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Needle Holes and fabric

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  • geoflyfisher
    Good morning to all who are reading the thread on needle holes. Rosaleen and I have traded notes under several topic names, this one may be more descriptive.
    Message 1 of 3 , Apr 3, 2003
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      Good morning to all who are reading the thread on needle holes.
      Rosaleen and I have traded notes under several topic names, this one
      may be more descriptive.

      The underlying fabric in silnylon is ripstop. But with the silicone
      in it the stuff does not act much like ripstop. It is really strong
      for its weight. However, when the edge of silnylon is cut with a
      pair of scissors, it does not fray at all. AT ALL!

      The holes made by seams I have removed in silnylon look just like
      paper perforations... just like tyveck. BTW, the tyveck does look
      like it is pressed fiber, like paper. It is not woven. Some tyveck
      (like that used in envelopes) has a tendency to separate in one
      direction, so I presume the fibers in the mat are oriented mostly in
      a direction parallel to those tears.

      <>< aka Flyfisher aka geoflyfisher aka Rick aka radiohiker

      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, rosaleen43@a... wrote:
      > Hi, "Geoflyfisher,"
      >
      > Thanks for the response. I have a couple of comments, inserted
      below.
      > >
      > > From: "geoflyfisher" <geoflyfisher@y...>
      > > Subject: Re: Near Disaster! "Autopsy" Results
      > >
      > > Hi Rosaleen,
      > >
      > > Great points in your post (pun intended ;) )
      > >
      > > The hammock material which failed was uncoated ripstop nylon. I
      was
      > > using a standard sewing machine needle... not ball point, not
      > > cutting needle, just sharp... When I made the bar tack, I had
      just
      > > sewn dozens of feet of hook and also loop velcro, which tends to
      > > cause burrs on the needle occasionally.
      > >
      > > I believe that ripstop nylon would be less likely to be weakened
      by
      > > sewing than silnylon is. The silicone stablizes the fabric
      thread
      > > and may allow it to be cut by a needle when regular woven cloth
      > > threads would be allowed to be separated by the needle.
      > >
      > ##### I believe most of the silnylon that I've seen is also
      ripstop, but it
      > was a finer denier (thinner) than most polyester or nylon ripstops
      that I've
      > seen. I've only done a very little sewing with silnylon, so far.
      I really
      > don't know whether to expect the fibers to be pushed aside by
      either a ball
      > point or woven point needle, if it matters at all, or if we really
      need the
      > finest, cleanest possible holes, or the optimum spacing to further
      reduce
      > further weakening, and hope the silicone will stabilize the fabric
      to stop
      > fraying or other problems. I would rather not find out the hard
      way!
      >
      >
      > > For this reason, silnylon and tyvek may have some inherent
      weakness
      > > for the weight supporting part of hammock making which the woven
      > > ripstop does not.
      > >
      > ####### I suspect the main concerns here would be the thickness,
      leading to
      > the strength of the materials, and whether or not they have weak
      spots from
      > stitching lines. If the fabric behaves as if it were perforated,
      as opposed
      > to sewn , I infer a big problem. I don't know if Tyvek is spun or
      woven.
      > It seems almost pressed, like paper. We all have seen perforated
      paper, and
      > what the perforations are for. I think most fabrics fit
      either "woven" or
      > "knitted." So, I think you are trying to distinguish between
      silnylon and
      > non-silnylon fabrics. Sport cloth seems to refer to a range of
      (mostly)
      > nylon fabrics, of varying deniers, coatings or non coatings, etc.,
      in my
      > local fabric shops. Unfortunately, no one around here seems to
      carry
      > silnylon, or other materials desirable to the lightweight crowd.
      Silnylon
      > comes in different deniers, too. I'm pretty sure the body and fly
      of my
      > Hennessy Asym Ultralight is silnylon. I will have to look closely
      to see if
      > it is ripstop.
      >
      > > I pointed out what I did to allow others to avoid over sewing the
      > > velcro at such a vulnerable location. As Ed Speer noted, it is
      > > likely the many needle punctures of the material which caused
      > > weakness instead of strength.
      > >
      > > I picked that up before, and think it is a good point to keep in
      mind.
      > > Maybe save bartacks for flexible, stretchable materials like
      denim for
      > > jeans?
      > >
      > > Cheers,
      > >
      > > Rosaleen
    • rosaleen43@aol.com
      In a message dated 4/3/2003 8:30:47 PM Eastern Standard Time,
      Message 2 of 3 , Apr 3, 2003
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        In a message dated 4/3/2003 8:30:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com writes:
        Flyfisher-

        Most of us who sew have had an occasion to rip out a seam.  The needle holes can be steamed out by pressing.  This would likely present a bit of a problem with silnylon.  I'll have to try pressing some silnylon between sheets of aluminum foil to see how it acts.  At lest we know that we can plug those holes with thinned silicone sealer, if necessary,

        Rosaleen






          From: "geoflyfisher" <geoflyfisher@...>
        Subject: Needle Holes and fabric

        Good morning to all who are reading the thread on needle holes. 
        Rosaleen and I have traded notes under several topic names, this one
        may be more descriptive.

        The underlying fabric in silnylon is ripstop.  But with the silicone
        in it the stuff does not act much like ripstop.  It is really strong
        for its weight.  However, when the edge of silnylon is cut with a
        pair of scissors, it does not fray at all.  AT ALL! 

        The holes made by seams I have removed in silnylon look just like
        paper perforations...  just like tyveck.  BTW, the tyveck does look
        like it is pressed fiber, like paper.  It is not woven.  Some tyveck
        (like that used in envelopes) has a tendency to separate in one
        direction, so I presume the fibers in the mat are oriented mostly in
        a direction parallel to those tears.



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