousness. That is, consciousness is a necessary condition for recognizing things. Consciousness structures the thing. The thing thus takes on its own conceived form and is subject to the imperfections of what things appear to be, but are not what they seem. Consciousness thus exercises an experience, a being for itself. This is an absolute negation, overcoming itself; that is, to have, in this cognitive sense, its essence in another. The point is that since being for itself negates all other being, it negates its own self, simply because it is in the mode of negation, and that its own essence is to be found in the determinations of other things. This indicates that no determinate being is just for itself, but is dependent upon the characteristics of other beings.
Regards,
Bob Fanelli
In the first quite compressed passage Hegel is playing off the dual sense of a negation of negation.
The first sense exhibits what he calls “this immanent turning back” as a process in which what persists is paradoxically the vanishing of finitude.
The second sense expresses what has been captured as existent which is being as self-referring which is then tagged as being-for-self.
Being-for-self is the double sense of the negation of the negation in that it is a fixed reference to an infinite turning of thought upon itself.
It is the motion at rest or the motion determined and thus given an intelligible designation, something that the motion as indeterminate or equivocal lacks.
Unfortunately, “sublation” being poorly glossed by Hegel scholars is taken by Hegel skeptics as that point when Hegel miraculously pulls a rabbit out of his hat.
- Alan
From: hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, December 10, 2018 11:05 AM
To: Chris Fanelli <fanellichris@...>; hegel@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan <bquinlan@...>; Paul Castrataro <comatunes@...>; michael peliogrino <consultmgp@...>; Cory <ctarp@...>; Darin Lee <dleet93@...>; gregory gregory <falon@...>; rob rob <fanelli20@...>; rob rob <fanelli20@...>; Hilary <hilarytarpenning@...>; Jayne Fanelli <jfanelli6@...>; Joe Colombo <josephcol@...>; kevin christiano <kchristiano47@...>; Mark Burrell <marktacit@...>; mike chappelle <mdchappelle@...>; gym teacher <Mgertner32669@...>; shawn wood <shawn.wood@...>; todd cornish <tcornish@...>; Ted Humphrey <tedhumphrey@...>; vinnie <vmazz1@...>; Katherine <wkbyphone@...>
Subject: Re: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126Bob, is consciousness something? Is your consciousness something?
Is a sunset that seems red a thing that appears red to consciousness? Is there a scientific explanation for this appearing-red-thing? Isn't this appearing red a property of the singular red sunset, namely that it can appear red to some?
"Ideality can be called the quality of the infinite; but it is essentially the process of becoming, and hence a transition – like the transition of becoming into existence. We must now explicate this transition. This immanent turning back, as the sublating of finitude – that is, of finitude as such and equally of the negative finitude that only stands opposite to it, is only negative finitude – is self-reference, being. Since there is negation in this being, the latter is existence; but, further, since the negation is essentially negation of the negation, self-referring negation, it is the existence that carries the name of being-for-itself." (SL, di Giovanni, 120)
"First, being-for-itself is immediately an existent-for-itself, the one.
Second, the one passes over into a multiplicity of ones – repulsion or the otherness of the one which sublates itself into its ideality, attraction.
Third, we have the alternating determination of repulsion and attraction in which the two sink into a state of equilibrium; and quality, driven to a head in being-for-itself, passes over into quantity." (SL, di Giovanni, 126)
Reading sublation where you have negation works miracles.
As a moment of the whole, any finite existence reflects (true) infinity and is for itself with other beings..
Bill
Everything speaks in its own way. (Bloom)
This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly prohibited.
From: hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of robert fanelli robertfanelli2001@... [hegel] <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2018 3:12:43 PM
To: Hegel Hegel; Chris Fanelli
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan; Paul Castrataro; michael peliogrino; Cory; Darin Lee; gregory gregory; rob rob; rob; Hilary; Jayne Fanelli; Joe Colombo; kevin christiano; Mark Burrell; mike chappelle; gym teacher; shawn wood; todd cornish; Ted Humphrey; vinnie; Katherine
Subject: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126Unsubscribe
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Dear Group,
A way that we can recognize what a thing is, is through consciousness. That is, consciousness is a necessary condition for recognizing things. Consciousness structures the thing. The thing thus takes on its own conceived form and is subject to the imperfections of what things appear to be, but are not what they seem. Consciousness thus exercises an experience, a being for itself. This is an absolute negation, overcoming itself; that is, to have, in this cognitive sense, its essence in another. The point is that since being for itself negates all other being, it negates its own self, simply because it is in the mode of negation, and that its own essence is to be found in the determinations of other things. This indicates that no determinate being is just for itself, but is dependent upon the characteristics of other beings.
Regards,
Bob Fanelli
Probably varies.
Bill
Everything speaks in its own way. (Bloom)
This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly prohibited.From: Joe&Anne <josephcol@...>
Sent: Monday, December 10, 2018 10:44:13 AM
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Subject: Re: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126How much gibberish can one stand?!
Joe
-----Original Message-----
From: bill. hord <bill.hord@...>
To: Chris Fanelli <fanellichris@...>; hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan <bquinlan@...>; Paul Castrataro <comatunes@...>; michael peliogrino <consultmgp@...>; Cory <ctarp@...>; Darin Lee <dleet93@...>; gregory gregory <falon@...>; rob rob <fanelli20@...>; rob rob <fanelli20@...>; Hilary <hilarytarpenning@...>; Jayne Fanelli <jfanelli6@...>; Joe Colombo <josephcol@...>; kevin christiano <kchristiano47@...>; Mark Burrell <marktacit@...>; mike chappelle <mdchappelle@...>; gym teacher <Mgertner32669@...>; shawn wood <shawn.wood@...>; todd cornish <tcornish@...>; Ted Humphrey <tedhumphrey@...>; vinnie <vmazz1@...>; Katherine <wkbyphone@...>
Sent: Mon, Dec 10, 2018 11:05 am
Subject: Re: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126
Bob, is consciousness something? Is your consciousness something?Is a sunset that seems red a thing that appears red to consciousness? Is there a scientific explanation for this appearing-red-thing? Isn't this appearing red a property of the singular red sunset, namely that it can appear red to some?"Ideality can be called the quality of the infinite; but it is essentially the process of becoming, and hence a transition – like the transition of becoming into existence. We must now explicate this transition. This immanent turning back, as the sublating of finitude – that is, of finitude as such and equally of the negative finitude that only stands opposite to it, is only negative finitude – is self-reference, being. Since there is negation in this being, the latter is existence; but, further, since the negation is essentially negation of the negation, self-referring negation, it is the existence that carries the name of being-for-itself." (SL, di Giovanni, 120)"First, being-for-itself is immediately an existent-for-itself, the one.Second, the one passes over into a multiplicity of ones – repulsion or the otherness of the one which sublates itself into its ideality, attraction.Third, we have the alternating determination of repulsion and attraction in which the two sink into a state of equilibrium; and quality, driven to a head in being-for-itself, passes over into quantity." (SL, di Giovanni, 126)Reading sublation where you have negation works miracles.As a moment of the whole, any finite existence reflects (true) infinity and is for itself with other beings.Bill
Everything speaks in its own way. (Bloom)This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly prohibited.From: hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of robert fanelli robertfanelli2001@... [hegel] <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2018 3:12:43 PM
To: Hegel Hegel; Chris Fanelli
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan; Paul Castrataro; michael peliogrino; Cory; Darin Lee; gregory gregory; rob rob; rob; Hilary; Jayne Fanelli; Joe Colombo; kevin christiano; Mark Burrell; mike chappelle; gym teacher; shawn wood; todd cornish; Ted Humphrey; vinnie; Katherine
Subject: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126UnsubscribeIt appears that you have subscribed to commercial messages from this sender. To stop receiving such messages from this sender, please unsubscribe
Dear Group,A way that we can recognize what a thing is, is through consciousness. That is, consciousness is a necessary condition for recognizing things. Consciousness structures the thing. The thing thus takes on its own conceived form and is subject to the imperfections of what things appear to be, but are not what they seem. Consciousness thus exercises an experience, a being for itself. This is an absolute negation, overcoming itself; that is, to have, in this cognitive sense, its essence in another. The point is that since being for itself negates all other being, it negates its own self, simply because it is in the mode of negation, and that its own essence is to be found in the determinations of other things. This indicates that no determinate being is just for itself, but is dependent upon the characteristics of other beings.
Regards,
Bob Fanelli
- Joe,Thanks for your response. At least you are reading it. Excuse the pun, but I don't think you have the spirit of Hegel in your sights.However, it's interesting how close you came to agreeing with Hegel when you referred to the ontology of the universe containing 'matter, energy, and information.' This may easily be equated to Nature, Logos, and with a little stretch, Spirit itself. Of course Hegel would add, that the universe also includes consciousness, and he would add, God not only in the mixture as modes of determinate finite being, but well beyond as absolute Being. I consider your comment to be one of considerable insight and its striking how similar it is to Hegel's main thesis.I have been studying the pros and cons of evolution and hopefully will have some comments to make, but I want to spend some more time on the various texts. There are some missing enthymemes is some of the theses.If you wish, I will not send you anymore Hegelian analyses. Please let me know.Regards,BobOn Monday, December 10, 2018 12:11 PM, "bill.hord bill.hord@... [hegel]" <hegel@yahoogroups.com> wrote:Probably varies.Bill
Everything speaks in its own way. (Bloom)This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly prohibited.From: Joe&Anne <josephcol@...>
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Subject: Re: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126How much gibberish can one stand?!
Joe
-----Original Message-----
From: bill. hord <bill.hord@...>
To: Chris Fanelli <fanellichris@...>; hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan <bquinlan@...>; Paul Castrataro <comatunes@...>; michael peliogrino <consultmgp@...>; Cory <ctarp@...>; Darin Lee <dleet93@...>; gregory gregory <falon@...>; rob rob <fanelli20@...>; rob rob <fanelli20@...>; Hilary <hilarytarpenning@...>; Jayne Fanelli <jfanelli6@...>; Joe Colombo <josephcol@aol..com>; kevin christiano <kchristiano47@...>; Mark Burrell <marktacit@...>; mike chappelle <mdchappelle@...>; gym teacher <Mgertner32669@...>; shawn wood <shawn.wood@...>; todd cornish <tcornish@...>; Ted Humphrey <tedhumphrey@...>; vinnie <vmazz1@...>; Katherine <wkbyphone@...>
Sent: Mon, Dec 10, 2018 11:05 am
Subject: Re: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126
Bob, is consciousness something? Is your consciousness something?Is a sunset that seems red a thing that appears red to consciousness? Is there a scientific explanation for this appearing-red-thing? Isn't this appearing red a property of the singular red sunset, namely that it can appear red to some?"Ideality can be called the quality of the infinite; but it is essentially the process of becoming, and hence a transition – like the transition of becoming into existence. We must now explicate this transition. This immanent turning back, as the sublating of finitude – that is, of finitude as such and equally of the negative finitude that only stands opposite to it, is only negative finitude – is self-reference, being. Since there is negation in this being, the latter is existence; but, further, since the negation is essentially negation of the negation, self-referring negation, it is the existence that carries the name of being-for-itself." (SL, di Giovanni, 120)"First, being-for-itself is immediately an existent-for-itself, the one.Second, the one passes over into a multiplicity of ones – repulsion or the otherness of the one which sublates itself into its ideality, attraction.Third, we have the alternating determination of repulsion and attraction in which the two sink into a state of equilibrium; and quality, driven to a head in being-for-itself, passes over into quantity." (SL, di Giovanni, 126)Reading sublation where you have negation works miracles.As a moment of the whole, any finite existence reflects (true) infinity and is for itself with other beings.Bill
Everything speaks in its own way. (Bloom)This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly prohibited.From: hegel@yahoogroups.com <hegel@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of robert fanelli robertfanelli2001@... [hegel] <hegel@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2018 3:12:43 PM
To: Hegel Hegel; Chris Fanelli
Cc: Brian 2 quinlan; Paul Castrataro; michael peliogrino; Cory; Darin Lee; gregory gregory; rob rob; rob; Hilary; Jayne Fanelli; Joe Colombo; kevin christiano; Mark Burrell; mike chappelle; gym teacher; shawn wood; todd cornish; Ted Humphrey; vinnie; Katherine
Subject: [hegel] Hegel's Phenomenology of Spirit Perception # 126UnsubscribeIt appears that you have subscribed to commercial messages from this sender. To stop receiving such messages from this sender, please unsubscribe
Dear Group,A way that we can recognize what a thing is, is through consciousness. That is, consciousness is a necessary condition for recognizing things. Consciousness structures the thing. The thing thus takes on its own conceived form and is subject to the imperfections of what things appear to be, but are not what they seem. Consciousness thus exercises an experience, a being for itself. This is an absolute negation, overcoming itself; that is, to have, in this cognitive sense, its essence in another. The point is that since being for itself negates all other being, it negates its own self, simply because it is in the mode of negation, and that its own essence is to be found in the determinations of other things. This indicates that no determinate being is just for itself, but is dependent upon the characteristics of other beings.
Regards,
Bob Fanelli
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