7197Re: [GTh] Recovering Thomas
- Jul 22, 2006
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Grondin
Sent: Saturday, July 22, 2006 6:01 AM
Subject: Re: [GTh] Recovering Thomas
[Andrew Criddle wrote]:
>> As a resource for evaluating the relation of Thomas to the Pseudo-
>> Clementines I'm posting here the most important parallels between
>> Thomas and the Pseudo-Clementine Literature
>Your note quotes sayings titled as 12, 16, 39, and 93, but the
>one titled 12 is actually 76. In addition, one wonders why you
>list only four now whereas you mentioned seven earlier in the
>> The main sayings concerned are Logions 9 16 39 40 68 76 93
12 should be 76 as you say, my stupid mistake sorry.
I left out 9 where there is apparently a parallel in the Recognitions with 'on the road' rather than 'along the road' as in the synoptics 40 which has a parallel in the Homilies with 'the Father' rather than 'my Father' in the synoptics and 68 where there is a parallel with the Homilies in being hated rather than having men hate you as in the synoptics.
The four I included all have more than one point of agreement against the synoptics.
>Aside from that, however, I'm finding it difficult to understand
>what importance or interest there is in these parallels. Your
>> What I meant to say was that the only Thomas sayings
>> paralleled in the Pseudo-Clementines are ones which occur
>> in the putative kernel and have canonical Gospel parallels.
>.... seems to suggest that DeConick is using the parallels as
>supporting evidence that those Thomas sayings she identifies
>as the kernel are really earlier than the others. Is that it? If so,
>it seems rather weak evidence in itself, since not only is it
>not the case that _all_ kernel sayings are paralleled in the
>Ps-Clem's, but even that _most aren't_ (based on your list).
>But this may not be what DeConick had in mind, so I won't
>pursue it at this point. What I would like to know is why the
>Ps-Clem parallels are important to DeConick.
What DeConick thinks important is that none of the parallels with the Pseudo-Clementines (and only saying 113 among the parallels to the Diatessaron) are parallels to non-Kernel texts. She argues (rightly or wrongly) that his supports early knowledge of a version of Thomas which contained the kernel but not later sayings.
>May I also add to my earlier request (that pp. 242-3 be made
>publicly available) that you or anyone else who has the book
>list (by number) those sayings and parts of sayings that she
>now includes in the supposed kernel? (I could list those which
>appear in her earlier article, but the list in her book may differ.)
The full list of sayings listed on 242-3 by DeConick as paralleled in The Pseudo-Clementines is 9,16,32,39,40,54,62,64,68,76,93,95.
The parallels to the Diatessaron are Quispel 6,8,9,16,21,25,32,33,35,36,39,40,44,45,46,47,48,55,57,63,64,66,68,74,79,86,89,90,91,94,95,96,98,100,104,109,113
and Baarda 4,8,9,10,16,20,21,26,32,33,34,35,38,39,40,44,45,46,47,48,54,55,56,57,61,63,64,65,68,69,72,73,76,78,79,86,89,91,93,94,96,99,100,104,107,113
The list of the kernel is 2,4(2-3),5,6(2-3),8,9,10,11(1),14(4),15,16(1-3),17,20(2-4),21(5),21(10-11),23(1),24(2-3),25,26,30,31,32,33,34,35,36,38(1),39,40,41,42,44(2-3),45,46(1-2a,c),47,48,54,55,57,58,61(1),62(1-2),63(1-4),64(1-11),65(1-8),66,68(1),69(2),71,72,73,74,76,78,79,81,82,86,89,90,91(2),92,93,94,95,96(1-3),97,98,99,100(1-3),102,103,104,107,109,111(1)
Also 12 and 68(2) are regarded as very early additions to the kernel
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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