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Re: [[gthomas] Saying 86 // Matt. 8.20 puns]

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  • Eric Laupot
    Jon Peter wrote: Can anyone refer me to articles or books that take note of the puns in the semitic version of this saying? Thanks - J. Dear
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 2, 2000
      "Jon Peter" <jnp@...> wrote:
      Can anyone refer me to articles or books that take note of the puns in the
      semitic version of this saying? Thanks - J.


      Dear Jon,

      Offhand (and I may be wrong), I don't believe
      there are any puns here in the semitic version.
      The place to look, though, would be with the
      following three authors who have written
      on the Aramaic origins of the Gospels: Frank
      Zimmermann (1981?), Matthew Black, and Charles Cutler
      Torrey. I checked Torrey's two books though, and he
      has nothing on Matt 8.20.

      However, I would point to one interesting detail
      in Matt 8.20 that has never, to my knowledge,
      been discussed. In the Greek, Jesus says he has
      no place to *recline* his head, not lay his head,
      as in the English translation. Jews at Passover
      recline their bodies at table on cushions, in
      memory of the flight to freedom and exodus from
      Egypt. It is possible this was also the custom
      in Jesus' time since the Passover Seder has
      probably changed little over the last
      2000 years in terms of its more important aspects. In
      other words, Jesus may have been
      suggesting that not only was he unable to relax
      and recline as they do at Passover, he couldn't even
      recline his head! In other words, he wasn't really
      free. In turn, this may have been because,
      as suggested in John 7 and 9 (I believe, more or less),
      there was a Roman criminal arrest warrant out for him.

      Sorry I couldn't be more definite about this, however.

      Sincerely,


      Eric Laupot
      PO Box 286510
      New York, NY 10128
      USA
      elaupot@...
      Tel. (212) 744-9450
    • Jack Kilmon
      ... From: Eric Laupot To: Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2000 7:11 PM Subject: Re: [[gthomas] Saying 86 // Matt. 8.20
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 3, 2000
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Eric Laupot" <elaupot@...>
        To: <gthomas@egroups.com>
        Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2000 7:11 PM
        Subject: Re: [[gthomas] Saying 86 // Matt. 8.20 puns]


        > "Jon Peter" <jnp@...> wrote:
        > Can anyone refer me to articles or books that take note of the puns in the
        > semitic version of this saying? Thanks - J.
        >
        >
        > Dear Jon,
        >
        > Offhand (and I may be wrong), I don't believe
        > there are any puns here in the semitic version.
        > The place to look, though, would be with the
        > following three authors who have written
        > on the Aramaic origins of the Gospels: Frank
        > Zimmermann (1981?), Matthew Black, and Charles Cutler
        > Torrey. I checked Torrey's two books though, and he
        > has nothing on Matt 8.20.
        >
        > However, I would point to one interesting detail
        > in Matt 8.20 that has never, to my knowledge,
        > been discussed. In the Greek, Jesus says he has
        > no place to *recline* his head, not lay his head,
        > as in the English translation. Jews at Passover
        > recline their bodies at table on cushions, in
        > memory of the flight to freedom and exodus from
        > Egypt. It is possible this was also the custom
        > in Jesus' time since the Passover Seder has
        > probably changed little over the last
        > 2000 years in terms of its more important aspects. In
        > other words, Jesus may have been
        > suggesting that not only was he unable to relax
        > and recline as they do at Passover, he couldn't even
        > recline his head! In other words, he wasn't really
        > free. In turn, this may have been because,
        > as suggested in John 7 and 9 (I believe, more or less),
        > there was a Roman criminal arrest warrant out for him.
        >
        > Sorry I couldn't be more definite about this, however.

        If it helps, the Aramaic vox Iesu would have been something like:



        }whl ty) )(qn )l(tl

        They have holes the foxes

        )ll+m )ym$d )txrplw

        nests of the skies and the birds

        )$n)d }yd hrbl

        of Man but the Son

        h$r \wms}d )ky) hl tyl

        his head he should lay (place) where no has

        leTHOla NEEkeh eeth leHON
        waleferECHtha dishMAya meeteLA
        leBAreh deen deNASHa layt leh EEka deneesMOK RESHech

        Other than the anarthrous noun "son of Man" noted by Fitzmyer,
        I do not see a play on words.

        Jack


        -----
        ______________________________________________

        taybutheh d'maran yeshua masheecha am kulkon

        Jack Kilmon
        North Hollywood, Ca.
        jkilmon@...

        http://www.historian.net

        sharing a meal for free.
        http://www.thehungersite.com/


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Jack Kilmon
        I had used a 1st century Hebrew/Aramaic font for the Aramaic of Mt. 8:20 in HTML format but apparently it didn t take. If anyone wants the
        Message 3 of 3 , Nov 3, 2000
          I had used a 1st century Hebrew/Aramaic font for the Aramaic of Mt. 8:20 in
          HTML format but apparently it didn't "take." If anyone wants the
          Michigan-Claremont transliteration of the Aramaic pericope, I will do so.

          Jack
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