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Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain

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  • Robb Ouzts
    Yes, Hindrikjen Hindriks Lamain was born 16.9.1838 in Bovenweg, gemeente: Muntendam, died 5.5.1864 in Akkers. She was the daughter of Hindrik (Hindrik Jelis
    Message 1 of 6 , Jan 22, 2013
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      Yes,
      Hindrikjen Hindriks Lamain was born 16.9.1838 in Bovenweg, gemeente: Muntendam, died 5.5.1864 in Akkers. She was the daughter of Hindrik (Hindrik Jelis per her death record) Hindriks Lemain & Trijntje Gerrits Knapper married 1837 in Muntendam, and granddaughter of Hindrik Jelis Lamain & Hinderkien Hindriks Speelman for whom she was named.
       
      My evidence so far is circumspect.  She names both the sons she gives birth to Ties. The 1861 birth (in Veendam) is incorrectly listed on Allegroningers as mother: Hillechien Lamein, but if you look at the actual record the mother's name was Hinderkien. A few months after the birth of this first Ties he dies in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam, which is where the Hoving family was living.  One of the witnesses to his death is Diedericus Hofman, who is also a witness to the death of Albert Hoving (brother of Tjipke) less than a month later.  The other witness to Albert's death is Nicolaas Lambrecht who is also witness to Hindrikje Hoving (sister of Tjipke) who died 3 days before Albert in 1861.  Nicolaas Lambrecht is also witness to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain's death in 1864.  Of course Akkers is a small section in Muntendam, so everyone is everyone's neighbor.  Ties Lemain's naming of his children Tjipke (the eldest son, so used before honoring
      Antina op de Dijk's father: Albert), and Sietske, both names are somewhat common as you point out, but they are not names from Hindrikjen Lamain's family nor Antina's family.  Eppo is a name from Antina's family, an indication that she and Ties did honor family members in the naming of their 10 children.  None of this is conclusive, but Tjipke Hoving may not have recognized legally Ties as he never married Hindrikjen before her death and Roelfien may not have wanted his love child in her home as a reminder that he had been with some one before her.  (NOTE: My 2nd great grandfather did not want his wife's love child in the home, nor did they bring the love child with them to the states when they came, she stayed behind in the Netherlands, living with her grandmother till the grandmother's death.)  The only further evidence I can think of right now is to find Hindrikjen Lamain on the population register at the time of her death in 1864 and see if by
      chance she is listed in the Hoving household.  Also to see if Ties can be found on the registers and see whose household he lived in after his mother's death till his marriage in 1885.
       
      groetjes,
      Robb.


      ________________________________
      From: Ina Hazewinkel <haasjes5winkel@...>
      To: groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 12:14 PM
      Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain


       

      Hi Rob,
      What evidence do you have that Tjipke Hoving is the father of Ties Lemain?The names of the children of son Ties, was at that time common in Muntendam,would it not be more logical, if only one child, was named to the family of Hindrikien?or named after his possible father Tjipke
      With the marriage of Tjipke Hoving and Roelfjen Smith,Ties was not named as a child, even though he iswas  only 1 1/2 years old.
      Tjipke and Roelfsen married on 16/11/1865 Muntendamand they had the following children:Aaltje 1866- Meindert 1868- Thijs 1870
      Do you know the parents of Hinder Kien Lemain?
      Best regards Ina
      --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com> wrote:

      From: Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com>
      Subject: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
      To: "Groningen Genealogy" mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com>
      Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 2:15 PM

      Beste lijstegenoten:
       
      I have been working on the family of Ties Lemain, born 1864 in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain, who died less than a month later.  She had a prior son, also name Ties/Thijs born 1861 in Veendam, died 1861 in Veen.  At the time of Hindrikjen's death it appears that only her mother and brother: Gerrit were alive, her other siblings and father were deceased already.
       
      It looks to me as if Tjipke Hoving might be the father.  His youngest 2 siblings die in 1861 in Akkers.  He has a sister Sieske/Sietske, named for their paternal grandmother.  Ties Lemain marries Antina op de Dijk in 1885, and has 10 children.  The first 5 are named for the grandparents (eldest son: Tjipke & 2 sons: Albert, one died young).  They have a Sietske & a Jan boths siblings of Tjipke Hoving.  I think Tjipke and Hindrikjen didn't marry for some reason, maybe the cost of a wedding held them up, and then she died.  Tjipke is married about 18 months, after the death of Hindrikjen, with Roelfien Meinderts Smit.  Does anyone have evidence of this?  Maybe a population register showing who Ties lived with after the death of his mother?
       
      mvg,
      Robb.

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    • Ina Hazewinkel
      Hello Robb, The death certificate of first son Thijs on 17/08/1961 as witnesses Diederick Hofman (neighbor) and Marten Harkema? The birth certificate of son
      Message 2 of 6 , Jan 22, 2013
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        Hello Robb,

        The death certificate of first son Thijs on 17/08/1961
        as witnesses Diederick Hofman (neighbor) and Marten Harkema?

        The birth certificate of son Ties 04/13/1864,
        The following witnesses called:
        Albert Kieleman and M? Beur

        and in the death certificate of Ties as witnesses:
        Henry Tebbens and Wigbolt Flik

        the death certificate of Hindrikjen (Hinder Kien) as witnesses
        Nicolaus Lambrechts and Hindrik Pla(e)ger

        Hoving's name is not in the records

        all these scans can be found on http://www.allegroningers.nl




        Best regards Ina




        --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts <rawboots@...> wrote:

        From: Robb Ouzts <rawboots@...>
        Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
        To: "groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com" <groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com>
        Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 9:01 PM

        Yes,
        Hindrikjen Hindriks Lamain was born 16.9.1838 in Bovenweg, gemeente: Muntendam, died 5.5.1864 in Akkers. She was the daughter of Hindrik (Hindrik Jelis per her death record) Hindriks Lemain & Trijntje Gerrits Knapper married 1837 in Muntendam, and granddaughter of Hindrik Jelis Lamain & Hinderkien Hindriks Speelman for whom she was named.
         
        My evidence so far is circumspect.  She names both the sons she gives birth to Ties. The 1861 birth (in Veendam) is incorrectly listed on Allegroningers as mother: Hillechien Lamein, but if you look at the actual record the mother's name was Hinderkien. A few months after the birth of this first Ties he dies in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam, which is where the Hoving family was living.  One of the witnesses to his death is Diedericus Hofman, who is also a witness to the death of Albert Hoving (brother of Tjipke) less than a month later.  The other witness to Albert's death is Nicolaas Lambrecht who is also witness to Hindrikje Hoving (sister of Tjipke) who died 3 days before Albert in 1861.  Nicolaas Lambrecht is also witness to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain's death in 1864.  Of course Akkers is a small section in Muntendam, so everyone is everyone's neighbor.  Ties Lemain's naming of his children Tjipke (the eldest son, so used before honoring
        Antina op de Dijk's father: Albert), and Sietske, both names are somewhat common as you point out, but they are not names from Hindrikjen Lamain's family nor Antina's family.  Eppo is a name from Antina's family, an indication that she and Ties did honor family members in the naming of their 10 children.  None of this is conclusive, but Tjipke Hoving may not have recognized legally Ties as he never married Hindrikjen before her death and Roelfien may not have wanted his love child in her home as a reminder that he had been with some one before her.  (NOTE: My 2nd great grandfather did not want his wife's love child in the home, nor did they bring the love child with them to the states when they came, she stayed behind in the Netherlands, living with her grandmother till the grandmother's death.)  The only further evidence I can think of right now is to find Hindrikjen Lamain on the population register at the time of her death in 1864 and see if by
        chance she is listed in the Hoving household.  Also to see if Ties can be found on the registers and see whose household he lived in after his mother's death till his marriage in 1885.
         
        groetjes,
        Robb.


        ________________________________
        From: Ina Hazewinkel <haasjes5winkel@...>
        To: groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 12:14 PM
        Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
           

          

        Hi Rob,
        What evidence do you have that Tjipke Hoving is the father of Ties Lemain?The names of the children of son Ties, was at that time common in Muntendam,would it not be more logical, if only one child, was named to the family of Hindrikien?or named after his possible father Tjipke
        With the marriage of Tjipke Hoving and Roelfjen Smith,Ties was not named as a child, even though he iswas  only 1 1/2 years old.
        Tjipke and Roelfsen married on 16/11/1865 Muntendamand they had the following children:Aaltje 1866- Meindert 1868- Thijs 1870
        Do you know the parents of Hinder Kien Lemain?
        Best regards Ina
        --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com> wrote:

        From: Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com>
        Subject: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
        To: "Groningen Genealogy" mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com>
        Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 2:15 PM

        Beste lijstegenoten:
         
        I have been working on the family of Ties Lemain, born 1864 in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain, who died less than a month later.  She had a prior son, also name Ties/Thijs born 1861 in Veendam, died 1861 in Veen.  At the time of Hindrikjen's death it appears that only her mother and brother: Gerrit were alive, her other siblings and father were deceased already.
         
        It looks to me as if Tjipke Hoving might be the father.  His youngest 2 siblings die in 1861 in Akkers.  He has a sister Sieske/Sietske, named for their paternal grandmother.  Ties Lemain marries Antina op de Dijk in 1885, and has 10 children.  The first 5 are named for the grandparents (eldest son: Tjipke & 2 sons: Albert, one died young).  They have a Sietske & a Jan boths siblings of Tjipke Hoving.  I think Tjipke and Hindrikjen didn't marry for some reason, maybe the cost of a wedding held them up, and then she died.  Tjipke is married about 18 months, after the death of Hindrikjen, with Roelfien Meinderts Smit.  Does anyone have evidence of this?  Maybe a population register showing who Ties lived with after the death of his mother?
         
        mvg,
        Robb.

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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      • Robb Ouzts
        For those who have an interest in this family: I found Ties Lemain on the population register for Muntendam 1860-1880. I have posted a file containing the 3
        Message 3 of 6 , Jan 24, 2013
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          For those who have an interest in this family:
          I found Ties Lemain on the population register for Muntendam 1860-1880. I have posted a file containing the 3 pages I found him on to the group's website under files. It is labeled with Ties Lemain's name. Dates of when he enterred each household are not given, but I think I have placed the pages in order of which house he lived in. I believe he was born while his mother Hinderkien Lemain lived with her mother: Trijntje Knapper. Either after his mother's death or when his grandmother could no longer care for him, he went to live in the house of the man for whom he was named: Ties Hoving. He is listed as no relation to Ties Hoving, however I think this is from the stigma of his being illegitimate. Lastly he is found on the same page as the man I believe is is father: Tjipke Hoving. Tjipke's brother Jan married Nella Houwen, and died less than 1 year later, leaving her a widow with a young son: Ties Hoving. It is Nella's home where I found him
          last.
          On the page where he is listed with Ties Hoving as head of household, there is a note on line with his name, which I am  not sure what it means. I was wondering if someone in the group would look at it and translate it. I was unable to make the best of copies, so if it can't be read, I will try and make another copy when I have a chance to go to the library again.
           
          I believe it is more than a coincidence that Ties Lemain end's up living with various members of the Hoving family. As he share's the name of Tjipke Hoving's father: Ties, and he names his eldest son Tjipke, I believe it is Tjipke Hoving who is his father. I think as he had an elder brother Ties born and died in 1861, that his mother and Tjipke had a relationship which may well have resulted in marriage had not Hinderkien Lemain died shortly after her 2nd son: Ties' birth.  For now I am linking Tjipke as Ties' father in my records. Here is a link to what I have:
           
          http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=rawboots&id=I247617
           
          mvg,
          Robb. 



          ________________________________
          From: Ina Hazewinkel <haasjes5winkel@...>
          To: groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 2:13 PM
          Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain


           

          Hello Robb,

          The death certificate of first son Thijs on 17/08/1961
          as witnesses Diederick Hofman (neighbor) and Marten Harkema?

          The birth certificate of son Ties 04/13/1864,
          The following witnesses called:
          Albert Kieleman and M? Beur

          and in the death certificate of Ties as witnesses:
          Henry Tebbens and Wigbolt Flik

          the death certificate of Hindrikjen (Hinder Kien) as witnesses
          Nicolaus Lambrechts and Hindrik Pla(e)ger

          Hoving's name is not in the records

          all these scans can be found on http://www.allegroningers.nl

          Best regards Ina

          --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com> wrote:

          From: Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com>
          Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
          To: "mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com" mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com>
          Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 9:01 PM

          Yes,
          Hindrikjen Hindriks Lamain was born 16.9.1838 in Bovenweg, gemeente: Muntendam, died 5.5.1864 in Akkers. She was the daughter of Hindrik (Hindrik Jelis per her death record) Hindriks Lemain & Trijntje Gerrits Knapper married 1837 in Muntendam, and granddaughter of Hindrik Jelis Lamain & Hinderkien Hindriks Speelman for whom she was named.
           
          My evidence so far is circumspect.  She names both the sons she gives birth to Ties. The 1861 birth (in Veendam) is incorrectly listed on Allegroningers as mother: Hillechien Lamein, but if you look at the actual record the mother's name was Hinderkien. A few months after the birth of this first Ties he dies in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam, which is where the Hoving family was living.  One of the witnesses to his death is Diedericus Hofman, who is also a witness to the death of Albert Hoving (brother of Tjipke) less than a month later.  The other witness to Albert's death is Nicolaas Lambrecht who is also witness to Hindrikje Hoving (sister of Tjipke) who died 3 days before Albert in 1861.  Nicolaas Lambrecht is also witness to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain's death in 1864.  Of course Akkers is a small section in Muntendam, so everyone is everyone's neighbor.  Ties Lemain's naming of his children Tjipke (the eldest son, so used before honoring
          Antina op de Dijk's father: Albert), and Sietske, both names are somewhat common as you point out, but they are not names from Hindrikjen Lamain's family nor Antina's family.  Eppo is a name from Antina's family, an indication that she and Ties did honor family members in the naming of their 10 children.  None of this is conclusive, but Tjipke Hoving may not have recognized legally Ties as he never married Hindrikjen before her death and Roelfien may not have wanted his love child in her home as a reminder that he had been with some one before her.  (NOTE: My 2nd great grandfather did not want his wife's love child in the home, nor did they bring the love child with them to the states when they came, she stayed behind in the Netherlands, living with her grandmother till the grandmother's death.)  The only further evidence I can think of right now is to find Hindrikjen Lamain on the population register at the time of her death in 1864 and see if by
          chance she is listed in the Hoving household.  Also to see if Ties can be found on the registers and see whose household he lived in after his mother's death till his marriage in 1885.
           
          groetjes,
          Robb.


          ________________________________
          From: Ina Hazewinkel mailto:haasjes5winkel%40yahoo.com>
          To: mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 12:14 PM
          Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
             

            

          Hi Rob,
          What evidence do you have that Tjipke Hoving is the father of Ties Lemain?The names of the children of son Ties, was at that time common in Muntendam,would it not be more logical, if only one child, was named to the family of Hindrikien?or named after his possible father Tjipke
          With the marriage of Tjipke Hoving and Roelfjen Smith,Ties was not named as a child, even though he iswas  only 1 1/2 years old.
          Tjipke and Roelfsen married on 16/11/1865 Muntendamand they had the following children:Aaltje 1866- Meindert 1868- Thijs 1870
          Do you know the parents of Hinder Kien Lemain?
          Best regards Ina
          --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com> wrote:

          From: Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com>
          Subject: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
          To: "Groningen Genealogy" mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com>
          Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 2:15 PM

          Beste lijstegenoten:
           
          I have been working on the family of Ties Lemain, born 1864 in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain, who died less than a month later.  She had a prior son, also name Ties/Thijs born 1861 in Veendam, died 1861 in Veen.  At the time of Hindrikjen's death it appears that only her mother and brother: Gerrit were alive, her other siblings and father were deceased already.
           
          It looks to me as if Tjipke Hoving might be the father.  His youngest 2 siblings die in 1861 in Akkers.  He has a sister Sieske/Sietske, named for their paternal grandmother.  Ties Lemain marries Antina op de Dijk in 1885, and has 10 children.  The first 5 are named for the grandparents (eldest son: Tjipke & 2 sons: Albert, one died young).  They have a Sietske & a Jan boths siblings of Tjipke Hoving.  I think Tjipke and Hindrikjen didn't marry for some reason, maybe the cost of a wedding held them up, and then she died.  Tjipke is married about 18 months, after the death of Hindrikjen, with Roelfien Meinderts Smit.  Does anyone have evidence of this?  Maybe a population register showing who Ties lived with after the death of his mother?
           
          mvg,
          Robb.

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

             
                   

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        • Chris van Dijkum
          Afgeschreven (= uitgeschreven = removed from the register) met kr. k[?] ... [?] d. 21[?] Juli 1879 ... [?] Groet, Chris van Dijkum
          Message 4 of 6 , Jan 24, 2013
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            Afgeschreven (= uitgeschreven = removed from the register) met
            kr. k[?] ... [?]
            d. 21[?] Juli 1879 ... [?]

            Groet, Chris van Dijkum
            --- In groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Robb Ouzts wrote:
            >
            > For those who have an interest in this family:
            > I found Ties Lemain on the population register for Muntendam 1860-1880. I have posted a file containing the 3 pages I found him on to the group's website under files. It is labeled with Ties Lemain's name. Dates of when he enterred each household are not given, but I think I have placed the pages in order of which house he lived in. I believe he was born while his mother Hinderkien Lemain lived with her mother: Trijntje Knapper. Either after his mother's death or when his grandmother could no longer care for him, he went to live in the house of the man for whom he was named: Ties Hoving. He is listed as no relation to Ties Hoving, however I think this is from the stigma of his being illegitimate. Lastly he is found on the same page as the man I believe is is father: Tjipke Hoving. Tjipke's brother Jan married Nella Houwen, and died less than 1 year later, leaving her a widow with a young son: Ties Hoving. It is Nella's home where I found him
            > last.
            > On the page where he is listed with Ties Hoving as head of household, there is a note on line with his name, which I am  not sure what it means. I was wondering if someone in the group would look at it and translate it. I was unable to make the best of copies, so if it can't be read, I will try and make another copy when I have a chance to go to the library again.
            >  
            > I believe it is more than a coincidence that Ties Lemain end's up living with various members of the Hoving family. As he share's the name of Tjipke Hoving's father: Ties, and he names his eldest son Tjipke, I believe it is Tjipke Hoving who is his father. I think as he had an elder brother Ties born and died in 1861, that his mother and Tjipke had a relationship which may well have resulted in marriage had not Hinderkien Lemain died shortly after her 2nd son: Ties' birth.  For now I am linking Tjipke as Ties' father in my records. Here is a link to what I have:
            >  
            > http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=rawboots&id=I247617
            >  
            > mvg,
            > Robb. 
            >
            >
            >
            > ________________________________
            > From: Ina Hazewinkel
            > To: groningen-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 2:13 PM
            > Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
            >
            >
            >  
            >
            > Hello Robb,
            >
            > The death certificate of first son Thijs on 17/08/1961
            > as witnesses Diederick Hofman (neighbor) and Marten Harkema?
            >
            > The birth certificate of son Ties 04/13/1864,
            > The following witnesses called:
            > Albert Kieleman and M? Beur
            >
            > and in the death certificate of Ties as witnesses:
            > Henry Tebbens and Wigbolt Flik
            >
            > the death certificate of Hindrikjen (Hinder Kien) as witnesses
            > Nicolaus Lambrechts and Hindrik Pla(e)ger
            >
            > Hoving's name is not in the records
            >
            > all these scans can be found on http://www.allegroningers.nl
            >
            > Best regards Ina
            >
            > --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com> wrote:
            >
            > From: Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com>
            > Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
            > To: "mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com" mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com>
            > Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 9:01 PM
            >
            > Yes,
            > Hindrikjen Hindriks Lamain was born 16.9.1838 in Bovenweg, gemeente: Muntendam, died 5.5.1864 in Akkers. She was the daughter of Hindrik (Hindrik Jelis per her death record) Hindriks Lemain & Trijntje Gerrits Knapper married 1837 in Muntendam, and granddaughter of Hindrik Jelis Lamain & Hinderkien Hindriks Speelman for whom she was named.
            >  
            > My evidence so far is circumspect.  She names both the sons she gives birth to Ties. The 1861 birth (in Veendam) is incorrectly listed on Allegroningers as mother: Hillechien Lamein, but if you look at the actual record the mother's name was Hinderkien. A few months after the birth of this first Ties he dies in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam, which is where the Hoving family was living.  One of the witnesses to his death is Diedericus Hofman, who is also a witness to the death of Albert Hoving (brother of Tjipke) less than a month later.  The other witness to Albert's death is Nicolaas Lambrecht who is also witness to Hindrikje Hoving (sister of Tjipke) who died 3 days before Albert in 1861.  Nicolaas Lambrecht is also witness to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain's death in 1864.  Of course Akkers is a small section in Muntendam, so everyone is everyone's neighbor.  Ties Lemain's naming of his children Tjipke (the eldest son, so used before honoring
            > Antina op de Dijk's father: Albert), and Sietske, both names are somewhat common as you point out, but they are not names from Hindrikjen Lamain's family nor Antina's family.  Eppo is a name from Antina's family, an indication that she and Ties did honor family members in the naming of their 10 children.  None of this is conclusive, but Tjipke Hoving may not have recognized legally Ties as he never married Hindrikjen before her death and Roelfien may not have wanted his love child in her home as a reminder that he had been with some one before her.  (NOTE: My 2nd great grandfather did not want his wife's love child in the home, nor did they bring the love child with them to the states when they came, she stayed behind in the Netherlands, living with her grandmother till the grandmother's death.)  The only further evidence I can think of right now is to find Hindrikjen Lamain on the population register at the time of her death in 1864 and see if by
            > chance she is listed in the Hoving household.  Also to see if Ties can be found on the registers and see whose household he lived in after his mother's death till his marriage in 1885.
            >  
            > groetjes,
            > Robb.
            >
            >
            > ________________________________
            > From: Ina Hazewinkel mailto:haasjes5winkel%40yahoo.com>
            > To: mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 12:14 PM
            > Subject: Re: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
            >    
            >
            >   
            >
            > Hi Rob,
            > What evidence do you have that Tjipke Hoving is the father of Ties Lemain?The names of the children of son Ties, was at that time common in Muntendam,would it not be more logical, if only one child, was named to the family of Hindrikien?or named after his possible father Tjipke
            > With the marriage of Tjipke Hoving and Roelfjen Smith,Ties was not named as a child, even though he iswas  only 1 1/2 years old.
            > Tjipke and Roelfsen married on 16/11/1865 Muntendamand they had the following children:Aaltje 1866- Meindert 1868- Thijs 1870
            > Do you know the parents of Hinder Kien Lemain?
            > Best regards Ina
            > --- On Tue, 1/22/13, Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com> wrote:
            >
            > From: Robb Ouzts mailto:rawboots%40yahoo.com>
            > Subject: [groningen-genealogy] Ties Lemain
            > To: "Groningen Genealogy" mailto:groningen-genealogy%40yahoogroups.com>
            > Date: Tuesday, January 22, 2013, 2:15 PM
            >
            > Beste lijstegenoten:
            >  
            > I have been working on the family of Ties Lemain, born 1864 in Akkers, gemeente: Muntendam to Hindrikjen/Hinderkien Lamain, who died less than a month later.  She had a prior son, also name Ties/Thijs born 1861 in Veendam, died 1861 in Veen.  At the time of Hindrikjen's death it appears that only her mother and brother: Gerrit were alive, her other siblings and father were deceased already.
            >  
            > It looks to me as if Tjipke Hoving might be the father.  His youngest 2 siblings die in 1861 in Akkers.  He has a sister Sieske/Sietske, named for their paternal grandmother.  Ties Lemain marries Antina op de Dijk in 1885, and has 10 children.  The first 5 are named for the grandparents (eldest son: Tjipke & 2 sons: Albert, one died young).  They have a Sietske & a Jan boths siblings of Tjipke Hoving.  I think Tjipke and Hindrikjen didn't marry for some reason, maybe the cost of a wedding held them up, and then she died.  Tjipke is married about 18 months, after the death of Hindrikjen, with Roelfien Meinderts Smit.  Does anyone have evidence of this?  Maybe a population register showing who Ties lived with after the death of his mother?
            >  
            > mvg,
            > Robb.
            >
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