Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: (unknown)

Expand Messages
  • faltin2001
    ... com:office:office / ... Hi Vladimir, perhaps belyi Russian for white is a possible link? Not sure what white would be in Old Slavonic. cheers Dirk
    Message 1 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
    • 0 Attachment
      --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, åÇÏÒÏ× ÷ÌÁÄÉÍÉÒ <vegorov@i...> wrote:
      > Hi Greg!<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-
      com:office:office" />
      >
      >
      >
      > I have not a direct answer on your question
      > regarding the "barbaric" word "balan".
      > But I draw your attention to the Russian word
      > "bulany" as a horse color. "Bulany" is regularly
      > translated in English as "dun" though old
      > Russian explanatory dictionaries treat the notion
      > as "ore-yellow, yellowish of diverse tints,
      > with the mane and tail being black or deep-brown,
      > and usually with a strap along spinal column".
      >
      >
      >
      > I do not know the exact origin of "bulany" but
      > Turkic (Kuman) extraction looks most probable.
      > I guess you should search in this direction.
      >
      >
      >
      > Good luck,
      >
      > Vladimir
      >


      Hi Vladimir,

      perhaps 'belyi' Russian for white is a possible link? Not sure
      what 'white' would be in Old Slavonic.

      cheers
      Dirk










      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: greg scaff [mailto:g_scaff@y...]
      > Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 4:22 AM
      > To: gothic-l@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: [gothic-l] (unknown)
      >
      >
      >
      > Hails,
      >
      > I am curious as to the origin of the word "balan", mentioned
      in Procopius' History of the Wars, V, XVlll, in my vol, p
      173, ",,,and his whole body was dark grey, except that his face from
      the top of his head to the nostrils was the purest white. Such a
      horse the Greeks call "phalius" and the barbarians "balan." Within
      the context of this passage it seems that Procopius was referring to
      Ostrogoths as the barbarians in question, but not definatively. I'm
      aware that "balan" is unattested as a Gothic word. Can it be
      identified as having a known Iranic/Turkic/Arabic or other origin?
      Are there any Germanic cognates? Has anyone studied this word
      before? I would appreciate your ideas and comments, thank you.
      >
      > Greg
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
      >
      >
      > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a
      blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
      Service.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ---------------------------------
      > Do you Yahoo!?
      > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your
      desktop!
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
      >
      > ADVERTISEMENT
      >
      <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=17
      05297328:HM/A=1481646/R=0/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300
      _flake/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl>
      > <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?
      M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupmail/S=:HM/A=1481646/rand=371
      930928>
      >
      > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a
      blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
      <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Francisc Czobor
      Hails, Greg in the Romanian language, balan means white or light-colored , with reference to horses (and sometimes it means also blonde , with reference
      Message 2 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
      • 0 Attachment
        Hails, Greg

        in the Romanian language, "balan" means "white" or "light-colored",
        with reference to horses (and sometimes it means also "blonde", with
        reference to humans). The word seems to be of Slavic origin (Old
        Slavonic belu "white"). It is interesting that the word mentioned by
        Procopius is identical with the modern Romanian form.

        Francisc

        --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, greg scaff <g_scaff@y...> wrote:
        >
        > Hails,
        >
        > I am curious as to the origin of the word "balan", mentioned
        in Procopius' History of the Wars, V, XVlll, in my vol, p
        173, ",,,and his whole body was dark grey, except that his face from
        the top of his head to the nostrils was the purest white. Such a
        horse the Greeks call "phalius" and the barbarians "balan." Within
        the context of this passage it seems that Procopius was referring to
        Ostrogoths as the barbarians in question, but not definatively. I'm
        aware that "balan" is unattested as a Gothic word. Can it be
        identified as having a known Iranic/Turkic/Arabic or other origin?
        Are there any Germanic cognates? Has anyone studied this word
        before? I would appreciate your ideas and comments, thank you.
        >
        > Greg
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
        >
        >
        > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a
        blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
        Service.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > Do you Yahoo!?
        > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your
        desktop!
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • matthew carver
        Koebler suggests Go. *Bala- refers orig. to white , and spec. a horse with a white marking, i.e. a blaze (cf. Byz. balas ), prob.
        Message 3 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
        • 0 Attachment
          Koebler suggests
          Go. *Bala- refers orig. to 'white', and spec. a horse with a white
          marking, i.e. a "blaze" (cf. Byz. 'balas'), prob. < s. germ. *bala-
          "white, light, shining" < PIE (Pok.) *bha'-(1). THere is the gothic adj.
          *bal-s, PIE *bhel-(1) v. ref. (Pok.). It may be an extended form in
          *blagks < *blankaz "white" (> it. bianco, fr. blanc).

          There is of course baltic similarity in Lith. balts "white", Rus. byel-.


          -Matthew
          On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 12:39 AM, faltin2001 wrote:

          > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, åÇÏÒÏ× ÷ÌÁÄÉÍÉÒ <vegorov@i...> wrote:
          >> Hi Greg!<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-
          > com:office:office" />
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> I have not a direct answer on your question
          >> regarding the "barbaric" word "balan".
          >> But I draw your attention to the Russian word
          >> "bulany" as a horse color. "Bulany" is regularly
          >> translated in English as "dun" though old
          >> Russian explanatory dictionaries treat the notion
          >> as "ore-yellow, yellowish of diverse tints,
          >> with the mane and tail being black or deep-brown,
          >> and usually with a strap along spinal column".
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> I do not know the exact origin of "bulany" but
          >> Turkic (Kuman) extraction looks most probable.
          >> I guess you should search in this direction.
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Good luck,
          >>
          >> Vladimir
          >>
          >
          >
          > Hi Vladimir,
          >
          > perhaps 'belyi' Russian for white is a possible link? Not sure
          > what 'white' would be in Old Slavonic.
          >
          > cheers
          > Dirk
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >>
          >>
          >> -----Original Message-----
          >> From: greg scaff [mailto:g_scaff@y...]
          >> Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 4:22 AM
          >> To: gothic-l@yahoogroups.com
          >> Subject: [gothic-l] (unknown)
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Hails,
          >>
          >> I am curious as to the origin of the word "balan", mentioned
          > in Procopius' History of the Wars, V, XVlll, in my vol, p
          > 173, ",,,and his whole body was dark grey, except that his face from
          > the top of his head to the nostrils was the purest white. Such a
          > horse the Greeks call "phalius" and the barbarians "balan." Within
          > the context of this passage it seems that Procopius was referring to
          > Ostrogoths as the barbarians in question, but not definatively. I'm
          > aware that "balan" is unattested as a Gothic word. Can it be
          > identified as having a known Iranic/Turkic/Arabic or other origin?
          > Are there any Germanic cognates? Has anyone studied this word
          > before? I would appreciate your ideas and comments, thank you.
          >>
          >> Greg
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
          >>
          >>
          >> You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a
          > blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
          >>
          >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
          > Service.
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> ---------------------------------
          >> Do you Yahoo!?
          >> Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your
          > desktop!
          >>
          >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
          >>
          >> ADVERTISEMENT
          >>
          > <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=17
          > 05297328:HM/A=1481646/R=0/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300
          > _flake/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl>
          >> <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?
          > M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupmail/S=:HM/A=1481646/rand=371
          > 930928>
          >>
          >> You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a
          > blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
          >>
          >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
          > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service.
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank
          > email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • matthew carver
          hot - heits south(ward) - adv. sunthr north(ern) - adj. naurths (adv. = ? naurthr) on - ana (et al.) off - ab (et al.) feel - ? you have to name what exactly
          Message 4 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
          • 0 Attachment
            hot - heits
            south(ward) - adv. sunthr
            north(ern) - adj. naurths (adv. = ? naurthr)
            on - ana (et al.)
            off - ab (et al.)
            feel - ? you have to name what exactly is felt, i think, or use words to
            mean touch (tekan) or think (hugjan, munan, thugkjan, frathjan etc.)
            feelings - sense is 'frathi' or 'gahugds' - again, not common modern
            usage.
            close - galukan (verb to close), adj. (near, tight) lukns, adv. nehw(a)
            finish - ustiuhan
            blue - not attested. ? *blews
            gray - (adj) grews, greiseis, hasws, falws; (n) hawi
            brown - (adj) bruns
            yellow - not attested. but yellowish, pale (grayish) = falws. use golden
            (gultheins) or red (ruths) or bright (bairhts) perhaps.

            it really requires one to think differently about domains of meaning and
            examine one's idioms and ways of expression in comparison with those of
            gothic.

            -matthew


            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
            > is this particular reading in gothic or what. is balan gothic for
            > horse- i dont know. but maybe you might know some word meanings i hadnt
            > found in wrights glossary or the german-gotisch glossary. here they
            > are-
            > hot,south,north,on,off,feel,feelings,close,finish,blue,gray,brown,yellow----ik
            > andbeiden izwar andwaurdwa.swa larsizuhain andbeiden skura
            > seina--nightly bath? afletan mein dwalipa waurdei, im swe sidondan
            > mein gutiska.---awiulidon bropar
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank
            > email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
            >
          • Егоров Владимир
            Hi Dirk! I do not think Russian belyi to have connection to Procopius balan .
            Message 5 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
            • 0 Attachment
              Hi Dirk!<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />



              I do not think Russian "belyi" to have connection
              to Procopius' "balan". First, the transition
              a -> e (half-long narrow sound) is not characteristic
              for the Russian language. Second, the white color
              is very specific, while Procopius wrote explicitly
              about the "dark gray" color.

              Perhaps the mentioned Greek "phalios" could be
              a cognate of English "pale"?
              But this is another pair of shoes.



              Vladimir



              -----Original Message-----
              From: faltin2001 [mailto:dirk@...]
              Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2003 11:40 AM
              To: gothic-l@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [gothic-l] Re: (unknown)


              --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, ������ �������� <vegorov@i...> wrote:
              > Hi Greg!<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-
              com:office:office" />
              >


              Hi Vladimir,

              perhaps 'belyi' Russian for white is a possible link? Not sure
              what 'white' would be in Old Slavonic.

              cheers
              Dirk









              >




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • OSCAR HERRERA
              matthew carver wrote:hot - heits south(ward) - adv. sunthr north(ern) - adj. naurths (adv. = ? naurthr) on - ana (et al.) off - ab (et
              Message 6 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
              • 0 Attachment
                matthew carver <me@...> wrote:hot - heits
                south(ward) - adv. sunthr
                north(ern) - adj. naurths (adv. = ? naurthr)
                on - ana (et al.)
                off - ab (et al.)
                feel - ? you have to name what exactly is felt, i think, or use words to
                mean touch (tekan) or think (hugjan, munan, thugkjan, frathjan etc.)
                feelings - sense is 'frathi' or 'gahugds' - again, not common modern
                usage.
                close - galukan (verb to close), adj. (near, tight) lukns, adv. nehw(a)
                finish - ustiuhan
                blue - not attested. ? *blews
                gray - (adj) grews, greiseis, hasws, falws; (n) hawi
                brown - (adj) bruns
                yellow - not attested. but yellowish, pale (grayish) = falws. use golden
                (gultheins) or red (ruths) or bright (bairhts) perhaps.

                it really requires one to think differently about domains of meaning and
                examine one's idioms and ways of expression in comparison with those of
                gothic.

                -matthew


                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                > is this particular reading in gothic or what. is balan gothic for
                > horse- i dont know. but maybe you might know some word meanings i hadnt
                > found in wrights glossary or the german-gotisch glossary. here they
                > are-
                > hot,south,north,on,off,feel,feelings,close,finish,blue,gray,brown,yellow----ik
                > andbeiden izwar andwaurdwa.swa larsizuhain andbeiden skura
                > seina--nightly bath? afletan mein dwalipa waurdei, im swe sidondan
                > mein gutiska.---awiulidon bropar
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank
                > email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                >
                >
                >


                Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                couple of more questions- in the word your which is izwar,is izwar pronounced as just the war part as var,so your saying var-your.also in reading other peoples work in gothic i noticed most of the words are suffixed different than their original meaning counterparts.do you know of a more teachable book and glossary other that i have free access to on internet.

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • matthew carver
                oscar - izwar is pronounced IZ-war. The w is always w , not like v. It is the semivowel, not the bilabial continuant, in other words, like english w or
                Message 7 of 19 , Mar 19, 2003
                • 0 Attachment
                  oscar -

                  izwar is pronounced IZ-war. The 'w' is always 'w', not like v.
                  It is the semivowel, not the bilabial continuant, in other words,
                  like english 'w' or perhaps spanish 'hu'. there are links on my
                  website http://www.matthewcarver.com/gutrazda/. i think
                  david salo had some lessons online, but i forget the exact
                  address.

                  -matthew

                  On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 07:42 AM, OSCAR HERRERA wrote:
                  >

                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                  > couple of more questions- in the word your which is izwar,is izwar
                  > pronounced as just the war part as var,so your saying var-your.also in
                  > reading other peoples work in gothic i noticed most of the words are
                  > suffixed different than their original meaning counterparts.do you know
                  > of a more teachable book and glossary other that i have free access to
                  > on internet.
                • OSCAR HERRERA
                  matthew carver wrote:oscar - izwar is pronounced IZ-war. The w is always w , not like v. It is the semivowel, not the bilabial
                  Message 8 of 19 , Mar 20, 2003
                  • 0 Attachment
                    matthew carver <me@...> wrote:oscar -

                    izwar is pronounced IZ-war. The 'w' is always 'w', not like v.
                    It is the semivowel, not the bilabial continuant, in other words,
                    like english 'w' or perhaps spanish 'hu'. there are links on my
                    website http://www.matthewcarver.com/gutrazda/. i think
                    david salo had some lessons online, but i forget the exact
                    address.

                    -matthew

                    On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 07:42 AM, OSCAR HERRERA wrote:
                    >

                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                    > couple of more questions- in the word your which is izwar,is izwar
                    > pronounced as just the war part as var,so your saying var-your.also in
                    > reading other peoples work in gothic i noticed most of the words are
                    > suffixed different than their original meaning counterparts.do you know
                    > of a more teachable book and glossary other that i have free access to
                    > on internet.


                    Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT

                    You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.

                    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                    when you use words as verbs such word can be used differently and spelled differently---here are some examples---cut,cutter,cutting-----wait,waiting---look,looking---wait is beiden,waiting is beidendan?----cut is bimaitan, cutter is ?, cutting is bimaitandan---another words whatis appropriate suffixes for words like this are standard-+---also more words in gothic---ice,floor,wrong

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • OSCAR HERRERA
                    matthew carver wrote:oscar - izwar is pronounced IZ-war. The w is always w , not like v. It is the semivowel, not the bilabial
                    Message 9 of 19 , Mar 20, 2003
                    • 0 Attachment
                      matthew carver <me@...> wrote:oscar -

                      izwar is pronounced IZ-war. The 'w' is always 'w', not like v.
                      It is the semivowel, not the bilabial continuant, in other words,
                      like english 'w' or perhaps spanish 'hu'. there are links on my
                      website http://www.matthewcarver.com/gutrazda/. i think
                      david salo had some lessons online, but i forget the exact
                      address.

                      -matthew

                      On Wednesday, March 19, 2003, at 07:42 AM, OSCAR HERRERA wrote:
                      >

                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                      > couple of more questions- in the word your which is izwar,is izwar
                      > pronounced as just the war part as var,so your saying var-your.also in
                      > reading other peoples work in gothic i noticed most of the words are
                      > suffixed different than their original meaning counterparts.do you know
                      > of a more teachable book and glossary other that i have free access to
                      > on internet.


                      Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT

                      You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.

                      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                      is the word for stop-gadaubjon.how about--- which,already---are you sure blue is blews.

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Grsartor@aol.com
                      Sorry for the tardy response. I suggest for a translation of Fire of life, make holy this place and keep out all evil : Fon þizos libainais, weihais þana
                      Message 10 of 19 , Mar 21, 2003
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Sorry for the tardy response.

                        I suggest for a translation of "Fire of life, make holy this place and keep
                        out all evil":

                        "Fon þizos libainais, weihais þana staþ warjaizuh all þata ubil."

                        Perhaps "hina" would be a better choice for "this" than "þana", which has a
                        sense more like "the" or "that"; on the other hand, I am not sure how free we
                        should feel to use forms like "hina", and "himma". The surviving examples of
                        their use seem to suggest that they were mainly employed in particular
                        phrases, such as "himma daga", on this day.

                        Gerry T.


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • greg scaff
                        Hails, My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your interest and insightful comments re: balan . I guess another question would be
                        Message 11 of 19 , Mar 25, 2003
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hails,

                          My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your interest and insightful comments re: "balan". I guess another question would be how accurate Procopius was in rendering a foreign word. Oh well. I find it compelling that it means the same in Romania today,or has the same form, as Francisc says, and wonder if their is any possible actual connection between the Romanian form and the possible Gothic?

                          cheers,

                          Greg






                          ---------------------------------
                          Do you Yahoo!?
                          Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • OSCAR HERRERA
                          greg scaff wrote: Hails, My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your interest and insightful comments re:
                          Message 12 of 19 , Mar 25, 2003
                          • 0 Attachment
                            greg scaff <g_scaff@...> wrote:

                            Hails,

                            My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your interest and insightful comments re: "balan". I guess another question would be how accurate Procopius was in rendering a foreign word. Oh well. I find it compelling that it means the same in Romania today,or has the same form, as Francisc says, and wonder if their is any possible actual connection between the Romanian form and the possible Gothic?

                            cheers,

                            Greg






                            ---------------------------------
                            Do you Yahoo!?
                            Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


                            Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT

                            You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.

                            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                            ik naup gaskierjan af samma waurdws. sind---interest(ing),key,paper,minute(s),bath(bathes),color,paint,horse,fox,sex(y)----awiulidon bropar

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • matthew carver
                            hails greg- It may be possible. The horse-riding tribes of the steppes, Scythians and Sarmations seem to have loaned a few words to germanic languages in
                            Message 13 of 19 , Mar 26, 2003
                            • 0 Attachment
                              hails greg-

                              It may be possible. The horse-riding tribes of the steppes, Scythians
                              and Sarmations seem to have loaned a few words to germanic languages in
                              general, or perhaps they came through Gothic (s.t. via Celtic, as marah-
                              'horse', cf. Green, Language & History...): paida 'leather coat' (< ?
                              riding coat), path- 'path (orig. a specific 'Scythian' path?), faths
                              'leader' (exhibiting the decimal model of the Persian/Iranian military
                              grouping). In Green, p. 81: "the possible presence of Gothic (or Gepid)
                              loanwords in Rumanian." (ref.: Bierbrauer [1994], 130. Diculescu [1921],
                              420ff. et al.)

                              -matthew


                              On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 04:33 PM, greg scaff wrote:

                              >
                              >
                              > Hails,
                              >
                              > My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your
                              > interest and insightful comments re: "balan". I guess another question
                              > would be how accurate Procopius was in rendering a foreign word. Oh
                              > well. I find it compelling that it means the same in Romania today,or
                              > has the same form, as Francisc says, and wonder if their is any
                              > possible actual connection between the Romanian form and the possible
                              > Gothic?
                              >
                              > cheers,
                              >
                              > Greg
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > ---------------------------------
                              > Do you Yahoo!?
                              > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank
                              > email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
                              >
                              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                              > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                              >
                              >
                              >
                            • greg scaff
                              Hails Matthew, Very interesting-thank you, and thanks for the references. cheers, Greg matthew carver wrote:hails greg- It may be
                              Message 14 of 19 , Mar 26, 2003
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Hails Matthew,
                                Very interesting-thank you, and thanks for the references.
                                cheers,
                                Greg
                                matthew carver <me@...> wrote:hails greg-

                                It may be possible. The horse-riding tribes of the steppes, Scythians
                                and Sarmations seem to have loaned a few words to germanic languages in
                                general, or perhaps they came through Gothic (s.t. via Celtic, as marah-
                                'horse', cf. Green, Language & History...): paida 'leather coat' (< ?
                                riding coat), path- 'path (orig. a specific 'Scythian' path?), faths
                                'leader' (exhibiting the decimal model of the Persian/Iranian military
                                grouping). In Green, p. 81: "the possible presence of Gothic (or Gepid)
                                loanwords in Rumanian." (ref.: Bierbrauer [1994], 130. Diculescu [1921],
                                420ff. et al.)

                                -matthew


                                On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 04:33 PM, greg scaff wrote:

                                >
                                >
                                > Hails,
                                >
                                > My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your
                                > interest and insightful comments re: "balan". I guess another question
                                > would be how accurate Procopius was in rendering a foreign word. Oh
                                > well. I find it compelling that it means the same in Romania today,or
                                > has the same form, as Francisc says, and wonder if their is any
                                > possible actual connection between the Romanian form and the possible
                                > Gothic?
                                >
                                > cheers,
                                >
                                > Greg
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > ---------------------------------
                                > Do you Yahoo!?
                                > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
                                >
                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank
                                > email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
                                >
                                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                >
                                >
                                >


                                Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
                                var lrec_target="_top";var lrec_URL = new Array();lrec_URL[1] = "http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=1705297328:HM/A=1508984/R=0/id=flashurl/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300_02F/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl";var link="javascript:LRECopenWindow(1)";var lrec_flashfile = 'http://us.a1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/a/1-/flash/expert_city/093002_weather300x250_02f.swf?clickTAG='+link+'';var lrec_altURL = "http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=1705297328:HM/A=1508984/R=1/id=altimgurl/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300_02F/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl";var lrec_altimg = "http://us.yimg.com/a/ex/expert_city/300x250_yh1.gif";var lrec_width = 300;var lrec_height = 250;
                                You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.

                                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                                ---------------------------------
                                Do you Yahoo!?
                                Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • OSCAR HERRERA
                                matthew carver wrote:hails greg- It may be possible. The horse-riding tribes of the steppes, Scythians and Sarmations seem to have
                                Message 15 of 19 , Mar 29, 2003
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  matthew carver <me@...> wrote:hails greg-

                                  It may be possible. The horse-riding tribes of the steppes, Scythians
                                  and Sarmations seem to have loaned a few words to germanic languages in
                                  general, or perhaps they came through Gothic (s.t. via Celtic, as marah-
                                  'horse', cf. Green, Language & History...): paida 'leather coat' (< ?
                                  riding coat), path- 'path (orig. a specific 'Scythian' path?), faths
                                  'leader' (exhibiting the decimal model of the Persian/Iranian military
                                  grouping). In Green, p. 81: "the possible presence of Gothic (or Gepid)
                                  loanwords in Rumanian." (ref.: Bierbrauer [1994], 130. Diculescu [1921],
                                  420ff. et al.)

                                  -matthew


                                  On Tuesday, March 25, 2003, at 04:33 PM, greg scaff wrote:

                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Hails,
                                  >
                                  > My thanks go to Dirk, Vladimir, Oscar, and of course Matthew for your
                                  > interest and insightful comments re: "balan". I guess another question
                                  > would be how accurate Procopius was in rendering a foreign word. Oh
                                  > well. I find it compelling that it means the same in Romania today,or
                                  > has the same form, as Francisc says, and wonder if their is any
                                  > possible actual connection between the Romanian form and the possible
                                  > Gothic?
                                  >
                                  > cheers,
                                  >
                                  > Greg
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ---------------------------------
                                  > Do you Yahoo!?
                                  > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank
                                  > email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.
                                  >
                                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                  > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >


                                  Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
                                  var lrec_target="_top";var lrec_URL = new Array();lrec_URL[1] = "http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=1705297328:HM/A=1508984/R=0/id=flashurl/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300_02F/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl";var link="javascript:LRECopenWindow(1)";var lrec_flashfile = 'http://us.a1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/a/1-/flash/expert_city/093002_weather300x250_02f.swf?clickTAG='+link+'';var lrec_altURL = "http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=1705297328:HM/A=1508984/R=1/id=altimgurl/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300_02F/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl";var lrec_altimg = "http://us.yimg.com/a/ex/expert_city/300x250_yh1.gif";var lrec_width = 300;var lrec_height = 250;
                                  You are a member of the Gothic-L list. To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe@egroups.com>.

                                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                                  hails matt--- ik swa naup samma waurdws du gaskeiran. her sind---stop,horse,sex,bugs, interest,do,tiger,lion,bear,paint,color,second,minute,animal,elephant,eagle,falcon. ive reading the corpus of the wulfila project and the translations are assumed and are not exact translations. also are crimean gothic words right translations. like eggs-ada or car-waghen and so forth. another word is cheese........ good luck--oscar

                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.