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20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

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  • Anthony Austin
    What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 16, 2013

    What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.

  • Stephen Craven
    Agreed. From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52 To:
    Message 2 of 7 , Jan 16, 2013
    • 0 Attachment

      Agreed.

       

      From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin
      Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52
      To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane [2 Attachments]

       

       

      [Attachment(s) from Anthony Austin included below]

      What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.

    • Liz Delap
      Me too Kind Regards Liz ________________________________ From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
      Message 3 of 7 , Jan 17, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        Me too
         

        Kind Regards

        Liz



         


        From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Craven
        Sent: 16 January 2013 22:31
        To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

         

        Agreed.

        From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin
        Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52
        To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane [2 Attachments]

         

        [Attachment(s) from Anthony Austin included below]

        What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.

        Page Title

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        This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from

        disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it

        by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received

        it in error.

         

        Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent

        those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA (Europe) Ltd.

         

        TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia, with its registered office

        at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120, Richmond, VA 23236-5403, USA.

        TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its

        registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London, SE1 7RG, UK.

         

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      • mick davis
        And me. Gig From: Liz Delap Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:42 AM To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in
        Message 4 of 7 , Jan 17, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          And me.
          Gig
           
          From: Liz Delap
          Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:42 AM
          Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane
           
           

          Me too
           

          Kind Regards

          Liz



           
           

          From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Craven
          Sent: 16 January 2013 22:31
          To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

           

          Agreed.

          From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin
          Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52
          To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane [2 Attachments]

           

          [Attachment(s) from Anthony Austin included below]

          What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.

          * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

          This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from

          disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it

          by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received

          it in error.

           

          Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent

          those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA (Europe) Ltd.

           

          TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia, with its registered office

          at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120, Richmond, VA 23236-5403, USA.

          TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its

          registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London, SE1 7RG, UK.

           

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        • scarlgar
          I think some raised tables are better than others. Typically raised tables are installed at junctions and I have often found them problematic. At a junction a
          Message 5 of 7 , Jan 17, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            I think some raised tables are better than others. Typically raised tables are installed at junctions and I have often found them problematic. At a junction a cyclist will often want to stretch out an arm to indicate left or right, but it is difficult to take one hand off the handlebars when the raised table abruptly throws you up in the air at an angle of 45 degrees when you are attempting to do so. There is a raised table like this on Royal Hill near the junction with Prior Street.

            Speed cushions are often criticised and I appreciate why, but in my experience they do slow the traffic down and often mean that cyclists can avoid cycling over bumps/humps at all. My own experience on local roads with speed cushions has generally been fairly positive, whereas elsewhere I have encountered some ghastly angular raised tables and road humps that are as bad as a road full of potholes.

            However I have no objection to raised tables and road humps that extend across the full width of the road provided that they are of the "sinusoidal" kind
            (see http://www.ukroads.org/webfiles/TAL%209-98%20Sinusoidal%20-%20H%20and%20S%20road%20humps.pdf). 

            As this document says, "Humps with a sinusoidal profile are similar to round-top humps but have a shallower initial rise. They were developed in the Netherlands and Denmark to provide a more comfortable ride for cyclists in traffic calmed areas. The sinusoidal profile has also been used instead of straight ramps for flat-top road humps".


            Gareth


            From: mick davis <migfamily@...>
            To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Thursday, 17 January 2013, 19:00
            Subject: Re: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane



            And me.
            Gig
             
            From: Liz Delap
            Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:42 AM
            Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane
             
             
            Me too
             
            Kind Regards

            Liz



             
             

            From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Craven
            Sent: 16 January 2013 22:31
            To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

             
            Agreed.
            From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin
            Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52
            To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane [2 Attachments]
             
            [Attachment(s) from Anthony Austin included below]
            What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.
            * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
            This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from
            disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it
            by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received
            it in error.
             
            Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent
            those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA (Europe) Ltd.
             
            TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia, with its registered office
            at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120, Richmond, VA 23236-5403, USA.
            TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its
            registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London, SE1 7RG, UK.
             
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          • Liz Delap
            I agree with Gareth about sinusoidal road tables. As a cycling instructor I would suggest that arm signals should be done before you reach the junction. It is
            Message 6 of 7 , Jan 18, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              I agree with Gareth about sinusoidal road tables. As a cycling instructor I would suggest that arm signals should be done before you reach the junction. It is safer to have both hands on the bars for turning, as well as negotiating speed humps or tables. Liz


              Sent from Samsung Mobile


              scarlgar <scarlgar@...> wrote:


               

              I think some raised tables are better than others. Typically raised tables are installed at junctions and I have often found them problematic. At a junction a cyclist will often want to stretch out an arm to indicate left or right, but it is difficult to take one hand off the handlebars when the raised table abruptly throws you up in the air at an angle of 45 degrees when you are attempting to do so. There is a raised table like this on Royal Hill near the junction with Prior Street.

              Speed cushions are often criticised and I appreciate why, but in my experience they do slow the traffic down and often mean that cyclists can avoid cycling over bumps/humps at all. My own experience on local roads with speed cushions has generally been fairly positive, whereas elsewhere I have encountered some ghastly angular raised tables and road humps that are as bad as a road full of potholes.

              However I have no objection to raised tables and road humps that extend across the full width of the road provided that they are of the "sinusoidal" kind
              (see http://www.ukroads.org/webfiles/TAL%209-98%20Sinusoidal%20-%20H%20and%20S%20road%20humps.pdf). 

              As this document says, "Humps with a sinusoidal profile are similar to round-top humps but have a shallower initial rise. They were developed in the Netherlands and Denmark to provide a more comfortable ride for cyclists in traffic calmed areas. The sinusoidal profile has also been used instead of straight ramps for flat-top road humps".


              Gareth


              From: mick davis <migfamily@...>
              To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Thursday, 17 January 2013, 19:00
              Subject: Re: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane



              And me.
              Gig
               
              Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:42 AM
              Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane
               
               
              Me too
               
              Kind Regards

              Liz



               
               

              From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups..com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Craven
              Sent: 16 January 2013 22:31
              To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

               
              Agreed.
              From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto:greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin
              Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52
              To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane [2 Attachments]
               
              [Attachment(s) from Anthony Austin included below]
              What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.
              * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
              This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from
              disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it
              by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received
              it in error.
               
              Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent
              those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA (Europe) Ltd.
               
              TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia, with its registered office
              at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120, Richmond, VA 23236-5403, USA.
              TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its
              registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London, SE1 7RG, UK.
               
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              Page Title

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              This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from

              disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it

              by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received

              it in error.

               

              Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent

              those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA (Europe) Ltd.

               

              TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia, with its registered office

              at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120, Richmond, VA 23236-5403, USA.

              TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its

              registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London, SE1 7RG, UK.

               

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            • Anthony Austin
              Traffic islands built in 20 mph zones to narrow the road to a single lane are another potential hazard for cyclists (E.G. Vanbrugh Park Road), but that s not
              Message 7 of 7 , Jan 18, 2013
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                Traffic islands built in 20 mph zones to narrow the road to a single lane are another potential hazard for cyclists (E.G. Vanbrugh Park Road ), but that’s not proposed in Herbert Road and Swingate Lane .

                Thanks for your responses to date and I’ll include sinusoidal tables in our submission (when I’ve found out what it means).


                From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Liz Delap
                Sent: 18 January 2013 09:12
                To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

                 

                 

                I agree with Gareth about sinusoidal road tables. As a cycling instructor I would suggest that arm signals should be done before you reach the junction. It is safer to have both hands on the bars for turning, as well as negotiating speed humps or tables. Liz


                Sent from Samsung Mobile


                scarlgar < scarlgar @...> wrote:

                 

                I think some raised tables are better than others. Typically raised tables are installed at junctions and I have often found them problematic. At a junction a cyclist will often want to stretch out an arm to indicate left or right, but it is difficult to take one hand off the handlebars when the raised table abruptly throws you up in the air at an angle of 45 degrees when you are attempting to do so. There is a raised table like this on Royal Hill near the junction with Prior Street .

                 

                Speed cushions are often criticised and I appreciate why, but in my experience they do slow the traffic down and often mean that cyclists can avoid cycling over bumps/humps at all. My own experience on local roads with speed cushions has generally been fairly positive, whereas elsewhere I have encountered some ghastly angular raised tables and road humps that are as bad as a road full of potholes.

                 

                However I have no objection to raised tables and road humps that extend across the full width of the road provided that they are of the "sinusoidal" kind

                (see http://www.ukroads.org/webfiles/TAL%209-98%20Sinusoidal%20-%20H%20and%20S%20road%20humps.pdf). 

                 

                As this document says, "Humps with a sinusoidal profile are similar to round-top humps but have a shallower initial rise. They were developed in the Netherlands and Denmark to provide a more comfortable ride for cyclists in traffic calmed areas. The sinusoidal profile has also been used instead of straight ramps for flat-top road humps".

                 

                 

                Gareth

                 


                From: mick davis <migfamily@...>
                To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Thursday, 17 January 2013, 19:00
                Subject: Re: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

                 

                 

                And me.

                Gig

                 

                From: Liz Delap

                Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:42 AM

                Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

                 

                 

                Me too

                 

                Kind Regards

                Liz


                 

                 


                From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups..com [mailto: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Stephen Craven
                Sent: 16 January 2013 22:31
                To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane

                 

                Agreed.

                From: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com [mailto: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Anthony Austin
                Sent: 16 January 2013 10:52
                To: greenwichcyclists@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [greenwichcyclists] 20 mph zones in Herbert Rd and Swingate Lane [2 Attachments]

                 

                [Attachment(s) from Anthony Austin included below]

                What do you think about these proposed 20mph zones in Woolwich and Plumstead? At the moment I plan to reply by the February 5 deadline saying we welcome 20 mph zones and parking restrictions. We prefer traffic calming measures in the form of raised tables extending the full width of the carriageway rather than speed bumps which encourage impatient motorists to race ahead of cyclists and crowd them into the kerb.

                * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

                This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from

                disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it

                by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received

                it in error.

                 

                Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent

                those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA ( Europe ) Ltd.

                 

                TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia , with its registered office

                at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120 , Richmond , VA 23236-5403 , USA .

                TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its

                registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London , SE1 7RG , UK .

                 

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                This email may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from

                disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this email, do not duplicate or redistribute it

                by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received

                it in error.

                 

                Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent

                those of TESLA, Inc. or TESLA ( Europe ) Ltd.

                 

                TESLA, Inc. is a company incorporated in the Commonwealth of Virginia , with its registered office

                at 9201 Arboretum Parkway, Suite 120 , Richmond , VA 23236-5403 , USA .

                TESLA (Europe) Ltd. is a company registered in England (Registered No. 2777311), with its

                registered office at 42-43 Lower Marsh, London , SE1 7RG , UK .

                 

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