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Re: [Hammock Camping] staying warm

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  • Robert Mittelman
    Robert, I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter bag for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag for my long mummy
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 1, 2003
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      Robert,
       
      I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter bag for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag for my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits.  Hence my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up.  I have a few questions:
       
      1) what length Ponderosa do you have?  I would think that the 7' would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6" should be sufficient.  I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine trip.
       
      2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea Pod for a Speer hammock.  I haven't seen a response from you, but thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.
       
      3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey?  Which is more comfortable and why?  Do you sleep in the Crib on the diagonal, as in the Hennessey and Speer?  If not, how do you avoid the banana shape?  Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?
       
      4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions?  If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?
       
      Thanks.
       
      Bob Mittelman

      Robert Moore <simva4040@...> wrote:
      David,
      Quite a bit here to respond to....
      for wind and rain I think the fly I ususally carry -the Golite Cave 2- will provide enough coverage for wind and rain...splatter rain, from the ground up, is not a concern at the temps this set up is intended for, and that is when expected nightime temps are 25 degrees and colder (hard for ice to splatter too much onto the bottom of the Ponderosa..
      Dont know what to say about sleeping on one's side since I dont but I agree that there would be wasted space inside the Ponderosa, space that would contain the next days hiking clothes to warm and dry...
      And an emphatic yes that the Nunatak Arc Alpinist is THE insulation for weight/ounce, and mine has accompanied me on all trips for the last year-whether hammocking, sheltering, hutting and so on...for the extreme winter set up with the Crib/Ponderosa, the Arc Alpinist would be an awesome addition as would a piece of foam...now about foam, I too have several closed cell foam pads, have used them all in various applications, but went away from them after deploying underquilts/tacos with the HH....BUT I recently recieved from a company in Knoxville,TN a piece of foam that is 8 feet long and 7 feet wide. This piece of foam would/could be easily cut to fit inside an HH that would include 'wings' for the shoulder section (not a new idea, Sgt Rock first proposed it out of 2 pieces of foam) but this would be a one piece foam pad. So yes closed cell foam pads can make any hammock effective against cold but the argument is always their bulk when placed on the pack, their width (so the shoulders dont get cold), their placement, etc. all leading us to the underquilt.
      With several underquilts I have been very pleased with them-especially in conjunction with a sil-nyl taco (which blocks wind and rain and splatter)...but in the end Ed Speer had figured out that really cold hammocking requires a peapod....I just didnt like the cost/weight/temp rating ratio, and I had a Ponderosa sitting around....

      o123david <o123david@...> wrote:
      The Crazy Crib with the WM Ponderosa around it sure looks warm and
      comfortable. With the Nunatak Down Balaclava it sounds warm.
      But I have some questions about it. What happens if it's windy? Or
      rain is blown in from the side?
      Can you get enough protection with a large tarp set up close to the
      hammock and coming down sharply toward the ground? Even if the wind
      shifts and comes from one of the ends?
      Also, when you're in that type of setup and you are sleeping on your
      side with your legs bent it seems that the sleeping bag wouldn't be
      able to bend with you and you would end up with a lot of extra space
      inside the bag and hammock. This space would waste body heat and
      leave you colder.

      What I'd like to try if I ever get out camping again is the following.
      - Sleep on an angle, probably on my side in the fetal position.
      - Use a thick pad, actually at least 4 layers of Oware's lightweight
      1/4" foam cut to various sizes so the padding is thicker where
      needed, to protect me from the cold air below.
      - Use the sleeping bag with the most warmth for a given weight, the
      Nunatak Arc Alpinist (with extra fill). Use some lightweight webbing
      to hold the pads together and keep the bottom of the bag centered
      over the pads.
      - Drape lightweight plastic or coated nylon in a skirt around the
      hammock, with the material forced to stay apart at the bottom by
      adding weight or tying it down or holding the bottoms apart with
      poles. It gets clammy if they aren't held apart. This probably isn't
      a problem when it's windy. Even without wind I have found that this
      lightweight skirt adds a lot of warmth.
      - And, of course, a tarp. In my case a diamond-shaped Hennessy tarp
      over a Speer hammock.

      It seems that this would be lightweight and keep me warm into the
      single digits, which is needed at times during the winter on the
      southern AT.
      Does any of this make any sense? Any feedback?

      One other thing.
      Yes, foam pads do an excellent job of blocking the wind.
      The problem is that when it is windy there is no layer of warm air
      next to the cold side of the pad.
      It has also been pointed out that if the distance between the cold
      side of the pad and material blocking the wind is too great then the
      material blocking the wind adds little warmth.
      So what I am proposing has the skirt that is blocking the wind
      hanging near the cold side of the pad but still a small distance away
      from it.
      In testing it last spring with a lightweight sleeping bag (Nunatak
      Ghost) and a thin pad with the temperature in the 30's the skirt
      added a significant amount of badly needed warmth.
      I'm trying to keep the bottom open, at least when it isn't windy, to
      avoid condensation.

      One last thing. Western Mountaineering makes a vapor barrier out of a
      strong lightweight material which has a layer that reflects radiation
      on one side. In cold weather would it make sense to use a diamond-
      shaped tarp made of that material, and possibly even use that
      material to make the skirt surrounding the hammock? --David



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    • Coy
      Bob I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I ll give you what I know and what I suspect. See below. ... for a January snow shoeing trip to
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 5, 2003
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        Bob

        I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I'll give you
        what I know and what I suspect. See below.

        --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mittelman
        <rmittelman@s...> wrote:
        > Robert,
        >
        > I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter bag
        for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag for
        my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits. Hence
        my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up. I have a few questions:
        >
        > 1) what length Ponderosa do you have? I would think that the 7'
        would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6"
        should be sufficient. I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine
        trip.

        I would think the 7 foot version would be best with a speer type,
        The crib is shorter by a little and is wider at each end. it uses 2
        straps and it dosent quite come together at the ends like a Soeer or
        Hennessy. The bag will still need to slide down the hammock a
        little but with a 7 foot bag it would be close to being able to zip
        it closed at the middle of the foot end where the hanging strap
        exits the bag.
        >
        > 2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea
        Pod for a Speer hammock. I haven't seen a response from you, but
        thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.

        The Crib is narrower than the Speere so I may try to make a Speere a
        little narrower. I don't think the Ponderosa is as big in the
        middle as Eds PeaPod.
        >
        > 3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey? Which is
        more comfortable and why? Do you sleep in the Crib on the diagonal,
        as in the Hennessey and Speer? If not, how do you avoid the banana
        shape? Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the
        Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?

        I have a Crib but mine uses the hoops so mine dosn't pinch at the
        shoulders as much as the regular Crib. I have tried mine without
        the spreaded bars (hoops) and it definatly closes around me tighter
        than my hennessys do. But it is still very confortable. I sleep a
        little flatter in the HH than I do in the Crib especially sans the
        spreader hoops.
        >
        > 4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions?
        If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?

        I imagine the head sticking out will allow some blowing snow around
        the face area but hanging the tarp low and devising a wind break
        with spare rain jacket etc at the head end will help. When using
        the Ponderosa as a PeaPod I doubt the netting would be in use even
        though it helps block a little wind and most snow. Maybe throw a
        Frogg Togg top over my head if the snow was blowing that bad.
        >
        > Thanks.
        >
        > Bob Mittelman

        Coy Boy
      • Robert Mittelman
        Thanks, CB! Bob Mittelman Coy wrote: Bob I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I ll give you what I know and what I
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 6, 2003
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          Thanks, CB!
           
          Bob Mittelman

          Coy <starnescr@...> wrote:
          Bob

          I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I'll give you
          what I know and what I suspect.  See below.

          --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mittelman
          <rmittelman@s...> wrote:
          > Robert,

          > I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter bag
          for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag for
          my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits.  Hence
          my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up.  I have a few questions:

          > 1) what length Ponderosa do you have?  I would think that the 7'
          would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6"
          should be sufficient.  I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine
          trip.

          I would think the 7 foot version would be best with a speer type, 
          The crib is shorter by a little and is wider at each end.  it uses 2
          straps and it dosent quite come together at the ends like a Soeer or
          Hennessy.  The bag will still need to slide down the hammock a
          little but with a 7 foot bag it would be close to being able to zip
          it closed at the middle of the foot end where the hanging strap
          exits the bag.

          > 2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea
          Pod for a Speer hammock.  I haven't seen a response from you, but
          thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.

          The Crib is narrower than the Speere so I may try to make a Speere a
          little narrower.  I don't think the Ponderosa is as big in the
          middle as Eds PeaPod.

          > 3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey?  Which is
          more comfortable and why?  Do you sleep in the Crib on the diagonal,
          as in the Hennessey and Speer?  If not, how do you avoid the banana
          shape?  Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the
          Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?

          I have a Crib but mine uses the hoops so mine dosn't pinch at the
          shoulders as much as the regular Crib.  I have tried mine without
          the spreaded bars (hoops) and it definatly closes around me tighter
          than my hennessys do.  But it is still very confortable.  I sleep a
          little flatter in the HH than I do in the Crib especially sans the
          spreader hoops.

          > 4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions? 
          If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?

          I imagine the head sticking out will allow some blowing snow around
          the face area but hanging the tarp low and devising a wind break
          with spare rain jacket etc at the head end will help.  When using
          the Ponderosa as a PeaPod I doubt the netting would be in use even
          though it helps block a little wind and most snow.  Maybe throw a
          Frogg Togg top over my head if the snow was blowing that bad.

          > Thanks.

          > Bob Mittelman

          Coy Boy




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        • Robert Moore
          Coy, So many questions and many I cannot answer because in all honesty I have not taken the Ponderosa/Crib on a hike yet....our last 2 sections we slacked ( I
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 6, 2003
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            Coy,
            So many questions and many I cannot answer because in all honesty I have not taken the Ponderosa/Crib on a hike yet....our last 2 sections we slacked ( I had done them before and La AquaNa needed them, they were around Hotsprings NC so we took the opportunity to use the hot springs after each hike-luxury hiking!).....The system I have hiked with is the taco/HH with varying insulation.
            The 6'6" Ponderosa had no problem covering up my head and still providing good (well complete) coverage of the foot area.....but not wanting condensation inside I ordered the Nunatak balaclava to use in this system.
            The Crib does lay differently than the HH, and though I have the a-sym I never slept crosswise in it and wont in the Crib....in trials with La AquaNa padding me down to see if the down was every compressed we found that wasnt even in the fetal position--so with that I'm thinking the Ponderosa may not be as wide in the middle as the peapod, it is still a wide bag....which makes me wonder what the Spear PeaPod will cost when it comes out in down????
            As far as wind driven rain/snow....I use the Golite Cave2 tarp instead of the OME fly that came with the HH...I like it for the real estate below though it is a heavy tarp at around a pound....but it is so large I havent had any problems with the driven water-I did with the OME with some intense horizontal rain behind Albert Mtn shelter, my underquilt got wet but I was still warm, it was then that I switched to the Cave2....
            Yes my Crib has 2 straps but when weighted and pulled tight they are essentially one strap leaving the hammock....did you look closely at the pics I posted at whiteblaze.net of the setup? if so you saw that the foot end appears only to have one strap leaving the foot box.....
            Ok, sorry I was late and missed your questions....I do love the Ponderosa, we have taken it on many a hike to sleep under as a comforter in the motel or hostel and its original intent was paddle camping where the kayak doesnt care how much it weighs :)
            Medicine Man
            oooo, forgot, here in the shadow of Roan Mountain it hasnt gotten above 24 degrees all day.

            Coy <starnescr@...> wrote:
            Bob

            I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I'll give you
            what I know and what I suspect.  See below.

            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mittelman
            <rmittelman@s...> wrote:
            > Robert,

            > I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter bag
            for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag for
            my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits.  Hence
            my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up.  I have a few questions:

            > 1) what length Ponderosa do you have?  I would think that the 7'
            would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6"
            should be sufficient.  I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine
            trip.

            I would think the 7 foot version would be best with a speer type, 
            The crib is shorter by a little and is wider at each end.  it uses 2
            straps and it dosent quite come together at the ends like a Soeer or
            Hennessy.  The bag will still need to slide down the hammock a
            little but with a 7 foot bag it would be close to being able to zip
            it closed at the middle of the foot end where the hanging strap
            exits the bag.

            > 2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea
            Pod for a Speer hammock.  I haven't seen a response from you, but
            thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.

            The Crib is narrower than the Speere so I may try to make a Speere a
            little narrower.  I don't think the Ponderosa is as big in the
            middle as Eds PeaPod.

            > 3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey?  Which is
            more comfortable and why?  Do you sleep in the Crib on the diagonal,
            as in the Hennessey and Speer?  If not, how do you avoid the banana
            shape?  Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the
            Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?

            I have a Crib but mine uses the hoops so mine dosn't pinch at the
            shoulders as much as the regular Crib.  I have tried mine without
            the spreaded bars (hoops) and it definatly closes around me tighter
            than my hennessys do.  But it is still very confortable.  I sleep a
            little flatter in the HH than I do in the Crib especially sans the
            spreader hoops.

            > 4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions? 
            If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?

            I imagine the head sticking out will allow some blowing snow around
            the face area but hanging the tarp low and devising a wind break
            with spare rain jacket etc at the head end will help.  When using
            the Ponderosa as a PeaPod I doubt the netting would be in use even
            though it helps block a little wind and most snow.  Maybe throw a
            Frogg Togg top over my head if the snow was blowing that bad.

            > Thanks.

            > Bob Mittelman

            Coy Boy




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          • Coy
            Medicine Man Thanks, and when you have all the answers I m all ears LOL. As for the straps exiting as one, Yep, thats pretty much what I experienced. On
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 7, 2003
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              Medicine Man

              Thanks, and when you have "all" the answers I'm all ears LOL. As
              for the straps exiting as one, Yep, thats pretty much what I
              experienced. On the other hand my daughter has sort of laid claim
              to the Crib and when she uses it the straps dont draw up so tight or
              close together. Maybe I need to lose some weight LOL.

              It was cold here all day (Sat) but it got up to 40 for a few
              minutes. We had sleet and snow Friday but no acculation High Fri
              was 36. The ground is still to warm. Great testing weather... I
              think?

              for now I'm on the lookout for a "big man" rectangular bag like you
              see in Sportsmans Guide etc. I know they weigh a ton but I could
              test the concept with different hammocks to see if it will work for
              me. Then either get a Ponderosa, PeaPod, or a homemade version.

              Coy Boy

              --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Moore <simva4040@y...>
              wrote:
              > Coy,
              > So many questions and many I cannot answer because in all honesty
              I have not taken the Ponderosa/Crib on a hike yet....our last 2
              sections we slacked ( I had done them before and La AquaNa needed
              them, they were around Hotsprings NC so we took the opportunity to
              use the hot springs after each hike-luxury hiking!).....The system I
              have hiked with is the taco/HH with varying insulation.
              > The 6'6" Ponderosa had no problem covering up my head and still
              providing good (well complete) coverage of the foot area.....but not
              wanting condensation inside I ordered the Nunatak balaclava to use
              in this system.
              > The Crib does lay differently than the HH, and though I have the a-
              sym I never slept crosswise in it and wont in the Crib....in trials
              with La AquaNa padding me down to see if the down was every
              compressed we found that wasnt even in the fetal position--so with
              that I'm thinking the Ponderosa may not be as wide in the middle as
              the peapod, it is still a wide bag....which makes me wonder what the
              Spear PeaPod will cost when it comes out in down????
              > As far as wind driven rain/snow....I use the Golite Cave2 tarp
              instead of the OME fly that came with the HH...I like it for the
              real estate below though it is a heavy tarp at around a pound....but
              it is so large I havent had any problems with the driven water-I did
              with the OME with some intense horizontal rain behind Albert Mtn
              shelter, my underquilt got wet but I was still warm, it was then
              that I switched to the Cave2....
              > Yes my Crib has 2 straps but when weighted and pulled tight they
              are essentially one strap leaving the hammock....did you look
              closely at the pics I posted at whiteblaze.net of the setup? if so
              you saw that the foot end appears only to have one strap leaving the
              foot box.....
              > Ok, sorry I was late and missed your questions....I do love the
              Ponderosa, we have taken it on many a hike to sleep under as a
              comforter in the motel or hostel and its original intent was paddle
              camping where the kayak doesnt care how much it weighs :)
              > Medicine Man
              > oooo, forgot, here in the shadow of Roan Mountain it hasnt gotten
              above 24 degrees all day.
              >
              > Coy <starnescr@y...> wrote:
              > Bob
              >
              > I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I'll give
              you
              > what I know and what I suspect. See below.
              >
              > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mittelman
              > <rmittelman@s...> wrote:
              > > Robert,
              > >
              > > I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter
              bag
              > for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag
              for
              > my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits.
              Hence
              > my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up. I have a few questions:
              > >
              > > 1) what length Ponderosa do you have? I would think that the 7'
              > would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6"
              > should be sufficient. I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine
              > trip.
              >
              > I would think the 7 foot version would be best with a speer type,
              > The crib is shorter by a little and is wider at each end. it uses
              2
              > straps and it dosent quite come together at the ends like a Soeer
              or
              > Hennessy. The bag will still need to slide down the hammock a
              > little but with a 7 foot bag it would be close to being able to
              zip
              > it closed at the middle of the foot end where the hanging strap
              > exits the bag.
              > >
              > > 2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea
              > Pod for a Speer hammock. I haven't seen a response from you, but
              > thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.
              >
              > The Crib is narrower than the Speere so I may try to make a Speere
              a
              > little narrower. I don't think the Ponderosa is as big in the
              > middle as Eds PeaPod.
              > >
              > > 3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey? Which is
              > more comfortable and why? Do you sleep in the Crib on the
              diagonal,
              > as in the Hennessey and Speer? If not, how do you avoid the
              banana
              > shape? Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the
              > Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?
              >
              > I have a Crib but mine uses the hoops so mine dosn't pinch at the
              > shoulders as much as the regular Crib. I have tried mine without
              > the spreaded bars (hoops) and it definatly closes around me
              tighter
              > than my hennessys do. But it is still very confortable. I sleep
              a
              > little flatter in the HH than I do in the Crib especially sans the
              > spreader hoops.
              > >
              > > 4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions?
              > If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?
              >
              > I imagine the head sticking out will allow some blowing snow
              around
              > the face area but hanging the tarp low and devising a wind break
              > with spare rain jacket etc at the head end will help. When using
              > the Ponderosa as a PeaPod I doubt the netting would be in use even
              > though it helps block a little wind and most snow. Maybe throw a
              > Frogg Togg top over my head if the snow was blowing that bad.
              > >
              > > Thanks.
              > >
              > > Bob Mittelman
              >
              > Coy Boy
              >
              >
              >
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            • Robert Moore
              Coy, The more I play with the Ponderosa the more I like it....I guess I have been spoiled by the Arc Alpinist-the lightest amount of sleeping warmth you can
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 7, 2003
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                Coy,
                The more I play with the Ponderosa the more I like it....I guess I have been spoiled by the Arc Alpinist-the lightest amount of sleeping warmth you can carry, and I always carry a WM Flight, so the two, well I could go on and on...but the Ponderosa just may have an advantage over the other pods....I was reading that Risk keeps a knife with him so he can get out ....in the Pon/Crib combo you dont have that worry.....I did sleep in the Nunatak down balaclava this evening to get a feel for it....wonderful is an understatement but if you know the Arc alpinist then you know their workmanship....
                Wednesday night we (La AquaNa) and I will be testing hammock variations of insulation at Ripshin (realistic temps there)...she doesnt want to deal with the tacos/underquilts/pods right now and is trying to go it with pads...since she is 5'2 and very light and not wide I told her she would probably do well with a Therm-a-rest and an additional closed cell pad placed 90 to the therm-a-rest....
                OK for now, here in the hospital at the moment and will be all night.
                Medicine Man

                Coy <starnescr@...> wrote:
                Medicine Man

                Thanks, and when you have "all" the answers I'm all ears LOL.  As
                for the straps exiting as one,  Yep, thats pretty much what I
                experienced.  On the other hand my daughter has sort of laid claim
                to the Crib and when she uses it the straps dont draw up so tight or
                close together.  Maybe I need to lose some weight LOL. 

                It was cold here all day (Sat) but it got up to 40 for a few
                minutes.  We had sleet and snow Friday but no acculation  High Fri
                was 36.  The ground is still to warm.  Great testing weather... I
                think?

                for now I'm on the lookout for a "big man" rectangular bag like you
                see in Sportsmans Guide etc.   I know they weigh a ton but I could
                test the concept with different hammocks to see if it will work for
                me.  Then either get a Ponderosa, PeaPod, or a homemade version.

                Coy Boy

                --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Moore <simva4040@y...>
                wrote:
                > Coy,
                > So many questions and many I cannot answer because in all honesty
                I have not taken the Ponderosa/Crib on a hike yet....our last 2
                sections we slacked ( I had done them before and La AquaNa needed
                them, they were around Hotsprings NC so we took the opportunity to
                use the hot springs after each hike-luxury hiking!).....The system I
                have hiked with is the taco/HH with varying insulation.
                > The 6'6" Ponderosa had no problem covering up my head and still
                providing good (well complete) coverage of the foot area.....but not
                wanting condensation inside I ordered the Nunatak balaclava to use
                in this system.
                > The Crib does lay differently than the HH, and though I have the a-
                sym I never slept crosswise in it and wont in the Crib....in trials
                with La AquaNa padding me down to see if the down was every
                compressed we found that wasnt even in the fetal position--so with
                that I'm thinking the Ponderosa may not be as wide in the middle as
                the peapod, it is still a wide bag....which makes me wonder what the
                Spear PeaPod will cost when it comes out in down????
                > As far as wind driven rain/snow....I use the Golite Cave2 tarp
                instead of the OME fly that came with the HH...I like it for the
                real estate below though it is a heavy tarp at around a pound....but
                it is so large I havent had any problems with the driven water-I did
                with the OME with some intense horizontal rain behind Albert Mtn
                shelter, my underquilt got wet but I was still warm, it was then
                that I switched to the Cave2....
                > Yes my Crib has 2 straps but when weighted and pulled tight they
                are essentially one strap leaving the hammock....did you look
                closely at the pics I posted at whiteblaze.net of the setup? if so
                you saw that the foot end appears only to have one strap leaving the
                foot box.....
                > Ok, sorry I was late and missed your questions....I do love the
                Ponderosa, we have taken it on many a hike to sleep under as a
                comforter in the motel or hostel and its original intent was paddle
                camping where the kayak doesnt care how much it weighs :)
                > Medicine Man
                > oooo, forgot, here in the shadow of Roan Mountain it hasnt gotten
                above 24 degrees all day.
                >
                > Coy <starnescr@y...> wrote:
                > Bob
                >
                > I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I'll give
                you
                > what I know and what I suspect.  See below.
                >
                > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mittelman
                > <rmittelman@s...> wrote:
                > > Robert,
                > > 
                > > I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter
                bag
                > for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag
                for
                > my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits. 
                Hence
                > my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up.  I have a few questions:
                > > 
                > > 1) what length Ponderosa do you have?  I would think that the 7'
                > would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6"
                > should be sufficient.  I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine
                > trip.
                >
                > I would think the 7 foot version would be best with a speer type, 
                > The crib is shorter by a little and is wider at each end.  it uses
                2
                > straps and it dosent quite come together at the ends like a Soeer
                or
                > Hennessy.  The bag will still need to slide down the hammock a
                > little but with a 7 foot bag it would be close to being able to
                zip
                > it closed at the middle of the foot end where the hanging strap
                > exits the bag.
                > > 
                > > 2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea
                > Pod for a Speer hammock.  I haven't seen a response from you, but
                > thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.
                >
                > The Crib is narrower than the Speere so I may try to make a Speere
                a
                > little narrower.  I don't think the Ponderosa is as big in the
                > middle as Eds PeaPod.
                > > 
                > > 3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey?  Which is
                > more comfortable and why?  Do you sleep in the Crib on the
                diagonal,
                > as in the Hennessey and Speer?  If not, how do you avoid the
                banana
                > shape?  Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the
                > Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?
                >
                > I have a Crib but mine uses the hoops so mine dosn't pinch at the
                > shoulders as much as the regular Crib.  I have tried mine without
                > the spreaded bars (hoops) and it definatly closes around me
                tighter
                > than my hennessys do.  But it is still very confortable.  I sleep
                a
                > little flatter in the HH than I do in the Crib especially sans the
                > spreader hoops.
                > > 
                > > 4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions? 
                > If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?
                >
                > I imagine the head sticking out will allow some blowing snow
                around
                > the face area but hanging the tarp low and devising a wind break
                > with spare rain jacket etc at the head end will help.  When using
                > the Ponderosa as a PeaPod I doubt the netting would be in use even
                > though it helps block a little wind and most snow.  Maybe throw a
                > Frogg Togg top over my head if the snow was blowing that bad.
                > > 
                > > Thanks.
                > > 
                > > Bob Mittelman
                >
                > Coy Boy
                >
                >
                >
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              • Coy
                I imagine the Ponderaos is about as good as it gets. I m considering something like a Nort Face Golith or Mammoth. I would have to modify it with a hole in
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 7, 2003
                • 0 Attachment
                  I imagine the Ponderaos is about as good as it gets. I'm considering
                  something like a Nort Face Golith or Mammoth. I would have to
                  modify it with a hole in the end for the hammock line to pass out but
                  the 6' 8" version might be long enough to get a speere inside. The
                  hood on the bottom might want to hang down or maybe pass the head end
                  rope through the "modified hood" something like a big gromet. It
                  weighs 4 lb 10 oz but of couse I would be doing away with any pad
                  except for really cold nights which i would have to experiment to find
                  the low it would go. Basically like the PeaPod I'm looking to get a
                  sleeping bag which will fit around my setup. you could always "loan"
                  me the Ponderosa. I would send it right back LOL

                  Coy Boy

                  --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Moore <simva4040@y...>
                  wrote:
                  > Coy,
                  > The more I play with the Ponderosa the more I like it....I guess I
                  have been spoiled by the Arc Alpinist-the lightest amount of sleeping
                  warmth you can carry, and I always carry a WM Flight, so the two, well
                  I could go on and on...but the Ponderosa just may have an advantage
                  over the other pods....I was reading that Risk keeps a knife with him
                  so he can get out ....in the Pon/Crib combo you dont have that
                  worry.....I did sleep in the Nunatak down balaclava this evening to
                  get a feel for it....wonderful is an understatement but if you know
                  the Arc alpinist then you know their workmanship....
                  > Wednesday night we (La AquaNa) and I will be testing hammock
                  variations of insulation at Ripshin (realistic temps there)...she
                  doesnt want to deal with the tacos/underquilts/pods right now and is
                  trying to go it with pads...since she is 5'2 and very light and not
                  wide I told her she would probably do well with a Therm-a-rest and an
                  additional closed cell pad placed 90 to the therm-a-rest....
                  > OK for now, here in the hospital at the moment and will be all night.
                  > Medicine Man
                  >
                  > Coy <starnescr@y...> wrote:
                  > Medicine Man
                  >
                  > Thanks, and when you have "all" the answers I'm all ears LOL. As
                  > for the straps exiting as one, Yep, thats pretty much what I
                  > experienced. On the other hand my daughter has sort of laid claim
                  > to the Crib and when she uses it the straps dont draw up so tight or
                  > close together. Maybe I need to lose some weight LOL.
                  >
                  > It was cold here all day (Sat) but it got up to 40 for a few
                  > minutes. We had sleet and snow Friday but no acculation High Fri
                  > was 36. The ground is still to warm. Great testing weather... I
                  > think?
                  >
                  > for now I'm on the lookout for a "big man" rectangular bag like you
                  > see in Sportsmans Guide etc. I know they weigh a ton but I could
                  > test the concept with different hammocks to see if it will work for
                  > me. Then either get a Ponderosa, PeaPod, or a homemade version.
                  >
                  > Coy Boy
                  >
                  > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Moore <simva4040@y...>
                  > wrote:
                  > > Coy,
                  > > So many questions and many I cannot answer because in all honesty
                  > I have not taken the Ponderosa/Crib on a hike yet....our last 2
                  > sections we slacked ( I had done them before and La AquaNa needed
                  > them, they were around Hotsprings NC so we took the opportunity to
                  > use the hot springs after each hike-luxury hiking!).....The system I
                  > have hiked with is the taco/HH with varying insulation.
                  > > The 6'6" Ponderosa had no problem covering up my head and still
                  > providing good (well complete) coverage of the foot area.....but not
                  > wanting condensation inside I ordered the Nunatak balaclava to use
                  > in this system.
                  > > The Crib does lay differently than the HH, and though I have the a-
                  > sym I never slept crosswise in it and wont in the Crib....in trials
                  > with La AquaNa padding me down to see if the down was every
                  > compressed we found that wasnt even in the fetal position--so with
                  > that I'm thinking the Ponderosa may not be as wide in the middle as
                  > the peapod, it is still a wide bag....which makes me wonder what the
                  > Spear PeaPod will cost when it comes out in down????
                  > > As far as wind driven rain/snow....I use the Golite Cave2 tarp
                  > instead of the OME fly that came with the HH...I like it for the
                  > real estate below though it is a heavy tarp at around a pound....but
                  > it is so large I havent had any problems with the driven water-I did
                  > with the OME with some intense horizontal rain behind Albert Mtn
                  > shelter, my underquilt got wet but I was still warm, it was then
                  > that I switched to the Cave2....
                  > > Yes my Crib has 2 straps but when weighted and pulled tight they
                  > are essentially one strap leaving the hammock....did you look
                  > closely at the pics I posted at whiteblaze.net of the setup? if so
                  > you saw that the foot end appears only to have one strap leaving the
                  > foot box.....
                  > > Ok, sorry I was late and missed your questions....I do love the
                  > Ponderosa, we have taken it on many a hike to sleep under as a
                  > comforter in the motel or hostel and its original intent was paddle
                  > camping where the kayak doesnt care how much it weighs :)
                  > > Medicine Man
                  > > oooo, forgot, here in the shadow of Roan Mountain it hasnt gotten
                  > above 24 degrees all day.
                  > >
                  > > Coy <starnescr@y...> wrote:
                  > > Bob
                  > >
                  > > I seee no one answered your questions, mine either, so I'll give
                  > you
                  > > what I know and what I suspect. See below.
                  > >
                  > > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Robert Mittelman
                  > > <rmittelman@s...> wrote:
                  > > > Robert,
                  > > >
                  > > > I am considering buying a hammock and need either a new winter
                  > bag
                  > > for a January snow shoeing trip to northern Maine, or an overbag
                  > for
                  > > my long mummy bag that is comfortable into the single digits.
                  > Hence
                  > > my interest in your Crib/Ponderosa set up. I have a few questions:
                  > > >
                  > > > 1) what length Ponderosa do you have? I would think that the 7'
                  > > would be best for Pea Pod use, but for my overbag needs, 6' 6"
                  > > should be sufficient. I don't plan on using a hammock on my Maine
                  > > trip.
                  > >
                  > > I would think the 7 foot version would be best with a speer type,
                  > > The crib is shorter by a little and is wider at each end. it uses
                  > 2
                  > > straps and it dosent quite come together at the ends like a Soeer
                  > or
                  > > Hennessy. The bag will still need to slide down the hammock a
                  > > little but with a 7 foot bag it would be close to being able to
                  > zip
                  > > it closed at the middle of the foot end where the hanging strap
                  > > exits the bag.
                  > > >
                  > > > 2) Coy has a post where he questions using a Ponderosa as a Pea
                  > > Pod for a Speer hammock. I haven't seen a response from you, but
                  > > thought I'd ask if you have any thoughts on the subject.
                  > >
                  > > The Crib is narrower than the Speere so I may try to make a Speere
                  > a
                  > > little narrower. I don't think the Ponderosa is as big in the
                  > > middle as Eds PeaPod.
                  > > >
                  > > > 3) how does the Crib sleep relative to your Hennessey? Which is
                  > > more comfortable and why? Do you sleep in the Crib on the
                  > diagonal,
                  > > as in the Hennessey and Speer? If not, how do you avoid the
                  > banana
                  > > shape? Will sleeping on the diagonal be possible when using the
                  > > Ponderosa as a Pea Pod, given the barrel shape of the Ponderosa?
                  > >
                  > > I have a Crib but mine uses the hoops so mine dosn't pinch at the
                  > > shoulders as much as the regular Crib. I have tried mine without
                  > > the spreaded bars (hoops) and it definatly closes around me
                  > tighter
                  > > than my hennessys do. But it is still very confortable. I sleep
                  > a
                  > > little flatter in the HH than I do in the Crib especially sans the
                  > > spreader hoops.
                  > > >
                  > > > 4) have you used the Crib/Ponderosa in snowy, windy conditions?
                  > > If so, was snow blowing into the hammock a problem?
                  > >
                  > > I imagine the head sticking out will allow some blowing snow
                  > around
                  > > the face area but hanging the tarp low and devising a wind break
                  > > with spare rain jacket etc at the head end will help. When using
                  > > the Ponderosa as a PeaPod I doubt the netting would be in use even
                  > > though it helps block a little wind and most snow. Maybe throw a
                  > > Frogg Togg top over my head if the snow was blowing that bad.
                  > > >
                  > > > Thanks.
                  > > >
                  > > > Bob Mittelman
                  > >
                  > > Coy Boy
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
                  > >
                  > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > > hammockcamping-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                  > Service.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ---------------------------------
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                  > > New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing
                  >
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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