Meta: Philosophy-IL has 8 members
- Philosophy-IL have exactly 8 members now. Hackers-IL has more member in
its "core" group and this is not including the many lurkers and occasional
contributors. I see two options:
1. Merging back into Hackers-IL while making some regulations regarding
philosophy. I don't think philosophy is a bad word, and I think the
Hackers-IL people can effectively discuss a non-technical matter with
style. We have already diverted into them occasionally.
Now, re Politics. I don't want the standard "Palesitinians are bad and we
should bombar them all" versus "We must evacuate all settlements" crap we
hear so often. I don't mind discussing Philsopohy here on Philosophy-IL
and did, but it has to be well-though, well-reasoned and profound. (which
I hope I have achieved)
2. Try and get more people to join. We can publicize in various Israeli
forums or even abroad ones. The latter will risk this mailing list turning
into a discussion of "Israel abuses Palestinians". This fact may be true
to some extent, but discussing it excessively make everybody annoyed and
indifferent. I actually invited someone (a Singaporian) to join this list
and he refused because he believed it was specific to Israel.
Now, I don't have a policy against not welcoming non-Israelis, and
Hackers-IL and Linux-IL don't have this policy either. But I would like
that problems that are specific to Israel can be freely discussed, without
it turning into an anti/pro-Israeli flamewar. I.e: when we discussed
voluntary army service, I'd like an American not to say something like
"Israel is acting in an inhumane manner by forcing its sons to kill
Palestiniants", but would very much like him to give an Analogy with
Vietnam, and how pointless the general draft and the war was there. (since
it underscores the fact, a nation can use a mandatory army for its
What I think can be a good idea is make sure everybody gets an army
training, but no-one is forced to actually fight. Even in the Old
Testament it was specified that whenever there's a war the people should
be gathered, and asked if anyone is afraid of fighting, and whoever
confesses to be so, can return to his home.
>>>What do you suggest to do?
Shlomi Fish shlomif@...
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
Home E-mail: shlomif@...
"Let's suppose you have a table with 2^n cups..."
"Wait a second - is n a natural number?"
I strongly object to Shlomi's suggestion.
The original agenda of hackers-il is computer related discussion. In my
opinion, the reason hackers-il has more members is that more readers are
interested in coputer discussion than in philosophy-politics.
By moving philosophy into hackers-il, you will annoy or drive out the exect
people who are interested in computers and not in philosophy.
I fully intend to moderate any political or philosophical discussion which
isn't related to technology.
If any of our esteemed readers are interested in such discussion, they are
free to join philosophy-il.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Oleg Goldshmidt [mailto:pub@...]
> Sent: ùáú 11 éðåàø 2003 09:34
> To: firstname.lastname@example.org
> Subject: Re: [hackers-il] RE: Meta: Philosophy-IL has 8 members
> Chen Shapira <chen@...> writes:
> > I fully intend to moderate any political or philosophical
> discussion which
> > isn't related to technology.
> Please do.
> Oleg Goldshmidt | pub@...
> "There is nothing more practical than idealism."
> [Richard M. Stallman, quoted with permission]
- On Sat, Jan 11, 2003 at 09:59:29AM +0200, Chen Shapira wrote:
> > > I fully intend to moderate any political or philosophicalAgreed.
> > discussion which
> > > isn't related to technology.
> > Please do.
ObHackersIL: Reading Cory Doctorow's Down and Under in the Magic
Kingdom, and it's really good.
my opinions may seem crazy. But they all make sense. Insane sense, but
sense nontheless. -- Shlomi Fish on #offtopic.
- Hi Shlomi,
Although I'm usually a watcher here, I will post my opinion about what you
On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote:
> Philosophy-IL have exactly 8 members now. Hackers-IL has more member in
> its "core" group and this is not including the many lurkers and occasional
> contributors. I see two options:
> 1. Merging back into Hackers-IL while making some regulations regarding
> philosophy. I don't think philosophy is a bad word, and I think the
> Hackers-IL people can effectively discuss a non-technical matter with
> style. We have already diverted into them occasionally.
Philosophy isn't a bad word, but it's not the main interest in here. Some
discussions may become philosophical, but not necessarily about
philosophy, and "philosophy" is not what we're talking about, but about
programming "better" (it's all relative, ofcourse), and about the way to
do that creatively. By saying "philosophy-IL", you spread the main purpose
of this mailing list, and I am not sure that people here are interested in
that (at least not me).
> Now, re Politics. I don't want the standard "Palesitinians are bad and we
> should bombar them all" versus "We must evacuate all settlements" crap we
> hear so often. I don't mind discussing Philsopohy here on Philosophy-IL
> and did, but it has to be well-though, well-reasoned and profound. (which
> I hope I have achieved)
Once again - it's a totally different subject. And different subject(s)
should remain in a different mailing list.
> 2. Try and get more people to join. We can publicize in various Israeli
This may be your mission :) Or anybody else's who is interested in that.
Spreading the word about philosophy-IL is quite off-topic, and I am not
sure how it would be treated if you said that in Linux-IL, for instance.
Not that I compare anything, Shlomi, but think what would happen if any
person who opened a mailing list would want to spread the word in an
off-topic mailing list? That would get out of control.
> What do you suggest to do?
Love your mailing list and try to make it grow - not at the account of
this mailing list. You've got a wonderful idea - but hackers-IL is not
meant for it. Sorry.
> Shlomi Fish
> Shlomi Fish shlomif@...
> Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
> Home E-mail: shlomif@...
> "Let's suppose you have a table with 2^n cups..."
> "Wait a second - is n a natural number?"
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