Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Crimean runes

Expand Messages
  • Troels Brandt
    I agree in your comments below. It was the connection Kerch - Goths - Romenia - Pietroassa - Reicherts J -rune (discussed as at Stentoften) which made me
    Message 1 of 18 , Mar 8, 2005
    • 0 Attachment
      I agree in your comments below. It was the connection Kerch - Goths -
      Romenia - Pietroassa - Reicherts "J"-rune (discussed as at
      Stentoften) which made me suggest this theoretical possibility.

      Troels

      --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "llama_nom" <600cell@o...> wrote:
      >
      > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Troels Brandt" <trbrandt@p...>
      > wrote:
      >
      > > I am not the right to answer and llama has answered the linquistc
      > > part.
      >
      >
      > Far from it: I haven´t answered anything, only suggested some more
      > questions! I just tried to give a summary of what sort of
      > inscriptions have been found so far that are attributed to East
      > Germanic peoples such as the Goths and Heruls. Anything else is
      > pure speculation on my part.
      >
      > Troels mentions the idea of runes used as ideographs, standing for
      > the concept represented by the name of the rune
      > (called "Begriffsrunen" in German, "begrepsruner" in Norwegian,
      > which term is sometimes translated "concept runes" in English).
      > That´s something I hadn´t thought of, but an interesting
      possibility
      > to consider. The technique is probably used in some Scandinavian
      > inscriptions predating the Viking Age (e.g. Stentoften & Gummarp),
      > and it is attested somewhat later in Anglo-Saxon manuscripts, but
      > there are many inscriptions where the use of concept runes is
      > disputed, or impossible to prove. There is one widely accepted
      > example of a concept rune in an inscription considered to be
      Gothic:
      > the Pietroassa ring, found in Romania. Here, as at Stentoften, the
      > ideograph as part of a text which otherwise is spelt out in full--
      > rather than a series of initials.
      >
      > Here is a quote from JH Looijenga's book "Runes Around the North
      > Sea...", she is talking about finds from before the Viking period:
      >
      > "Personally I have difficulties determining when and if an
      > ideographic rune (or Begriffsrune) was used, since the runewriters'
      > criteria for using them are unknown to us. There is at least
      > one clear instance of the use of an ideographic rune: the single j
      > rune on the Stentoften stone, representing its name *jara
      > meaning `good year' = harvest. The peculiar use of this ideograph
      > is further emphasized by the fact that it was carved in an archaic
      > fashion. The h in Thorsberg aisgzh may or may not be such a
      > Begriffsrune, there is no graphic peculiarity (h has no
      > archaic forerunner), but, in Antonsen's interpretation, it could
      > symbolize its name on syntactic grounds. In some other cases,
      > isolated runes may be read as abbreviations, such as the r in the
      > Sievern bracteate, which apparently denotes r[unoz]. Single runes
      > may have been read as abbreviations in the oldest inscriptions, and
      > may later on have come to represent the symbolic meaning of the
      > rune's name."
      >
      > http://www.ub.rug.nl/eldoc/dis/arts/j.h.looijenga/
      >
      >
      > Needless to say, with a whole series of abbreviations, it would be
      > very hard to narrow down the possible interpretations. If they
      > stood for the concepts embodied in the rune names, it's easy to
      > think up symbolic interpretations, but hard if not impossible to
      > test them.
      >
      > Llama Nom
    Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.