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Re: [GTh] The Strange Case of the Nancy Johnson Translation

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  • Michael Grondin
    Hi Christian- Glad to see you re still around. I ve dug up a few more facts relevant to this issue, though I still have no idea who Nancy Johnson is or how her
    Message 1 of 9 , Nov 29, 2006
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      Hi Christian-

      Glad to see you're still around. I've dug up a few more
      facts relevant to this issue, though I still have no idea
      who Nancy Johnson is or how her name came to be
      associated with the translation in question.

      1. From the archives: I see that we had a discussion
      back in July of 2001 on this same subject:

      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gthomas/message/3963
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gthomas/message/3987

      (I see from this that you were the one who told Davies
      about this, resulting in his removing it from his site.)

      2. Raghavan Iyer (1930-1995) was in fact Pico's father.
      No evidence, however, that Pico shares his father's
      Theosophical views, and nothing I can find about Pico
      having had any training in Coptic. He's well-educated,
      though, so he might have. (It'd be nice to contact Pico
      directly, but I can't find any email address for him.)

      3. "Sacred Texts" is apparently an alternate title for
      the book mentioned earlier.

      4. I've written to the Reluctant-Messenger website
      to ask them to change the author's name on their text,
      but I don't expect a positive result, and anyway this isn't
      the only place the text appears. Since stamping out web
      misinformation is rather like fighting the hydra, a more
      fruitful approach might be to create a counter-text, i.e.,
      to put the text up somewhere, properly attributed to Iyer,
      and with an explanatory note that it's elsewhere erroneously
      attributed. Web-searchers would presumably find this
      among their results, and would take heed.

      Regards,
      Mike G.
    • Christian Jensen
      Hi MIke, Great idea about putting up a site with the proper info. Unfortunately, I don t have the means to do so. I would be able to help in any way if someone
      Message 2 of 9 , Nov 29, 2006
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        Hi MIke,

        Great idea about putting up a site with the proper info.
        Unfortunately, I don't have the means to do so. I would be able to
        help in any way if someone else was to post the info. Maybe S. Davies
        would be interested. Let me know if I can help.

        You might be able to contact Pico through one of the magazines he
        writes for. Just an idea. :)

        ~Christian
      • Michael Grondin
        Hi Christian- I ve been hard at work the last hour or so copying the source-code from one of the Nancy Johnson translation pages on the web, suitably altering
        Message 3 of 9 , Nov 29, 2006
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          Hi Christian-

          I've been hard at work the last hour or so copying
          the source-code from one of the Nancy Johnson
          translation pages on the web, suitably altering it,
          and uploading it to my site. See
          http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/IYERTRAN.HTM

          Hopefully, Google and other web-search spiders
          will soon pick it up. It's not yet linked to any of my
          pages, but I may post an essay to my main page
          and link to it from that. (I don't want to put it in my list of
          Thomas translations, cuz I don't think it's a good one.)

          Regards,
          Mike
        • Judy Redman
          Maybe it would be better to refer to it as a paraphrase. It reminds me rather of the Living Bible or The Message. Such things probably have their places, but
          Message 4 of 9 , Nov 30, 2006
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            Maybe it would be better to refer to it as a paraphrase. It reminds me
            rather of the Living Bible or The Message. Such things probably have their
            places, but IMHO they're probably even less useful for text like Thomas that
            hasn't been well worked over for centuries.

            Judy

            -----Original Message-----
            From: gthomas@yahoogroups.com [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            Michael Grondin
            Sent: Thursday, 30 November 2006 4:15 PM
            To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [GTh] The Strange Case of the Nancy Johnson Translation

            Hi Christian-

            I've been hard at work the last hour or so copying the source-code from one
            of the Nancy Johnson translation pages on the web, suitably altering it, and
            uploading it to my site. See http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/IYERTRAN.HTM

            Hopefully, Google and other web-search spiders will soon pick it up. It's
            not yet linked to any of my pages, but I may post an essay to my main page
            and link to it from that. (I don't want to put it in my list of Thomas
            translations, cuz I don't think it's a good one.)

            Regards,
            Mike




            ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
            Interlinear translation: http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm

            Yahoo! Groups Links
          • Christian Jensen
            Hi Mike, Yeah, it isn t a translation. It is a rendering . I hope this helps sort things out. ~Christian ... [Non-text portions of this message have been
            Message 5 of 9 , Nov 30, 2006
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              Hi Mike,

              Yeah, it isn't a translation. It is a "rendering". I hope this helps
              sort things out.

              ~Christian

              On Nov 29, 2006, at 9:14 PM, Michael Grondin wrote:

              > Hi Christian-
              >
              > I've been hard at work the last hour or so copying
              > the source-code from one of the Nancy Johnson
              > translation pages on the web, suitably altering it,
              > and uploading it to my site. See
              > http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/IYERTRAN.HTM
              >
              > Hopefully, Google and other web-search spiders
              > will soon pick it up. It's not yet linked to any of my
              > pages, but I may post an essay to my main page
              > and link to it from that. (I don't want to put it in my list of
              > Thomas translations, cuz I don't think it's a good one.)
              >
              > Regards,
              > Mike
              >
              >
              >



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Michael Grondin
              Just to give notice that I ve added two Short Notes to my main page. One of them is basically the note I wrote to the list some time back on the number of
              Message 6 of 9 , Nov 30, 2006
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                Just to give notice that I've added two "Short Notes"
                to my main page. One of them is basically the note I
                wrote to the list some time back on the number of
                books in the jar. The other is called "The Strange
                Case of Nancy Johnson", and links to the Iyer page
                I uploaded yesterday. What these short notes have
                in common is that they're both intended to counter
                continuing misinformation.

                Mike Grondin
              • Judy Redman
                Hmmm. Just slowed down for the week and re-read this. I didn t *mean* to sound arrogant and dismissive, but I suspect that s how this probably comes across.
                Message 7 of 9 , Dec 1, 2006
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                  Hmmm. Just slowed down for the week and re-read this. I didn't *mean* to
                  sound arrogant and dismissive, but I suspect that's how this probably comes
                  across. From my perspective, paraphrases or 'renderings' are useful for
                  texts that have been around for a very long time, so that people are so
                  familiar with them that they take them for granted and don't really *read*
                  them. A paraphrase can highlight a different way of understanding the text
                  to the traditional reading of it. What it usually does for me is to send me
                  back to the original to see if you can *really* get that from it.

                  My personal experience makes me very wary of people who twist text so that
                  they can use it as the basis of some unhelpful theology or another. Mostly
                  I have worked with text that I (and they) regard as Scripture, and therefore
                  authoratitive, so there is much more at stake than there is when you're more
                  interested in what the people who wrote it and used it understood it to
                  mean, which is how I work with Thomas.

                  So I think the point I was *trying* to make was that paraphrases/renderings
                  have their place, but I don't think it's in "scholarly" examination of texts
                  and I am not sure that Thomas has had the time to get so stale that there's
                  a big need for a paraphrase/rendering.

                  Judy

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: gthomas@yahoogroups.com [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  Judy Redman
                  Sent: Thursday, 30 November 2006 8:27 PM
                  To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [GTh] The Strange Case of the Nancy Johnson Translation

                  Maybe it would be better to refer to it as a paraphrase. It reminds me
                  rather of the Living Bible or The Message. Such things probably have their
                  places, but IMHO they're probably even less useful for text like Thomas that
                  hasn't been well worked over for centuries.

                  Judy

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: gthomas@yahoogroups.com [mailto:gthomas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  Michael Grondin
                  Sent: Thursday, 30 November 2006 4:15 PM
                  To: gthomas@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [GTh] The Strange Case of the Nancy Johnson Translation

                  Hi Christian-

                  I've been hard at work the last hour or so copying the source-code from one
                  of the Nancy Johnson translation pages on the web, suitably altering it, and
                  uploading it to my site. See http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/IYERTRAN.HTM

                  Hopefully, Google and other web-search spiders will soon pick it up. It's
                  not yet linked to any of my pages, but I may post an essay to my main page
                  and link to it from that. (I don't want to put it in my list of Thomas
                  translations, cuz I don't think it's a good one.)

                  Regards,
                  Mike




                  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
                  Interlinear translation: http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm

                  Yahoo! Groups Links






                  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  Gospel of Thomas Homepage: http://home.epix.net/~miser17/Thomas.html
                  Interlinear translation: http://www.geocities.com/mwgrondin/x_transl.htm

                  Yahoo! Groups Links
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