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RE: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...

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  • Thomas Peltier
    Assuming the tree doesn t split wide open and burst into flames!! _____ From: Shane Steinkamp [mailto:shane@theplacewithnoname.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 27,
    Message 1 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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      Assuming the tree doesn’t split wide open and burst into flames!!

       

       

       


      From: Shane Steinkamp [mailto:shane@...]
      Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 2:20 PM
      To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

       

      > What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?

      You're much safer in the hammock.  Remember, lightning follows the path of
      least resistance.  You are really pretty safe suspended off the ground.  The
      lightning will run right down the trees and diffuse into the ground.

      Shane



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    • J Cornelius
      Sleep in the hammock anyway - I love storms and if I m gonna die, it might as well be swinging in the trees! Jodi Abnormality is THE normality at this locality
      Message 2 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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        Sleep in the hammock anyway - I love storms and if I'm gonna die, it might as well be swinging in the trees!
         
        Jodi
         
         
        Abnormality is THE normality at this locality
        -------Original Message-------
         
        Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:04:19 PM
        Subject: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...
         
        What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?



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      • Dave Womble
        ... path of ... ground. The ... Shane, I have seen/heard that same comment before, but I see a few potential problems. The current caused by the lightning
        Message 3 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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          --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Shane Steinkamp" <shane@t...>
          wrote:
          > > What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?
          >
          > You're much safer in the hammock. Remember, lightning follows the
          path of
          > least resistance. You are really pretty safe suspended off the
          ground. The
          > lightning will run right down the trees and diffuse into the ground.
          >
          > Shane

          Shane,

          I have seen/heard that same comment before, but I see a few potential
          problems. The current caused by the lightning discharge will try to
          follow all of its available paths to ground, with the magnitude of
          the currents in each path being inversely proportional to the
          resistance in that path. If everything is wet, it might make it even
          worse for an attached hammock. It might be possible for the hammock
          webbing/rope to melt. Then there is the fact that sometimes the tree
          kinda explodes and limbs fall off or the trunk explodes or chunks fly
          off. All in all, lightning is not something you want to get close
          and personal with. It is a danger and being in a hammock is not
          going to keep you completely safe. Thankfully, I don't have any
          experience being in a hammock when lightning hit one of the
          attachment trees, but I have seen lightning damaged trees and don't
          think I would have wanted to be anywhere near them. I think the best
          thing we hammock hangers have going for us is that we are not usually
          attached to the biggest trees and the odds are that lightning will
          strike the highest ones around.

          Youngblood
        • Thomas Peltier
          Now this brings up the question of Widow Makers and hanging under a tree _____ From: Dave Womble [mailto:dpwomble@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003
          Message 4 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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            Now this brings up the question of Widow Makers and hanging under a tree

             


            From: Dave Womble [mailto:dpwomble@...]
            Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 3:19 PM
            To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

             

            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Shane Steinkamp" <shane@t...>
            wrote:
            > > What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?
            >
            > You're much safer in the hammock.  Remember, lightning follows the
            path of
            > least resistance.  You are really pretty safe suspended off the
            ground.  The
            > lightning will run right down the trees and diffuse into the ground.
            >
            > Shane

            Shane,

            I have seen/heard that same comment before, but I see a few potential
            problems.  The current caused by the lightning discharge will try to
            follow all of its available paths to ground, with the magnitude of
            the currents in each path being inversely proportional to the
            resistance in that path.  If everything is wet, it might make it even
            worse for an attached hammock.  It might be possible for the hammock
            webbing/rope to melt.  Then there is the fact that sometimes the tree
            kinda explodes and limbs fall off or the trunk explodes or chunks fly
            off.  All in all, lightning is not something you want to get close
            and personal with.  It is a danger and being in a hammock is not
            going to keep you completely safe.  Thankfully, I don't have any
            experience being in a hammock when lightning hit one of the
            attachment trees, but I have seen lightning damaged trees and don't
            think I would have wanted to be anywhere near them.  I think the best
            thing we hammock hangers have going for us is that we are not usually
            attached to the biggest trees and the odds are that lightning will
            strike the highest ones around.

            Youngblood



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          • ciyd01
            Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to ground. Lightning has a strong preference for the tallest item it encounters. However, a
            Message 5 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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              Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to
              ground. Lightning has a strong preference for the tallest item it
              encounters. However, a shorter tree located on the very edge of a
              cliff or hill is a likely lightning strike as it presents an easy
              target for a lot of built up energy. The problem with the hammock is
              that it is stretched between 2 trees and a close strike actually
              induces current flow in nearby conductive items. It is possible that
              the voltage potential between one end of the hammock and the other
              could be high enough to allow current to flow through it (and you).
              That's why they tell you to squat on the ground with your feet close
              together and your hands wrapped around you knees. Current flowing
              from hand to hand goes through the heart and causes fibrillation.
              Current flowing from hand to foot can go through heart or abdominal
              cavity causing fibrillation or vomiting (seen it). Current flowing
              from foot to foot does not flow through any major organ systems.
              Most people die from either fibrillation (muscle spasms of the heart
              that don't allow for blood to be pumped through the heart) or the
              massive burns (internal and external) or bleeding caused from limb
              loss (not tree limbs - arms and legs).

              Can you tell I work around high voltage for a living?

              Don't pick the tallest tree. Don't pick the tree next to the tallest
              tree. Don't pick a tree on the edge of a hill or cliff. Don't golf
              in an electrical storm (yes, people still die doing this).

              ciyd

              --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "J Cornelius" <bpskids@c...>
              wrote:
              > Sleep in the hammock anyway - I love storms and if I'm gonna die,
              it might
              > as well be swinging in the trees!
              >
              > Jodi
              >
              >
              >
              > Abnormality is THE normality at this locality
              > -------Original Message-------
              >
              > From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:04:19 PM
              > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...
              >
              > What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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            • Thomas Peltier
              Hmm, take a lightning rod, stand in an open space and stick it up over your head. Yeah, that s a damn good idea in a lightning storm. Great info about the
              Message 6 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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                Hmm,  take a lightning rod, stand in an open space and stick it up over your head…

                 

                Yeah, that’s a damn good idea in a lightning storm.  Great info about the flow and all. 

                 

                 


                From: ciyd01 [mailto:ciyd@...]
                Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:35 PM
                To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                 

                Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to
                ground.  Lightning has a strong preference for the tallest item it
                encounters.  However, a shorter tree located on the very edge of a
                cliff or hill is a likely lightning strike as it presents an easy
                target for a lot of built up energy.  The problem with the hammock is
                that it is stretched between 2 trees and a close strike actually
                induces current flow in nearby conductive items.  It is possible that
                the voltage potential between one end of the hammock and the other
                could be high enough to allow current to flow through it (and you). 
                That's why they tell you to squat on the ground with your feet close
                together and your hands wrapped around you knees.  Current flowing
                from hand to hand goes through the heart and causes fibrillation. 
                Current flowing from hand to foot can go through heart or abdominal
                cavity causing fibrillation or vomiting (seen it).  Current flowing
                from foot to foot does not flow through any major organ systems. 
                Most people die from either fibrillation (muscle spasms of the heart
                that don't allow for blood to be pumped through the heart) or the
                massive burns (internal and external) or bleeding caused from limb
                loss (not tree limbs - arms and legs).

                Can you tell I work around high voltage for a living?

                Don't pick the tallest tree.  Don't pick the tree next to the tallest
                tree.  Don't pick a tree on the edge of a hill or cliff.  Don't golf
                in an electrical storm (yes, people still die doing this).

                ciyd

                --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "J Cornelius" <bpskids@c...>
                wrote:
                > Sleep in the hammock anyway - I love storms and if I'm gonna die,
                it might
                > as well be swinging in the trees!
                >
                > Jodi
                >
                >
                >
                > Abnormality is THE normality at this locality
                > -------Original Message-------
                >
                > From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:04:19 PM
                > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...
                >
                > What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?
                >
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                > ADVERTISEMENT
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                >
                >
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



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              • Dave Womble
                ... Not quite right. Lightning and all electrical current will take EVERY path to ground that is available to it. The current will split and the path with
                Message 7 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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                  --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "ciyd01" <ciyd@a...> wrote:
                  > Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to
                  > ground.

                  Not quite right. Lightning and all electrical current will take
                  EVERY path to ground that is available to it. The current will split
                  and the path with least resistance will get proportionately more
                  current. For example, if you have a two bulb light fixture in your
                  house and place a 100 watt bulb in fixture #1 and a 50 watt bulb in
                  fixture #2, don't they BOTH light up? The 100 watt bulb is the
                  easiest path to ground, but current still flows through the higher
                  resistance of the 50 watt bulb. BTW, this is how a 50/100/150 watt 3-
                  way light bulb works; a 50 watt & a 100 watt bulb with a 4 postion
                  switch.

                  Youngblood
                • Ronald
                  I also understand this to be true. If the least resistance path is a billion times more than lethal current and the path through you is only a thousand times
                  Message 8 of 21 , Aug 27, 2003
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                    I also understand this to be true.  If the least resistance path is a billion times more than lethal current and the path through you is only a thousand times more than a lethal current, then there is very little difference as far as you are concerned.
                     
                    From spending a lot of time on mountain peaks with experts like the ski patrol, I have learned a little from them to pass on to you.  They will first seek a lower place and shelter, but if in the process they feel all of their hairs standing on end and believe a near lightning strike is imminent, then they will crouch down low with their feet close together.  The reason is that a ground strike nearby will result in a huge amount of current dissipating through high resistance soil and rock with a tremendous voltage gradient.  The voltage between two points is greater for a greater distance.  With your feet spread apart, you span a greater voltage differential and would get more current than if your feet were together.
                     
                    Taking this into my thought and extrapolating to a hammock strung between two trees, I'm seeing that you can be reaching out across a huge potential were lightning strike nearby.  I'm wondering if a wire going from one end of your hammock to the other end might give you any protection, but I caution you that I have not tested this ;)
                     
                    Maybe someone who knows can tell us more.
                     
                    Ronald H Levine
                     
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 6:09 PM
                    Subject: Re: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...

                    --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "ciyd01" <ciyd@a...> wrote:
                    > Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to
                    > ground. 

                    Not quite right.  Lightning and all electrical current will take
                    EVERY path to ground that is available to it.  The current will split
                    and the path with least resistance will get proportionately more
                    current.  For example, if you have a two bulb light fixture in your
                    house and place a 100 watt bulb in fixture #1 and a 50 watt bulb in
                    fixture #2, don't they BOTH light up?  The 100 watt bulb is the
                    easiest path to ground, but current still flows through the higher
                    resistance of the 50 watt bulb.  BTW, this is how a 50/100/150 watt 3-
                    way light bulb works; a 50 watt & a 100 watt bulb with a 4 postion
                    switch.

                    Youngblood



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                  • Risk
                    And, If I m gonna swing in the trees, I d rather not die... ... might
                    Message 9 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                      And, If I'm gonna swing in the trees, I'd rather not die...

                      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "J Cornelius" <bpskids@c...> wrote:
                      > Sleep in the hammock anyway - I love storms and if I'm gonna die, it
                      might
                      > as well be swinging in the trees!
                      >
                      > Jodi
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Abnormality is THE normality at this locality
                      > -------Original Message-------
                      >
                      > From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                      > Date: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:04:19 PM
                      > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...
                      >
                      > What would you do? Get out and squat on a foam pad?
                      >
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                      > ADVERTISEMENT
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                      > hammockcamping-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                    • Lenny Nichols
                      I just returned from a trip to Colorado. It was my first backpacking trip with a Hammock (HH). We seem to have caused evening thunderstorms by cooking
                      Message 10 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                        I just returned from a trip to Colorado. It was my first backpacking trip
                        with a Hammock (HH). We seem to have caused evening thunderstorms by
                        cooking dinner... One evening I had just finished cooking dinner when a
                        huge thunderstorm hit. Everyone else crawled into their tents. I sat on my
                        foam "sit-upon" pad under my hammock, ate dinner, and watched the storm. We
                        had three lightning strikes within about 300 yards and torrential rain. I
                        figured I was pretty safe on the foam pad, but I put in earplugs. If the
                        lightning got any closer, and it didn't actually hit me, it might deafen
                        me. I'm glad to report that I stayed safe and also stayed dry.

                        I did learn another lesson that I don't recall seeing explicitly in the HH
                        instruction. Instead of "opening up" the Snakeskins and sitting in the
                        hammock to tension it when setting up, I just leaned on it with everything
                        still inside the Snakeskins. I managed to break the ridge line in the
                        hammock. I was pleased to learn that the hammock still worked fine; I just
                        couldn't store anything overhead. So once I get the hammock back from HH;
                        no more leaning on the ridge line.

                        Lenny Nichols, PMP
                      • Thomas Peltier
                        Or perhaps to a ground rod? _____ From: Ronald [mailto:Ronald.H.Levine@mindspring.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 5:39 PM To:
                        Message 11 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                          Or perhaps to a ground rod?

                           

                           


                          From: Ronald [mailto:Ronald.H.Levine@...]
                          Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 5:39 PM
                          To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                           

                          I also understand this to be true.  If the least resistance path is a billion times more than lethal current and the path through you is only a thousand times more than a lethal current, then there is very little difference as far as you are concerned.

                           

                          From spending a lot of time on mountain peaks with experts like the ski patrol, I have learned a little from them to pass on to you.  They will first seek a lower place and shelter, but if in the process they feel all of their hairs standing on end and believe a near lightning strike is imminent, then they will crouch down low with their feet close together.  The reason is that a ground strike nearby will result in a huge amount of current dissipating through high resistance soil and rock with a tremendous voltage gradient.  The voltage between two points is greater for a greater distance.  With your feet spread apart, you span a greater voltage differential and would get more current than if your feet were together.

                           

                          Taking this into my thought and extrapolating to a hammock strung between two trees, I'm seeing that you can be reaching out across a huge potential were lightning strike nearby.  I'm wondering if a wire going from one end of your hammock to the other end might give you any protection, but I caution you that I have not tested this ;)

                           

                          Maybe someone who knows can tell us more.

                           

                          Ronald H Levine

                           

                          ----- Original Message -----

                          Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 6:09 PM

                          Subject: Re: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...

                           

                          --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "ciyd01" <ciyd@a...> wrote:
                          > Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to
                          > ground. 

                          Not quite right.  Lightning and all electrical current will take
                          EVERY path to ground that is available to it.  The current will split
                          and the path with least resistance will get proportionately more
                          current.  For example, if you have a two bulb light fixture in your
                          house and place a 100 watt bulb in fixture #1 and a 50 watt bulb in
                          fixture #2, don't they BOTH light up?  The 100 watt bulb is the
                          easiest path to ground, but current still flows through the higher
                          resistance of the 50 watt bulb.  BTW, this is how a 50/100/150 watt 3-
                          way light bulb works; a 50 watt & a 100 watt bulb with a 4 postion
                          switch.

                          Youngblood



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                        • Ronald
                          I know that the tendency is for lightning to travel on the outside surfaces of an object. Perhaps the wet skin of a tent or hammock would be conductive enough
                          Message 12 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                            I know that the tendency is for lightning to travel on the outside surfaces
                            of an object. Perhaps the wet skin of a tent or hammock would be conductive
                            enough combined with repulsion of the charge of electrons and the tendency
                            to travel on the outside surfaces might result in some protection. I'm
                            thinking that the wire on the outside surface and away from the body would
                            encourage a path that might detour it around your body not unlike being
                            inside an automobile or an airplane. Perhaps a large loop with you in the
                            middle will have some protection. It wouldn't be practical to lug around a
                            heavy conductor, so just a thin wire might initiate the path of current
                            which would be so great that the wire will instantly explode into an ionized
                            gas, but that should still be a path. Again, that is my speculation based
                            on just bits and pieces of related information and it is untested. It would
                            be good to know, so I post it in case someone can direct us to proven
                            information.

                            Ronald

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: Thomas Peltier
                            To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 10:53 AM
                            Subject: RE: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...

                            Or perhaps to a ground rod?

                            From: Ronald [mailto:Ronald.H.Levine@...]
                            Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 5:39 PM
                            To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                            I also understand this to be true. If the least resistance path is a
                            billion times more than lethal current and the path through you is only a
                            thousand times more than a lethal current, then there is very little
                            difference as far as you are concerned.

                            >From spending a lot of time on mountain peaks with experts like the ski
                            patrol, I have learned a little from them to pass on to you. They will
                            first seek a lower place and shelter, but if in the process they feel all of
                            their hairs standing on end and believe a near lightning strike is imminent,
                            then they will crouch down low with their feet close together. The reason
                            is that a ground strike nearby will result in a huge amount of current
                            dissipating through high resistance soil and rock with a tremendous voltage
                            gradient. The voltage between two points is greater for a greater distance.
                            With your feet spread apart, you span a greater voltage differential and
                            would get more current than if your feet were together.

                            Taking this into my thought and extrapolating to a hammock strung between
                            two trees, I'm seeing that you can be reaching out across a huge potential
                            were lightning strike nearby. I'm wondering if a wire going from one end of
                            your hammock to the other end might give you any protection, but I caution
                            you that I have not tested this ;)

                            Maybe someone who knows can tell us more.

                            Ronald H Levine

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: Dave Womble
                            To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 6:09 PM
                            Subject: Re: Hammock Camping Tied between trees during lightening...

                            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "ciyd01" <ciyd@a...> wrote:
                            > Lightning and all electrical current will take the easiest path to
                            > ground.

                            Not quite right. Lightning and all electrical current will take
                            EVERY path to ground that is available to it. The current will split
                            and the path with least resistance will get proportionately more
                            current. For example, if you have a two bulb light fixture in your
                            house and place a 100 watt bulb in fixture #1 and a 50 watt bulb in
                            fixture #2, don't they BOTH light up? The 100 watt bulb is the
                            easiest path to ground, but current still flows through the higher
                            resistance of the 50 watt bulb. BTW, this is how a 50/100/150 watt 3-
                            way light bulb works; a 50 watt & a 100 watt bulb with a 4 postion
                            switch.

                            Youngblood

                            To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                            hammockcamping-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                          • ciyd01
                            A thin wire at those energy levels is known as a fast blow fuse. No protection. 50% of all lightning stroke currents is above 30,000 Amps. A 0000 wire,
                            Message 13 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                              A thin wire at those energy levels is known as a fast blow fuse. No
                              protection. 50% of all lightning stroke currents is above 30,000
                              Amps. A 0000 wire, which has an outer diameter of .460" has a
                              current rating of 316 Amps. The typical 16AWG wire is rated at
                              11.5Amps. You'll need to bring about 1500 of them with you, and
                              drive them 6 feet into the ground, to dissipate that much energy. A
                              thin wire attached to your hammock is now a lightning rod and is only
                              going to provide a point for corona build up.

                              Yes, current will take multiple parallel paths to ground but we are
                              talking about some enormous ENORMOUS amounts of energy here and just
                              about everything nearby IS a path of low resistance. Energy in the
                              level of kilo joules. The lightning stroke reaches temperatures of
                              several tens of thousand degrees Kelvin (or Fahrenheit), clearly
                              sufficient to initiate combustion in many common materials. In many
                              common materials lightning current causes a rapid localized expansion
                              that causes the material to fracture or split apart. This effect can
                              be observed in trees that have been split by lightning or in masonry
                              buildings that have bricks "blown" off. When lightning strikes a
                              building, it can cause internal electric fields in excess of 100
                              thousand volts per meter and can cause internal arcing across rooms.

                              Now, taking 100kV per meter, the average man is approximately 2
                              meters long, that's 200kV. The resistance of the human body, (dry
                              unbroken skin) is 250k ohms. V = I*R. I = V/R. I = 200kV/250K
                              ohms so I = 1A. While I don't have the numbers for currents at
                              these frequencies, in 60Hz applications, .010 Amps is holding current
                              (can't let go) and .060Amps is considered to be probably fatal. 1A
                              is surely fatal.

                              If the current running through your body doesn't kill you, surely
                              the "localised expansion" of the tissues will. Most linemen don't
                              die from electrocution, they die from burns, blood loss, or the fall.

                              PLEASE PLEASE don't fuck around with wire grounding and crap like
                              that! This is energy on the order of a generating station being
                              discharged in a matter of milliseconds. This is a highly specialized
                              field of electrical engineering that I have only had occasion to
                              briefly interact with. If you're really interested in lightning,
                              find a copy of ANSI/IEEE 62.42 for a crash course in lightning
                              protection. There's a lot of good info on how they get their data
                              and what the average lightning event looks like. Another good site
                              for lightning information is:

                              http://www.boltlightningprotection.com/lightning_physics.htm


                              Better safe and crouched down than dead!
                              ciyd

                              --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ronald"
                              <Ronald.H.Levine@m...> wrote:
                              > I know that the tendency is for lightning to travel on the outside
                              surfaces
                              > of an object. Perhaps the wet skin of a tent or hammock would be
                              conductive
                              > enough combined with repulsion of the charge of electrons and the
                              tendency
                              > to travel on the outside surfaces might result in some protection.
                              I'm
                              > thinking that the wire on the outside surface and away from the
                              body would
                              > encourage a path that might detour it around your body not unlike
                              being
                              > inside an automobile or an airplane. Perhaps a large loop with you
                              in the
                              > middle will have some protection. It wouldn't be practical to lug
                              around a
                              > heavy conductor, so just a thin wire might initiate the path of
                              current
                              > which would be so great that the wire will instantly explode into
                              an ionized
                              > gas, but that should still be a path. Again, that is my
                              speculation based
                              > on just bits and pieces of related information and it is untested.
                              It would
                              > be good to know, so I post it in case someone can direct us to
                              proven
                              > information.
                              >
                              > Ronald
                            • Thomas Peltier
                              PLEASE PLEASE don t fuck around with wire grounding and crap like that! This is energy on the order of a generating station being discharged in a matter of
                              Message 14 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                                PLEASE PLEASE don't fuck around with wire grounding and crap like
                                that!  This is energy on the order of a generating station being
                                discharged in a matter of milliseconds.

                                 

                                 

                                Ah, your taking all the fun out of it.  And just when I was thinking about Storm hunting to test my new 24 guage hammock grounding device  I call it the HGD.

                                 

                              • Bror8588@AOL.com
                                In a message dated 8/28/03 18:28:50 Eastern Daylight Time, ... Now, if instead of a grounding device one used a kite with a key on the tail and attached it to
                                Message 15 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                                  In a message dated 8/28/03 18:28:50 Eastern Daylight Time, Thomas@... writes:



                                  PLEASE PLEASE don't fuck around with wire grounding and crap like
                                  that!  This is energy on the order of a generating station being
                                  discharged in a matter of milliseconds.


                                  Ah, your taking all the fun out of it.  And just when I was thinking about Storm hunting to test my new 24 gauge hammock grounding device  I call it the HGD




                                  Now, if instead of a grounding device one used a kite with a key on the tail and attached it to a volt meter, ohm meter, ampere meter and the flush toilet what kind of readings could we expect.  Would there be enough power to flush the toilet?
                                  Just curious.  BTW are there privies where there are flush toilets on any of the trails?

                                  Skylander Jack  
                                • ciyd01
                                  Is that being sold under the DarwinWasRight brand name? ;-) ... thinking about ... call it
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                                    Is that being sold under the DarwinWasRight brand name? ;-)



                                    --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Peltier" <Thomas@G...>
                                    wrote:
                                    > Ah, your taking all the fun out of it. And just when I was
                                    thinking about
                                    > Storm hunting to test my new 24 guage hammock grounding device I
                                    call it
                                    > the HGD.
                                  • Thomas Peltier
                                    The new DWR HGD available at the HSN real soon _____ From: ciyd01 [mailto:ciyd@attbi.com] Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 3:49 PM To:
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                                      The new DWR HGD available at the HSN real soon

                                       

                                       


                                      From: ciyd01 [mailto:ciyd@...]
                                      Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2003 3:49 PM
                                      To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                                       

                                      Is that being sold under the DarwinWasRight brand name?  ;-)



                                      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Peltier" <Thomas@G...>
                                      wrote:
                                      > Ah, your taking all the fun out of it.  And just when I was
                                      thinking about
                                      > Storm hunting to test my new 24 guage hammock grounding device  I
                                      call it
                                      > the HGD.



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                                    • Coy
                                      Set up on a flex pay I hope. Seriously, If I m set up in my hammock at night NOT in the tallest trees around and a bad electrical storm rolls in, I m gona
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                                        Set up on a flex pay I hope. Seriously, If I'm set up in my
                                        hammock at night NOT in the tallest trees around and a bad
                                        electrical storm rolls in, I'm gona just hunker down. Anything with
                                        metal will be thrown to the wind, whether it is a pack with aluminum
                                        stays or my radio. I've been through a few storms and it was nerve
                                        racking but I figgure my hammock is about as safe as the next
                                        option. Now if I know of a cave close by I would think of making a
                                        run for it. I have been run in a few caves by lightning storms when
                                        out day hiking.

                                        Coy Boy

                                        --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Peltier"
                                        <Thomas@G...> wrote:
                                        > The new DWR HGD available at the HSN real soon
                                      • ciyd01
                                        ... with ... aluminum ... I would, too. The point is to not be the easiest thing for lightning to reach. Tallest trees or the first set of trees on a cliff
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Aug 28, 2003
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                                          --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Coy" <starnescr@y...> wrote:
                                          > Seriously, If I'm set up in my
                                          > hammock at night NOT in the tallest trees around and a bad
                                          > electrical storm rolls in, I'm gona just hunker down. Anything
                                          with
                                          > metal will be thrown to the wind, whether it is a pack with
                                          aluminum
                                          > stays or my radio.

                                          I would, too. The point is to not be the easiest thing for lightning
                                          to reach. Tallest trees or the first set of trees on a cliff or hill
                                          are bad. If I'm concerned that the storm is really bad, I might
                                          hunker down under the hammock until the worst of it passed. That's
                                          usually 30 minutes or less.

                                          I think falling branches would be the biggest danger.

                                          Fortunately, I moved out of the stormy part of the continent. We
                                          just don't get that much electrical storm activity here and it's
                                          usually pretty tame compared to Texas and Florida.

                                          ciyd
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