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Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement

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  • Michael Grondin
    Latest news on this front is that Gary Hudson has responded in timely fashion to my notes to Vesica Press. Among other things, he indirectly reminded me that -
    Message 1 of 14 , Jan 20, 2007
      Latest news on this front is that Gary Hudson has
      responded in timely fashion to my notes to Vesica
      Press. Among other things, he indirectly reminded
      me that - contrary to my statement in an earlier
      note - we _had_ been in contact a year and a half
      ago on this very issue.

      Although I didn't recall it, we did in fact have a brief
      exchange back on June 28, 2005. Judy's memory is
      correct that back then she and I and Gary were active
      on the GospelofThomas list. Soon after I had had an
      exchange with him on that list, he sent me a note
      requesting permission to use my "GoT translations"
      in a "forthcoming book". My complete reply to him
      was as follows:
      -----------------------------------------------------------------------
      The only "translation" that's mine is the word-for-word
      translation that appears under each Coptic line. I've
      never done a translation other than that. The translation
      up top of each saying is Lambdin's. I'm not sure how
      one could use the word-for-word by itself, since in a lot
      of places it's awkward, or needs explanation for other
      reasons (such as that Coptic had no true passive voice).
      Some folks have used the word-for-word for the purpose
      of checking their own translations, and you can see how
      they worded their acknowledgements at
      http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9068/z_transl.htm
      ("Notices in Print"). You can do that too, if you want.
      As for quoting the word-for-word in the body of a book,
      though, I'd have serious doubts whether that's a good
      thing to do.
      -------------------- (end quote) ----------------------------------

      Mr. Hudson now says that he took these comments to
      be "tacit approval" of some sort or other, though he
      admits he might have misunderstood. Indeed. At any rate,
      I'll leave it at that for now, since I'm in communication with
      him, but I did want to correct my one misstatement and fill
      in some background information that casts the situation in
      a somewhat different light.

      Mike
    • Judy Redman
      So Mike, you now know that if anyone emails you in future about using your work in a forthcoming book, you should be more careful about how you reply and ask
      Message 2 of 14 , Jan 20, 2007
        So Mike, you now know that if anyone emails you in future about using your
        work in a forthcoming book, you should be more careful about how you reply
        and ask some questions about how it is going to be used and on the basis of
        that put restrictions on how it needs to be acknowledged (or whether you're
        happy to have it used in that way at all).

        Your interlinear *is* very useful, and it's quite likely that other people
        might well want to use it for similar purposes to Hudson, in the same way
        that a large number of Christians who have no Greek use interlinears. In
        other words, some people use them to help them understand what people who do
        know Greek well are saying, while others use them to validate creative
        theories about the meaning of the text. You may get more such requests

        My impression of many of the people on the GospelofThomas list is that they
        are enthusiastic amateurs, many of whom are looking at the text as
        Scripture, something on which to base how they live their lives. If Hudson
        has, indeed, decided to publish his own book, or is using a publishing
        company owned/run an equally naive friend, this is probably a genuine
        mistake. Which doesn't, of course, remove the problem that your text has
        been published as part of a book which probably contains material with which
        you would prefer not to be associated. Maybe an erratum to be included with
        the rest of the print run?

        I will be interested to see what Rick makes of his copy when it arrives.
        You *are* going to review it for us, aren't you, Rick?

        Judy



        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
        > [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Grondin
        > Sent: Sunday, 21 January 2007 3:42 PM
        > To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement
        >
        > Latest news on this front is that Gary Hudson has responded
        > in timely fashion to my notes to Vesica Press. Among other
        > things, he indirectly reminded me that - contrary to my
        > statement in an earlier note - we _had_ been in contact a
        > year and a half ago on this very issue.
        >
        > Although I didn't recall it, we did in fact have a brief
        > exchange back on June 28, 2005. Judy's memory is correct that
        > back then she and I and Gary were active on the
        > GospelofThomas list. Soon after I had had an exchange with
        > him on that list, he sent me a note requesting permission to
        > use my "GoT translations"
        > in a "forthcoming book". My complete reply to him was as follows:
        > --------------------------------------------------------------
        > ---------
        > The only "translation" that's mine is the word-for-word
        > translation that appears under each Coptic line. I've never
        > done a translation other than that. The translation up top of
        > each saying is Lambdin's. I'm not sure how one could use the
        > word-for-word by itself, since in a lot of places it's
        > awkward, or needs explanation for other reasons (such as that
        > Coptic had no true passive voice).
        > Some folks have used the word-for-word for the purpose of
        > checking their own translations, and you can see how they
        > worded their acknowledgements at
        > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9068/z_transl.htm
        > ("Notices in Print"). You can do that too, if you want.
        > As for quoting the word-for-word in the body of a book,
        > though, I'd have serious doubts whether that's a good thing to do.
        > -------------------- (end quote) ----------------------------------
        >
        > Mr. Hudson now says that he took these comments to be "tacit
        > approval" of some sort or other, though he admits he might
        > have misunderstood. Indeed. At any rate, I'll leave it at
        > that for now, since I'm in communication with him, but I did
        > want to correct my one misstatement and fill in some
        > background information that casts the situation in a somewhat
        > different light.
        >
        > Mike
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > --------------------------------------------------------------
        > ----------
        > Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
        > Interlinear translation:
        > http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
      • Rick Hubbard
        Judy wrote: I will be interested to see what Rick makes of his copy when it arrives. You *are* going to review it for us, aren t you, Rick? Yep. Soon as it
        Message 3 of 14 , Jan 21, 2007
          Judy wrote:

          I will be interested to see what Rick makes of his copy when it arrives.
          You *are* going to review it for us, aren't you, Rick?

          Yep. Soon as it comes.

          Rick


          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
          > [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Grondin
          > Sent: Sunday, 21 January 2007 3:42 PM
          > To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement
          >
          > Latest news on this front is that Gary Hudson has responded
          > in timely fashion to my notes to Vesica Press. Among other
          > things, he indirectly reminded me that - contrary to my
          > statement in an earlier note - we _had_ been in contact a
          > year and a half ago on this very issue.
          >
          > Although I didn't recall it, we did in fact have a brief
          > exchange back on June 28, 2005. Judy's memory is correct that
          > back then she and I and Gary were active on the
          > GospelofThomas list. Soon after I had had an exchange with
          > him on that list, he sent me a note requesting permission to
          > use my "GoT translations"
          > in a "forthcoming book". My complete reply to him was as follows:
          > --------------------------------------------------------------
          > ---------
          > The only "translation" that's mine is the word-for-word
          > translation that appears under each Coptic line. I've never
          > done a translation other than that. The translation up top of
          > each saying is Lambdin's. I'm not sure how one could use the
          > word-for-word by itself, since in a lot of places it's
          > awkward, or needs explanation for other reasons (such as that
          > Coptic had no true passive voice).
          > Some folks have used the word-for-word for the purpose of
          > checking their own translations, and you can see how they
          > worded their acknowledgements at
          > http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9068/z_transl.htm
          > ("Notices in Print"). You can do that too, if you want.
          > As for quoting the word-for-word in the body of a book,
          > though, I'd have serious doubts whether that's a good thing to do.
          > -------------------- (end quote) ----------------------------------
          >
          > Mr. Hudson now says that he took these comments to be "tacit
          > approval" of some sort or other, though he admits he might
          > have misunderstood. Indeed. At any rate, I'll leave it at
          > that for now, since I'm in communication with him, but I did
          > want to correct my one misstatement and fill in some
          > background information that casts the situation in a somewhat
          > different light.
          >
          > Mike
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --------------------------------------------------------------
          > ----------
          > Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
          > Interlinear translation:
          > http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >



          ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
          Interlinear translation: http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm

          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • Michael Grondin
          ... Just to let you know, Judy, that I m also getting a copy of this book in the near future. (I was advised that I should do that before taking any further
          Message 4 of 14 , Jan 22, 2007
            [Judy wrote]:
            > I will be interested to see what Rick makes of his
            > copy when it arrives.

            Just to let you know, Judy, that I'm also getting a copy of
            this book in the near future. (I was advised that I should do
            that before taking any further action.) Two copies, in fact,
            since I first ordered it from Amazon, then Gary Hudson
            said he would send me a copy - alas too late to cancel
            my Amazon order. So sometime late this week or early
            next, Rick and I can compare impressions.

            Best,
            Mike
          • Paul Lanier
            Hi Judy, A couple of thoughts based on the Business Law class I took last year. An attorney should be consulted but this is my understanding. A contractual
            Message 5 of 14 , Jan 22, 2007
              Hi Judy,

              A couple of thoughts based on the Business Law class I took last year. An attorney should be consulted but this is my understanding.

              A contractual agreement does not exist unless both parties agree to specifics. If a contract is vague it cannot be enforced. Moreover both sides must receive something of value in order for a contract to exist. The safest way to respond to an offer may be to ignore it. In that case there is no contract.

              If one gives something to another without compensation, it's a gift and it must have been given without any doubt. The mere claim that the recipient thought it was a gift is insufficient.

              Finally, in the absence of a specific agreement, copyright is always retained by the author.

              regards, Paul


              ----- Original Message ----
              From: Judy Redman <jredman@...>
              To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 11:21:11 PM
              Subject: RE: [GTh] Copyright Infringement

              So Mike, you now know that if anyone emails you in future about using your
              work in a forthcoming book, you should be more careful about how you reply
              and ask some questions about how it is going to be used and on the basis of
              that put restrictions on how it needs to be acknowledged (or whether you're
              happy to have it used in that way at all).

              Your interlinear *is* very useful, and it's quite likely that other people
              might well want to use it for similar purposes to Hudson, in the same way
              that a large number of Christians who have no Greek use interlinears. In
              other words, some people use them to help them understand what people who do
              know Greek well are saying, while others use them to validate creative
              theories about the meaning of the text. You may get more such requests

              My impression of many of the people on the GospelofThomas list is that they
              are enthusiastic amateurs, many of whom are looking at the text as
              Scripture, something on which to base how they live their lives. If Hudson
              has, indeed, decided to publish his own book, or is using a publishing
              company owned/run an equally naive friend, this is probably a genuine
              mistake. Which doesn't, of course, remove the problem that your text has
              been published as part of a book which probably contains material with which
              you would prefer not to be associated. Maybe an erratum to be included with
              the rest of the print run?

              I will be interested to see what Rick makes of his copy when it arrives.
              You *are* going to review it for us, aren't you, Rick?

              Judy

              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: gthomas@yahoogroups .com
              > [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf Of Michael Grondin
              > Sent: Sunday, 21 January 2007 3:42 PM
              > To: gthomas@yahoogroups .com
              > Subject: Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement
              >
              > Latest news on this front is that Gary Hudson has responded
              > in timely fashion to my notes to Vesica Press. Among other
              > things, he indirectly reminded me that - contrary to my
              > statement in an earlier note - we _had_ been in contact a
              > year and a half ago on this very issue.
              >
              > Although I didn't recall it, we did in fact have a brief
              > exchange back on June 28, 2005. Judy's memory is correct that
              > back then she and I and Gary were active on the
              > GospelofThomas list. Soon after I had had an exchange with
              > him on that list, he sent me a note requesting permission to
              > use my "GoT translations"
              > in a "forthcoming book". My complete reply to him was as follows:
              > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
              > ---------
              > The only "translation" that's mine is the word-for-word
              > translation that appears under each Coptic line. I've never
              > done a translation other than that. The translation up top of
              > each saying is Lambdin's. I'm not sure how one could use the
              > word-for-word by itself, since in a lot of places it's
              > awkward, or needs explanation for other reasons (such as that
              > Coptic had no true passive voice).
              > Some folks have used the word-for-word for the purpose of
              > checking their own translations, and you can see how they
              > worded their acknowledgements at
              > http://www.geocitie s.com/Athens/ 9068/z_transl. htm
              > ("Notices in Print"). You can do that too, if you want.
              > As for quoting the word-for-word in the body of a book,
              > though, I'd have serious doubts whether that's a good thing to do.
              > ------------ -------- (end quote) ------------ --------- --------- ----
              >
              > Mr. Hudson now says that he took these comments to be "tacit
              > approval" of some sort or other, though he admits he might
              > have misunderstood. Indeed. At any rate, I'll leave it at
              > that for now, since I'm in communication with him, but I did
              > want to correct my one misstatement and fill in some
              > background information that casts the situation in a somewhat
              > different light.
              >
              > Mike
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
              > ----------
              > Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home. epix.net/ ~miser17/ Thomas.html
              > Interlinear translation:
              > http://www.geocitie s.com/mwgrondin/ x_transl. htm
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >






              ____________________________________________________________________________________
              Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate
              in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A.
              http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545367

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Ron McCann
              ... You can consent to, or waive a copyright infringement without any consideration being offered, accepted or exchanged. No contract need be involved. Ron
              Message 6 of 14 , Jan 22, 2007
                At 09:41 PM 22/01/07, Paul wrote:

                >Hi Judy,
                >
                >A couple of thoughts based on the Business Law class I took last
                >year. An attorney should be consulted but this is my understanding.
                >
                >A contractual agreement does not exist unless both parties agree to
                >specifics. If a contract is vague it cannot be enforced. Moreover
                >both sides must receive something of value in order for a contract
                >to exist. The safest way to respond to an offer may be to ignore it.
                >In that case there is no contract.
                >
                >If one gives something to another without compensation, it's a gift
                >and it must have been given without any doubt. The mere claim that
                >the recipient thought it was a gift is insufficient.
                >
                >Finally, in the absence of a specific agreement, copyright is always
                >retained by the author.
                >
                >regards, Paul

                You can consent to, or waive a copyright infringement without
                any"consideration"
                being offered, accepted or exchanged. No contract need be involved.

                Ron McCann
                Barrister & Solicitor
                (Retired).
              • Judy Redman
                Paul, I m not a lawyer and I live in Australia, so I don t want to venture an opinion about US copyright law, but what is legal and what is sensible are
                Message 7 of 14 , Jan 22, 2007
                  Paul,

                  I'm not a lawyer and I live in Australia, so I don't want to venture an
                  opinion about US copyright law, but what is legal and what is sensible are
                  sometimes two different things.

                  Because Mike isn't (as far as I know) earning any money from his
                  interlinear, taking legal action against people who use it inappropriately
                  is a nuisance and at one level probably not worth the bother. At another
                  level, it is quite likely that his work is now in published form in a book
                  that contains interpretations of Thomas with which he doesn't want to be
                  associated and while (as I understand it) he isn't a professional Thomas
                  scholar, he still values his good name within the scholarly community. We
                  all know the background, but there are Thomas scholars not on this list (!)
                  who might well pick up Hudson's book, decide it's very lightweight and
                  therefore make a wrong judgement about Mike for agreeing to have his
                  interlinear published in it.

                  In the situation at the time, simply ignoring the email would have come
                  across as rude and arrogant. It would have been better if, when Hudson
                  initially posed his question, Mike had said something like "I'm not happy to
                  have the interlinear published without my seeing the text with which it's
                  going to be associated. Feel free to point people to the URL, though, and
                  they can download it with my blessing." Instead, he let his natural modesty
                  lead the way and he said something that was a bit vague and was
                  misinterpreted and he is now in an awkward situation, even if he has the law
                  on his side.

                  Judy

                  --
                  Rev Judy Redman
                  Uniting Church Chaplain
                  University of New England
                  Armidale 2351 Australia
                  ph: +61 2 6773 3739
                  fax: +61 2 6773 3749
                  web: http://www.une.edu.au/chaplaincy/uniting/
                  email: jredman@...



                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
                  > [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul Lanier
                  > Sent: Tuesday, 23 January 2007 2:42 PM
                  > To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement
                  >
                  > Hi Judy,
                  >
                  > A couple of thoughts based on the Business Law class I took
                  > last year. An attorney should be consulted but this is my
                  > understanding.
                  >
                  > A contractual agreement does not exist unless both parties
                  > agree to specifics. If a contract is vague it cannot be
                  > enforced. Moreover both sides must receive something of value
                  > in order for a contract to exist. The safest way to respond
                  > to an offer may be to ignore it. In that case there is no contract.
                  >
                  > If one gives something to another without compensation, it's
                  > a gift and it must have been given without any doubt. The
                  > mere claim that the recipient thought it was a gift is insufficient.
                  >
                  > Finally, in the absence of a specific agreement, copyright is
                  > always retained by the author.
                  >
                  > regards, Paul
                  >
                  >
                  > ----- Original Message ----
                  > From: Judy Redman <jredman@...>
                  > To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2007 11:21:11 PM
                  > Subject: RE: [GTh] Copyright Infringement
                  >
                  > So Mike, you now know that if anyone emails you in future
                  > about using your work in a forthcoming book, you should be
                  > more careful about how you reply and ask some questions about
                  > how it is going to be used and on the basis of that put
                  > restrictions on how it needs to be acknowledged (or whether
                  > you're happy to have it used in that way at all).
                  >
                  > Your interlinear *is* very useful, and it's quite likely that
                  > other people might well want to use it for similar purposes
                  > to Hudson, in the same way that a large number of Christians
                  > who have no Greek use interlinears. In other words, some
                  > people use them to help them understand what people who do
                  > know Greek well are saying, while others use them to validate
                  > creative theories about the meaning of the text. You may get
                  > more such requests
                  >
                  > My impression of many of the people on the GospelofThomas
                  > list is that they are enthusiastic amateurs, many of whom are
                  > looking at the text as Scripture, something on which to base
                  > how they live their lives. If Hudson has, indeed, decided to
                  > publish his own book, or is using a publishing company
                  > owned/run an equally naive friend, this is probably a genuine
                  > mistake. Which doesn't, of course, remove the problem that
                  > your text has been published as part of a book which probably
                  > contains material with which you would prefer not to be
                  > associated. Maybe an erratum to be included with the rest of
                  > the print run?
                  >
                  > I will be interested to see what Rick makes of his copy when
                  > it arrives.
                  > You *are* going to review it for us, aren't you, Rick?
                  >
                  > Judy
                  >
                  > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > From: gthomas@yahoogroups .com
                  > > [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf Of Michael Grondin
                  > > Sent: Sunday, 21 January 2007 3:42 PM
                  > > To: gthomas@yahoogroups .com
                  > > Subject: Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement
                  > >
                  > > Latest news on this front is that Gary Hudson has responded
                  > in timely
                  > > fashion to my notes to Vesica Press. Among other things, he
                  > indirectly
                  > > reminded me that - contrary to my statement in an earlier note - we
                  > > _had_ been in contact a year and a half ago on this very issue.
                  > >
                  > > Although I didn't recall it, we did in fact have a brief
                  > exchange back
                  > > on June 28, 2005. Judy's memory is correct that back then she and I
                  > > and Gary were active on the GospelofThomas list. Soon after
                  > I had had
                  > > an exchange with him on that list, he sent me a note requesting
                  > > permission to use my "GoT translations"
                  > > in a "forthcoming book". My complete reply to him was as follows:
                  > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                  > > ---------
                  > > The only "translation" that's mine is the word-for-word translation
                  > > that appears under each Coptic line. I've never done a translation
                  > > other than that. The translation up top of each saying is
                  > Lambdin's.
                  > > I'm not sure how one could use the word-for-word by itself,
                  > since in a
                  > > lot of places it's awkward, or needs explanation for other reasons
                  > > (such as that Coptic had no true passive voice).
                  > > Some folks have used the word-for-word for the purpose of checking
                  > > their own translations, and you can see how they worded their
                  > > acknowledgements at http://www.geocitie s.com/Athens/
                  > 9068/z_transl.
                  > > htm ("Notices in Print"). You can do that too, if you want.
                  > > As for quoting the word-for-word in the body of a book, though, I'd
                  > > have serious doubts whether that's a good thing to do.
                  > > ------------ -------- (end quote) ------------ --------- ---------
                  > > ----
                  > >
                  > > Mr. Hudson now says that he took these comments to be
                  > "tacit approval"
                  > > of some sort or other, though he admits he might have
                  > misunderstood.
                  > > Indeed. At any rate, I'll leave it at that for now, since I'm in
                  > > communication with him, but I did want to correct my one
                  > misstatement
                  > > and fill in some background information that casts the
                  > situation in a
                  > > somewhat different light.
                  > >
                  > > Mike
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                  > > ----------
                  > > Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home. epix.net/ ~miser17/
                  > > Thomas.html Interlinear translation:
                  > > http://www.geocitie s.com/mwgrondin/ x_transl. htm
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > ______________________________________________________________
                  > ______________________
                  > Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debate
                  > in the Yahoo! Answers Food & Drink Q&A.
                  > http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545367
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --------------------------------------------------------------
                  > ----------
                  > Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
                  > Interlinear translation:
                  > http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • Michael Grondin
                  Hi Judy, ... Not a dime. ... Exactly so. ... On the up side, Gary Hudson tells me that only one copy had been sold at the time he wrote. Evidently, Rick and I
                  Message 8 of 14 , Jan 22, 2007
                    Hi Judy,
                    Some responses to your latest note:

                    > Because Mike isn't (as far as I know) earning
                    > any money from his interlinear ...

                    Not a dime.

                    > ... it is quite likely that [Mike's] work is now in published
                    > form in a book that contains interpretations of Thomas
                    > with which he doesn't want to be associated and while
                    > (as I understand it) he isn't a professional Thomas scholar,
                    > he still values his good name within the scholarly community.

                    Exactly so.

                    > We all know the background, but there are Thomas scholars
                    > not on this list (!) who might well pick up Hudson's book,
                    > decide it's very lightweight and therefore make a wrong
                    > judgement about Mike for agreeing to have his interlinear
                    > published in it.

                    On the up side, Gary Hudson tells me that only one copy
                    had been sold at the time he wrote. Evidently, Rick and I
                    have accounted for a 200% increase in sales! But yes,
                    whether I'm inclined to let it slide or not depends a lot on
                    what's in the book. I suspect I won't like it, but we'll see.

                    > It would have been better if, when Hudson initially posed
                    > his question, Mike had said something like "I'm not happy
                    > to have the interlinear published without my seeing the text
                    > with which it's going to be associated. ..." Instead, he let
                    > his natural modesty lead the way and he said something
                    > that was a bit vague and was misinterpreted ...

                    I look at it as realism, not modesty. I can see that what I
                    was thinking at the time I wrote the note wasn't whether
                    _Gary_ should publish the interlinear, but whether _anyone_
                    should publish it in current form. Maybe this confused him,
                    but when I concluded that I didn't think it was a good idea
                    in general, I thought that the implication of that for his
                    specific request was clear enough. In future, I'll shoot
                    down the request first and ask questions later!

                    Regards,
                    Mike
                  • Paul Lanier
                    Thanks Ron, What I m saying is that if you just ignore a request for use of material then use of the material cannot be considered by contract nor gift. It s
                    Message 9 of 14 , Jan 23, 2007
                      Thanks Ron,
                      What I'm saying is that if you just ignore a request for use of material then use of the material cannot be considered by contract nor gift. It's just theft :)
                      regards, Paul

                      ----- Original Message ----
                      From: Ron McCann <ronmccann1@...>
                      To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 8:58:12 PM
                      Subject: Re: [GTh] Copyright Infringement













                      At 09:41 PM 22/01/07, Paul wrote:



                      >Hi Judy,

                      >

                      >A couple of thoughts based on the Business Law class I took last

                      >year. An attorney should be consulted but this is my understanding.

                      >

                      >A contractual agreement does not exist unless both parties agree to

                      >specifics. If a contract is vague it cannot be enforced. Moreover

                      >both sides must receive something of value in order for a contract

                      >to exist. The safest way to respond to an offer may be to ignore it.

                      >In that case there is no contract.

                      >

                      >If one gives something to another without compensation, it's a gift

                      >and it must have been given without any doubt. The mere claim that

                      >the recipient thought it was a gift is insufficient.

                      >

                      >Finally, in the absence of a specific agreement, copyright is always

                      >retained by the author.

                      >

                      >regards, Paul



                      You can consent to, or waive a copyright infringement without

                      any"consideration"

                      being offered, accepted or exchanged. No contract need be involved.



                      Ron McCann

                      Barrister & Solicitor

                      (Retired).














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