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RE: [Hammock Camping] update PeaPod experience

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  • Ed Speer
    Hi Billybob, glad to see you putting that PeaPod to the test! Of course, I m a big believer in that sucker & I use mine a lot in all kinds of conditions. It
    Message 1 of 18 , Jan 6, 2008
      Hi Billybob, glad to see you putting that PeaPod to the test! Of course,
      I'm a big believer in that sucker & I use mine a lot in all kinds of
      conditions. It really is highly adaptable to varying conditions, and just
      as you found by completely closing the PeaPod, it can easily be adjusted for
      the conditions. When first attaching the PeaPod, I like to leave some open
      air space between it & the hammock, then if it's going to be cold, I fill
      that extra space with down blankets, CCF pads or unused clothing like
      jackets, rain pants, sweaters, pack covers, etc-the extra warmth is amazing.
      Even dead leaves can be added! In fact, packing the PeaPod with dead leaves
      can take you well below zero F without carrying any additional weight! In
      the winter, I carry several trash bags so I can even use wet leaves if
      necessary. I hope you get to experiment with some of these innovative
      techniques with your PeaPod...Ed



      Moderator, Hammock Camping List

      Author, Hammock Camping book

      Editor, Hammock Camping Newsletters

      Owner, Speer Hammocks Inc



      From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com [mailto:hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com]
      On Behalf Of billybob38801
      Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 1:47 AM
      To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [Hammock Camping] update PeaPod experience



      I thought I should post my most recent results in some real cold a
      couple of nights back.

      First, let me say that I am still having minor difficulties adjusting
      the "loft compression vs no air gap" conflict. IOW, it seems that if I
      adjust the PeaPod sag any where near where the pod barely contacts the
      hammock bottom with me in it- or even with a small gap, then I don't
      seem to have full loft right under my butt. So, I'm still working on
      that, and so far I can't quite figure it out. Also, I would like to
      know, if I can't have a very close fit without some loss of loft, then
      which should I sacrifice? Would I be better off with a air gap of an
      inch or two under my lowest point, and have full loft? Or the reverse,
      better off with a "snugfit" and some loss of loft of an inch or so?

      I should also say that I am probably an average sleeper temp wise. I
      used to be very hot natured, warm sleeper. But as I have gotten older, I
      definitely have much less tolerance for the cold. So, maybe I am now
      about in the middle, but who knows?

      Any way, the forecast low was 14-16*F. It was 11PM when I hung the
      hammock and put on the PeaPod by head lamp. Really quite easy to do, I
      just adjusted it for about the same distance from end knots as some
      previous experiments had shown to be correct. I was using a structural
      ridge line for consistent hang. Then I hung my tarp. It was already 19*,
      and by the time I did this I was starting to get quite a chill. There
      was also a bit of a wind chill all night, probably and additional 5* or
      a bit more.

      So, I hopped in and Velcroed up. I had on light thin long johns, 1 layer
      of medium wool socks with liner socks and vapor barrier on standby, neck
      gator, hat and Bozeman Mountain Works Cocoon Polargard pants ( 8 ozs )
      and hooded jacket ( 14 ozs.) that I had used on previous tests without
      quilt. But this time I added a 25 year old quallofil summer bag that
      has about 1-1.25 " SINGLE layer loft, used as quilt. The original rating
      was either 40* or 50*, I don't remember. And sense it was already 1*
      below the PeaPod's rating, I added a 2 oz space blanket to the pod,
      which covered the bottom and well up the sides of the hammock. I closed
      the Velcro down to about a 6" opening above my face, got on the diagonal
      a bit and tried to sleep, always tough for me to do in the back yard,
      for some reason. But not in the woods in a hammock, where I sleep like
      the dead! Once again, though it felt like the pod did not quite contact
      my low point ( very small gap), when I reached around the outside, it
      only felt like there was no more than 1 - 1.5" loft. I said to heck
      with it, as I figured there would be plenty of days on the trail where I
      would be too tired to fool with fine adjustments. Let's just see how it
      goes. I figured I would have to go in later, too cold.

      It took about 10 or 20 minutes before I realized that I was starting to
      over heat. So I let my hood down, and then I was just plenty warm, but
      not starting to sweat. I did my usual fitful backyard style sleeping,
      but plenty warm, I had to admit. Once during the night, I was not quite
      comfortable enough around my shoulders, having my usual trouble with
      draftiness when using a quilt, especially when I would move briefly to
      my side. I never have much luck using sleeping bags as quilts as far as
      drafts around the shoulders. But I would just snug the quilt up and be
      fine again until I moved too much, plus at some point I pulled the hood
      back up.

      Finally, I woke up at what I figured was about 0130 or 0230. I was no
      longer toasty warm, but I was not uncomfortably cold. Just barely cool,
      top and bottom. So I figured that's it, I'll go in and get some good
      sleep. It's probably about 16* and I have established my lower limit
      with this set-up. So I turned on my head lamp, looked at my watch, and
      lo and behold it was 0430! So I had made it through most of the night
      without getting uncomfortably cold, just barely cool. Amazingly for me,
      even though I had a big drink of water right before bed in hopes of
      staying hydrated in the cold, I had not even had to gt up and take a
      leak over 51/2 hours. So I decided to just ride it out until 0600, when
      I had to get up for work anyway. But as the night was nearly over, I
      decided to take a risk on condensation and closed the pod completely.
      Boy, that made a very noticeable difference pretty quickly. In a few
      minutes, I was agin warm on top, and still just ok on the bottom. I fell
      back asleep, but then car noises woke me up again at 0500, and now I
      realized I really did have to take a leak, so I just got up. I looked at
      my thermometer, and it read 10*! Plus, according to the weather folks,
      there was an intermittent wind chill of zero* to 5*.

      Folks, I don't know about you, but I think that is pretty darn good
      performance for that amount of gear in a hammock! It definitely worked
      as advertised. And I wonder if I can do better if I ever get better at
      getting a "snugfit" with out loft loss on the bottom?

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • David Fox
      I remember reading that you got cold around your shoulders and I was thinking I saw a pretty cool hood with Velcro that just attached to the peapod so there
      Message 2 of 18 , Jan 6, 2008
        I remember reading that you got cold around your shoulders and I was
        thinking I saw a pretty cool hood with Velcro that just attached to the
        peapod so there was no actual opening open to the air. As I remember it, you
        got into the hammock, closed the peapod up a bit, stuck your head into the
        polar fleece hood so that your face was exhaling out of the peapod but the
        hood kept out drafts. Looked cool to me.



        From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com [mailto:hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com]
        On Behalf Of billybob38801
        Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 9:10 AM
        To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] update PeaPod experience



        Hmm, it took me a minute to picture what you were saying, but I think
        you are on to something. Best of both worlds. It would, of course, be
        even more expensive than the normal PeaPod, but I guess no more so
        than a Snugfit plus a separate top quilt or two No Snivelers. I'm
        still looking forward to seeing some temp reports on the Snugfit.

        Though I'm still hoping I can get it adjusted just right. Once I do,
        I'll just leave it in place. But what's amazing to me is how well I
        did with a less than optimum ( apparently ) adjustment. Basically, at
        least as good as rated, I believe. I mean, a summer weight bag as
        quilt, some warm clothing( I've used more, believe me!)and a space
        blanket, and I am adequate at 10* with a wind chill between 0* and 5*,
        without any pads? What competing single product can beat that, even
        with a perfect adjustment? I'm impressed. After all, I'm not
        Mr.Antifreeze blood, AKA Neo!

        This thing is not perfect for me, and I hate that I can't use it with
        my HH, for example, and it won't necessarily replace all of my other
        means of keeping warm in a hammock. BUT, there is something just
        super efficient about this thing when it comes to hammock warmth. My
        impression is that reports I've seen with separate UQs plus top quilts
        don't show as much warmth? And I can understand that on top, since I
        added a thin quilt, which adds weight. But that shouldn't effect the
        bottom warmth.

        Maybe it is the effect of being sealed in, like a mummy bag? Which
        might be even more efficient using my separate Marmot hood outside the
        pod, with the pod sealed around my neck.

        I also wonder if being sealed in, with loft closing all around the
        side/top edges, decreases any cooling effect of small air gaps and
        less than perfect fit underneath? I can see where it would decrease
        any effect from breezes or air circulation, that might be more of a
        problem with quilts top and bottom? I don't know, just guessing about
        why this product seems to be warmer than you would think when
        comparing it to similar products, weight wise and rated loft wise.

        Of course, I really kind of expected ( no, let's say "hoped for")
        this. Due to having PMed a couple PeaPod users, who don't post very
        much on the forums. Folks who had reported super good results with
        their PeaPods on the trail. In all cases, better than rated for the
        PeaPod they were using.

        --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
        <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com> , tim garner <slowhike@...> wrote:
        >
        > maybe ed & dave need to come up w/ a section that covers the top of
        the hammock by velcroing to the snugfit quilt??? that may be just
        about ideal.
        >
        >
        > billybob38801 <billybob38801@...> wrote:
        > I thought I should post my most recent results in some real cold a
        > couple of nights back.
        >
        > First, let me say that I am still having minor difficulties adjusting
        > the "loft compression vs no air gap" conflict. IOW, it seems that if I
        > adjust the PeaPod sag any where near where the pod barely contacts the
        > hammock bottom with me in it- or even with a small gap, then I don't
        > seem to have full loft right under my butt. So, I'm still working on
        > that, and so far I can't quite figure it out. Also, I would like to
        > know, if I can't have a very close fit without some loss of loft, then
        > which should I sacrifice? Would I be better off with a air gap of an
        > inch or two under my lowest point, and have full loft? Or the reverse,
        > better off with a "snugfit" and some loss of loft of an inch or so?
        >
        > I should also say that I am probably an average sleeper temp wise. I
        > used to be very hot natured, warm sleeper. But as I have gotten older, I
        > definitely have much less tolerance for the cold. So, maybe I am now
        > about in the middle, but who knows?
        >
        > Any way, the forecast low was 14-16*F. It was 11PM when I hung the
        > hammock and put on the PeaPod by head lamp. Really quite easy to do, I
        > just adjusted it for about the same distance from end knots as some
        > previous experiments had shown to be correct. I was using a structural
        > ridge line for consistent hang. Then I hung my tarp. It was already 19*,
        > and by the time I did this I was starting to get quite a chill. There
        > was also a bit of a wind chill all night, probably and additional 5* or
        > a bit more.
        >
        > So, I hopped in and Velcroed up. I had on light thin long johns, 1 layer
        > of medium wool socks with liner socks and vapor barrier on standby, neck
        > gator, hat and Bozeman Mountain Works Cocoon Polargard pants ( 8 ozs )
        > and hooded jacket ( 14 ozs.) that I had used on previous tests without
        > quilt. But this time I added a 25 year old quallofil summer bag that
        > has about 1-1.25 " SINGLE layer loft, used as quilt. The original rating
        > was either 40* or 50*, I don't remember. And sense it was already 1*
        > below the PeaPod's rating, I added a 2 oz space blanket to the pod,
        > which covered the bottom and well up the sides of the hammock. I closed
        > the Velcro down to about a 6" opening above my face, got on the diagonal
        > a bit and tried to sleep, always tough for me to do in the back yard,
        > for some reason. But not in the woods in a hammock, where I sleep like
        > the dead! Once again, though it felt like the pod did not quite contact
        > my low point ( very small gap), when I reached around the outside, it
        > only felt like there was no more than 1 - 1.5" loft. I said to heck
        > with it, as I figured there would be plenty of days on the trail where I
        > would be too tired to fool with fine adjustments. Let's just see how it
        > goes. I figured I would have to go in later, too cold.
        >
        > It took about 10 or 20 minutes before I realized that I was starting to
        > over heat. So I let my hood down, and then I was just plenty warm, but
        > not starting to sweat. I did my usual fitful backyard style sleeping,
        > but plenty warm, I had to admit. Once during the night, I was not quite
        > comfortable enough around my shoulders, having my usual trouble with
        > draftiness when using a quilt, especially when I would move briefly to
        > my side. I never have much luck using sleeping bags as quilts as far as
        > drafts around the shoulders. But I would just snug the quilt up and be
        > fine again until I moved too much, plus at some point I pulled the hood
        > back up.
        >
        > Finally, I woke up at what I figured was about 0130 or 0230. I was no
        > longer toasty warm, but I was not uncomfortably cold. Just barely cool,
        > top and bottom. So I figured that's it, I'll go in and get some good
        > sleep. It's probably about 16* and I have established my lower limit
        > with this set-up. So I turned on my head lamp, looked at my watch, and
        > lo and behold it was 0430! So I had made it through most of the night
        > without getting uncomfortably cold, just barely cool. Amazingly for me,
        > even though I had a big drink of water right before bed in hopes of
        > staying hydrated in the cold, I had not even had to gt up and take a
        > leak over 51/2 hours. So I decided to just ride it out until 0600, when
        > I had to get up for work anyway. But as the night was nearly over, I
        > decided to take a risk on condensation and closed the pod completely.
        > Boy, that made a very noticeable difference pretty quickly. In a few
        > minutes, I was agin warm on top, and still just ok on the bottom. I fell
        > back asleep, but then car noises woke me up again at 0500, and now I
        > realized I really did have to take a leak, so I just got up. I looked at
        > my thermometer, and it read 10*! Plus, according to the weather folks,
        > there was an intermittent wind chill of zero* to 5*.
        >
        > Folks, I don't know about you, but I think that is pretty darn good
        > performance for that amount of gear in a hammock! It definitely worked
        > as advertised. And I wonder if I can do better if I ever get better at
        > getting a "snugfit" with out loft loss on the bottom?
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > don`t leave the CREATOR out of the creation!!!
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Johan van Dijk
        That was the peapod hood from Just Jeff s site www.tothewoods.net http://www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeGearPeaPodHood.html Sorry for answering Just Jeff but I
        Message 3 of 18 , Jan 7, 2008
          That was the peapod hood from "Just Jeff"'s site www.tothewoods.net

          http://www.tothewoods.net/HomemadeGearPeaPodHood.html

          Sorry for answering "Just Jeff" but I read your site alot and maybe Ed
          should offer a "peapodhood" as an accessory (sp?) if possible. Now I will
          have to start tinkering myself and god knows I am pretty clumsy at that. ;-)

          Patiently awaiting my peapod, hammock and wintertarp....

          Grtz Johan

          --
          It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most
          intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.

          --
          mob: +31 6 44 80 82 63
          email: gonewalkabout2003@...

          http://www.geocities.com/johanvandijk
          http://calendar.yahoo.com/johanvandijk
          --


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • billybob38801
          That must have been JustJeff s PeaPod hood. It is a good idea. I have a very lofty separate Marmot hood that I can use for that purpose, though I have not
          Message 4 of 18 , Jan 7, 2008
            That must have been JustJeff's PeaPod hood. It is a good idea. I have
            a very lofty separate Marmot hood that I can use for that purpose,
            though I have not tried it yet. It even has some velcro around the
            neck area that might match up with the scratchy side PeaPod Velcro.

            Also, if I was expecting consistent temps this cold(10*) or colder, I
            might use a light summer mummy bag, as I already do( winter weight
            though) when it's really cold and I'm in my HH SuperShelter. Then the
            hood and draft collar make any neck draft problem go away. Yes, I know
            it stinks trying to get in a mummy bag in a hammock, but I can do it
            now with minimal stuggle. And my experience has been that nothing is
            competitive with a mummy's hood/collar heat sealing abilities.

            But in this test, that "cool shoulders" due to a poor quilt fit pretty
            much disappeared when I closed the pod down from a 3-6 or so inch
            opening to all the way closed. There was a quick warm up then. Yes, I
            know, I worry about the condensation in the pod also. But I didn't
            really see any that was enough to decrease loft. There was a bit of
            dampness in the area just above my face, but again, there was still
            plenty of loft. But I wouldn't want to do this unless I could count on
            some sunshine to dry out the pod.

            I'm thinking we might be able to get away with this because of the
            Velcro closure? ( wild guess)IOW, since there is no draft tube, the
            pod's closure, even when fully closed, is relatively open compared to
            a zipper, especially with a draft tube.

            This MIGHT be just enough super breathable area ( no down in the way)
            to allow most moisture to escape around/thru the Velco, without having
            to go thru the down first and possibly condensing there?

            Anybody here with lot's of experience fully closing the pod in really
            cold weather? Do you have much trouble with wet down, as we would
            normally expect?
            Bill

            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "David Fox" <amendment2@...> wrote:
            >
            > I remember reading that you got cold around your shoulders and I was
            > thinking I saw a pretty cool hood with Velcro that just attached to the
            > peapod so there was no actual opening open to the air. As I remember
            it, you
            > got into the hammock, closed the peapod up a bit, stuck your head
            into the
            > polar fleece hood so that your face was exhaling out of the peapod
            but the
            > hood kept out drafts. Looked cool to me.
            >
            >
            >
            > From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
            [mailto:hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com]
            > On Behalf Of billybob38801
            > Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 9:10 AM
            > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] update PeaPod experience
            >
            >
            >
            > Hmm, it took me a minute to picture what you were saying, but I think
            > you are on to something. Best of both worlds. It would, of course, be
            > even more expensive than the normal PeaPod, but I guess no more so
            > than a Snugfit plus a separate top quilt or two No Snivelers. I'm
            > still looking forward to seeing some temp reports on the Snugfit.
            >
            > Though I'm still hoping I can get it adjusted just right. Once I do,
            > I'll just leave it in place. But what's amazing to me is how well I
            > did with a less than optimum ( apparently ) adjustment. Basically, at
            > least as good as rated, I believe. I mean, a summer weight bag as
            > quilt, some warm clothing( I've used more, believe me!)and a space
            > blanket, and I am adequate at 10* with a wind chill between 0* and 5*,
            > without any pads? What competing single product can beat that, even
            > with a perfect adjustment? I'm impressed. After all, I'm not
            > Mr.Antifreeze blood, AKA Neo!
            >
            > This thing is not perfect for me, and I hate that I can't use it with
            > my HH, for example, and it won't necessarily replace all of my other
            > means of keeping warm in a hammock. BUT, there is something just
            > super efficient about this thing when it comes to hammock warmth. My
            > impression is that reports I've seen with separate UQs plus top quilts
            > don't show as much warmth? And I can understand that on top, since I
            > added a thin quilt, which adds weight. But that shouldn't effect the
            > bottom warmth.
            >
            > Maybe it is the effect of being sealed in, like a mummy bag? Which
            > might be even more efficient using my separate Marmot hood outside the
            > pod, with the pod sealed around my neck.
            >
            > I also wonder if being sealed in, with loft closing all around the
            > side/top edges, decreases any cooling effect of small air gaps and
            > less than perfect fit underneath? I can see where it would decrease
            > any effect from breezes or air circulation, that might be more of a
            > problem with quilts top and bottom? I don't know, just guessing about
            > why this product seems to be warmer than you would think when
            > comparing it to similar products, weight wise and rated loft wise.
            >
            > Of course, I really kind of expected ( no, let's say "hoped for")
            > this. Due to having PMed a couple PeaPod users, who don't post very
            > much on the forums. Folks who had reported super good results with
            > their PeaPods on the trail. In all cases, better than rated for the
            > PeaPod they were using.
            >
            > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com> , tim garner <slowhike@>
            wrote:
            > >
            > > maybe ed & dave need to come up w/ a section that covers the top of
            > the hammock by velcroing to the snugfit quilt??? that may be just
            > about ideal.
            > >
            > >
            > > billybob38801 <billybob38801@> wrote:
            > > I thought I should post my most recent results in some real cold a
            > > couple of nights back.
            > >
            > > First, let me say that I am still having minor difficulties adjusting
            > > the "loft compression vs no air gap" conflict. IOW, it seems that if I
            > > adjust the PeaPod sag any where near where the pod barely contacts the
            > > hammock bottom with me in it- or even with a small gap, then I don't
            > > seem to have full loft right under my butt. So, I'm still working on
            > > that, and so far I can't quite figure it out. Also, I would like to
            > > know, if I can't have a very close fit without some loss of loft, then
            > > which should I sacrifice? Would I be better off with a air gap of an
            > > inch or two under my lowest point, and have full loft? Or the reverse,
            > > better off with a "snugfit" and some loss of loft of an inch or so?
            > >
            > > I should also say that I am probably an average sleeper temp wise. I
            > > used to be very hot natured, warm sleeper. But as I have gotten
            older, I
            > > definitely have much less tolerance for the cold. So, maybe I am now
            > > about in the middle, but who knows?
            > >
            > > Any way, the forecast low was 14-16*F. It was 11PM when I hung the
            > > hammock and put on the PeaPod by head lamp. Really quite easy to do, I
            > > just adjusted it for about the same distance from end knots as some
            > > previous experiments had shown to be correct. I was using a structural
            > > ridge line for consistent hang. Then I hung my tarp. It was
            already 19*,
            > > and by the time I did this I was starting to get quite a chill. There
            > > was also a bit of a wind chill all night, probably and additional
            5* or
            > > a bit more.
            > >
            > > So, I hopped in and Velcroed up. I had on light thin long johns, 1
            layer
            > > of medium wool socks with liner socks and vapor barrier on
            standby, neck
            > > gator, hat and Bozeman Mountain Works Cocoon Polargard pants ( 8 ozs )
            > > and hooded jacket ( 14 ozs.) that I had used on previous tests without
            > > quilt. But this time I added a 25 year old quallofil summer bag that
            > > has about 1-1.25 " SINGLE layer loft, used as quilt. The original
            rating
            > > was either 40* or 50*, I don't remember. And sense it was already 1*
            > > below the PeaPod's rating, I added a 2 oz space blanket to the pod,
            > > which covered the bottom and well up the sides of the hammock. I
            closed
            > > the Velcro down to about a 6" opening above my face, got on the
            diagonal
            > > a bit and tried to sleep, always tough for me to do in the back yard,
            > > for some reason. But not in the woods in a hammock, where I sleep like
            > > the dead! Once again, though it felt like the pod did not quite
            contact
            > > my low point ( very small gap), when I reached around the outside, it
            > > only felt like there was no more than 1 - 1.5" loft. I said to heck
            > > with it, as I figured there would be plenty of days on the trail
            where I
            > > would be too tired to fool with fine adjustments. Let's just see
            how it
            > > goes. I figured I would have to go in later, too cold.
            > >
            > > It took about 10 or 20 minutes before I realized that I was
            starting to
            > > over heat. So I let my hood down, and then I was just plenty warm, but
            > > not starting to sweat. I did my usual fitful backyard style sleeping,
            > > but plenty warm, I had to admit. Once during the night, I was not
            quite
            > > comfortable enough around my shoulders, having my usual trouble with
            > > draftiness when using a quilt, especially when I would move briefly to
            > > my side. I never have much luck using sleeping bags as quilts as
            far as
            > > drafts around the shoulders. But I would just snug the quilt up and be
            > > fine again until I moved too much, plus at some point I pulled the
            hood
            > > back up.
            > >
            > > Finally, I woke up at what I figured was about 0130 or 0230. I was no
            > > longer toasty warm, but I was not uncomfortably cold. Just barely
            cool,
            > > top and bottom. So I figured that's it, I'll go in and get some good
            > > sleep. It's probably about 16* and I have established my lower limit
            > > with this set-up. So I turned on my head lamp, looked at my watch, and
            > > lo and behold it was 0430! So I had made it through most of the night
            > > without getting uncomfortably cold, just barely cool. Amazingly
            for me,
            > > even though I had a big drink of water right before bed in hopes of
            > > staying hydrated in the cold, I had not even had to gt up and take a
            > > leak over 51/2 hours. So I decided to just ride it out until 0600,
            when
            > > I had to get up for work anyway. But as the night was nearly over, I
            > > decided to take a risk on condensation and closed the pod completely.
            > > Boy, that made a very noticeable difference pretty quickly. In a few
            > > minutes, I was agin warm on top, and still just ok on the bottom.
            I fell
            > > back asleep, but then car noises woke me up again at 0500, and now I
            > > realized I really did have to take a leak, so I just got up. I
            looked at
            > > my thermometer, and it read 10*! Plus, according to the weather folks,
            > > there was an intermittent wind chill of zero* to 5*.
            > >
            > > Folks, I don't know about you, but I think that is pretty darn good
            > > performance for that amount of gear in a hammock! It definitely worked
            > > as advertised. And I wonder if I can do better if I ever get better at
            > > getting a "snugfit" with out loft loss on the bottom?
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > don`t leave the CREATOR out of the creation!!!
            > >
            > >
            > > ---------------------------------
            > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Ed Speer
            Bill, I hope others will also respond to your question, but I ve never seen a serious problem with condensation when I ve closed my PeaPod completely. Of
            Message 5 of 18 , Jan 7, 2008
              Bill, I hope others will also respond to your question, but I've never seen
              a serious problem with condensation when I've closed my PeaPod completely.
              Of course, some wetness does occur directly above my face, but it's a small
              price to pay for being snug & warm. I too have noticed that the wetness
              isn't as bad as I would have expected, perhaps because the PeaPod has
              breathable shells & my own body heat helps drive some of the moisture all
              the way out. I've had success reducing the wetness a bit by wearing the
              re-breather balaclava (forgot the brand name-Rick gear tested this item a
              year or so ago). A bandana over my mouth & nose does about the same thing &
              traps some of the moisture before it gets into the PeaPod. The PeaPod still
              gets a little wet, but this isn't a major problem even on week long trips.
              I've had my PeaPod get a whole lot wetter just from dew condensing on it on
              high-humidity nights, but this also seems to evaporate with no loss of
              warmth, again perhaps because my body warms the PeaPod again the next night,
              driving out any accumulated moisture. I've often thought of doing some
              weight tests to see if moisture continues to accumulate on multi-night use,
              but haven't yet-so I too am interested in other people's experience..Ed



              Moderator, Hammock Camping List

              Author, Hammock Camping book

              Editor, Hammock Camping Newsletters

              Owner, Speer Hammocks Inc



              From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com [mailto:hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com]
              On Behalf Of billybob38801
              Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 12:36 PM
              To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [SPAM]Re: [Hammock Camping] update PeaPod experience



              That must have been JustJeff's PeaPod hood. It is a good idea. I have
              a very lofty separate Marmot hood that I can use for that purpose,
              though I have not tried it yet. It even has some velcro around the
              neck area that might match up with the scratchy side PeaPod Velcro.

              Also, if I was expecting consistent temps this cold(10*) or colder, I
              might use a light summer mummy bag, as I already do( winter weight
              though) when it's really cold and I'm in my HH SuperShelter. Then the
              hood and draft collar make any neck draft problem go away. Yes, I know
              it stinks trying to get in a mummy bag in a hammock, but I can do it
              now with minimal stuggle. And my experience has been that nothing is
              competitive with a mummy's hood/collar heat sealing abilities.

              But in this test, that "cool shoulders" due to a poor quilt fit pretty
              much disappeared when I closed the pod down from a 3-6 or so inch
              opening to all the way closed. There was a quick warm up then. Yes, I
              know, I worry about the condensation in the pod also. But I didn't
              really see any that was enough to decrease loft. There was a bit of
              dampness in the area just above my face, but again, there was still
              plenty of loft. But I wouldn't want to do this unless I could count on
              some sunshine to dry out the pod.

              I'm thinking we might be able to get away with this because of the
              Velcro closure? ( wild guess)IOW, since there is no draft tube, the
              pod's closure, even when fully closed, is relatively open compared to
              a zipper, especially with a draft tube.

              This MIGHT be just enough super breathable area ( no down in the way)
              to allow most moisture to escape around/thru the Velco, without having
              to go thru the down first and possibly condensing there?

              Anybody here with lot's of experience fully closing the pod in really
              cold weather? Do you have much trouble with wet down, as we would
              normally expect?
              Bill

              --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com> , "David Fox" <amendment2@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > I remember reading that you got cold around your shoulders and I was
              > thinking I saw a pretty cool hood with Velcro that just attached to the
              > peapod so there was no actual opening open to the air. As I remember
              it, you
              > got into the hammock, closed the peapod up a bit, stuck your head
              into the
              > polar fleece hood so that your face was exhaling out of the peapod
              but the
              > hood kept out drafts. Looked cool to me.
              >
              >
              >
              > From: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com>
              [mailto:hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com> ]
              > On Behalf Of billybob38801
              > Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2008 9:10 AM
              > To: hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com>
              > Subject: Re: [Hammock Camping] update PeaPod experience
              >
              >
              >
              > Hmm, it took me a minute to picture what you were saying, but I think
              > you are on to something. Best of both worlds. It would, of course, be
              > even more expensive than the normal PeaPod, but I guess no more so
              > than a Snugfit plus a separate top quilt or two No Snivelers. I'm
              > still looking forward to seeing some temp reports on the Snugfit.
              >
              > Though I'm still hoping I can get it adjusted just right. Once I do,
              > I'll just leave it in place. But what's amazing to me is how well I
              > did with a less than optimum ( apparently ) adjustment. Basically, at
              > least as good as rated, I believe. I mean, a summer weight bag as
              > quilt, some warm clothing( I've used more, believe me!)and a space
              > blanket, and I am adequate at 10* with a wind chill between 0* and 5*,
              > without any pads? What competing single product can beat that, even
              > with a perfect adjustment? I'm impressed. After all, I'm not
              > Mr.Antifreeze blood, AKA Neo!
              >
              > This thing is not perfect for me, and I hate that I can't use it with
              > my HH, for example, and it won't necessarily replace all of my other
              > means of keeping warm in a hammock. BUT, there is something just
              > super efficient about this thing when it comes to hammock warmth. My
              > impression is that reports I've seen with separate UQs plus top quilts
              > don't show as much warmth? And I can understand that on top, since I
              > added a thin quilt, which adds weight. But that shouldn't effect the
              > bottom warmth.
              >
              > Maybe it is the effect of being sealed in, like a mummy bag? Which
              > might be even more efficient using my separate Marmot hood outside the
              > pod, with the pod sealed around my neck.
              >
              > I also wonder if being sealed in, with loft closing all around the
              > side/top edges, decreases any cooling effect of small air gaps and
              > less than perfect fit underneath? I can see where it would decrease
              > any effect from breezes or air circulation, that might be more of a
              > problem with quilts top and bottom? I don't know, just guessing about
              > why this product seems to be warmer than you would think when
              > comparing it to similar products, weight wise and rated loft wise.
              >
              > Of course, I really kind of expected ( no, let's say "hoped for")
              > this. Due to having PMed a couple PeaPod users, who don't post very
              > much on the forums. Folks who had reported super good results with
              > their PeaPods on the trail. In all cases, better than rated for the
              > PeaPod they were using.
              >
              > --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com
              <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com>
              > <mailto:hammockcamping%40yahoogroups.com> , tim garner <slowhike@>
              wrote:
              > >
              > > maybe ed & dave need to come up w/ a section that covers the top of
              > the hammock by velcroing to the snugfit quilt??? that may be just
              > about ideal.
              > >
              > >
              > > billybob38801 <billybob38801@> wrote:
              > > I thought I should post my most recent results in some real cold a
              > > couple of nights back.
              > >
              > > First, let me say that I am still having minor difficulties adjusting
              > > the "loft compression vs no air gap" conflict. IOW, it seems that if I
              > > adjust the PeaPod sag any where near where the pod barely contacts the
              > > hammock bottom with me in it- or even with a small gap, then I don't
              > > seem to have full loft right under my butt. So, I'm still working on
              > > that, and so far I can't quite figure it out. Also, I would like to
              > > know, if I can't have a very close fit without some loss of loft, then
              > > which should I sacrifice? Would I be better off with a air gap of an
              > > inch or two under my lowest point, and have full loft? Or the reverse,
              > > better off with a "snugfit" and some loss of loft of an inch or so?
              > >
              > > I should also say that I am probably an average sleeper temp wise. I
              > > used to be very hot natured, warm sleeper. But as I have gotten
              older, I
              > > definitely have much less tolerance for the cold. So, maybe I am now
              > > about in the middle, but who knows?
              > >
              > > Any way, the forecast low was 14-16*F. It was 11PM when I hung the
              > > hammock and put on the PeaPod by head lamp. Really quite easy to do, I
              > > just adjusted it for about the same distance from end knots as some
              > > previous experiments had shown to be correct. I was using a structural
              > > ridge line for consistent hang. Then I hung my tarp. It was
              already 19*,
              > > and by the time I did this I was starting to get quite a chill. There
              > > was also a bit of a wind chill all night, probably and additional
              5* or
              > > a bit more.
              > >
              > > So, I hopped in and Velcroed up. I had on light thin long johns, 1
              layer
              > > of medium wool socks with liner socks and vapor barrier on
              standby, neck
              > > gator, hat and Bozeman Mountain Works Cocoon Polargard pants ( 8 ozs )
              > > and hooded jacket ( 14 ozs.) that I had used on previous tests without
              > > quilt. But this time I added a 25 year old quallofil summer bag that
              > > has about 1-1.25 " SINGLE layer loft, used as quilt. The original
              rating
              > > was either 40* or 50*, I don't remember. And sense it was already 1*
              > > below the PeaPod's rating, I added a 2 oz space blanket to the pod,
              > > which covered the bottom and well up the sides of the hammock. I
              closed
              > > the Velcro down to about a 6" opening above my face, got on the
              diagonal
              > > a bit and tried to sleep, always tough for me to do in the back yard,
              > > for some reason. But not in the woods in a hammock, where I sleep like
              > > the dead! Once again, though it felt like the pod did not quite
              contact
              > > my low point ( very small gap), when I reached around the outside, it
              > > only felt like there was no more than 1 - 1.5" loft. I said to heck
              > > with it, as I figured there would be plenty of days on the trail
              where I
              > > would be too tired to fool with fine adjustments. Let's just see
              how it
              > > goes. I figured I would have to go in later, too cold.
              > >
              > > It took about 10 or 20 minutes before I realized that I was
              starting to
              > > over heat. So I let my hood down, and then I was just plenty warm, but
              > > not starting to sweat. I did my usual fitful backyard style sleeping,
              > > but plenty warm, I had to admit. Once during the night, I was not
              quite
              > > comfortable enough around my shoulders, having my usual trouble with
              > > draftiness when using a quilt, especially when I would move briefly to
              > > my side. I never have much luck using sleeping bags as quilts as
              far as
              > > drafts around the shoulders. But I would just snug the quilt up and be
              > > fine again until I moved too much, plus at some point I pulled the
              hood
              > > back up.
              > >
              > > Finally, I woke up at what I figured was about 0130 or 0230. I was no
              > > longer toasty warm, but I was not uncomfortably cold. Just barely
              cool,
              > > top and bottom. So I figured that's it, I'll go in and get some good
              > > sleep. It's probably about 16* and I have established my lower limit
              > > with this set-up. So I turned on my head lamp, looked at my watch, and
              > > lo and behold it was 0430! So I had made it through most of the night
              > > without getting uncomfortably cold, just barely cool. Amazingly
              for me,
              > > even though I had a big drink of water right before bed in hopes of
              > > staying hydrated in the cold, I had not even had to gt up and take a
              > > leak over 51/2 hours. So I decided to just ride it out until 0600,
              when
              > > I had to get up for work anyway. But as the night was nearly over, I
              > > decided to take a risk on condensation and closed the pod completely.
              > > Boy, that made a very noticeable difference pretty quickly. In a few
              > > minutes, I was agin warm on top, and still just ok on the bottom.
              I fell
              > > back asleep, but then car noises woke me up again at 0500, and now I
              > > realized I really did have to take a leak, so I just got up. I
              looked at
              > > my thermometer, and it read 10*! Plus, according to the weather folks,
              > > there was an intermittent wind chill of zero* to 5*.
              > >
              > > Folks, I don't know about you, but I think that is pretty darn good
              > > performance for that amount of gear in a hammock! It definitely worked
              > > as advertised. And I wonder if I can do better if I ever get better at
              > > getting a "snugfit" with out loft loss on the bottom?
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > don`t leave the CREATOR out of the creation!!!
              > >
              > >
              > > ---------------------------------
              > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Cara Lin Bridgman
              ... This sort of condensation occurs on the ground with sleeping mats and in ordinary mummy-bags. I ve always saw it as one of the normal and unavoidable
              Message 6 of 18 , Jan 7, 2008
                Ed Speer wrote:
                > but I've never seen a serious problem with condensation
                > when I've closed my PeaPod completely. Of course, some
                > wetness does occur directly above my face, but it's a small
                > price to pay for being snug & warm.


                This sort of condensation occurs on the ground with sleeping mats and in
                ordinary mummy-bags. I've always saw it as one of the normal and
                unavoidable parts of camping in the cold.

                CL
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