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Re: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter

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  • Jim Priest
    Let us know if you come up with anything! I m also an RC airplane enthusiast and that might be another avenue for lightweight power - lots of new tech battery
    Message 1 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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      Let us know if you come up with anything!

      I'm also an RC airplane enthusiast and that might be another avenue
      for lightweight power - lots of new tech battery options out there
      right now - Lipoly, A123, etc...

      Jim

      On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 3:34 PM, Ed Speer <ed@...> wrote:
      > Thanks Jim, I once bought all the DIY gear to make a thermostat controlled DC hammock warmer similar to your jacket liner, but never found the time to actually finish the project. So the idea is rattling around inside my head….Ed
    • Ralph Oborn
      Ed, I ve been using the hot hands warmers for years while snow camping with my scouts. I would vote for them as the way to go over an electrical sytem. 1.
      Message 2 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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        Ed, I've been using the "hot hands" warmers for years while snow camping
        with my scouts.
        I would vote for them as the way to go over an electrical sytem.

        1. Cheap (50 cents each)
        2. Reliable (keep them in your winter pack)
        3. Light weight (couple of oz each)
        4. Flexible (don't use for warm nights, use two or three for cold nights)
        5. No chance of an electrical.
        6. Uncomplicated
        7. Proven

        Ralph (Pocatello)


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Bill Fornshell
        Hi Ed, I don t know anyone that has used one of these.  I talked to Doug last week about something and just had a look over the things he sells.  I was
        Message 3 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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          Hi Ed,

          I don't know anyone that has used one of these.  I talked to Doug last week about something and just had a look over the things he sells.  I was really surprised at the low weight of his lightest stove.

          On the question about using charcoal, I think charcoal puts of carbon monoxide which would not be so good.  It might be fun to do some testing with one of these.  At 17 ounces for his lightest stove a light hiker could about carry one of these and still be under 25 pounds.

          Bill in Texas

          --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Ed Speer <ed@...> wrote:
          From: Ed Speer <ed@...>
          Subject: RE: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
          To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 2:23 PM











          The Titanium Goat stove does look good Bill. Do you know of anyone who's

          tried one? How long does it burn before needing more fuel? Could you use

          charcoal instead of wood? .Ed



          Moderator, Hammock Camping List



          Author, Hammock Camping book



          Editor, Hammock Camping Newsletters



          Owner, Speer Hammocks Inc



          From: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com]

          On Behalf Of Bill Fornshell

          Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 3:08 PM

          To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com

          Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter



          Hi,



          Check out one of these wood stoves from Titanium Goat. Look at the lightest

          version. Just over 1 pound.

          http://www.titanium goat.com/ cstove.html



          If you had something like a tent around and over your hammock one of these

          might work.



          If it was setup right you might be able to feed the stove without getting

          out of your hammock.



          Bill in Texas



          --- On Fri, 1/2/09, ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav% 40yahoo.com>

          > wrote:

          From: ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav% 40yahoo.com> >

          Subject: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter

          To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com <mailto:hammockcamp ing%40yahoogroup s.com>



          Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 12:58 PM



          My son spent a couple of days in Maine camping out in 10 degree



          weather. I asked him how he keep warm and he told me he used an



          emergeny car powerstart battery assy. and plugged in his small heater



          set on 500 watts and it lasted two 8 hr nights. Here's another thought,



          use a winter tarp with a Zodi propane heater. Lugging around Powerstart



          car batteries and Zodi heaters only adds a couple of more pounds



          conpared with lugging around underquits and more padding. Each style of



          camping will have different sets of parameters. The style of camping



          using heaters and winter tents will only appeal to campers who pull



          small sleds while snowshoeing in on flat terrain and could care less



          about adding an extra couple of pounds. I think using special designed



          winter hammocks is the way to go for winter hammocking rather then



          modifing a 3 season hammock for winter conditions. Just my thoughts and



          nothing is set in stone.



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





























          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Rick
          THe wood is going to create carbon monoxide as well. The vent has to be vented outside the tent it is in. I don t think that charcoal would be hotter than
          Message 4 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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            THe wood is going to create carbon monoxide as well. The vent has to be
            vented outside the tent it is in. I don't think that charcoal would be
            hotter than wood. In the wood stove that I used in my tipi, there was a
            specific instruction not to burn cardboard or quantities of paper, as
            they could burn through the steel.

            I thought it was silly that cardboard would burn hotter than wood, but
            when I tried burning up some cardboard, it was considerably hotter than
            any of the wood fires I had made up to that point.

            Rick

            Bill Fornshell wrote:
            > Hi Ed,
            >
            > I don't know anyone that has used one of these. I talked to Doug last week about something and just had a look over the things he sells. I was really surprised at the low weight of his lightest stove.
            >
            > On the question about using charcoal, I think charcoal puts of carbon monoxide which would not be so good. It might be fun to do some testing with one of these. At 17 ounces for his lightest stove a light hiker could about carry one of these and still be under 25 pounds.
            >
            > Bill in Texas
            >
            > --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Ed Speer <ed@...> wrote:
            > From: Ed Speer <ed@...>
            > Subject: RE: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
            > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 2:23 PM
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > The Titanium Goat stove does look good Bill. Do you know of anyone who's
            >
            > tried one? How long does it burn before needing more fuel? Could you use
            >
            > charcoal instead of wood? .Ed
            >
            >
            >
            > Moderator, Hammock Camping List
            >
            >
            >
            > Author, Hammock Camping book
            >
            >
            >
            > Editor, Hammock Camping Newsletters
            >
            >
            >
            > Owner, Speer Hammocks Inc
            >
            >
            >
            > From: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com]
            >
            > On Behalf Of Bill Fornshell
            >
            > Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 3:08 PM
            >
            > To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com
            >
            > Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
            >
            >
            >
            > Hi,
            >
            >
            >
            > Check out one of these wood stoves from Titanium Goat. Look at the lightest
            >
            > version. Just over 1 pound.
            >
            > http://www.titanium goat.com/ cstove.html
            >
            >
            >
            > If you had something like a tent around and over your hammock one of these
            >
            > might work.
            >
            >
            >
            > If it was setup right you might be able to feed the stove without getting
            >
            > out of your hammock.
            >
            >
            >
            > Bill in Texas
            >
            >
            >
            > --- On Fri, 1/2/09, ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav% 40yahoo.com>
            >
            >> wrote:
            >
            > From: ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav% 40yahoo.com> >
            >
            > Subject: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
            >
            > To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com <mailto:hammockcamp ing%40yahoogroup s.com>
            >
            >
            >
            > Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 12:58 PM
            >
            >
            >
            > My son spent a couple of days in Maine camping out in 10 degree
            >
            >
            >
            > weather. I asked him how he keep warm and he told me he used an
            >
            >
            >
            > emergeny car powerstart battery assy. and plugged in his small heater
            >
            >
            >
            > set on 500 watts and it lasted two 8 hr nights. Here's another thought,
            >
            >
            >
            > use a winter tarp with a Zodi propane heater. Lugging around Powerstart
            >
            >
            >
            > car batteries and Zodi heaters only adds a couple of more pounds
            >
            >
            >
            > conpared with lugging around underquits and more padding. Each style of
            >
            >
            >
            > camping will have different sets of parameters. The style of camping
            >
            >
            >
            > using heaters and winter tents will only appeal to campers who pull
            >
            >
            >
            > small sleds while snowshoeing in on flat terrain and could care less
            >
            >
            >
            > about adding an extra couple of pounds. I think using special designed
            >
            >
            >
            > winter hammocks is the way to go for winter hammocking rather then
            >
            >
            >
            > modifing a 3 season hammock for winter conditions. Just my thoughts and
            >
            >
            >
            > nothing is set in stone.
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
          • Bill Fornshell
            HI, Yes, the vent pipe has to go out of your enclosure. I just called Doug at TC.  He said one load of wood would only last 30 minutes or so before you would
            Message 5 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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              HI,

              Yes, the vent pipe has to go out of your enclosure.

              I just called Doug at TC.  He said one load of wood would only last 30 minutes or so before you would need to start adding some more wood.  The stove is not very large - 6.25" by 12" long.  He said he has had folks tell him they used charcoal.  He thinks your tent or what ever you were in might allow enough outside air to get in so you might be able to burn charcoal.  I would not take the chance with charcoal.

              I could see one of these being used to dry out my clothes if they were damp and to get my space warm at the time I decide to go to sleep.  Then start it back up early in the morning and warm things up and boil some water at the same time.  All of this might be done from the hammock if you got everything ready the night before.

              Bill in Texas

               

              --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Rick <ra1@...> wrote:
              From: Rick <ra1@...>
              Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
              To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 2:59 PM











              THe wood ian>an>s going to create carbon monoxide as well. The vent has to be

              vented outside the tent it is in. I don't think that charcoal would be

              hotter than wood. In the wood stove that I used in my tipi, there was a

              specific instruction not to burn cardboard or quantities of paper, as

              they could burn through the steel.



              I thought it was silly that cardboard would burn hotter than wood, but

              when I tried burning up some cardboard, it was considerably hotter than

              any of the wood fires I had made up to that point.



              Rick



              Bill Fornshell wrote:

              > Hi Ed,

              >

              > I don't know anyone that has used one of these. I talked to Doug last week about something and just had a look over the things he sells. I was really surprised at the low weight of his lightest stove.

              >

              > On the question about using charcoal, I think charcoal puts of carbon monoxide which would not be so good. It might be fun to do some testing with one of these. At 17 ounces for his lightest stove a light hiker could about carry one of these and still be under 25 pounds.

              >

              > Bill in Texas






















              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Jeff
              ... who s ... Here s a write-up w/ pics by Turk...he used a TiGoat stove inside a prototype JRB tarptent that he installed a stove jack in.
              Message 6 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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                --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Speer" <ed@...> wrote:
                >
                > The Titanium Goat stove does look good Bill. Do you know of anyone
                who's
                > tried one?

                Here's a write-up w/ pics by Turk...he used a TiGoat stove inside a
                prototype JRB tarptent that he installed a stove jack in.
                http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=2244

                Jeff
              • ratsmouth@aol.com
                Glad someone else brought up the CO issue with charcoal. I lost a high school friend who thought it was okay to light a hibachi in a (sort of) enclosed space
                Message 7 of 17 , Jan 2, 2009
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                  Glad someone else brought up the CO issue with charcoal. I lost a high
                  school friend who thought it was okay to light a hibachi in a (sort of)
                  enclosed space to keep warm one night. It was the last thing she ever
                  did. She left behind a two year old son. She was only 20.

                  Ratty


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Bill Fornshell <bfornshell@...>
                  To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 3:49 pm
                  Subject: RE: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter


                  Hi Ed,



                  I don't know anyone that has used one of these.  I talked to Doug last
                  week about something and just had a look over the things he sells.  I
                  was really surprised at the low weight of his lightest stove.



                  On the question about using charcoal, I think charcoal puts of carbon
                  monoxide which would not be so good.  It might be fun to do some
                  testing with one of these.  At 17 ounces for his lightest stove a light
                  hiker could about carry one of these and still be under 25 pounds.



                  Bill in Texas



                  --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Ed Speer <ed@...> wrote:

                  From: Ed Speer <ed@...>

                  Subject: RE: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter

                  To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com

                  Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 2:23 PM



                  The Titanium Goat stove does look good Bill. Do you know of anyone
                  who's



                  t
                  ried one? How long does it burn before needing more fuel? Could you
                  use



                  charcoal instead of wood? .Ed



                  Moderator, Hammock Camping List



                  Author, Hammock Camping book



                  Editor, Hammock Camping Newsletters



                  Owner, Speer Hammocks Inc



                  From: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:hammockcamping@
                  yahoogroups. com]



                  On Behalf Of Bill Fornshell



                  Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 3:08 PM



                  To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com



                  Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter



                  Hi,



                  Check out one of these wood stoves from Titanium Goat. Look at the
                  lightest



                  version. Just over 1 pound.



                  http://www.titanium goat.com/ cstove.html



                  If you had something like a tent around and over your hammock one of
                  these



                  might work.



                  If it was setup right you might be able to feed the stove without
                  getting



                  out of your hammock.



                  Bill in Texas



                  --- On Fri, 1/2/09, ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav%
                  40yahoo.com>



                  > wrote:



                  From: ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav% 40yahoo.com> >



                  Subject: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter



                  To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com <mailto:hammockcamp
                  ing%40yahoogroup s.com>



                  Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 12:5
                  8 PM



                  My son spent a couple of days in Maine camping out in 10 degree



                  weather. I asked him how he keep warm and he told me he used an



                  emergeny car powerstart battery assy. and plugged in his small heater



                  set on 500 watts and it lasted two 8 hr nights. Here's another thought,



                  use a winter tarp with a Zodi propane heater. Lugging around Powerstart



                  car batteries and Zodi heaters only adds a couple of more pounds



                  conpared with lugging around underquits and more padding. Each style of



                  camping will have different sets of parameters. The style of camping



                  using heaters and winter tents will only appeal to campers who pull



                  small sleds while snowshoeing in on flat terrain and could care less



                  about adding an extra couple of pounds. I think using special designed



                  winter hammocks is the way to go for winter hammocking rather then



                  modifing a 3 season hammock for winter conditions. Just my thoughts and



                  nothing is set in stone.



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]























                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Dave Womble
                  ... problems with ... Yeah I do and I can t get past the safely issues. I don t think silnylon is flame retardant to start with, I don t think our WinterTarp
                  Message 8 of 17 , Jan 3, 2009
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                    --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Speer" <ed@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Youngblood, do you have any thoughts on safety or condensation
                    problems with
                    > this stove & the WinterTarp? ..Ed
                    >

                    Yeah I do and I can't get past the safely issues. I don't think
                    silnylon is flame retardant to start with, I don't think our
                    WinterTarp is large enough when closed off for a wood burning stove,
                    and I think you might want something with a shape that was more
                    accommodating and had some means of exhausting the fumes for a wood
                    burning stove.

                    Our WinterTarp is designed for backpacking and as such it was designed
                    to be flexible enough to handle a wide range of conditions. When
                    backpacking with hammocks you don't always want your shelter closed
                    off or be confined to cleared and flat tent spots with appropriate
                    trees. Sometimes you just want rain protection and as much view as
                    possible, and sometimes you might want to camp on a slope in a cove
                    protected from the wind, etc. You are looking at something pretty
                    specialized when you are talking about a hammock tent/tarptent that
                    safely accommodates a wood burning stove for warmth.

                    Dave Womble
                    aka Youngblood 2000AT
                    designer of the Speer Segmented Pad Extender, SnugFit Underquilt, and
                    WinterTarp
                  • Dave Womble
                    ... nights) ... Thanks Ralph... I just looked over their site http://www.heatmax.com/HotHands/index.htm and they have a variety of products for this. I can see
                    Message 9 of 17 , Jan 3, 2009
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                      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Oborn" <Ralph.oborn@...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > Ed, I've been using the "hot hands" warmers for years while snow camping
                      > with my scouts.
                      > I would vote for them as the way to go over an electrical sytem.
                      >
                      > 1. Cheap (50 cents each)
                      > 2. Reliable (keep them in your winter pack)
                      > 3. Light weight (couple of oz each)
                      > 4. Flexible (don't use for warm nights, use two or three for cold
                      nights)
                      > 5. No chance of an electrical.
                      > 6. Uncomplicated
                      > 7. Proven
                      >
                      > Ralph (Pocatello)
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      Thanks Ralph... I just looked over their site
                      http://www.heatmax.com/HotHands/index.htm and they have a variety of
                      products for this.

                      I can see why you like them so much, with the climate you are in and
                      the Boy Scouts. I suspect they are required safety items for you?
                      They make a lot of sense for those just in case situations where
                      something happens you weren't prepared for or when you just need a
                      little more than what you have.

                      Dave
                    • Horace
                      Hi I just spent 3 nights in a tipi style tent with a larger wood burning stove. Banked up with 3-4 arm to leg thick pieces of wood it would stay warm for about
                      Message 10 of 17 , Jan 4, 2009
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                        Hi I just spent 3 nights in a tipi style tent with a larger wood
                        burning stove. Banked up with 3-4 arm to leg thick pieces of wood it
                        would stay warm for about 2-3 hours. Outside temperatures where around
                        freezing and it meant I could relax in comfort. Would be intresting to
                        try the stove out near to the hammock setup with additional tarps to
                        hold the heat a bit. Would certainly be warner than an open fire.
                        The sides can glow with wood so would be reluctant to try cardboard.
                        Also paper and cardboard throw out more ash and that which could
                        potentially pose a fire risk.
                        I only burnt wood and with doors closed it seemed ok for CO? May have
                        to get a CO tester to be sure next time.

                        Nigel

                        Sent from my iPhone!


                        On 2 Jan 2009, at 22:57, ratsmouth@... wrote:

                        > Glad someone else brought up the CO issue with charcoal. I lost a high
                        > school friend who thought it was okay to light a hibachi in a (sort
                        > of)
                        > enclosed space to keep warm one night. It was the last thing she ever
                        > did. She left behind a two year old son. She was only 20.
                        >
                        > Ratty
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: Bill Fornshell <bfornshell@...>
                        > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                        > Sent: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 3:49 pm
                        > Subject: RE: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
                        >
                        > Hi Ed,
                        >
                        > I don't know anyone that has used one of these. I talked to Doug last
                        > week about something and just had a look over the things he sells. I
                        > was really surprised at the low weight of his lightest stove.
                        >
                        > On the question about using charcoal, I think charcoal puts of carbon
                        > monoxide which would not be so good. It might be fun to do some
                        > testing with one of these. At 17 ounces for his lightest stove a
                        > light
                        > hiker could about carry one of these and still be under 25 pounds.
                        >
                        > Bill in Texas
                        >
                        > --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Ed Speer <ed@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > From: Ed Speer <ed@...>
                        >
                        > Subject: RE: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
                        >
                        > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
                        >
                        > Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 2:23 PM
                        >
                        > The Titanium Goat stove does look good Bill. Do you know of anyone
                        > who's
                        >
                        > t
                        > ried one? How long does it burn before needing more fuel? Could you
                        > use
                        >
                        > charcoal instead of wood? .Ed
                        >
                        > Moderator, Hammock Camping List
                        >
                        > Author, Hammock Camping book
                        >
                        > Editor, Hammock Camping Newsletters
                        >
                        > Owner, Speer Hammocks Inc
                        >
                        > From: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:hammockcamping@
                        > yahoogroups. com]
                        >
                        > On Behalf Of Bill Fornshell
                        >
                        > Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 3:08 PM
                        >
                        > To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com
                        >
                        > Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
                        >
                        > Hi,
                        >
                        > Check out one of these wood stoves from Titanium Goat. Look at the
                        > lightest
                        >
                        > version. Just over 1 pound.
                        >
                        > http://www.titanium goat.com/ cstove.html
                        >
                        > If you had something like a tent around and over your hammock one of
                        > these
                        >
                        > might work.
                        >
                        > If it was setup right you might be able to feed the stove without
                        > getting
                        >
                        > out of your hammock.
                        >
                        > Bill in Texas
                        >
                        > --- On Fri, 1/2/09, ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav%
                        > 40yahoo.com>
                        >
                        > > wrote:
                        >
                        > From: ginohav <ginohav@yahoo. com <mailto:ginohav% 40yahoo.com> >
                        >
                        > Subject: [Hammock Camping] Keeping warm in winter
                        >
                        > To: hammockcamping@ yahoogroups. com <mailto:hammockcamp
                        > ing%40yahoogroup s.com>
                        >
                        > Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 12:5
                        > 8 PM
                        >
                        > My son spent a couple of days in Maine camping out in 10 degree
                        >
                        > weather. I asked him how he keep warm and he told me he used an
                        >
                        > emergeny car powerstart battery assy. and plugged in his small heater
                        >
                        > set on 500 watts and it lasted two 8 hr nights. Here's another
                        > thought,
                        >
                        > use a winter tarp with a Zodi propane heater. Lugging around
                        > Powerstart
                        >
                        > car batteries and Zodi heaters only adds a couple of more pounds
                        >
                        > conpared with lugging around underquits and more padding. Each style
                        > of
                        >
                        > camping will have different sets of parameters. The style of camping
                        >
                        > using heaters and winter tents will only appeal to campers who pull
                        >
                        > small sleds while snowshoeing in on flat terrain and could care less
                        >
                        > about adding an extra couple of pounds. I think using special designed
                        >
                        > winter hammocks is the way to go for winter hammocking rather then
                        >
                        > modifing a 3 season hammock for winter conditions. Just my thoughts
                        > and
                        >
                        > nothing is set in stone.
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        > nsor .ad{ padding: 8px 0; } #ygrp-sponsor .ad #hd1{ font-
                        > family: Arial; font-weight: bold; color: #628c2a; font-size: 100%;
                        > line-height: 122%; } #ygrp-sponsor .ad a{ text-decoration: none; }
                        > #ygrp-sponsor .ad a:hover{ text-decoration: underline; } #ygrp-
                        > sponsor .ad p{ margin: 0; } o{font-size: 0; } .MsoNormal{ margin: 0
                        > 0 0 0; } #ygrp-text tt{ font-size: 120%; } blockquote{margin: 0 0 0
                        > 4px;} .replbq{margin:4} -->


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