Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Talkback about flame wars being substitute for capitalistic cutthroat competition

Expand Messages
  • Omer Zak
    The talkback http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/top_4_internet_flame_wars_ +around_free_software#comment-76576 of an article about four famous Free
    Message 1 of 4 , Aug 17 8:13 AM
    • 0 Attachment
      The talkback
      http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/top_4_internet_flame_wars_
      +around_free_software#comment-76576
      of an article about four famous Free Software related religious wars -
      has, among other things, the following passage (quoted out of context):
      "these debates (for want of a better word) propel the FSF Community
      towards greater heights, replacing, in effect, competition between
      companies"

      This is an interesting thought.


      --
      MS-Windows is the Pal-Kal of the PC world.
      My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/

      My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
      They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
      I may be affiliated in any way.
      WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html
    • Shlomi Fish
      ... This URL is broken into two. Here s the correct, unbroken URL:
      Message 2 of 4 , Aug 17 10:08 AM
      • 0 Attachment
        On Sunday 17 August 2008, Omer Zak wrote:
        > The talkback
        > http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/top_4_internet_flame_wars_
        > +around_free_software#comment-76576

        This URL is broken into two. Here's the correct, unbroken URL:

        http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/top_4_internet_flame_wars_+around_free_software#comment-76576

        And here's a shortened URL: http://xrl.us/onun9

        > of an article about four famous Free Software related religious wars -
        > has, among other things, the following passage (quoted out of context):
        > "these debates (for want of a better word) propel the FSF Community
        > towards greater heights, replacing, in effect, competition between
        > companies"

        That put aside, the author claims that Linus Torvalds belongs on the Emacs
        side of the "Emacs vs. Vi" war, but in fact, he's using MicroEmacs. See:

        http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/linus/

        I should also note that "Vim is Not Vi"<tm>, and has transcended above it. So
        the "Emacs vs. Vi" holy war is old-school.

        Regards,

        Shlomi Fish

        -----------------------------------------------------------------
        Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/
        Original Riddles - http://www.shlomifish.org/puzzles/

        Shlomi, so what are you working on? Working on a new wiki about unit testing
        fortunes in freecell? -- Ran Eilam
      • Omer Zak
        The comments below look to me to be of nitpicking nature. The important point of my original posting was that the religious wars are the Free Software
        Message 3 of 4 , Aug 17 10:14 AM
        • 0 Attachment
          The comments below look to me to be of nitpicking nature.
          The important point of my original posting was that the religious wars
          are the Free Software substitute to capitalist competition.

          I suppose that KDE and Gnome both benefitted from the religious war
          between them, and I wouldn't be surprised if vim turns out to have
          learned from emacs what features need to be added.

          --- Omer


          On Sun, 2008-08-17 at 20:08 +0300, Shlomi Fish wrote:
          > On Sunday 17 August 2008, Omer Zak wrote:
          > > The talkback
          > > http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/top_4_internet_flame_wars_
          > > +around_free_software#comment-76576
          >
          > This URL is broken into two. Here's the correct, unbroken URL:
          >
          > http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/top_4_internet_flame_wars_+around_free_software#comment-76576
          >
          > And here's a shortened URL: http://xrl.us/onun9
          >
          > > of an article about four famous Free Software related religious wars -
          > > has, among other things, the following passage (quoted out of context):
          > > "these debates (for want of a better word) propel the FSF Community
          > > towards greater heights, replacing, in effect, competition between
          > > companies"
          >
          > That put aside, the author claims that Linus Torvalds belongs on the Emacs
          > side of the "Emacs vs. Vi" war, but in fact, he's using MicroEmacs. See:
          >
          > http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/linus/
          >
          > I should also note that "Vim is Not Vi"<tm>, and has transcended above it. So
          > the "Emacs vs. Vi" holy war is old-school.
          --
          Every good master plan involves building a time machine. Moshe Zadka
          My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/

          My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
          They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
          I may be affiliated in any way.
          WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html
        • Nadav Har'El
          ... Indeed. However, it should be clear where the parallel ends: Competition between companies isn t just about you (as a company) being better than the
          Message 4 of 4 , Aug 17 2:09 PM
          • 0 Attachment
            On Sun, Aug 17, 2008, Omer Zak wrote about "[hackers-il] Talkback about flame wars being substitute for capitalistic?cutthroat competition":
            > of an article about four famous Free Software related religious wars -
            > has, among other things, the following passage (quoted out of context):
            > "these debates (for want of a better word) propel the FSF Community
            > towards greater heights, replacing, in effect, competition between
            > companies"
            >
            > This is an interesting thought.

            Indeed. However, it should be clear where the parallel ends: Competition
            between companies isn't just about you (as a company) being better than the
            others. It also involves trying to keep the other companies not as good as
            you, by employing tactics like trade secrets, NDAs, patents, and so on.

            With competition between free software projects, you have no (acceptable) way
            to put your competitor down - basically, any code you write, any idea you
            have, this competitor is free to copy from you.

            This is what makes, I think, free software so much more interesting than the
            commercial software world.

            By the way, with free software, the stakes are also difference. A company
            has a lot to lose by losing market share to a competitor. What does Richard
            Stallman care if 10%, 50% or 90% of the people chose his Emacs over Vi?
            I mean, it makes you feel good all over to know that many people benefit from
            what you did, but do people really care if 90% or "just" 10% of the users
            use the code you wrote? Does Bram Molenaar keep awake at night trying to
            devise ways to push the balance more to the vi side, or just improves vim
            because he really loves vim?


            --
            Nadav Har'El | Sunday, Aug 17 2008, 17 Av 5768
            nyh@... |-----------------------------------------
            Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |Linux: Because a PC is a terrible thing
            http://nadav.harel.org.il |to waste.
          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.