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Re: Three Digests Later...

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  • colonelcorn76
    ... spectra ... Ed can probably fill in the answers for you but one of the problems I have with a webbing based tie-off system on a homemade hammock is that I
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 1, 2003
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      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, Miguel Arboleda <butuki@g...>
      wrote:
      > > Also, may I ask why polypropylene straps are used instead of
      spectra
      > > rope slung through webbing, like the Hennessy?

      Ed can probably fill in the answers for you but one of the problems
      I have with a webbing based tie-off system on a homemade hammock is
      that I can't know for sure what the quality/strength of the webbing
      is. It's not typically something printed anywhere. Spectra and Pulse
      line is made to a standard that is documented with the spool so I'm
      much more comfortable with trusting I won't be ending up with my
      butt on the ground (I broke my tailbone once and don't want to do
      that again).

      Jim
    • Risk
      Jim wrote: One of the problems I have with a webbing based tie-off system on a homemade hammock is that I can t know for sure what the strength of the webbing
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 1, 2003
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        Jim wrote:

        One of the problems I have with a webbing based tie-off system on a
        homemade hammock is that I can't know for sure what the strength of
        the webbing is. It's not typically something printed anywhere.

        I agree it is not printed anywhere and no one can tell you how strong
        it is, and if they knew why you wanted to know, you can bet they
        would say it is not strong enough.

        Fortunately, one can easily test the stuff. Once you find a source
        that is acceptable, you can trust it for a while.

        Easiest method is to tie the webbing between two trees and have you
        and your friend sit on it. This is a rather standard engineering
        method of stressing something to twice its normal load. If you are
        concerned about hurting yourself, put something soft on the ground
        during the test. Webbing does not usually fail with a bang, but with
        a zipper like sound of breaking as the lengthwise threads snap. I
        have not had any of the 1 inch poly webbing I have gotten from the
        fabric store or from Walmart or from Outdoor Wilderness Fabrics or
        Seattle fabrics fail this test. The test has not even been
        destructive... the same webbing I tested seems perfectly strong
        enough for operational use.

        So if that is what is keeping you from experimenting, give it a try.

        BTW, the hammock itself with it's bartacked loops of webbing can be
        tested with the two person test in a 1.9 oz hammock as well. Here
        you are risking the hammock fabric too, because it really is close to
        breaking when you get 400 pounds in the hammock, but it does wonders
        to increase your faith in the product.

        Rick
      • Ed Speer
        Jim, Rick Just a note about testing webbing strength--Any stitching holding the webbing together (as in the knots or end loops) will probably be the weak
        Message 3 of 6 , Jul 2, 2003
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          Message
          Jim, Rick  Just a note about testing webbing strength--Any stitching holding the webbing together (as in the knots or end loops) will probably be the weak point.  I've had no problem using 4 heavy bar tacks in a 4" length, but the quality of the bar tacks & the thread is critical.  Weak bar tacks can easily fail, one at a time.  A published rope climbing expert has recently told me that 4-7 well made bar tacks are standard on climbing harnesses.  Sewing bar tacks too heavy, or with too many needle holes, can also damage and weaken the webbing--use a round point needle when possible.  Otherwise, sew up to 7 bar tacks--if they fail, they may do so slowly enought for you to react in time.  Inspect the stichting often!    ...Ed
           
           
          -----Original Message-----
          From: Risk [mailto:geoflyfisher@...]
          Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 11:34 PM
          To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Hammock Camping Re: Three Digests Later...

          Jim wrote:

          One of the problems I have with a webbing based tie-off system on a
          homemade hammock is that I can't know for sure what the strength of
          the webbing is. It's not typically something printed anywhere.

          I agree it is not printed anywhere and no one can tell you how strong
          it is, and if they knew why you wanted to know, you can bet they
          would say it is not strong enough. 

          Fortunately, one can easily test the stuff.  Once you find a source
          that is acceptable, you can trust it for a while. 

          Easiest method is to tie the webbing between two trees and have you
          and your friend sit on it.  This is a rather standard engineering
          method of stressing something to twice its normal load.  If you are
          concerned about hurting yourself, put something soft on the ground
          during the test.  Webbing does not usually fail with a bang, but with
          a zipper like sound of breaking as the lengthwise threads snap.   I
          have not had any of the 1 inch poly webbing I have gotten from the
          fabric store or from Walmart or from Outdoor Wilderness Fabrics or
          Seattle fabrics fail this test. The test has not even been
          destructive...  the same webbing I tested seems perfectly strong
          enough for operational use.

          So if that is what is keeping you from experimenting, give it a try.

          BTW, the hammock itself with it's bartacked loops of webbing can be
          tested with the two person test in a 1.9 oz hammock as well.  Here
          you are risking the hammock fabric too, because it really is close to
          breaking when you get 400 pounds in the hammock, but it does wonders
          to increase your faith in the product. 

          Rick



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        • Risk
          Hi Ed, Yep, that is the reason I tested my hammock with the weight of the two of us as well. I use three bar tacks presently, but I am trying to make it
          Message 4 of 6 , Jul 2, 2003
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            Hi Ed,

            Yep, that is the reason I tested my hammock with the weight of the
            two of us as well. I use three bar tacks presently, but I am trying
            to make it strong enough to hold about 600 pounds... unlike in my
            climbing days when I would not have been satisfied with a load
            strength of under 3000-6000 pounds. It is amazing how much pull you
            can get in a fall.

            If anyone wants to put together a hammock that works perfectly well
            for two so you can do tests on webbing, just use two layers of 1.9
            ripstop. It works very nicely.

            Rick

            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Speer" <info@s...> wrote:
            > Jim, Rick Just a note about testing webbing strength--Any stitching
            > holding the webbing together (as in the knots or end loops) will
            > probably be the weak point. I've had no problem using 4 heavy bar
            tacks
            > in a 4" length, but the quality of the bar tacks & the thread is
            > critical. Weak bar tacks can easily fail, one at a time. A
            published
            > rope climbing expert has recently told me that 4-7 well made bar
            tacks
            > are standard on climbing harnesses. Sewing bar tacks too heavy, or
            with
            > too many needle holes, can also damage and weaken the webbing--use a
            > round point needle when possible. Otherwise, sew up to 7 bar tacks-
            -if
            > they fail, they may do so slowly enought for you to react in time.
            > Inspect the stichting often! ...Ed
            >
            >
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: Risk [mailto:geoflyfisher@y...]
            > Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 11:34 PM
            > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: Hammock Camping Re: Three Digests Later...
            >
            >
            > Jim wrote:
            >
            > One of the problems I have with a webbing based tie-off system on a
            > homemade hammock is that I can't know for sure what the strength of
            > the webbing is. It's not typically something printed anywhere.
            >
            > I agree it is not printed anywhere and no one can tell you how
            strong
            > it is, and if they knew why you wanted to know, you can bet they
            > would say it is not strong enough.
            >
            > Fortunately, one can easily test the stuff. Once you find a source
            > that is acceptable, you can trust it for a while.
            >
            > Easiest method is to tie the webbing between two trees and have you
            > and your friend sit on it. This is a rather standard engineering
            > method of stressing something to twice its normal load. If you are
            > concerned about hurting yourself, put something soft on the ground
            > during the test. Webbing does not usually fail with a bang, but
            with
            > a zipper like sound of breaking as the lengthwise threads snap. I
            > have not had any of the 1 inch poly webbing I have gotten from the
            > fabric store or from Walmart or from Outdoor Wilderness Fabrics or
            > Seattle fabrics fail this test. The test has not even been
            > destructive... the same webbing I tested seems perfectly strong
            > enough for operational use.
            >
            > So if that is what is keeping you from experimenting, give it a try.
            >
            > BTW, the hammock itself with it's bartacked loops of webbing can be
            > tested with the two person test in a 1.9 oz hammock as well. Here
            > you are risking the hammock fabric too, because it really is close
            to
            > breaking when you get 400 pounds in the hammock, but it does
            wonders
            > to increase your faith in the product.
            >
            > Rick
            >
            >
            >
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