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Re: [GTh] Origen and Thomas 3: Methodology

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  • Stephen C. Carlson
    ... No, the statement is in Jerome s translation. I m just arguing that it wasn t something Jerome added during his translation. Stephen -- Stephen C. Carlson
    Message 1 of 9 , May 6, 2009
      On May 6, 2009 4:27 PM, Michael Grondin <mwgrondin@...> wrote:
      >Do you ignore Jerome's Latin translation here because the statement
      >in question isn't in it?

      No, the statement is in Jerome's translation. I'm just arguing that
      it wasn't something Jerome added during his translation.

      Stephen

      --
      Stephen C. Carlson
      Ph.D. student, Religion, Duke University
      Author of The Gospel Hoax: Morton Smith's Invention of Secret Mark (Baylor, 2005)
    • Michael Grondin
      Thanks, Andrew. That clears up that question nicely, to my mind. (Confirmation from Stephen just came in, but I was already quite sure that it would be
      Message 2 of 9 , May 6, 2009
        Thanks, Andrew. That clears up that question nicely, to my mind.
        (Confirmation from Stephen just came in, but I was already quite
        sure that it would be confirmed.) Stephen's SBL audience would
        no doubt understand why that passage was written as it was. For
        our audience, (including myself), I think it was good that it be
        spelled out.

        Mike
      • Judy Redman
        Stephen, Thanks for your postings. I am finding them interesting. As I read this your treatment of whether Origen had only heard about Thomas or had actually
        Message 3 of 9 , May 10, 2009
          Stephen,

          Thanks for your postings. I am finding them interesting.

          As I read this your treatment of whether Origen had only heard about Thomas or had actually read it, it occurred to me that one of the possibilities was that he had had access to some of the oral traditions in circulation which Thomas used, rather than having read Thomas. This is because I am interested in the field, but so are quite a few other scholars.

          Of course, Origen actually names "According to Thomas", rather than simply quoting material from it, so he is aware of the existence of the actual document and certainly implies that he's read it, so it is highly unlikely that he is quoting from orally traditions when he uses non-canonical Thomas material. This may be worth mentioning in passing, or storing in your mind in case someone asks. :-)

          Judy

          --
          "Politics is the work we do to keep the world safe for our spirituality" - Judith Plaskow, Phoenix Rising, 2000

          Rev Judy Redman
          PhD candidate & Uniting Church Chaplain
          University of New England Armidale 2351
          ph: +61 2 6773 3739
          fax: +61 2 6773 3749
          web: http://www-personal.une.edu.au/~jredman2 and
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          email: jredman2@...
        • Stephen C. Carlson
          ... Great question, Judy. As we ll see in the next excerpt, Origen explicitly said that he read the source. Stephen -- Stephen C. Carlson Ph.D. student,
          Message 4 of 9 , May 11, 2009
            On May 10, 2009 10:00 PM, Judy Redman <jredman@...> wrote:
            >Thanks for your postings. I am finding them interesting.
            >
            >As I read this your treatment of whether Origen had only heard about
            >Thomas or had actually read it, it occurred to me that one of the
            >possibilities was that he had had access to some of the oral traditions
            >in circulation which Thomas used, rather than having read Thomas. This
            >is because I am interested in the field, but so are quite a few other scholars.
            >
            >Of course, Origen actually names "According to Thomas", rather than simply
            >quoting material from it, so he is aware of the existence of the actual
            >document and certainly implies that he's read it, so it is highly unlikely
            >that he is quoting from orally traditions when he uses non-canonical Thomas
            >material. This may be worth mentioning in passing, or storing in your mind
            >in case someone asks. :-)

            Great question, Judy. As we'll see in the next excerpt, Origen explicitly
            said that he "read" the source.

            Stephen

            --
            Stephen C. Carlson
            Ph.D. student, Religion, Duke University
            Author of The Gospel Hoax: Morton Smith's Invention of Secret Mark (Baylor, 2005)
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