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Re: more condensation

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  • Dave Womble
    Coy, First a question, what does IIRC mean when you state: blue foam target pad 72 x 27 x 3/8 IIRC ? The condensation that you are experiencing is because
    Message 1 of 7 , Sep 16, 2003
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      Coy,

      First a question, what does 'IIRC' mean when you state: "blue foam
      target pad 72 x 27 x 3/8 IIRC " ?

      The condensation that you are experiencing is because of your
      insensible perspiration and the moisture is collecting against the
      non-breathable vapor barrier that your pad presents. I don't think
      adding a thicker pad will change that.

      When we sleep on the ground, we toss and turn all night. The
      moisture from our insensible perspiration has a chance to evaporate
      into the surrounding air before we have any significant moisture
      buildup because of this frequent turning.

      When we sleep on a hammock, we sleep comfortably on our backs pretty
      much all night. The insensible perspiration that our back-side
      generates is trapped between our body and the non-breathable vapor
      barrier of our sleeping pad. One solution is to utilize a 'high
      wicking fabric' against the non-breathable pad. Fleece blankets or
      fleece clothing apparently helps with this. I haven't noticed
      mositure problems using my two-layer hammock with the pad sandwiched
      between the two layers of rip-stop nylon. I suspect that 'Shane's
      Ultimate Pad' doesn't have moisture buildup problems because he wraps
      his non-breathable pads with a 'high wicking fabric'. Did you have
      moisture buildup when you used your Refectix/fleece pad? Another
      solution is to use breathable insulation, like Thomas did with the
      Neat Sheet and Ed does with his Pea Pod.

      I think condensation occurs when you use the mylar space blanket
      suspended under a hammock and you have the moist warm air (A lot of
      it from your insensible perspiration) in contact with the cooler
      surface of the space blanket. In Thomas's case, he used a breathable
      Neat Sheet that is also a 'high wicking fabric', so he probably
      didn't have a moisture buildup problem.

      When I have slept all night on my backside directly on a closed cell
      foam pad, I have had the moisture buildup that you mentioned and it
      wet my sleeping bag where it contacted the moisture. When I used a
      RidgeRest or Zrest, the moisture was pretty much contained in the
      large open surface cells of the pads and didn't wet my sleeping bag.
      What I did was to recognise that it was insensible perspiration and
      then find ways to deal with it. It might be as simple as to just
      sleep on your side for some periods during the night.

      Youngblood


      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Coy" <starnescr@y...> wrote:
      > I did a short overnight hike last night using my HH Expedition, a
      > blue foam target pad 72 x 27 x 3/8 IIRC (not sure if thats the
      right
      > thickness) It got down to 52 last night looking at the closeest
      > working weather bug station in Claysville about 5 miles from my
      > camp. Anyways I had some serious condensation on the top of my
      pad.
      > I was using a Mountaismith Wisp 30 deg bag that I'm just starting
      to
      > test for BGT. It is out drying on the deck right now. I realize
      > that the same principal as a glass of ice tea was in effect. I was
      > the warm air outside of the glass so to speak and the pad was the
      > glass and the air cool air below me was the ice tea. I am asuming a
      > thicker pad would cut down on this but i dont need a thicker pad as
      > I stayed warm all night. I dont think I sweated much after about
      10
      > pm and was still dry at that time so the moisture was mostly if not
      > all condensation. I left the half zip Wisp open till I woke up
      > feeling a little cool about 2 AM but felt a little warm after
      > zipping up, still not sweating though. I was wondering if some of
      > the recent neat sheet and coleman blanket users had much
      > condensation? Someone justask about it but i forget the name. I
      > just read Thomas's trip report and he used a neat sheet and did not
      > get condensation in the mid 30s so I'm thinking I need to get away
      > from pads and try som under insulation except for the entry hole
      > issues. I still have not built a Garlington type insulator but I
      > think it about time. Should this help with condensation? Also
      > would a real thick pad help? I know an insulated mug sweats less
      > than a plain glass glass etc. I just dont want to need much over a
      > 3/4 inch pad just to keep the condensation down. Opinions?
      >
      > Coy Boy
    • Thomas Peltier
      That probably explains most of the differances in condensation experienced. So to solve my problem I just need to move my campsite just a little west. Coy Boy
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 16, 2003
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        That probably explains most of the differances in condensation
        experienced. So to solve my problem I just need to move my campsite
        just a little west.

        Coy Boy

         

        That is one solution.  Unfortunately those conditions are not always that way so I’m hoping you can find another solution so I can learn from your wet nights.

         

        J 

         

        Tom

      • Coy
        IIRC = if I recall/remember correctly meaning I wasnt sure about the Target pads thickness. Now is insensible perspiration some kind of insult. LOL I know I
        Message 3 of 7 , Sep 16, 2003
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          IIRC = if I recall/remember correctly meaning I wasnt sure about the
          Target pads thickness.

          Now is insensible perspiration some kind of insult. LOL I know I
          sweat like a pig. Seriously, then Thomas besides having slept at a
          lower due point/less humidity, was on a breathable surface and could
          have put out as much moisture as I did but it was able to
          evaporate. I did sleep on my back in the same position all night.
          And my reflectix with fleece seems to help but not completly
          eliminate condensation which the fleece cove helps ficilatate. In
          this casr even a waterproog lower blanket under the hammock could
          help as there would be some air movement to help manage the moisture
          as fast as i produce it. Breathable would only be more so. Thanks
          for the info.

          Coy Boy



          -- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Dave Womble" <dpwomble@y...>
          wrote:
          > Coy,
          >
          > First a question, what does 'IIRC' mean when you state: "blue foam
          > target pad 72 x 27 x 3/8 IIRC " ?
          >
          > The condensation that you are experiencing is because of your
          > insensible perspiration and the moisture is collecting against the
          > non-breathable vapor barrier that your pad presents. I don't
          think
          > adding a thicker pad will change that.
          >
          > When we sleep on the ground, we toss and turn all night. The
          > moisture from our insensible perspiration has a chance to
          evaporate
          > into the surrounding air before we have any significant moisture
          > buildup because of this frequent turning.
          >
          > When we sleep on a hammock, we sleep comfortably on our backs
          pretty
          > much all night. The insensible perspiration that our back-side
          > generates is trapped between our body and the non-breathable vapor
          > barrier of our sleeping pad. One solution is to utilize a 'high
          > wicking fabric' against the non-breathable pad. Fleece blankets
          or
          > fleece clothing apparently helps with this. I haven't noticed
          > mositure problems using my two-layer hammock with the pad
          sandwiched
          > between the two layers of rip-stop nylon. I suspect that 'Shane's
          > Ultimate Pad' doesn't have moisture buildup problems because he
          wraps
          > his non-breathable pads with a 'high wicking fabric'. Did you
          have
          > moisture buildup when you used your Refectix/fleece pad? Another
          > solution is to use breathable insulation, like Thomas did with the
          > Neat Sheet and Ed does with his Pea Pod.
          >
          > I think condensation occurs when you use the mylar space blanket
          > suspended under a hammock and you have the moist warm air (A lot
          of
          > it from your insensible perspiration) in contact with the cooler
          > surface of the space blanket. In Thomas's case, he used a
          breathable
          > Neat Sheet that is also a 'high wicking fabric', so he probably
          > didn't have a moisture buildup problem.
          >
          > When I have slept all night on my backside directly on a closed
          cell
          > foam pad, I have had the moisture buildup that you mentioned and
          it
          > wet my sleeping bag where it contacted the moisture. When I used
          a
          > RidgeRest or Zrest, the moisture was pretty much contained in the
          > large open surface cells of the pads and didn't wet my sleeping
          bag.
          > What I did was to recognise that it was insensible perspiration
          and
          > then find ways to deal with it. It might be as simple as to just
          > sleep on your side for some periods during the night.
          >
          > Youngblood
          >
          >
          > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Coy" <starnescr@y...>
          wrote:
          > > I did a short overnight hike last night using my HH Expedition,
          a
          > > blue foam target pad 72 x 27 x 3/8 IIRC (not sure if thats the
          > right
          > > thickness) It got down to 52 last night looking at the closeest
          > > working weather bug station in Claysville about 5 miles from my
          > > camp. Anyways I had some serious condensation on the top of my
          > pad.
          > > I was using a Mountaismith Wisp 30 deg bag that I'm just
          starting
          > to
          > > test for BGT. It is out drying on the deck right now. I realize
          > > that the same principal as a glass of ice tea was in effect. I
          was
          > > the warm air outside of the glass so to speak and the pad was
          the
          > > glass and the air cool air below me was the ice tea. I am
          asuming a
          > > thicker pad would cut down on this but i dont need a thicker pad
          as
          > > I stayed warm all night. I dont think I sweated much after
          about
          > 10
          > > pm and was still dry at that time so the moisture was mostly if
          not
          > > all condensation. I left the half zip Wisp open till I woke up
          > > feeling a little cool about 2 AM but felt a little warm after
          > > zipping up, still not sweating though. I was wondering if some
          of
          > > the recent neat sheet and coleman blanket users had much
          > > condensation? Someone justask about it but i forget the name. I
          > > just read Thomas's trip report and he used a neat sheet and did
          not
          > > get condensation in the mid 30s so I'm thinking I need to get
          away
          > > from pads and try som under insulation except for the entry hole
          > > issues. I still have not built a Garlington type insulator but I
          > > think it about time. Should this help with condensation? Also
          > > would a real thick pad help? I know an insulated mug sweats
          less
          > > than a plain glass glass etc. I just dont want to need much
          over a
          > > 3/4 inch pad just to keep the condensation down. Opinions?
          > >
          > > Coy Boy
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