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Historicity of the Corinthian Eucharist versus Mithras reply

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  • BitsyCat1@aol.com
    StKilda@comcast.net- writes /The person who wrote the long section of 1 Corinthians below did not get this teaching from Jesus as he claims in verse 23. What
    Message 1 of 1 , Mar 3, 2007
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      StKilda@...- writes

      /The person who wrote the long section of 1 Corinthians below
      did not get this teaching from Jesus as he claims in verse 23. What
      we read here is how the Roman solders in the second and third
      centuries worshipped and celebrated their god Mithra. They
      enjoyed a communal meal and they partook of bread and wine,
      symbols of Mithra's flesh and blood./

      John Notes:


      Can you show that Mithraic worship was not corrupted by Christianity
      in the later Roman empire? We are speaking of the early 1st century in the
      writings of the Pauline letters.


      Mithraism is the ancient Roman mystery cult of the god Mithras. Roman worship
      of Mithras began sometime during the early Roman empire, perhaps during the
      late first century of the Common Era (hereafter CE), and flourished from the
      second through the fourth centuries CE."

      All references I find date the birth of Mithraism to after 70CE and as late
      as 100 CE save for a reference to some celician pirates. Several scholars set
      this date as post 100 CE.

      I should note that it is unclear whether the mithraic cult even originated in
      Persia at all, to be transmitted as you suggest.( That appears to now be in
      dispute)

      I refer you to a comprehensive counter argument (Illustrated (to that belief
      which appears to be pre 1971 scholarship (I.e. that Mithra was sourced in
      Persia)

      http://www.well.com/user/davidu/mithras.html

      IF you will read this article it would appear that the source is not Iranian
      (Persian), and differs substantially from that belief. In many ways.

      This would appear to argue against the old scholarship which tried to tie
      mIthaism to an origin in Persia, this religion (Persian) apparently had no
      taurectomy(an integral symbol of Mithras, the slaying of the bull)

      Did the later church CO opt the date of Jesus and set it on the date of
      mithras birth?( December 25th) Intentionally so to compete with Pagan religion and
      supplant it.
      There is a record of one of the Catholic popes actually intentionally setting
      the day and feast of the nativity to compete with this popular religion, and
      supplant the Saturnalia which was occurring at that time. Forcing the people
      to celebrate the Christian holiday and not the Pagan.

      The belief was that the SON would conquer the Sun and it appears to have been
      a good strategy.

      However this is far and long after Paul's written words. In the early 1st
      century.


      (substitution would have been unknown to Hebrews) Regarding the Eucharist?

      As for the substitution of Human for Sheep and being contra to Judaic thought
      (eating of the flesh and blood for a substitution)?

      I refer you to the sacrifice of Isaac, where God orders Abraham to sacrifice
      his only son. Abraham obeys God and is about to sacrifice his only son as God
      has demanded.

      Then at the very last moment his hand is stayed and GOD, provides a
      sacrificial lamb to take Isaac's place. The sacrifice lamb is always at least partially
      consumed by the priests family.( There is mosaic law providing fro the
      feeding of the Priesthood).

      Here you have a ritual sacrifice, representing a human boy, being consumed by
      the family of that boy. While certain portions of the animal are burned in
      sacrifice to God.

      In The day of Moses, god demanded the deaths of the Egyptian first born,( and
      in fact there is no record of this being a bloodless death) but rather the
      lambs blood marks the places of the Hebrews, and the Angel of death passes over.

      It is the lamb which is a part of the Passover seder, representing the blood
      of that Passover.
      And Jesus uses a modified Passover ritual.

      The concept of substitution of the lamb and blood, lay deeply ingrained in
      Hebrew History, which included the original story of the Passover. Where the
      blood of lambs saved the people from the angel of Death and marked them as Gods
      own,.As well as the substitution of the lamb for Isaac.

      I don't think you need look outside of the Passover and the substitution of
      Isaac(with the Lamb) for a source of the concepts that are presented within
      the Pauline as well as other sources for the Eucharist.

      As well in the ancient world, and in the Aramaic, the use of wine and bread
      symbolized the giving of Gods word. When you ate of the bread and drank the
      wine, you ate of Gods word and drank of his spirit.

      This again is not a symbolism which lies outside of Judaism. And is reflected
      in the known teachings of Yeshua bar yosef.

      The symbols already existed in Judaic literature and scriptures. It would
      appear they are merely used as a substitution, one thing for another, which as I
      have noted is common in Judaism

      Regards,
      John Moon
      Springfield,Tenn 37172


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