[GTh] Re: Was Thomas written by the twin of Jesus?
- --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Michael Grondin" <mwgrondin@c...>
> Maurice wrote:back off a bit on this one. In fact, I can add one more to the list
> > ... I did a quick comparison of other translations and find
> > that a number of others seem to belittle the "as he is" part ...
> > Lambdin: "I myself shall become he ..."
> > Dorese: "I will become what he is ..."
> > Meyer: "I shall be that person ..."
> > Davis: "I will become he ..."
> > Layton: "I too, will become that person ..."
> > Hmmmmm ! Now why would this be ???
> I don't know, but in light of this evidence, I'm going to have to
against me and Doresse -the highly-respected Patterson/Robinson/Bethge
translation in _The Fifth Gospel_. In spite of this, however, the
grammar seems quite clear to me: on the general model of "I will X
him", the verbal-phrase Ti-NA-X should be followed by the personal
pronominal object MMOy, if that's what it meant - but it isn't.
Perhaps this is a special construction, or maybe it's ambiguous. (This
is where we need a real Coptic expert!) In any case, apologies to
Stephen for the sharp words. I'll have to add this one to the
other case (#42) where it seems to me that the minority translation
is correct (in that case, the minority "Come into being as you pass
away" vs the majority "Become passers-by").
Hello, Mike .... sorry you ran out of time on your post ... there are
a lot of good points to metabolize in it. Indeed, it will be very
interesting to see where you come out on the "as I am" issue ...
please share your findings with us. Knowing nothing about Coptic, I
can't add to your thoughts, but for the moment, (as a "die hard"
dogmatist) the majority interpretation continues to make sense to me.
As I, too, have only a few moments to comment, I will limit myself to
your way of seeing logion # 42.
Reading logion #42 from a strict dogmatic point of view ... I
personally find no difficulty with either interpretation. On the one
hand the idea that we should become "passers-by" pretty well denotes
the need to avoid the material/carnal things of this world, while the
idea that we "Come into being as you pass away" denotes the notion
that we come into "spiritual life" (we become alive) at the exact same
moment that we choose to "pass away" from (leave behind) our
material/carnal ways and values. To a dogmatist,the two notions are
one and the same ... i.e. "Pass up on the carnal stuff, and
(accordingly) find spiritual life!" To a literalist (I guess) the two
views have possible important shades of difference. I guess we are
engaged here in the age old question of "What did Jesus say" ...
versus ... "What did Jesus mean".