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  • tim garner
    yeah, there`s been quite a bit of talk here & on other backpacking groups/sites about tree damage. others here can do a better job of explaining the in`s &
    Message 1 of 9 , May 30, 2006
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      yeah, there`s been quite a bit of talk here & on other backpacking
      groups/sites about tree damage. others here can do a better job of
      explaining the in`s & out`s of it, but here`s what i`ve gathered so
      far.
      the damage will vary from one kind of tree to another (like a
      smooth bark beech or a rough bark pine). and then there are differant
      kinds & thickness` of rope.
      some bark could probably take it with-out any sign of damage,
      especialy not anything that would show up as a problem for quite some
      time. but even though a hammock gives us a lot of freedom in where we
      sleep, the best place we find our hammock for the night may be using
      trees with thin bark.
      it seems a much better idea to err on the side of caution,
      especialy when we`re encouraging others to try hammocking & some of
      those folks may not know any differance from one tree to another.
      and some of them probably wont care. so it`s better to encourage
      the use of a flat webbing tree hugger or the hollowbraid rope like
      dave & several of us are using (being hollow, it flatens out when
      streched).
      ...tim
    • Aris Dennis
      Hi Tim, where can you get this hollow braid rope? is it polypro? Aris ... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam?
      Message 2 of 9 , May 30, 2006
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        Hi Tim,
        where can you get this hollow braid rope? is it
        polypro?
        Aris

        --- tim garner <slowhike@...> wrote:

        > yeah, there`s been quite a bit of talk here & on
        > other backpacking
        > groups/sites about tree damage. others here can
        > do a better job of
        > explaining the in`s & out`s of it, but here`s what
        > i`ve gathered so
        > far.
        > the damage will vary from one kind of tree to
        > another (like a
        > smooth bark beech or a rough bark pine). and then
        > there are differant
        > kinds & thickness` of rope.
        > some bark could probably take it with-out any
        > sign of damage,
        > especialy not anything that would show up as a
        > problem for quite some
        > time. but even though a hammock gives us a lot of
        > freedom in where we
        > sleep, the best place we find our hammock for the
        > night may be using
        > trees with thin bark.
        > it seems a much better idea to err on the side of
        > caution,
        > especialy when we`re encouraging others to try
        > hammocking & some of
        > those folks may not know any differance from one
        > tree to another.
        > and some of them probably wont care. so it`s
        > better to encourage
        > the use of a flat webbing tree hugger or the
        > hollowbraid rope like
        > dave & several of us are using (being hollow, it
        > flatens out when
        > streched).
        > ...tim
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >


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      • kbwaddy
        tim, where can i find info on this hollow braid rope, is it much heavier than a regular lightweight cord, whats it made of etc...Brandon
        Message 3 of 9 , May 30, 2006
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          tim, where can i find info on this hollow braid rope, is it much heavier than a
          regular lightweight cord, whats it made of etc...Brandon



          --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "tim garner" <slowhike@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > yeah, there`s been quite a bit of talk here & on other backpacking
          > groups/sites about tree damage. others here can do a better job of
          > explaining the in`s & out`s of it, but here`s what i`ve gathered so
          > far.
          > the damage will vary from one kind of tree to another (like a
          > smooth bark beech or a rough bark pine). and then there are differant
          > kinds & thickness` of rope.
          > some bark could probably take it with-out any sign of damage,
          > especialy not anything that would show up as a problem for quite some
          > time. but even though a hammock gives us a lot of freedom in where we
          > sleep, the best place we find our hammock for the night may be using
          > trees with thin bark.
          > it seems a much better idea to err on the side of caution,
          > especialy when we`re encouraging others to try hammocking & some of
          > those folks may not know any differance from one tree to another.
          > and some of them probably wont care. so it`s better to encourage
          > the use of a flat webbing tree hugger or the hollowbraid rope like
          > dave & several of us are using (being hollow, it flatens out when
          > streched).
          > ...tim
          >
        • tim garner
          aris & brandon... g-morning. if i`m not mistaken, dave (youngblood) was the 1st to point out the usefulness of this type rope. i belive it`s poly, & the way
          Message 4 of 9 , May 31, 2006
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            aris & brandon... g-morning. if i`m not mistaken, dave (youngblood) was the 1st to point out the usefulness of this type rope.
            i belive it`s poly, & the way it`s braided, there`s nothing in the center. it`s actualy a hollow tube. so when it`s pulled against a tree, it flatens out, just like a pice of webbing.
            they sell it at lowes, home depot, or most any hardware store. i got mine at the local general store. i belive 3/8" is what most are using. someone else will have to fill you in on the breaking strength/safe working strength, but that size seems to be plenty strong. or check the files on this group.
            the weight is less, belive it or not, than webbing.
            now some may make the point that even though this kind of rope seems to be very "tree frendly", if we use "rope" instead of flat webbing, we are inviting trouble, because some will see our using rope & choose to use rope themselfs, not understand (or caring) about the differance in this type of rope. i certainly understand that point, but i`ve desided to at least give the hollow braid a try. i`ll be using it for the 2nd time this weekend. thanks ...tim



            kbwaddy <kbwaddy@...> wrote:
            tim, where can i find info on this hollow braid rope, is it much heavier than a
            regular lightweight cord, whats it made of etc...Brandon



            --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "tim garner" <slowhike@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > yeah, there`s been quite a bit of talk here & on other backpacking
            > groups/sites about tree damage. others here can do a better job of
            > explaining the in`s & out`s of it, but here`s what i`ve gathered so
            > far.
            > the damage will vary from one kind of tree to another (like a
            > smooth bark beech or a rough bark pine). and then there are differant
            > kinds & thickness` of rope.
            > some bark could probably take it with-out any sign of damage,
            > especialy not anything that would show up as a problem for quite some
            > time. but even though a hammock gives us a lot of freedom in where we
            > sleep, the best place we find our hammock for the night may be using
            > trees with thin bark.
            > it seems a much better idea to err on the side of caution,
            > especialy when we`re encouraging others to try hammocking & some of
            > those folks may not know any differance from one tree to another.
            > and some of them probably wont care. so it`s better to encourage
            > the use of a flat webbing tree hugger or the hollowbraid rope like
            > dave & several of us are using (being hollow, it flatens out when
            > streched).
            > ...tim
            >







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            tim garner

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          • sebastiantoney
            I use 1.5 inch webbing for my hammock. There is gonna be some damage no matter what you do. Here s what I think: the last tornado that came throught town did
            Message 5 of 9 , Jun 1 8:53 AM
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              I use 1.5 inch webbing for my hammock. There is gonna be some "damage"
              no matter what you do.

              Here's what I think: the last tornado that came throught town did a
              whole lot more damage to trees than I ever could. If you look at the
              number of trees destoryed by hurricanes, earthquakes, floods,
              droughts, lightning, thunderstorms, tornados, tsunamis, etc, those
              natural disasters have probably done a million times more damage to
              trees than the entire hammock hanger population world wide.

              So if a little bark falls off, big deal. Once another tornado hits my
              little town that tree might not be there.

              --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "tim garner" <slowhike@...> wrote:
              >
              > yeah, there`s been quite a bit of talk here & on other backpacking
              > groups/sites about tree damage. others here can do a better job of
              > explaining the in`s & out`s of it, but here`s what i`ve gathered so
              > far.
              > the damage will vary from one kind of tree to another (like a
              > smooth bark beech or a rough bark pine). and then there are differant
              > kinds & thickness` of rope.
              > some bark could probably take it with-out any sign of damage,
              > especialy not anything that would show up as a problem for quite some
              > time. but even though a hammock gives us a lot of freedom in where we
              > sleep, the best place we find our hammock for the night may be using
              > trees with thin bark.
              > it seems a much better idea to err on the side of caution,
              > especialy when we`re encouraging others to try hammocking & some of
              > those folks may not know any differance from one tree to another.
              > and some of them probably wont care. so it`s better to encourage
              > the use of a flat webbing tree hugger or the hollowbraid rope like
              > dave & several of us are using (being hollow, it flatens out when
              > streched).
              > ...tim
              >
            • John Wilson
              ... Yes, but some over-zealous park official isn t going to propose (and probably get passed) a regulation banning tornados and hurricanes from state or
              Message 6 of 9 , Jun 1 3:19 PM
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                On Jun 1, 2006, at 11:53 AM, sebastiantoney wrote:

                > Here's what I think: the last tornado that came throught town did a
                > whole lot more damage to trees than I ever could. If you look at the
                > number of trees destoryed by hurricanes, earthquakes, floods,
                > droughts, lightning, thunderstorms, tornados, tsunamis, etc, those
                > natural disasters have probably done a million times more damage to
                > trees than the entire hammock hanger population world wide.
                >
                > So if a little bark falls off, big deal. Once another tornado hits my
                > little town that tree might not be there.

                Yes, but some over-zealous park official isn't going to propose (and
                probably get passed) a regulation banning tornados and hurricanes
                from state or national parks. But let a little tree damage from
                hammocks occur, and see if this doesn't happen. The fault of your
                analogy is that natural disasters (you didn't mention forest fires)
                are unavoidable, while much more minor damage (or even perceived
                damage) from hammocks is avoidable by passing a regulation. As one
                who used to write regulations for a natural resources agency, I know
                of which I speak -- if your only tool is a hammer, every problem
                seems like a nail. And if your only tool is prohibition . . . .

                John



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Ralph Oborn
                ... Yes, but some over-zealous park official isn t going to propose (and probably get passed) a regulation banning tornados and hurricanes from state or
                Message 7 of 9 , Jun 1 4:37 PM
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                  > So if a little bark falls off, big deal. Once another tornado hits my
                  > little town that tree might not be there.

                  Yes, but some over-zealous park official isn't going to propose (and
                  probably get passed) a regulation banning tornados and hurricanes
                  from state or national parks. But let a little tree damage from
                  hammocks occur, and see if this doesn't happen. The fault of your
                  analogy is that natural disasters (you didn't mention forest fires)
                  are unavoidable, while much more minor damage (or even perceived
                  damage) from hammocks is avoidable by passing a regulation. As one
                  who used to write regulations for a natural resources agency, I know
                  of which I speak -- if your only tool is a hammer, every problem
                  seems like a nail. And if your only tool is prohibition . . . .


                  Hey,
                  Before I knew about tree huggers, I got harrased in Yellowstone by a
                  backwoods ranger for harming tree bark with a cheep string hammock. He
                  failed to see the humor when I pointed out that most of the bark had been
                  stripped off by bears sharpening their claws on said bark!! :]


                  Bears, tornadoes, bark beetles etc = natural = good

                  You and me in a hammock = un natural = bad

                  And they don't have a sense of humor! Use a tree hugger, it shows them you
                  understand the issue and are attempting to trad lightly.

                  Ralph


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • kbwaddy
                  land managers won t hesitate to ban any activity they percieve as a problem, where i live, it seems the kiosks list almost every activity as being not
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jun 1 5:31 PM
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                    land managers won't hesitate to ban any activity they percieve as a problem,
                    where i live, it seems the kiosks list almost every activity as being "not
                    allowed" sometimes i half expect to see signs banning people all together
                    when i go to these places, it wouldn't surprise me. whoever mentioned
                    "percieved damage" was right, it probably doesn't even matter if you are really
                    hurting the tree or not, rangers and land managers live to write tickets and
                    ban activities, i think they actually enjoy it, and don't think you can hide from
                    them just because you think you are stealth camping, they love to hide behind
                    the bushes and then sneak up on you just as you are breaking a rule. as i've
                    seen in the climbing community the actions of a few can adversly affect
                    everyone, so if we decide that tree straps are the way to go, we should really
                    push everyone to use them, because it only takes a few people to ruin things
                    for everyone. i just checked and yatesgear.com(yates climbing gear) has
                    spectra/dyneema webbing for 80 cents/foot...Brandon



                    --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Oborn" <
                    Ralph.oborn@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > So if a little bark falls off, big deal. Once another tornado hits my
                    > > little town that tree might not be there.
                    >
                    > Yes, but some over-zealous park official isn't going to propose (and
                    > probably get passed) a regulation banning tornados and hurricanes
                    > from state or national parks. But let a little tree damage from
                    > hammocks occur, and see if this doesn't happen. The fault of your
                    > analogy is that natural disasters (you didn't mention forest fires)
                    > are unavoidable, while much more minor damage (or even perceived
                    > damage) from hammocks is avoidable by passing a regulation. As one
                    > who used to write regulations for a natural resources agency, I know
                    > of which I speak -- if your only tool is a hammer, every problem
                    > seems like a nail. And if your only tool is prohibition . . . .
                    >
                    >
                    > Hey,
                    > Before I knew about tree huggers, I got harrased in Yellowstone by a
                    > backwoods ranger for harming tree bark with a cheep string hammock. He
                    > failed to see the humor when I pointed out that most of the bark had been
                    > stripped off by bears sharpening their claws on said bark!! :]
                    >
                    >
                    > Bears, tornadoes, bark beetles etc = natural = good
                    >
                    > You and me in a hammock = un natural = bad
                    >
                    > And they don't have a sense of humor! Use a tree hugger, it shows them
                    you
                    > understand the issue and are attempting to trad lightly.
                    >
                    > Ralph
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                  • sebastiantoney
                    You re saying that being human is not natural? Oh, man... Dude, this planet has sustained far more damage than we humans can ever do. I don t want get into
                    Message 9 of 9 , Jun 2 9:03 AM
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                      You're saying that being human is not natural? Oh, man...

                      Dude, this planet has sustained far more damage than we humans can
                      ever do. I don't want get into this too deeply, but I just don't
                      believe humans are powerful enough to destory a planet. Life will go
                      on. Whether you believe with creat6ion or evolution this planet was
                      doing just fine without us. Even with us in it it's still doing fine,
                      there fine whole se species of animals, big animals we've never scene
                      before, coral reves that we've never seen before despite all the
                      "polution."

                      Life will go on despite what we do. As if we really have control over
                      what happens in this universe.

                      Anyway. You belive differently from me that's fine. I'm done talking
                      about this.

                      --- In hammockcamping@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Oborn" <Ralph.oborn@...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > > So if a little bark falls off, big deal. Once another tornado hits my
                      > > little town that tree might not be there.
                      >
                      > Yes, but some over-zealous park official isn't going to propose (and
                      > probably get passed) a regulation banning tornados and hurricanes
                      > from state or national parks. But let a little tree damage from
                      > hammocks occur, and see if this doesn't happen. The fault of your
                      > analogy is that natural disasters (you didn't mention forest fires)
                      > are unavoidable, while much more minor damage (or even perceived
                      > damage) from hammocks is avoidable by passing a regulation. As one
                      > who used to write regulations for a natural resources agency, I know
                      > of which I speak -- if your only tool is a hammer, every problem
                      > seems like a nail. And if your only tool is prohibition . . . .
                      >
                      >
                      > Hey,
                      > Before I knew about tree huggers, I got harrased in Yellowstone by a
                      > backwoods ranger for harming tree bark with a cheep string hammock. He
                      > failed to see the humor when I pointed out that most of the bark had
                      been
                      > stripped off by bears sharpening their claws on said bark!! :]
                      >
                      >
                      > Bears, tornadoes, bark beetles etc = natural = good
                      >
                      > You and me in a hammock = un natural = bad
                      >
                      > And they don't have a sense of humor! Use a tree hugger, it shows
                      them you
                      > understand the issue and are attempting to trad lightly.
                      >
                      > Ralph
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
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