Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Beyond Beleif

Expand Messages
  • Tom Saunders
    Dave Hindley asks about Tertullian.... We must consider that Tertullian had a change of heart and changed from orthodox to gnostic. Therefor it is possible
    Message 1 of 2 , Jun 6, 2003
    • 0 Attachment
      Dave Hindley asks about Tertullian....

      We must consider that Tertullian had a change of heart and changed from orthodox to gnostic. Therefor it is possible that much of what Tertullian presented will be very different at different times.

      Tom Saunders
      Platter Flats, OK



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • David C. Hindley
      ... orthodox to gnostic. Therefor it is possible that much of what Tertullian presented will be very different at different times.
      Message 2 of 2 , Jun 6, 2003
      • 0 Attachment
        Tom Saunders says:

        >>We must consider that Tertullian had a change of heart and changed from
        orthodox to gnostic. Therefor it is possible that much of what Tertullian
        presented will be very different at different times.<<

        Actually, he became a Montanist, who were more like modern Pentecostal
        fundamentalists than gnostics.

        Irenaeus quotes the Shepherd as scripture in _Against Heresies_ 4.20.2,
        sometime between 182-188 CE. Tertullian, who speaks of the Shepherd politely
        to make a point in _On Prayer_ Ch. XVI around 192 CE, and pointedly
        disparages the Shepherd as the "scripture of adulterers" in _On Modesty_, Ch
        X & XX, around 208.

        While no one knows for sure when exactly Tertullian became a Montanist, it
        is believed to have occurred between the writing of _On Prayer_ and _On
        Modesty_. Actually, this change in tone concerning the Shepherd can be
        treated as the "smoking gun" indicating the approximate period within which
        this conversion occurred (i.e., 192 to 208 CE), because the Shepherd is
        supposed to be anti-Montanist in tone (meaning, really, that it showed no
        sign of "incipient fanaticism," not that it actually seems to have any
        direct connection to known Montanist doctrines).

        I just find it hard to see how a Greek speaking bishop of Lyons (in Gaul)
        ends up being a front for the Latin speaking Tertullian, a lawyer of
        Carthage (in Africa). Talk about a second career!

        Respectfully,

        Dave Hindley
        Cleveland, Ohio, USA
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.