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[GTh] Re: A preliminarily work in GHoly12 associated with GThomas (parallels?)

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  • benedictlo1
    ... flesh ? ... Mike: By the same token, after reading the first 50 -100 pages of the BIBLE, many educated oriental trash it. Nevertheless, our brains also
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 20, 2006
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      > Gosh, from the preface alone I'd judge it bogus. "Given to us in the
      flesh"?
      > Might as well have a red sticker on it.
      >
      > Mike Grondin
      > Mt. Clemens, MI

      Mike:

      By the same token, after reading the first 50 -100 pages of the BIBLE,
      many educated oriental trash it. Nevertheless, our brains also
      collect many bogus that we never want to change.

      In GThomas saying 53,"psBbe Mme xM PNA afqN xhu thrf" which is one of
      important oriental spiritual approaches. I believe that some of you
      also buy it but rarely do it.

      Let me come back to learn more GThomas from you guys.

      Benedict
    • sarban
      ... From: benedictlo1 To: Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 11:48 PM Subject: [GTh] Re: A preliminarily
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 20, 2006
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        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "benedictlo1" <benedictlo1@...>
        To: <gthomas@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 11:48 PM
        Subject: [GTh] Re: A preliminarily work in GHoly12 associated with GThomas
        (parallels?)



        [ I use " xxxx " to indicate correlected text. ]
        =========================================
        GH12 - 88:5
        "And Jesus said, I stood in the midst of the world, and in
        the flesh was I seen and heard, and I found all men glutted with their
        own pleasures, and drunk with their own follies, and none found I
        hungry or athirst for the wisdom which is of God. My soul grieveth
        over the sons and daughters of men because they are blind in their
        heart, and in their soul are they deaf and hear not my voice."

        GTh - 28 (Greek)
        "Jesus saith: I stood in the midst of the world, and in the flesh was
        I seen of them, and I found and men drunken, and none found I athirst
        among them, and my soul grieveth over the sons of men because they are
        blind in their heart."

        ==========================
        GH12 - 27:12
        .. But a city which is built foursquare, enclosed in a circle or on
        the top of a hill, and "established on a rock, can neither fall" nor
        be hidden.

        GH12 - 39:6
        Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a City "built foursquare on
        the top of a high hill, and established on a rock, and strong in its
        surrounding wall", and its towers and its gates, which lie to the
        north, and to the south, and to the east, and to the west. Such a
        city falleth not, neither can it be hidden,.

        GTh - 32
        A city built upon the top of a hill "and fortified, can neither fall"
        nor be hidden.

        ============================
        GH12 - 13:5
        And he said: Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own
        home or in his own country, "neither doth a physician work cures upon
        them that know him."

        GTh - 31
        Jesus said, A prophet is not . . "Nor does a physican perform healings
        for those who know him."

        ============================
        GH12 - 39:5
        Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a woman who taketh of the
        incorruptible leaven and hideth it in three measures of meal, till the
        whole is leavened, and being baked by fire, "becometh one loaf." .

        GTh - 96
        Jesus said, The Father's kingdom is like a woman. She took a ..., and
        "made it into large loaves of bread"...

        ============================
        GH12 - 19:6
        "Raise the Stone, and there thou shall find me. Cleave the wood, and
        there am I." For in the fire and in the water even as in every living
        form, God is manifest as it's Life and it's Substance.

        GTh - 30 (Greek)
        Jesus said, ., I say, I am with him. "Lift the stone and there you
        will find me. Split the wood and I am there."

        ============================
        Hi Benedict

        All the above examples, (except for GH12 - 39:5 //GTh - 96 which
        is IMO weak), are found in P Oxyrhynchus 1 this was first published
        in 1897 (the other Greek Thomas papyri were published some years
        later in 1904

        Now from
        http://members.tripod.com/jbrooks2/Memoriam_Rev_Ouseley.html
        we learn of the GHoly12 that

        "It was first published by instalments in the columns of The Lindsey &
        Lincolnshire Star. These were concluded in the early part of 1900, and at
        the close of the following year, the First Edition was published, and
        further Editions followed. In 1903 a "revised and enlarged" Edition appears
        to have been published, and in 1904 a "New and Complete Edition" was
        published, the last during Rev. Ouseley's lifetime. "

        If this information is accurate then influence of P. Oxy 1 on GHoly12
        would seem non-problematic.

        Andrew Criddle
      • sarban
        ... Hi Benedict All the above examples, (except for GH12 - 39:5 //GTh - 96 which is IMO weak), are found in P Oxyrhynchus 1 this was first published in 1897
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 20, 2006
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          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: "benedictlo1" <benedictlo1@...>
          > To: <gthomas@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 11:48 PM
          > Subject: [GTh] Re: A preliminarily work in GHoly12 associated with GThomas
          > (parallels?)
          >
          >
          >
          > [ I use " xxxx " to indicate correlected text. ]
          > =========================================
          > GH12 - 88:5
          > "And Jesus said, I stood in the midst of the world, and in
          > the flesh was I seen and heard, and I found all men glutted with their
          > own pleasures, and drunk with their own follies, and none found I
          > hungry or athirst for the wisdom which is of God. My soul grieveth
          > over the sons and daughters of men because they are blind in their
          > heart, and in their soul are they deaf and hear not my voice."
          >
          > GTh - 28 (Greek)
          > "Jesus saith: I stood in the midst of the world, and in the flesh was
          > I seen of them, and I found and men drunken, and none found I athirst
          > among them, and my soul grieveth over the sons of men because they are
          > blind in their heart."
          >
          > ==========================
          > GH12 - 27:12
          > .. But a city which is built foursquare, enclosed in a circle or on
          > the top of a hill, and "established on a rock, can neither fall" nor
          > be hidden.
          >
          > GH12 - 39:6
          > Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a City "built foursquare on
          > the top of a high hill, and established on a rock, and strong in its
          > surrounding wall", and its towers and its gates, which lie to the
          > north, and to the south, and to the east, and to the west. Such a
          > city falleth not, neither can it be hidden,.
          >
          > GTh - 32
          > A city built upon the top of a hill "and fortified, can neither fall"
          > nor be hidden.
          >
          > ============================
          > GH12 - 13:5
          > And he said: Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own
          > home or in his own country, "neither doth a physician work cures upon
          > them that know him."
          >
          > GTh - 31
          > Jesus said, A prophet is not . . "Nor does a physican perform healings
          > for those who know him."
          >
          > ============================
          > GH12 - 39:5
          > Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a woman who taketh of the
          > incorruptible leaven and hideth it in three measures of meal, till the
          > whole is leavened, and being baked by fire, "becometh one loaf." .
          >
          > GTh - 96
          > Jesus said, The Father's kingdom is like a woman. She took a ..., and
          > "made it into large loaves of bread"...
          >
          > ============================
          > GH12 - 19:6
          > "Raise the Stone, and there thou shall find me. Cleave the wood, and
          > there am I." For in the fire and in the water even as in every living
          > form, God is manifest as it's Life and it's Substance.
          >
          > GTh - 30 (Greek)
          > Jesus said, ., I say, I am with him. "Lift the stone and there you
          > will find me. Split the wood and I am there."
          >
          > ============================
          Hi Benedict

          All the above examples, (except for GH12 - 39:5 //GTh - 96 which
          is IMO weak), are found in P Oxyrhynchus 1 this was first published
          in 1897 (the other Greek Thomas papyri were published some years
          later in 1904

          Now from
          http://members.tripod.com/jbrooks2/Memoriam_Rev_Ouseley.html
          we learn of the GHoly12 that

          "It was first published by instalments in the columns of The Lindsey &
          Lincolnshire Star. These were concluded in the early part of 1900,
          and at the close of the following year, the First Edition was published,
          and further Editions followed. In 1903 a "revised and enlarged"
          Edition appears to have been published, and in 1904 a "New and
          Complete Edition" was published, the last during Rev. Ouseley's lifetime. "

          If this information is accurate then influence of P. Oxy 1 on GHoly12
          would seem non-problematic.

          Andrew Criddle

          (Resend; first message lost in cyber space)
        • benedictlo1
          ... and at ... Dear Andrew Criddle: I am not so sure that we can completely trust websites. I scanned through many of them including the one you cited. Some
          Message 4 of 5 , Jan 21, 2006
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            > Hi Benedict
            >
            > All the above examples, (except for GH12 - 39:5 //GTh - 96 which
            > is IMO weak), are found in P Oxyrhynchus 1 this was first published
            > in 1897 (the other Greek Thomas papyri were published some years
            > later in 1904
            >
            > Now from
            > http://members.tripod.com/jbrooks2/Memoriam_Rev_Ouseley.html
            > we learn of the GHoly12 that
            >
            > "It was first published by instalments in the columns of The Lindsey &
            > Lincolnshire Star. These were concluded in the early part of 1900,
            and at
            > the close of the following year, ... "New and Complete Edition" was
            > published, the last during Rev. Ouseley's lifetime. "
            >
            > If this information is accurate then influence of P. Oxy 1 on GHoly12
            > would seem non-problematic.
            >
            > Andrew Criddle
            >

            Dear Andrew Criddle:

            I am not so sure that we can completely trust websites. I scanned
            through many of them including the one you cited. Some claimed that
            the 1st edition of GH12 was published in 1892. We only need 90% - 99%
            confidence to convince ourselves. However, academically speaking we
            need provide 100% evidence, if we can, to convince everybody including
            those not yet born to close the case.


            Benedict
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