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My hammock

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  • Matthew Takeda
    I went motorcycle camping with some friends this weekend and actually remembered to bring a camera, so I took a few pictures of my hammock. They re at:
    Message 1 of 13 , Sep 13, 2004
      I went motorcycle camping with some friends this weekend and actually
      remembered to bring a camera, so I took a few pictures of my hammock.
      They're at:

      <http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/the_joat/album?.dir=afa4>

      Matthew Takeda
      the JOAT
    • Rick
      ... Interesting... My hammock does not hang in that much of a U shape when I am comfortable. Rick
      Message 2 of 13 , Sep 13, 2004
        Matthew Takeda wrote:

        >I went motorcycle camping with some friends this weekend and actually
        >remembered to bring a camera, so I took a few pictures of my hammock.
        >They're at:
        >
        ><http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/the_joat/album?.dir=afa4>
        >
        >Matthew Takeda
        >the JOAT
        >
        >
        >
        Interesting...

        My hammock does not hang in that much of a U shape when I am comfortable.

        Rick
      • Craig Stephanski
        It appears that his hammock is between 2 very widely spaced trees, that might account for the amount of sag. ... Interesting... My hammock does not hang in
        Message 3 of 13 , Sep 13, 2004
          It appears that his hammock is between 2 very widely spaced trees,  that might account for the amount of sag.

          Rick <ra1@...> wrote:
          Matthew Takeda wrote:

          >I went motorcycle camping with some friends this weekend and actually
          >remembered to bring a camera, so I took a few pictures of my hammock.
          >They're at:
          >
          ><http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/the_joat/album?.dir=afa4>
          >
          >Matthew Takeda
          >the JOAT
          >

          >
          Interesting...

          My hammock does not hang in that much of a U shape when I am comfortable.

          Rick



        • Coy
          thanks for sharing Matthew. In the first pic it look like you could roast something in the hammock (looks like it is right over the fire ring/grate). In
          Message 4 of 13 , Sep 13, 2004
            thanks for sharing Matthew. In the first pic it look like you
            could roast something in the hammock (looks like it is right over
            the fire ring/grate). In the 3rd pic the hammock is mighty close to
            the ground. I have set up that close myself but usually try to get
            a little higher. I saw where Craig mention the trees are pretty far
            apart. that does make getting higher difficult. you can tie as
            high as you can reach but thats about it (well with a motorcycle you
            could stand on the seat and reach higher).

            Coy Boy

            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Matthew Takeda <takeda@s...>
            wrote:
            > I went motorcycle camping with some friends this weekend and
            actually
            > remembered to bring a camera, so I took a few pictures of my
            hammock.
            > They're at:
            >
            > <http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/the_joat/album?.dir=afa4>
            >
            > Matthew Takeda
            > the JOAT
          • Matthew Takeda
            ... There are a couple of reasons for that. First, it was morning, so there may have been a bit of accumulated sag during the night. Second, it s the first
            Message 5 of 13 , Sep 13, 2004
              Risk wrote:
              >Interesting...
              >
              >My hammock does not hang in that much of a U shape when I am comfortable.

              There are a couple of reasons for that. First, it was morning, so there may
              have been a bit of accumulated sag during the night. Second, it's the first
              time I've set it up with a fixed ridgeline, so I'm still working out the
              optimum length for that. Third, I was starting to take it down when I
              remembered to get out the camera, so I may not have tied it back up as
              tightly as it was when I was in it. All I can say is that it was quite
              comfortable when I was in it.

              Also, you can't really see the hammock body too well. It's blue, about the
              same color as my sleeping bag. The gray part is a silnylon "capsule" or
              bivy that goes around it. The bug netting tends to hang down near my face,
              so I'm going to try putting in some spring wire from one of those
              spring-type auto windshield shades to make it bow away from me.

              Matthew Takeda
              the JOAT
            • Adrnlnjnky
              Matthew, How do you connect your hammock to the ridge line? I have taken to using a prussic and that makes the adjustment very easy. ... From: Matthew Takeda
              Message 6 of 13 , Sep 14, 2004
                Matthew,

                How do you connect your hammock to the ridge line?

                I have taken to using a prussic and that makes the adjustment very easy.



                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Matthew Takeda <takeda@...>
                Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 18:32:21 -0700
                Subject: [Hammock Camping] Re: My hammock
                To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                Risk wrote:
                >Interesting...
                >
                >My hammock does not hang in that much of a U shape when I am comfortable.

                There are a couple of reasons for that. First, it was morning, so there may
                have been a bit of accumulated sag during the night. Second, it's the first
                time I've set it up with a fixed ridgeline, so I'm still working out the
                optimum length for that. Third, I was starting to take it down when I
                remembered to get out the camera, so I may not have tied it back up as
                tightly as it was when I was in it. All I can say is that it was quite
                comfortable when I was in it.

                Also, you can't really see the hammock body too well. It's blue, about the
                same color as my sleeping bag. The gray part is a silnylon "capsule" or
                bivy that goes around it. The bug netting tends to hang down near my face,
                so I'm going to try putting in some spring wire from one of those
                spring-type auto windshield shades to make it bow away from me.

                Matthew Takeda
                the JOAT





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                --
                Tom Peltier
                Pura Vida

                Were we directed from Washington when to sow, and when to reap, we
                should soon want bread.
                Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, 1821
              • Matthew Takeda
                ... I can see how it would make adjusting the position of the ridgeline on the suspension line easy, but I m happy with that. I m only adjusting the length of
                Message 7 of 13 , Sep 15, 2004
                  Tom Peltier wrote:
                  >How do you connect your hammock to the ridge line?
                  >
                  >I have taken to using a prussic and that makes the adjustment very easy.

                  I can see how it would make adjusting the position of the ridgeline on the
                  suspension line easy, but I'm happy with that. I'm only adjusting the
                  length of the ridgeline right now. For the connection, I've tried several
                  things, including prussiks, 'biners, and various hitches. I've also tried
                  making the ridgeline continuous between the trees and hanging the
                  suspension lines below it, instead of attaching the ridgeline between the
                  suspension lines. In the pictures, there are butterfly loops in the
                  suspension lines and the ridgeline has a midshipman's hitch at each end.
                  I'll probably try long splices next, since that would preserve more of the
                  strength of the line (1/4" 1100 lb test polypropylene).

                  Other details:

                  The entire setup is sewn with 100% wooly nylon thread. Since the thread
                  stretches just like the fabric, there is no issue with stitches pulling
                  out. The hammock body is attached to the suspension lines with double
                  dragon loops, which run through vinyl tubing to eliminate chafe. The
                  openings in the silnylon "capsule" are large enough to pull the hammock
                  body through for assembly/disassembly (although in practice you only need
                  to untie the suspension line and pull it out), but are closed tightly
                  around the tubing with zip ties to keep bugs out. The sides of the hammock
                  body, the edges of the tarp, the edges of the opening in the "capsule," and
                  the edges of the netting are all bound with bias binding. The bottom of the
                  "capsule" hangs just below the bottom of the hammock, providing a double
                  bottom (it's only gotten down to the high 50's so far during testing, but I
                  did throw a down sweater in there one time and it's loft was enough to keep
                  it from being flattened). The netting is attached with six fully separating
                  30" zippers, so the netting is completely removable. The ridgeline goes
                  under the netting, providing a convenient handhold to help me sit up and I
                  can also hang small items from it. The tarp has bungee loops at the four
                  corners and is diamond-shaped, with a long axis of 10' and a short axis of
                  9.' In the pictures, it is set up with the long axis parallel to the
                  hammock, but I usually set it up with the short axis parallel to the hammock.

                  Matthew Takeda
                  the JOAT
                • dlfrost_1
                  ... easy. ... on the ... the ... several ... tried ... between the ... end. A gripper-knot (Prussic, Taughtline Hitch, etc.) ridgeline arrangement works better
                  Message 8 of 13 , Sep 16, 2004
                    --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Matthew Takeda <takeda@s...>
                    wrote:
                    > Tom Peltier wrote:
                    > >How do you connect your hammock to the ridge line?
                    > >
                    > >I have taken to using a prussic and that makes the adjustment very
                    easy.
                    >
                    > I can see how it would make adjusting the position of the ridgeline
                    on the
                    > suspension line easy, but I'm happy with that. I'm only adjusting
                    the
                    > length of the ridgeline right now. For the connection, I've tried
                    several
                    > things, including prussiks, 'biners, and various hitches. I've also
                    tried
                    > making the ridgeline continuous between the trees and hanging the
                    > suspension lines below it, instead of attaching the ridgeline
                    between the
                    > suspension lines. In the pictures, there are butterfly loops in the
                    > suspension lines and the ridgeline has a midshipman's hitch at each
                    end.

                    A gripper-knot (Prussic, Taughtline Hitch, etc.) ridgeline
                    arrangement works better if you add some small bungie cord at one end
                    to protect the works when you get into the hammock. That way the
                    ridgeline can also arranged for use as a hanging guideline: When the
                    line is nearly taught but not pulling out the bungie, the hammock
                    tension is set correctly. If you also include some kind of clip-in
                    hardware it makes it easier to sweep the bug netting aside to use the
                    hammock as a chair.

                    > I'll probably try long splices next, since that would preserve more
                    of the
                    > strength of the line (1/4" 1100 lb test polypropylene).

                    Probably not worth the trouble. Just use better knots. Anything
                    that's going to subject your suspension lines to, say, 700lbs. of
                    force is going to kill you anyway. ;-)

                    But it does bring up an important point many folks don't realize: If
                    you've been calculating your hanging strap loads on the assumption
                    that each one only has to hold half of your weight, you're
                    dangerously mistaken. Each line holds 100% of your body weight,
                    perhaps even more.

                    Any book on rope climbing will tell you why. In structural terms a
                    hammock is The World's Worst Two-Point Top Rope Anchor. The farther
                    apart two anchor points are the more stress there will be on each
                    line because of dynamic sheer. The critical angle is 120º, at which
                    point each line is bearing 100% of the load.

                    The next time you've got your hammock out look at it from the side
                    with a protractor and note the angle of the lines. It's about 120º
                    ain't it? Ayup.

                    Doug Frost
                  • Dave Womble
                    ... wrote: ... If ... farther ... which ... Doug, It took me a minute to figure out that your 120 degree angle is referenced to vertical, we have used
                    Message 9 of 13 , Sep 16, 2004
                      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "dlfrost_1" <dlfrost@a...>
                      wrote:
                      ...>
                      > But it does bring up an important point many folks don't realize:
                      If
                      > you've been calculating your hanging strap loads on the assumption
                      > that each one only has to hold half of your weight, you're
                      > dangerously mistaken. Each line holds 100% of your body weight,
                      > perhaps even more.
                      >
                      > Any book on rope climbing will tell you why. In structural terms a
                      > hammock is The World's Worst Two-Point Top Rope Anchor. The
                      farther
                      > apart two anchor points are the more stress there will be on each
                      > line because of dynamic sheer. The critical angle is 120º, at
                      which
                      > point each line is bearing 100% of the load.
                      >

                      Doug,

                      It took me a minute to figure out that your 120 degree angle is
                      referenced to vertical, we have used horizontal as our reference when
                      we have talked about hammock strap forces in the past. For what it's
                      worth, 90 degrees from vertical is horizontal so your 120 degrees is
                      what we have called 30 degrees from horizontal.

                      Your statement that "The farther apart two anchor points are the more
                      stress there will be on each line because of dynamic sheer" interests
                      me. The static load is the same when you move the two anchor points
                      further apart as long as you increase the rope/strap length such that
                      the angle from horizontal remains constant. (Another way to look at
                      that is it doesn't matter if the trees are 12 feet apart or 15 feet
                      apart, as long as you adjust the rope length and how high you tie the
                      hammock ropes up the trees to maintain a 30 degree rope angle.) How
                      does dynamic sheer affect us hammockers, this is something I haven't
                      taken into account other than to realize that you sit down easy when
                      you get into a hammock and that you don't treat it like a suspended
                      swing and try to swing in as big an arc as possible.?

                      Thanks,
                      Youngblood
                    • Matthew Takeda
                      ... The tension on the lines depends on how far apart the trees are, since it has to be higher if the trees are further apart to maintain ground clearance. The
                      Message 10 of 13 , Sep 16, 2004
                        Doug Frost wrote:
                        >A gripper-knot (Prussic, Taughtline Hitch, etc.) ridgeline
                        >arrangement works better if you add some small bungie cord at one end
                        >to protect the works when you get into the hammock. That way the
                        >ridgeline can also arranged for use as a hanging guideline: When the
                        >line is nearly taught but not pulling out the bungie, the hammock
                        >tension is set correctly.

                        The tension on the lines depends on how far apart the trees are, since it
                        has to be higher if the trees are further apart to maintain ground
                        clearance. The point of a fixed-length ridgeline is to take that tension so
                        the hammock body always hangs the same no matter what the line tension
                        needs to be.

                        > If you also include some kind of clip-in
                        >hardware it makes it easier to sweep the bug netting aside to use the
                        >hammock as a chair.

                        I have no idea what you're trying to say here. My netting zips in and out,
                        so it's easy to get out of the way.

                        > > I'll probably try long splices next, since that would preserve
                        > > more of the strength of the line (1/4" 1100 lb test polypropylene).
                        >
                        >Probably not worth the trouble. Just use better knots. Anything
                        >that's going to subject your suspension lines to, say, 700lbs. of
                        >force is going to kill you anyway. ;-)

                        No trouble, I learned to splice in the '60s. I could almost do it blindfolded.

                        >But it does bring up an important point many folks don't realize:

                        If you think so, you haven't been reading this group very long. The subject
                        has come up before.

                        >Any book on rope climbing

                        I don't "rope climb," but I do rock climb. Does that count?

                        Matthew Takeda
                        the JOAT
                      • dlfrost_1
                        ... the ... and out, ... Whoops, my mistake...forgot you used zippers. Please disregard. ... subject ... Ok, but I doubt the newcomers to this group are
                        Message 11 of 13 , Sep 16, 2004
                          --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Matthew Takeda <takeda@s...>
                          wrote:
                          > > If you also include some kind of clip-in
                          > >hardware it makes it easier to sweep the bug netting aside to use
                          the
                          > >hammock as a chair.
                          >
                          > I have no idea what you're trying to say here. My netting zips in
                          and out,
                          > so it's easy to get out of the way.

                          Whoops, my mistake...forgot you used zippers. Please disregard.

                          > >But it does bring up an important point many folks don't realize:
                          >
                          > If you think so, you haven't been reading this group very long. The
                          subject
                          > has come up before.

                          Ok, but I doubt the newcomers to this group are reading all of the
                          archives though. (It would help if Yahoo would improve their search
                          function.)

                          > >Any book on rope climbing
                          >
                          > I don't "rope climb," but I do rock climb. Does that count?

                          Sorry to have annoyed you.

                          Doug Frost
                        • Matthew Takeda
                          ... Agreed. However, I am not a newcomer and it was me that you were addressing. According to Yahoo!, you ve only been here since March, so you re a relative
                          Message 12 of 13 , Sep 17, 2004
                            Doug Frost wrote:
                            >Ok, but I doubt the newcomers to this group are reading all of the
                            >archives though. (It would help if Yahoo would improve their search
                            >function.)

                            Agreed. However, I am not a newcomer and it was me that you were addressing.

                            According to Yahoo!, you've only been here since March, so you're a
                            relative newcomer yourself.

                            Don't hold your breath for that improved search function at Yahoo!Groups.
                            However, if you go to:
                            <http://news.gmane.org/gmane.culture.backpacking.hammockcamping/>
                            you'll find archives with a much better search function for this group, as
                            well as backpackgeartest, backpackingstoves, and backpackinglight.

                            >Sorry to have annoyed you.

                            I am annoyed at being lectured to about things I already know, but not by
                            an attempt to impart knowledge to the group. Attitude and tone are hard to
                            judge in a text-only environment, and sometimes we tend to think the worst.
                            I tend to post late at night, and sometimes my temper is a little short.
                            You should see the posts I write and then delete before sending.

                            Matthew Takeda
                            the JOAT
                          • Adrnlnjnky
                            Doug, Don t worry to much about Matthew, you have to remember he is our resident JOAT (Jack of All Trades) {And he s a good one too}. Mr. Tekada has probably
                            Message 13 of 13 , Sep 21, 2004
                              Doug,

                              Don't worry to much about Matthew, you have to remember he is our
                              resident JOAT (Jack of All Trades) {And he's a good one too}.

                              Mr. Tekada has probably forgotten more about more things that I will
                              learn in all my long life.

                              Tom



                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: Matthew Takeda <takeda@...>
                              Date: Fri, 17 Sep 2004 23:04:35 -0700
                              Subject: [Hammock Camping] Re: My hammock
                              To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                              Doug Frost wrote:
                              >Ok, but I doubt the newcomers to this group are reading all of the
                              >archives though. (It would help if Yahoo would improve their search
                              >function.)

                              Agreed. However, I am not a newcomer and it was me that you were addressing.

                              According to Yahoo!, you've only been here since March, so you're a
                              relative newcomer yourself.

                              Don't hold your breath for that improved search function at Yahoo!Groups.
                              However, if you go to:
                              <http://news.gmane.org/gmane.culture.backpacking.hammockcamping/>
                              you'll find archives with a much better search function for this group, as
                              well as backpackgeartest, backpackingstoves, and backpackinglight.

                              >Sorry to have annoyed you.

                              I am annoyed at being lectured to about things I already know, but not by
                              an attempt to impart knowledge to the group. Attitude and tone are hard to
                              judge in a text-only environment, and sometimes we tend to think the worst.
                              I tend to post late at night, and sometimes my temper is a little short.
                              You should see the posts I write and then delete before sending.

                              Matthew Takeda
                              the JOAT





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                              Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                              --
                              Tom Peltier
                              Pura Vida

                              Were we directed from Washington when to sow, and when to reap, we
                              should soon want bread.
                              Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, 1821
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