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Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment

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  • Steven Dufresne
    Hi Phil, Quick answer... nope, we re not 100% sure. However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon drum device, his one that flew away and
    Message 1 of 17 , Feb 28 5:20 PM
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      Hi Phil,
      Quick answer... nope, we're not 100% sure.

      However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon drum device,
      his one that flew away and his one that when toyed with would stop cars in
      the street were done when he was living in Maple Ridge, Brittish Columbia
      in western Canada, before he moved out to the country in Gilmore, Ontario.
      Other than interfering with electronics, I've never heard of any health side effects.
      David seemed to think it was safe in that regard.
      -Steve
      http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

      -----Original Message-----
      From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2003@...>
      Sent 2/28/2010 7:22:42 PM
      To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [hameltech] Risk assessment

      Hi guys
       
      Just wanted to check - are we sure this technology (if we get it working) is safe?  I mean if we construct a working prototype in our garage are we sure that we would not be inducing cancer/leukeamia in our (selves and) neighbours within 500 yards or 2 miles even?
       
      Do we have a handle on how it actually works and what it's consequences may be on a cellular level?
       
      The big guys are busy scaring us with possible black holes at CERN Geneva once they get the Hadron Collider working.  Should we be showing perhaps better concern than this?
       
      David Hamel sort of infers that this technology is benign (ie no recorded bad effects) but he did seem to be away in the country where perhaps local environment may have had a shielding effect. 
       
      I did some layman research into the effects of power lines on health some years back.  If proved detrimental then $billions would need to be spent on ensuring power lines were x meters from habitation.  The ruling factor for the power companies appears to be that without a physical mechanism to prove how power lines could affect health there is no reason to change what we have.  To date there is no physical theory proving detrimental health albeit statistical evidence indicates an increased incidence of leukaemia and sterility in power line workers.
       
      Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding exactly how they work?
       
      I seem to remember from school madam Curie died with a radiation related disease.
       
      Regards
       
      Phil 
       
    • Matt G. Rock
      since the ship is tuned to the star of david...which is the geometry of nature, there should be no effects to endanger us. In fact, it should be the safest
      Message 2 of 17 , Mar 1, 2010
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        since the ship is tuned to the star of david...which is the geometry of nature, there should be no effects to endanger us. In fact, it should be the safest since tuning to the geometry of nature.
        That is why the technology works and is the highest known technology, for now. Ancients regard it as the highest.
         
        Devices which are outside of nature's design can produce harmful EM which can hurt us. THey don't adhere to laws of nature fully enough. David's tech DOES. That is why it is regarded as supreme physics by "Them".
         
        CERN is violating these laws as well, in which they will find out, whether they create a black hole or not, there are still tuning into the 'well of nature' incorrectly. Using raw and highest power and violent reactions, is not the way....at all. This is a lesson to be learned, whether or not the outcome is severe or not.
         
        "Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding exactly how they work?"
         
        NOPE....in fact, everything WE DO RIGHT NOW IS against NATURE.....at least when it comes to high voltage wires, 60Hz 120VAC, fossil fuel etc.
        Wind turbines and hydro dams are okay, but the signal of AC we generate is not nature. It is manmade, and that is why it is harmful.
        Hamel machines are from what I understand, the most safe and beneficial...because the design is wholly natural in concept.
         

      • Philip Wilson
        That s reassuring, Steve - thanks (and Matt).   Sorry, to come across as a kiljoy.  Here in the UK they stop kids sailing their model boats in park ponds -
        Message 3 of 17 , Mar 1, 2010
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          That's reassuring, Steve - thanks (and Matt).
           
          Sorry, to come across as a kiljoy.  Here in the UK they stop kids sailing their model boats in park ponds - in case they fall in and drown!  However, it's important to get the balance right.
           
          Perhaps it's useful to take a "health check" and be aware of possible consequences eg stopping cars' engines next to a major highway may be culpable - let's not go there!
           
          Without diverting attention from Research being done on Hamel technology too much I wonder if it's worthwhile codifying some rules of thumb as to how, where and when experimental runs should be done?
           
          Or just leave to common sense?
           
          Kind regards
           
          Phil


          --- On Mon, 1/3/10, Steven Dufresne <stevend@...> wrote:

          From: Steven Dufresne <stevend@...>
          Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
          To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Monday, 1 March, 2010, 1:20

           
          Hi Phil,
          Quick answer... nope, we're not 100% sure.

          However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon drum device,
          his one that flew away and his one that when toyed with would stop cars in
          the street were done when he was living in Maple Ridge, Brittish Columbia
          in western Canada, before he moved out to the country in Gilmore, Ontario.
          Other than interfering with electronics, I've never heard of any health side effects.
          David seemed to think it was safe in that regard.
          -Steve
          http://rimstar. org   http://wsminfo. org

          -----Original Message-----
          From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse20 03@yahoo. com>
          Sent 2/28/2010 7:22:42 PM
          To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
          Subject: [hameltech] Risk assessment

          Hi guys
           
          Just wanted to check - are we sure this technology (if we get it working) is safe?  I mean if we construct a working prototype in our garage are we sure that we would not be inducing cancer/leukeamia in our (selves and) neighbours within 500 yards or 2 miles even?
           
          Do we have a handle on how it actually works and what it's consequences may be on a cellular level?
           
          The big guys are busy scaring us with possible black holes at CERN Geneva once they get the Hadron Collider working.  Should we be showing perhaps better concern than this?
           
          David Hamel sort of infers that this technology is benign (ie no recorded bad effects) but he did seem to be away in the country where perhaps local environment may have had a shielding effect. 
           
          I did some layman research into the effects of power lines on health some years back.  If proved detrimental then $billions would need to be spent on ensuring power lines were x meters from habitation.  The ruling factor for the power companies appears to be that without a physical mechanism to prove how power lines could affect health there is no reason to change what we have.  To date there is no physical theory proving detrimental health albeit statistical evidence indicates an increased incidence of leukaemia and sterility in power line workers.
           
          Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding exactly how they work?
           
          I seem to remember from school madam Curie died with a radiation related disease.
           
          Regards
           
          Phil 
           

        • PICO
          Phil There was a reason why I started off asking about your interest in insurance. Unless you are going to cover all the risks in your policy or some else
          Message 4 of 17 , Mar 1, 2010
          • 0 Attachment
            Phil
            There was a reason why I started off asking about your interest in
            insurance. Unless you are going to cover all the risks in your policy
            or some else feels you might make that claim on their policy -- You dont
            need to worry about it.
            D

            Philip Wilson wrote:
            >
            >
            >
            > Here in the UK they stop kids sailing their model boats in park ponds
            > - in case they fall in and drown!
            >
            >
            >
            > --- On *Mon, 1/3/10, Steven Dufresne /<stevend@...>/* wrote:
            >
            >
            > From: Steven Dufresne <stevend@...>
            > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
            > To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Monday, 1 March, 2010, 1:20
            >
            >
            > Hi Phil,
            > Quick answer... nope, we're not 100% sure.
            >
            > However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon
            > drum device,
            > his one that flew away and his one that when toyed with would stop
            > cars in
            > the street were done when he was living in Maple Ridge, Brittish
            > Columbia
            > in western Canada, before he moved out to the country in Gilmore,
            > Ontario.
            > Other than interfering with electronics, I've never heard of any
            > health side effects.
            > David seemed to think it was safe in that regard.
            > -Steve
            > http://rimstar. org <http://rimstar.org/> http://wsminfo. org
            > <http://wsminfo.org/>
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse20 03@yahoo. com>
            > Sent 2/28/2010 7:22:42 PM
            > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
            > Subject: [hameltech] Risk assessment
            >
            > Hi guys
            >
            > Just wanted to check - are we sure this technology (if we get it
            > working) is safe? I mean if we construct a working prototype in
            > our garage are we sure that we would not be inducing
            > cancer/leukeamia in our (selves and) neighbours within 500 yards
            > or 2 miles even?
            >
            > Do we have a handle on how it actually works and what it's
            > consequences may be on a cellular level?
            >
            > The big guys are busy scaring us with possible black holes at CERN
            > Geneva once they get the Hadron Collider working. Should we be
            > showing perhaps better concern than this?
            >
            > David Hamel sort of infers that this technology is benign (ie no
            > recorded bad effects) but he did seem to be away in the country
            > where perhaps local environment may have had a shielding effect.
            >
            > I did some layman research into the effects of power lines on
            > health some years back. If proved detrimental then $billions
            > would need to be spent on ensuring power lines were x meters from
            > habitation. The ruling factor _for_ the power companies appears
            > to be that without a physical mechanism to prove how power lines
            > could affect health there is no reason to change what we have. To
            > date there is no physical theory proving detrimental health albeit
            > statistical evidence indicates an increased incidence of leukaemia
            > and sterility in power line workers.
            >
            > Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or
            > our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding
            > exactly how they work?
            >
            > I seem to remember from school madam Curie died with a radiation
            > related disease.
            >
            > Regards
            >
            > Phil
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
          • joesmith@cvctx.com
            I agree.95% anyway. Joe in Texas Quoting Matt G. Rock : since the ship is tuned to the star of david...which is the geometry of nature, there should be no
            Message 5 of 17 , Mar 1, 2010
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              I agree.95% anyway.

              Joe in Texas


              Quoting "Matt G. Rock" :
               

              since the ship is tuned to the star of david...which is the geometry of nature, there should be no effects to endanger us. In fact, it should be the safest since tuning to the geometry of nature.
              That is why the technology works and is the highest known technology, for now. Ancients regard it as the highest.
               
              Devices which are outside of nature's design can produce harmful EM which can hurt us. THey don't adhere to laws of nature fully enough. David's tech DOES. That is why it is regarded as supreme physics by "Them".
               
              CERN is violating these laws as well, in which they will find out, whether they create a black hole or not, there are still tuning into the 'well of nature' incorrectly. Using raw and highest power and violent reactions, is not the way....at all. This is a lesson to be learned, whether or not the outcome is severe or not.
               
              "Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding exactly how they work?"
               
              NOPE....in fact, everything WE DO RIGHT NOW IS against NATURE.....at least when it comes to high voltage wires, 60Hz 120VAC, fossil fuel etc.
              Wind turbines and hydro dams are okay, but the signal of AC we generate is not nature. It is manmade, and that is why it is harmful.
              Hamel machines are from what I understand, the most safe and beneficial.. .because the design is wholly natural in concept.
               

            • corrigan ken
              I think Matt is right. This is an implosive energy model ( the kind nature uses) vs the explosive  destructive kind western industrial tech uses. There are
              Message 6 of 17 , Mar 2, 2010
              • 0 Attachment
                I think Matt is right. This is an implosive energy model ( the kind nature uses) vs the explosive  destructive kind western industrial tech uses. There are some great videos on google on Schauberger who I think was dealing with this. Ken Corrigan

                --- On Mon, 3/1/10, joesmith@... <joesmith@...> wrote:

                From: joesmith@... <joesmith@...>
                Subject: Re: [hameltech] Re: Risk assessment
                To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                Received: Monday, March 1, 2010, 7:51 PM

                I agree.95% anyway.

                Joe in Texas


                Quoting "Matt G. Rock" :
                 

                since the ship is tuned to the star of david...which is the geometry of nature, there should be no effects to endanger us. In fact, it should be the safest since tuning to the geometry of nature.
                That is why the technology works and is the highest known technology, for now. Ancients regard it as the highest.
                 
                Devices which are outside of nature's design can produce harmful EM which can hurt us. THey don't adhere to laws of nature fully enough. David's tech DOES. That is why it is regarded as supreme physics by "Them".
                 
                CERN is violating these laws as well, in which they will find out, whether they create a black hole or not, there are still tuning into the 'well of nature' incorrectly. Using raw and highest power and violent reactions, is not the way....at all. This is a lesson to be learned, whether or not the outcome is severe or not.
                 
                "Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding exactly how they work?"
                 
                NOPE....in fact, everything WE DO RIGHT NOW IS against NATURE.....at least when it comes to high voltage wires, 60Hz 120VAC, fossil fuel etc.
                Wind turbines and hydro dams are okay, but the signal of AC we generate is not nature. It is manmade, and that is why it is harmful.
                Hamel machines are from what I understand, the most safe and beneficial.. .because the design is wholly natural in concept.
                 



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              • demondoppel
                thanks Ken :) here: http://www.thefractalfieldtech.com/ have fun cya p.s.: schauberger was right as well.....
                Message 7 of 17 , Mar 2, 2010
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                  thanks Ken :)

                  here:
                  http://www.thefractalfieldtech.com/

                  have fun

                  cya

                  p.s.: schauberger was right as well.....

                  --- In hameltech@yahoogroups.com, corrigan ken <rednightshine@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I think Matt is right. This is an implosive energy model ( the kind nature uses) vs the explosive  destructive kind western industrial tech uses. There are some great videos on google on Schauberger who I think was dealing with this. Ken Corrigan
                  >
                  > --- On Mon, 3/1/10, joesmith@... <joesmith@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > From: joesmith@... <joesmith@...>
                  > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Re: Risk assessment
                  > To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                  > Received: Monday, March 1, 2010, 7:51 PM
                  >
                  >
                  > I agree.95% anyway.Joe in Texas
                  > Quoting "Matt G.
                  > Rock" :
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > since the ship is tuned
                  > to the star of david...which is the geometry of nature, there should be no
                  > effects to endanger us. In fact, it should be the safest since tuning to
                  > the geometry of nature.
                  > That is why the technology works and is the highest known technology, for
                  > now. Ancients regard it as the highest.
                  >  
                  > Devices which are outside of nature's design can produce harmful EM which
                  > can hurt us. THey don't adhere to laws of nature fully enough. David's tech
                  > DOES. That is why it is regarded as supreme physics by "Them".
                  >  
                  > CERN is violating these laws as well, in which they will find out, whether
                  > they create a black hole or not, there are still tuning into the 'well of
                  > nature' incorrectly. Using raw and highest power and violent reactions, is not
                  > the way....at all. This is a lesson to be learned, whether or not the outcome is
                  > severe or not.
                  >  
                  > "Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or our
                  > neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding exactly how they
                  > work?"
                  >  
                  > NOPE....in fact, everything WE DO RIGHT NOW IS against NATURE.....at least
                  > when it comes to high voltage wires, 60Hz 120VAC, fossil fuel etc.
                  > Wind turbines and hydro dams are okay, but the signal of AC we generate is
                  > not nature. It is manmade, and that is why it is harmful.
                  > Hamel machines are from what I understand, the most safe and
                  > beneficial.. .because the design is wholly natural in concept.
                  >  
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > #yiv1137878196
                  >
                  > #yiv1137878196
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > __________________________________________________________________
                  > Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now
                  > http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com
                  >
                • Philip Wilson
                  Hi there   Reading some of the mails coming in it does seem that the technology will have less detrimental health effects than using mobile phones for
                  Message 8 of 17 , Mar 3, 2010
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                    Hi there
                     
                    Reading some of the mails coming in it does seem that the technology will have less detrimental health effects than using mobile phones for example.
                     
                    Without asking the question tho' I would not have appreciated properly the physical effects on electrical equipment.  Hence doing a project a block away from a Hospital may not be recommended which is why I then mooted putting together a code or checklist which could minimise unwanted impact.
                     
                    Without a theory of knowing exactly the mechanism at work we can not calculate field/range effects but perhaps we may be able to build up some rules of thumb for expected effects from experiments to date.
                     
                    You can't foresee everything, it's true but if the worst were to happen and for example a mum with child in car goes off the road as the engine cuts it would only reflect badly on the group's research.
                     
                    I wonder if some of David's Hamel's neighbours (or just several passers by) may have complained to the authorities if they suffered interference to electrical equipment or had their car engines cut out?  Hence this may be the reason that David's equipment was confiscated.  If so, whoever gets a working prototype going would need to consider such a reaction and may need to act quickly to get the whole concept witnessed sufficiently before officers come calling. (I hope I have the facts right here -my apologies if not!)
                     
                    Just food for thought!
                     
                    Kind regards
                     
                    Phil

                    --- On Tue, 2/3/10, PICO <picotech9999@...> wrote:

                    From: PICO <picotech9999@...>
                    Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                    To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Tuesday, 2 March, 2010, 0:27

                     
                    Phil
                    There was a reason why I started off asking about your interest in
                    insurance. Unless you are going to cover all the risks in your policy
                    or some else feels you might make that claim on their policy -- You dont
                    need to worry about it.
                    D

                    Philip Wilson wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Here in the UK they stop kids sailing their model boats in park ponds
                    > - in case they fall in and drown!
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > --- On *Mon, 1/3/10, Steven Dufresne /<stevend@rimstar. org>/* wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > From: Steven Dufresne <stevend@rimstar. org>
                    > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                    > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                    > Date: Monday, 1 March, 2010, 1:20
                    >
                    >
                    > Hi Phil,
                    > Quick answer... nope, we're not 100% sure.
                    >
                    > However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon
                    > drum device,
                    > his one that flew away and his one that when toyed with would stop
                    > cars in
                    > the street were done when he was living in Maple Ridge, Brittish
                    > Columbia
                    > in western Canada, before he moved out to the country in Gilmore,
                    > Ontario.
                    > Other than interfering with electronics, I've never heard of any
                    > health side effects.
                    > David seemed to think it was safe in that regard.
                    > -Steve
                    > http://rimstar. org <http://rimstar. org/> http://wsminfo. org
                    > <http://wsminfo. org/>
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2 0 03@yahoo. com>
                    > Sent 2/28/2010 7:22:42 PM
                    > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                    > Subject: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                    >
                    > Hi guys
                    >
                    > Just wanted to check - are we sure this technology (if we get it
                    > working) is safe? I mean if we construct a working prototype in
                    > our garage are we sure that we would not be inducing
                    > cancer/leukeamia in our (selves and) neighbours within 500 yards
                    > or 2 miles even?
                    >
                    > Do we have a handle on how it actually works and what it's
                    > consequences may be on a cellular level?
                    >
                    > The big guys are busy scaring us with possible black holes at CERN
                    > Geneva once they get the Hadron Collider working. Should we be
                    > showing perhaps better concern than this?
                    >
                    > David Hamel sort of infers that this technology is benign (ie no
                    > recorded bad effects) but he did seem to be away in the country
                    > where perhaps local environment may have had a shielding effect.
                    >
                    > I did some layman research into the effects of power lines on
                    > health some years back. If proved detrimental then $billions
                    > would need to be spent on ensuring power lines were x meters from
                    > habitation. The ruling factor _for_ the power companies appears
                    > to be that without a physical mechanism to prove how power lines
                    > could affect health there is no reason to change what we have. To
                    > date there is no physical theory proving detrimental health albeit
                    > statistical evidence indicates an increased incidence of leukaemia
                    > and sterility in power line workers.
                    >
                    > Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or
                    > our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding
                    > exactly how they work?
                    >
                    > I seem to remember from school madam Curie died with a radiation
                    > related disease.
                    >
                    > Regards
                    >
                    > Phil
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >

                  • Steven Dufresne
                    I don t think anyone has anything working right now so it s a bit of a moot point. However, when testing, it may be good to have a radio or CRT tube type TV
                    Message 9 of 17 , Mar 3, 2010
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                      I don't think anyone has anything working right now so it's a bit of a moot point.
                      However, when testing, it may be good to have a radio or CRT tube type TV
                      (i.e. not a new flat screen LCD or plasma) on and keep an eye out for interference.
                      I think I recall Justin causing interference on his TV many years ago when he
                      was experimenting.

                      Oh, and David never had anything confiscated.
                      -Steve
                      http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2003@...>
                      Sent 3/3/2010 8:12:12 AM
                      To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                      Hi there
                       
                      Reading some of the mails coming in it does seem that the technology will have less detrimental health effects than using mobile phones for example.
                       
                      Without asking the question tho' I would not have appreciated properly the physical effects on electrical equipment.  Hence doing a project a block away from a Hospital may not be recommended which is why I then mooted putting together a code or checklist which could minimise unwanted impact.
                       
                      Without a theory of knowing exactly the mechanism at work we can not calculate field/range effects but perhaps we may be able to build up some rules of thumb for expected effects from experiments to date.
                       
                      You can't foresee everything, it's true but if the worst were to happen and for example a mum with child in car goes off the road as the engine cuts it would only reflect badly on the group's research.
                       
                      I wonder if some of David's Hamel's neighbours (or just several passers by) may have complained to the authorities if they suffered interference to electrical equipment or had their car engines cut out?  Hence this may be the reason that David's equipment was confiscated.  If so, whoever gets a working prototype going would need to consider such a reaction and may need to act quickly to get the whole concept witnessed sufficiently before officers come calling. (I hope I have the facts right here -my apologies if not!)
                       
                      Just food for thought!
                       
                      Kind regards
                       
                      Phil
                       
                    • jszymanek2000
                      Tracy had the tv interference. I got a little radio interference, but never tried with a tv. Using one is a good idea as it will give early indication that
                      Message 10 of 17 , Mar 3, 2010
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                        Tracy had the tv interference. I got a little radio interference, but never tried with a tv. Using one is a good idea as it will give early indication that something is happening.

                        Justin

                        --- In hameltech@yahoogroups.com, "Steven Dufresne" <stevend@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I don't think anyone has anything working right now so it's a bit of a moot point.
                        > However, when testing, it may be good to have a radio or CRT tube type TV
                        > (i.e. not a new flat screen LCD or plasma) on and keep an eye out for interference.
                        > I think I recall Justin causing interference on his TV many years ago when he
                        > was experimenting.
                        > Oh, and David never had anything confiscated.
                        > -Stevehttp://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2003@...>
                        > Sent 3/3/2010 8:12:12 AM
                        > To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessmentHi there Reading some of the mails coming in it does seem that the technology will have less detrimental health effects than using mobile phones for example. Without asking the question tho' I would not have appreciated properly the physical effects on electrical equipment.  Hence doing a project a block away from a Hospital may not be recommended which is why I then mooted putting together a code or checklist which could minimise unwanted impact. Without a theory of knowing exactly the mechanism at work we can not calculate field/range effects but perhaps we may be able to build up some rules of thumb for expected effects from experiments to date. You can't foresee everything, it's true but if the worst were to happen and for example a mum with child in car goes off the road as the engine cuts it would only reflect badly on the group's research. I wonder if some of David's Hamel's neighbours (or just several passers by) may have complained to the authorities if they suffered interference to electrical equipment or had their car engines cut out?  Hence this may be the reason that David's equipment was confiscated.  If so, whoever gets a working prototype going would need to consider such a reaction and may need to act quickly to get the whole concept witnessed sufficiently before officers come calling. (I hope I have the facts right here -my apologies if not!) Just food for thought! Kind regards Phil 
                        >
                      • demondoppel
                        Then any true and large experimentation should be done in the boonies ...much like David had tried to attempt. If you can get onto a farm or large piece of
                        Message 11 of 17 , Mar 6, 2010
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                          Then any true and large experimentation should be done in the 'boonies'...much like David had tried to attempt. If you can get onto a farm or large piece of land, then you got it made.

                          Yes, we must worry about such affects of shutting down the power grid close to hospitals and the like. Most definitely.

                          Measuring such a field outside of any device is a matter of the device which measures. Magnetic field effects/flux density, vibrational rates, electrical fields.
                          This exotic tech makes any 'circuit' that we use, as in electronics, and copper cables/wires (motor windings etc) and relays/etc, will just plain saturate and cease current motion in them. Depending on field resonation...i.e. field being the ZPE field. The closer the resonation, the bigger the EM effects around the machine.

                          Never be afraid of trying.

                          Those Masters above who gave David the knowledge are OUT THERE.....meaning they didn't let those discrepancies get in the way of progress.

                          Besides this tech is too important! If we don't try....we lose out on the biggest pot of gold ever! Which it is...plainfully and simply.



                          --- In hameltech@yahoogroups.com, Philip Wilson <gutboybarrelhouse2003@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi there
                          >  
                          > Reading some of the mails coming in it does seem that the technology will have less detrimental health effects than using mobile phones for example.
                          >  
                          > Without asking the question tho' I would not have appreciated properly the physical effects on electrical equipment.  Hence doing a project a block away from a Hospital may not be recommended which is why I then mooted putting together a code or checklist which could minimise unwanted impact.
                          >  
                          > Without a theory of knowing exactly the mechanism at work we can not calculate field/range effects but perhaps we may be able to build up some rules of thumb for expected effects from experiments to date.
                          >  
                          > You can't foresee everything, it's true but if the worst were to happen and for example a mum with child in car goes off the road as the engine cuts it would only reflect badly on the group's research.
                          >  
                          > I wonder if some of David's Hamel's neighbours (or just several passers by) may have complained to the authorities if they suffered interference to electrical equipment or had their car engines cut out?  Hence this may be the reason that David's equipment was confiscated.  If so, whoever gets a working prototype going would need to consider such a reaction and may need to act quickly to get the whole concept witnessed sufficiently before officers come calling. (I hope I have the facts right here -my apologies if not!)
                          >  
                          > Just food for thought!
                          >  
                          > Kind regards
                          >  
                          > Phil
                          >
                          > --- On Tue, 2/3/10, PICO <picotech9999@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > From: PICO <picotech9999@...>
                          > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                          > To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                          > Date: Tuesday, 2 March, 2010, 0:27
                          >
                          >
                          >  
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Phil
                          > There was a reason why I started off asking about your interest in
                          > insurance. Unless you are going to cover all the risks in your policy
                          > or some else feels you might make that claim on their policy -- You dont
                          > need to worry about it.
                          > D
                          >
                          > Philip Wilson wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Here in the UK they stop kids sailing their model boats in park ponds
                          > > - in case they fall in and drown!
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > --- On *Mon, 1/3/10, Steven Dufresne /<stevend@rimstar. org>/* wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > From: Steven Dufresne <stevend@rimstar. org>
                          > > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                          > > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                          > > Date: Monday, 1 March, 2010, 1:20
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Hi Phil,
                          > > Quick answer... nope, we're not 100% sure.
                          > >
                          > > However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon
                          > > drum device,
                          > > his one that flew away and his one that when toyed with would stop
                          > > cars in
                          > > the street were done when he was living in Maple Ridge, Brittish
                          > > Columbia
                          > > in western Canada, before he moved out to the country in Gilmore,
                          > > Ontario.
                          > > Other than interfering with electronics, I've never heard of any
                          > > health side effects.
                          > > David seemed to think it was safe in that regard.
                          > > -Steve
                          > > http://rimstar. org <http://rimstar. org/> http://wsminfo. org
                          > > <http://wsminfo. org/>
                          > >
                          > > -----Original Message-----
                          > > From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2 0 03@yahoo. com>
                          > > Sent 2/28/2010 7:22:42 PM
                          > > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                          > > Subject: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                          > >
                          > > Hi guys
                          > >
                          > > Just wanted to check - are we sure this technology (if we get it
                          > > working) is safe? I mean if we construct a working prototype in
                          > > our garage are we sure that we would not be inducing
                          > > cancer/leukeamia in our (selves and) neighbours within 500 yards
                          > > or 2 miles even?
                          > >
                          > > Do we have a handle on how it actually works and what it's
                          > > consequences may be on a cellular level?
                          > >
                          > > The big guys are busy scaring us with possible black holes at CERN
                          > > Geneva once they get the Hadron Collider working. Should we be
                          > > showing perhaps better concern than this?
                          > >
                          > > David Hamel sort of infers that this technology is benign (ie no
                          > > recorded bad effects) but he did seem to be away in the country
                          > > where perhaps local environment may have had a shielding effect.
                          > >
                          > > I did some layman research into the effects of power lines on
                          > > health some years back. If proved detrimental then $billions
                          > > would need to be spent on ensuring power lines were x meters from
                          > > habitation. The ruling factor _for_ the power companies appears
                          > > to be that without a physical mechanism to prove how power lines
                          > > could affect health there is no reason to change what we have. To
                          > > date there is no physical theory proving detrimental health albeit
                          > > statistical evidence indicates an increased incidence of leukaemia
                          > > and sterility in power line workers.
                          > >
                          > > Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or
                          > > our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding
                          > > exactly how they work?
                          > >
                          > > I seem to remember from school madam Curie died with a radiation
                          > > related disease.
                          > >
                          > > Regards
                          > >
                          > > Phil
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                        • Philip Wilson
                          Yep, we gotta keep trying!   I attach a page from BBC Focus mag which indicates the universe is now thought as under tension between gravity and anti-gravity
                          Message 12 of 17 , Mar 7, 2010
                          • 1 Attachment
                          • 513 KB
                          Yep, we gotta keep trying!
                           
                          I attach a page from BBC Focus mag which indicates the universe is now thought as under tension between gravity and anti-gravity - interesting stuff.
                           
                          I'm going to have a go at just taking one cone and seeing what effects, if any, there could be as magnets experience continual repulsion, on-off at different frequencies whilst incorporating the aluminium sink.  Will take me a year I expect. I haven't found much literature on experimenting with magnets in repulsion.
                           
                          I just hope that by breaking up a big product into smaller parts some progress can be made.  There is the probable problem, tho', that only when all 3 cones act together and you get the "butterfly effect" that the system works and a new technology is entered into.
                           
                          Lets see what happens.
                           
                          Cheers
                           


                          --- On Sat, 6/3/10, demondoppel <demondoppel@...> wrote:

                          From: demondoppel <demondoppel@...>
                          Subject: [hameltech] Re: Risk assessment
                          To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                          Date: Saturday, 6 March, 2010, 16:13

                           
                          Then any true and large experimentation should be done in the 'boonies'... much like David had tried to attempt. If you can get onto a farm or large piece of land, then you got it made.

                          Yes, we must worry about such affects of shutting down the power grid close to hospitals and the like. Most definitely.

                          Measuring such a field outside of any device is a matter of the device which measures. Magnetic field effects/flux density, vibrational rates, electrical fields.
                          This exotic tech makes any 'circuit' that we use, as in electronics, and copper cables/wires (motor windings etc) and relays/etc, will just plain saturate and cease current motion in them. Depending on field resonation.. .i.e. field being the ZPE field. The closer the resonation, the bigger the EM effects around the machine.

                          Never be afraid of trying.

                          Those Masters above who gave David the knowledge are OUT THERE.....meaning they didn't let those discrepancies get in the way of progress.

                          Besides this tech is too important! If we don't try....we lose out on the biggest pot of gold ever! Which it is...plainfully and simply.

                          --- In hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com, Philip Wilson <gutboybarrelhouse2 003@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi there
                          >  
                          > Reading some of the mails coming in it does seem that the technology will have less detrimental health effects than using mobile phones for example.
                          >  
                          > Without asking the question tho' I would not have appreciated properly the physical effects on electrical equipment.  Hence doing a project a block away from a Hospital may not be recommended which is why I then mooted putting together a code or checklist which could minimise unwanted impact.
                          >  
                          > Without a theory of knowing exactly the mechanism at work we can not calculate field/range effects but perhaps we may be able to build up some rules of thumb for expected effects from experiments to date.
                          >  
                          > You can't foresee everything, it's true but if the worst were to happen and for example a mum with child in car goes off the road as the engine cuts it would only reflect badly on the group's research.
                          >  
                          > I wonder if some of David's Hamel's neighbours (or just several passers by) may have complained to the authorities if they suffered interference to electrical equipment or had their car engines cut out?  Hence this may be the reason that David's equipment was confiscated.  If so, whoever gets a working prototype going would need to consider such a reaction and may need to act quickly to get the whole concept witnessed sufficiently before officers come calling. (I hope I have the facts right here -my apologies if not!)
                          >  
                          > Just food for thought!
                          >  
                          > Kind regards
                          >  
                          > Phil
                          >
                          > --- On Tue, 2/3/10, PICO <picotech9999@ ...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > From: PICO <picotech9999@ ...>
                          > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                          > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                          > Date: Tuesday, 2 March, 2010, 0:27
                          >
                          >
                          >  
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Phil
                          > There was a reason why I started off asking about your interest in
                          > insurance. Unless you are going to cover all the risks in your policy
                          > or some else feels you might make that claim on their policy -- You dont
                          > need to worry about it.
                          > D
                          >
                          > Philip Wilson wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Here in the UK they stop kids sailing their model boats in park ponds
                          > > - in case they fall in and drown!
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > --- On *Mon, 1/3/10, Steven Dufresne /<stevend@rimstar. org>/* wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > From: Steven Dufresne <stevend@rimstar. org>
                          > > Subject: Re: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                          > > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                          > > Date: Monday, 1 March, 2010, 1:20
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Hi Phil,
                          > > Quick answer... nope, we're not 100% sure.
                          > >
                          > > However, all the things that David did that worked, his 45 gallon
                          > > drum device,
                          > > his one that flew away and his one that when toyed with would stop
                          > > cars in
                          > > the street were done when he was living in Maple Ridge, Brittish
                          > > Columbia
                          > > in western Canada, before he moved out to the country in Gilmore,
                          > > Ontario.
                          > > Other than interfering with electronics, I've never heard of any
                          > > health side effects.
                          > > David seemed to think it was safe in that regard.
                          > > -Steve
                          > > http://rimstar. org <http://rimstar. org/> http://wsminfo. org
                          > > <http://wsminfo. org/>
                          > >
                          > > -----Original Message-----
                          > > From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2 0 03@yahoo. com>
                          > > Sent 2/28/2010 7:22:42 PM
                          > > To: hameltech@yahoogrou ps.com
                          > > Subject: [hameltech] Risk assessment
                          > >
                          > > Hi guys
                          > >
                          > > Just wanted to check - are we sure this technology (if we get it
                          > > working) is safe? I mean if we construct a working prototype in
                          > > our garage are we sure that we would not be inducing
                          > > cancer/leukeamia in our (selves and) neighbours within 500 yards
                          > > or 2 miles even?
                          > >
                          > > Do we have a handle on how it actually works and what it's
                          > > consequences may be on a cellular level?
                          > >
                          > > The big guys are busy scaring us with possible black holes at CERN
                          > > Geneva once they get the Hadron Collider working. Should we be
                          > > showing perhaps better concern than this?
                          > >
                          > > David Hamel sort of infers that this technology is benign (ie no
                          > > recorded bad effects) but he did seem to be away in the country
                          > > where perhaps local environment may have had a shielding effect.
                          > >
                          > > I did some layman research into the effects of power lines on
                          > > health some years back. If proved detrimental then $billions
                          > > would need to be spent on ensuring power lines were x meters from
                          > > habitation. The ruling factor _for_ the power companies appears
                          > > to be that without a physical mechanism to prove how power lines
                          > > could affect health there is no reason to change what we have. To
                          > > date there is no physical theory proving detrimental health albeit
                          > > statistical evidence indicates an increased incidence of leukaemia
                          > > and sterility in power line workers.
                          > >
                          > > Hence, could we be endangering ourselves, our loved ones and/or
                          > > our neighbours by producing Hamel machines without understanding
                          > > exactly how they work?
                          > >
                          > > I seem to remember from school madam Curie died with a radiation
                          > > related disease.
                          > >
                          > > Regards
                          > >
                          > > Phil
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >


                        • lady hawk
                          Aparently the officers (RCMP amoung others) Did come calling. Thats why he relocated to Ont.
                          Message 13 of 17 , Mar 8, 2010
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Aparently the officers (RCMP amoung others) Did come calling.
                            Thats why he relocated to Ont.

                            On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 6:34 PM, Steven Dufresne <stevend@...> wrote:
                             

                            Phil,
                            If you do that I'd sure be interested in seeing what the electrical effects
                            are on the cone. I didn't examine that enough when I had mine all
                            assembled. When magnetic fields fluctuate near a wire you induce electron
                            flow in the wire. Well, we don't have a wire but we do have big conductive
                            metal cones that the magnets are attached to. It'd be specially interesting
                            to see what happens electrically if the tip of the one cone that you'll be
                            making is sitting in a notch on a round metal ball. The round metal
                            ball should hold a charge and if electrons are forced one way down the
                            cone to the tip, then the ball should become charged up. You might even
                            get an arc from it by holding a finger near. I have no idea if that would happen,
                            just a suggestion.

                            More likely you might get current flow by attaching a wire to the tip of the
                            cone and connecting the other end of the wire to ground.

                            Here's the brief test I did many years ago re charge on the cones:
                             http://rimstar.org/sdprop/haml45gd/h45gdmk2/mtr1mk2/mtr1mk2.htm
                            (Curse me for having disassembled and reused or gotten rid of all of this.)

                            -Steve
                            http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org



                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: "Philip Wilson" <gutboybarrelhouse2003@...>
                            Sent 3/7/2010 4:39:41 PM
                            To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [hameltech] Re: Risk assessment [1 Attachment]

                            Yep, we gotta keep trying!
                             
                            I attach a page from BBC Focus mag which indicates the universe is now thought as under tension between gravity and anti-gravity - interesting stuff.
                             
                            I'm going to have a go at just taking one cone and seeing what effects, if any, there could be as magnets experience continual repulsion, on-off at different frequencies whilst incorporating the aluminium sink.  Will take me a year I expect. I haven't found much literature on experimenting with magnets in repulsion.
                             
                            I just hope that by breaking up a big product into smaller parts some progress can be made.  There is the probable problem, tho', that only when all 3 cones act together and you get the "butterfly effect" that the system works and a new technology is entered into.
                             
                            Lets see what happens.
                             
                            Cheers


                          • Timothy
                            So the quantum vacuum is the new either?  1a. Re: Risk assessment Posted by: Philip Wilson gutboybarrelhouse2003@yahoo.com   gutboybarrelhouse2003 Sun
                            Message 14 of 17 , Mar 8, 2010
                            • 0 Attachment
                              So the quantum vacuum is the new either? 

                              1a.

                              Re: Risk assessment

                              Posted by: "Philip Wilson" gutboybarrelhouse2003@...   gutboybarrelhouse2003

                              Sun Mar 7, 2010 1:39 pm (PST)

                              [Attachment(s) from Philip Wilson included below]

                              Yep, we gotta keep trying!
                               
                              I attach a page from BBC Focus mag which indicates the universe is now thought as under tension between gravity and anti-gravity - interesting stuff.
                               
                              I'm going to have a go at just taking one cone and seeing what effects, if any, there could be as magnets experience continual repulsion, on-off at different frequencies whilst incorporating the aluminium sink.  Will take me a year I expect. I haven't found much literature on experimenting with magnets in repulsion.
                               
                              I just hope that by breaking up a big product into smaller parts some progress can be made.  There is the probable problem, tho', that only when all 3 cones act together and you get the "butterfly effect" that the system works and a new technology is entered into.
                               
                              Lets see what happens.
                               
                              Cheers
                               

                            • Steven Dufresne
                              Hardly new. The term and the concept of the quantum vacuum s been around in standard physics since the 1930s. But yeah, they both refer to the same medium,
                              Message 15 of 17 , Mar 8, 2010
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Hardly new. The term and the concept of the quantum vacuum's been
                                around in standard physics since the 1930s. But yeah, they both refer
                                to the same medium, ether being the 1800s version.
                                -Steve
                                http://rimstar.org   http://wsminfo.org

                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: "Timothy" <flytch@...>
                                Sent 3/8/2010 3:45:55 PM
                                To: hameltech@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: [hameltech] Re:Re: Risk assessment

                                So the quantum vacuum is the new either? 

                                1a.

                                Re: Risk assessment

                                Posted by: "Philip Wilson" gutboybarrelhouse2003@...   gutboybarrelhouse2003

                                Sun Mar 7, 2010 1:39 pm (PST)

                                [Attachment(s) from Philip Wilson included below]

                                Yep, we gotta keep trying!
                                 
                                I attach a page from BBC Focus mag which indicates the universe is now thought as under tension between gravity and anti-gravity - interesting stuff.
                                 
                                I'm going to have a go at just taking one cone and seeing what effects, if any, there could be as magnets experience continual repulsion, on-off at different frequencies whilst incorporating the aluminium sink.  Will take me a year I expect. I haven't found much literature on experimenting with magnets in repulsion.
                                 
                                I just hope that by breaking up a big product into smaller parts some progress can be made.  There is the probable problem, tho', that only when all 3 cones act together and you get the "butterfly effect" that the system works and a new technology is entered into.
                                 
                                Lets see what happens.
                                 
                                Cheers
                                 
                                 
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