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Gothic forms of common names?

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  • Michael Erwin
    I was thinking that a list of Gothic forms of various names would be nice. Many common western names come from either Hebrew, Greek, Latin, or Germanic roots;
    Message 1 of 22 , Jul 29 6:34 PM
      I was thinking that a list of Gothic forms of various names would be
      nice. Many common western names come from either Hebrew, Greek, Latin,
      or Germanic roots; many of the former are well-attested in the Gothic
      bible, via Greek or occasionally Latin.
    • Fredrik
      ... Latin, ... Gothic ... Yes I think that too. I would perhaps be quite easy to list all the names attested in the bible, right? And names of gothic kings are
      Message 2 of 22 , Aug 2, 2008
        --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, Michael Erwin <merwin@...> wrote:
        >
        > I was thinking that a list of Gothic forms of various names would be
        > nice. Many common western names come from either Hebrew, Greek,
        Latin,
        > or Germanic roots; many of the former are well-attested in the
        Gothic
        > bible, via Greek or occasionally Latin.
        >

        Yes I think that too. I would perhaps be quite easy to list all the
        names attested in the bible, right?
        And names of gothic kings are known from different sources.
        I also think it could be OK to create gothic name forms of not attested
        names that are known in other germanic languages.
        Names known from roman lanuages such as spanish could be used as well.
        Spanish Rodriguez would correspond to gothic hrodareiks. But maybe this
        is attested already, does some one know that?

        /Fredrik

        ps. my name have I seen as frithareiks, but since the first part is a u-
        stem (I guess) I suppose the name should be frithureiks instead.
      • Arthur Jones
        In responding to gadrauhts, I would submit   Frithureiks; see cf. Frithugairns (shortened by Romans, perhaps by others, to Fritigern).   Attila s bride:
        Message 3 of 22 , Aug 2, 2008
          In responding to gadrauhts, I would submit
           
          Frithureiks; see cf. Frithugairns
          (shortened by Romans, perhaps by others, to Fritigern).
           
          Attila's bride: Ildico (Hildegund)


          ARTHUR A. JONES

          --- On Sat, 8/2/08, Fredrik <gadrauhts@...> wrote:

          From: Fredrik <gadrauhts@...>
          Subject: [gothic-l] Re: Gothic forms of common names?
          To: gothic-l@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Saturday, August 2, 2008, 9:48 AM






          --- In gothic-l@yahoogroup s.com, Michael Erwin <merwin@...> wrote:
          >
          > I was thinking that a list of Gothic forms of various names would be
          > nice. Many common western names come from either Hebrew, Greek,
          Latin,
          > or Germanic roots; many of the former are well-attested in the
          Gothic
          > bible, via Greek or occasionally Latin.
          >

          Yes I think that too. I would perhaps be quite easy to list all the
          names attested in the bible, right?
          And names of gothic kings are known from different sources.
          I also think it could be OK to create gothic name forms of not attested
          names that are known in other germanic languages.
          Names known from roman lanuages such as spanish could be used as well.
          Spanish Rodriguez would correspond to gothic hrodareiks. But maybe this
          is attested already, does some one know that?

          /Fredrik

          ps. my name have I seen as frithareiks, but since the first part is a u-
          stem (I guess) I suppose the name should be frithureiks instead.















          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Michael Erwin
          Actually, Wright includes a list of proper names and some notes on Gothic renderings of the Greek forms. We could expand that by: 1. Including synonyms 2.
          Message 4 of 22 , Aug 2, 2008
            Actually, Wright includes a list of proper names and some notes on
            Gothic renderings of the Greek forms. We could expand that by:

            1. Including synonyms

            2. Including additional names derived from the Greek on the same
            basis, e.g. *Ailaine for Helen/Elena

            3. Including additional names attested in histories

            4. Including Gothic equivalents for other Germanic names

            We might need to distinguish *reconstructions and **ones depending on
            the degree of speculation.
          • ualarauans
            ... Not *Greimahildi?
            Message 5 of 22 , Aug 2, 2008
              --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, Arthur Jones <arthurobin2002@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > [...]
              > Attila's bride: Ildico (Hildegund)

              Not *Greimahildi?
            • Fredrik
              I v been pondering aboout some namerelated stuff. Names are nouns and I guess they are inflected as such. Some languages (such as baltic) add suffixes to
              Message 6 of 22 , Aug 3, 2008
                I'v been pondering aboout some namerelated stuff.

                Names are nouns and I guess they are inflected as such.

                Some languages (such as baltic) add suffixes to foreign names so they
                mach their own language.
                Should we do that in gothic too? And should we use gothic name forms
                when talking about foreign people.

                Let's say we're talking about the former swedish king Carolus Rex or as
                we also know him Karl XII. Should we use a gothic form *Kairls instead?
                Or Charlemagne as Kairls sa Mikila?

                Other names such as Vladimir Lenin should that be smth like Waldamêreis
                Lênins?
              • ualarauans
                What is Gothic for Karl Marx I wonder – Ka(i)rls Marks (gen. Markis) or Markss (Marksis)? The latter seems likelier, but there s no example of a final -ss,
                Message 7 of 22 , Aug 3, 2008
                  What is Gothic for Karl Marx I wonder – Ka(i)rls Marks (gen. Markis)
                  or Markss (Marksis)? The latter seems likelier, but there's no example
                  of a final -ss, as far as I know. Maybe Marks, gen. Marksis, as it is
                  in urruns, urrunsis?

                  Lettish for V. I. Lenin is Vladimirs Il,jic^s L,en,ins. Looks a bit
                  funny.
                • Michael Erwin
                  ... Could assimilate the name to marks, border. Is that attested? I was more concerned with first names, to be honest. I think the Greek form for Michael would
                  Message 8 of 22 , Aug 3, 2008
                    On Aug 3, 2008, at 6:38 PM, ualarauans wrote:
                    > What is Gothic for Karl Marx I wonder – Ka(i)rls Marks (gen. Markis)
                    > or Markss (Marksis)? The latter seems likelier, but there's no example
                    > of a final -ss, as far as I know. Maybe Marks, gen. Marksis, as it is
                    > in urruns, urrunsis?
                    >
                    > Lettish for V. I. Lenin is Vladimirs Il,jic^s L,en,ins. Looks a bit
                    > funny.
                    >

                    Could assimilate the name to marks, border. Is that attested?

                    I was more concerned with first names, to be honest. I think the Greek
                    form for Michael would suggest Gothic Mixael or Mixail.
                  • ualarauans
                    ... Marka is attested. *Marks could be its masculine counterpart :)
                    Message 9 of 22 , Aug 3, 2008
                      --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, Michael Erwin <merwin@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > [...]
                      > Could assimilate the name to marks, border. Is that attested?

                      Marka is attested. *Marks could be its masculine counterpart :)
                    • Fredrik
                      ... Markis) ... example ... is ... I would propose Kairls Marks (gen. Marksis). Since the final s is not a suffix it shouldn t change to Markis, and you re
                      Message 10 of 22 , Aug 5, 2008
                        --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "ualarauans" <ualarauans@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > What is Gothic for Karl Marx I wonder – Ka(i)rls Marks (gen.
                        Markis)
                        > or Markss (Marksis)? The latter seems likelier, but there's no
                        example
                        > of a final -ss, as far as I know. Maybe Marks, gen. Marksis, as it
                        is
                        > in urruns, urrunsis?
                        >

                        I would propose Kairls Marks (gen. Marksis).
                        Since the final s is not a suffix it shouldn't change to Markis,
                        and you're right that final -ss isn't very frequent at all.
                        E.g. the pgmc word for salmon *lahsaz would've been lahss if final
                        double s was allowed but this would change to lahs and the genitive
                        would be lahsis.

                        > Lettish for V. I. Lenin is Vladimirs Il,jic^s L,en,ins. Looks a bit
                        > funny.
                        >

                        Yes this might've been what I was thinking about when refering to
                        some baltic language.
                        A masculine person's name would I propose end in masculine a-stem
                        suffix -s in nominative and be declines as such.

                        But should we use the gothic corresponding name for Vladimir or use
                        the russian with a a-stem s attached to it?
                      • ualarauans
                        ... That s a good question. The same I guess as should we use Fredrik or *Friþureiks :). We may consider the following: 1. Whether Vladimir is Germanic or
                        Message 11 of 22 , Aug 5, 2008
                          --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > [...]
                          > But should we use the gothic corresponding name for Vladimir or use
                          > the russian with a a-stem s attached to it?

                          That's a good question. The same I guess as should we use Fredrik or
                          *Friþureiks :). We may consider the following:

                          1. Whether Vladimir is Germanic or Slavic name?

                          2. If we transliterate it, how are we to render the initial v- ?

                          One more issue to address here is how we are to render the Russian
                          patronymic Ilyich ("son of Ilya"). Should it be Heleiïns sunus (in a
                          Germanic way), Hailiggs (a still more Germanic way) or Iljic, with a
                          koppa at the end, to represent –ch. What think ye?
                        • Fredrik
                          ... use ... or ... Exactly! I use the name frithureiks when refering to friedrich engels, and a supposed gothicized form of his last name as Aggilisks. ... I
                          Message 12 of 22 , Aug 5, 2008
                            --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "ualarauans" <ualarauans@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > [...]
                            > > But should we use the gothic corresponding name for Vladimir or
                            use
                            > > the russian with a a-stem s attached to it?
                            >
                            > That's a good question. The same I guess as should we use Fredrik
                            or
                            > *Friþureiks :).

                            Exactly!
                            I use the name frithureiks when refering to friedrich engels, and a
                            supposed gothicized form of his last name as Aggilisks.

                            We may consider the following:
                            >
                            > 1. Whether Vladimir is Germanic or Slavic name?
                            >

                            I don't acctually know if it's germanic or slavic but I think it's
                            slavic. But there is at least one germanic form which is know to me
                            as Valdemar. A good thing is that the elements of the name Vladimir
                            are cognate to the also similar elements in the germanic languages.


                            > 2. If we transliterate it, how are we to render the initial v- ?
                            >

                            V is usually transliterated with b som perhaps *bladimirs, but then
                            is the vowel i unknown befor r to gothic speakers since this became
                            aí. The form *bladimaírs would be more natural for gothic speakers.

                            > One more issue to address here is how we are to render the Russian
                            > patronymic Ilyich ("son of Ilya"). Should it be Heleiïns sunus (in
                            a
                            > Germanic way), Hailiggs (a still more Germanic way) or Iljic, with
                            a
                            > koppa at the end, to represent –ch. What think ye?
                            >

                            There has been problems with the ch sound before and I don't have any
                            idea good enough to write this sound in gothic.
                            What's the origine of the name Ilya?

                            /F
                          • ualarauans
                            ... I think Waldamêrs would be still more natural :) ... Same as Gothic Heleias (which also appears as Haileiins gen., Eleias et sim.). Hebrew Eliyahu, that
                            Message 13 of 22 , Aug 5, 2008
                              --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > [...]
                              > The form *bladimaírs would be more natural for gothic speakers.

                              I think Waldamêrs would be still more natural :)

                              > What's the origine of the name Ilya?

                              Same as Gothic Heleias (which also appears as Haileiins gen., Eleias
                              et sim.). Hebrew Eliyahu, that is.

                              Another man we can try our hand at is Lev Davydovich Trotzki. Liwa
                              Daweidis sunus makes sense for me, but what about the last name?
                              Bearing in mind that it is an adjective formed from the Russian town
                              name Troki which is today's Trakai (masc. pl. a-stem) in Lithuania, we
                              could go for something like Liwa D. s. af Trakam, or sa Trakiska.
                              Alternatively, we could Gothicize his real name Bronstein if only we
                              know what its first element is about. The name is Germanic (Yiddish).
                            • Fredrik
                              ... Yes I agree...this would be the most natural since it would be a translated form. ... Eleias ... town ... we ... I d go with af trakam . That seems pretty
                              Message 14 of 22 , Aug 6, 2008
                                --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "ualarauans" <ualarauans@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@> wrote:
                                > >
                                > > [...]
                                > > The form *bladimaírs would be more natural for gothic speakers.
                                >
                                > I think Waldamêrs would be still more natural :)
                                >

                                Yes I agree...this would be the most natural since it would be a
                                translated form.

                                > > What's the origine of the name Ilya?
                                >
                                > Same as Gothic Heleias (which also appears as Haileiins gen.,
                                Eleias
                                > et sim.). Hebrew Eliyahu, that is.
                                >
                                > Another man we can try our hand at is Lev Davydovich Trotzki. Liwa
                                > Daweidis sunus makes sense for me, but what about the last name?
                                > Bearing in mind that it is an adjective formed from the Russian
                                town
                                > name Troki which is today's Trakai (masc. pl. a-stem) in Lithuania,
                                we
                                > could go for something like Liwa D. s. af Trakam, or sa Trakiska.

                                I'd go with 'af trakam'. That seems pretty good. Couldn't smth like
                                trakiggs be used in the sence 'from trakai' ???



                                > Alternatively, we could Gothicize his real name Bronstein if only
                                we
                                > know what its first element is about. The name is Germanic
                                (Yiddish).
                                >
                              • Michael Erwin
                                ... I thought Vladimir meant Airþareiks? I m not sure how anyone gets Waldamers from Vladimir.
                                Message 15 of 22 , Aug 6, 2008
                                  On Aug 6, 2008, at 4:40 PM, Fredrik wrote:

                                  > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "ualarauans" <ualarauans@...> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@> wrote:
                                  > > >
                                  > > > [...]
                                  > > > The form *bladimaírs would be more natural for gothic speakers.
                                  > >
                                  > > I think Waldamêrs would be still more natural :)
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  > Yes I agree...this would be the most natural since it would be a
                                  > translated form.
                                  >

                                  I thought Vladimir meant Airþareiks? I'm not sure how anyone gets
                                  Waldamers from Vladimir.
                                • Fredrik
                                  ... The name Bronstein (§¢§â§à§ß§ê§ä¨¦§Û§ß) could that be from yiddish broynshteyn? If so the name could be Brunastains in gothic.
                                  Message 16 of 22 , Aug 6, 2008
                                    >
                                    > > Alternatively, we could Gothicize his real name Bronstein if only
                                    > we
                                    > > know what its first element is about. The name is Germanic
                                    > (Yiddish).
                                    > >
                                    >


                                    The name Bronstein (§¢§â§à§ß§ê§ä¨¦§Û§ß) could that be from yiddish broynshteyn?

                                    If so the name could be Brunastains in gothic.
                                  • Fredrik
                                    ... speakers. ... I guess you think of mir in the meaning world/airþa? But it s probably an old word meaning famous and cognate to gothic mêrs/mêreis. The
                                    Message 17 of 22 , Aug 6, 2008
                                      --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, Michael Erwin <merwin@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > On Aug 6, 2008, at 4:40 PM, Fredrik wrote:
                                      >
                                      > > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "ualarauans" <ualarauans@> wrote:
                                      > > >
                                      > > > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@> wrote:
                                      > > > >
                                      > > > > [...]
                                      > > > > The form *bladimaírs would be more natural for gothic
                                      speakers.
                                      > > >
                                      > > > I think Waldamêrs would be still more natural :)
                                      > > >
                                      > >
                                      > > Yes I agree...this would be the most natural since it would be a
                                      > > translated form.
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      > I thought Vladimir meant Airþareiks? I'm not sure how anyone gets
                                      > Waldamers from Vladimir.
                                      >

                                      I guess you think of mir in the meaning world/airþa? But it's
                                      probably an old word meaning famous and cognate to gothic mêrs/mêreis.
                                      The first part vladi would probably better be translated to reiks but
                                      walda- is the most similar word and also a cognate.
                                      I think the form Waldamêrs also should be used for persons named
                                      Valdemar, which ofcoz is related and also a germanicized form of
                                      vladimir.
                                    • ualarauans
                                      ... It could, probably. Íslendingur is one from Ísland.
                                      Message 18 of 22 , Aug 7, 2008
                                        --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > [...]
                                        > Couldn't smth like
                                        > trakiggs be used in the sence 'from trakai' ???

                                        It could, probably. Íslendingur is one from Ísland.
                                      • ualarauans
                                        ... only ... broynshteyn? ... Yes. And if it s the same as German Born : Brunnen, then Brunnastains. Or, maybe, Bernstein = Brinnastains?
                                        Message 19 of 22 , Aug 7, 2008
                                          --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > >
                                          > > > Alternatively, we could Gothicize his real name Bronstein if
                                          only
                                          > > we
                                          > > > know what its first element is about. The name is Germanic
                                          > > (Yiddish).
                                          > > >
                                          > >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > The name Bronstein (§¢§â§à§ß§ê§ä¨¦§Û§ß) could that be from yiddish
                                          broynshteyn?
                                          >
                                          > If so the name could be Brunastains in gothic.

                                          Yes. And if it's the same as German Born : Brunnen, then
                                          Brunnastains. Or, maybe, Bernstein = Brinnastains?
                                        • Fredrik
                                          ... Yes (like swedish islänning and perhaps gothic *eislandiggs) and gothic tairwiggs is one from the forest, right?
                                          Message 20 of 22 , Aug 7, 2008
                                            --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "ualarauans" <ualarauans@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > --- In gothic-l@yahoogroups.com, "Fredrik" <gadrauhts@> wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > > [...]
                                            > > Couldn't smth like
                                            > > trakiggs be used in the sence 'from trakai' ???
                                            >
                                            > It could, probably. Íslendingur is one from Ísland.
                                            >

                                            Yes (like swedish islänning and perhaps gothic *eislandiggs) and gothic
                                            tairwiggs is one from the forest, right?
                                          • Ian Ragsdale
                                            My Deutsches Namen-Lexicon lists the brun in Brunstein as an old epitaph for Odin. I don t know enough to say whether this can be thrown out of the discussion
                                            Message 21 of 22 , Aug 8, 2008
                                              My Deutsches Namen-Lexicon lists the brun in Brunstein as an old
                                              epitaph for Odin. I don't know enough to say whether this can be
                                              thrown out of the discussion for Bronstein or not (which I could not
                                              find listed in the dictionary).

                                              IMR

                                              >> > > Alternatively, we could Gothicize his real name Bronstein if
                                              > only
                                              >> > we
                                              >> > > know what its first element is about. The name is Germanic
                                              >> > (Yiddish).
                                              >> > >
                                              >> >
                                              >>
                                              >>
                                              >> The name Bronstein (坎把抉扶扮找谷抄扶) could that be from yiddish
                                              > broynshteyn?
                                              >>
                                              >> If so the name could be Brunastains in gothic.
                                              >
                                              > Yes. And if it's the same as German Born : Brunnen, then
                                              > Brunnastains. Or, maybe, Bernstein = Brinnastains?
                                              >
                                              >
                                            • Lombard
                                              According to Henning Kaufmann ( Untersuchungen zu altdeutschen Rufnamen , Wilhelm Fink Verlag, München 1965) Romanic Carolus is derived from a Germ.-Rom.
                                              Message 22 of 22 , Aug 15, 2008
                                                According to Henning Kaufmann ("Untersuchungen zu altdeutschen Rufnamen", Wilhelm Fink Verlag, München 1965) Romanic "Carolus" is derived from a Germ.-Rom. hybrid "Hari-olus":



                                                "Der dem Kurznamen Hario entsprechende Kosename mit l-Suffix ist unter anderem in einer lothringischen Urkunde vom Jahre 942 als " Hariolus" (mit dem Ton auf der Stammsilbe!) überliefert. Im Munde von Romanen konnte dieser Kosename dann - sozusagen lautgesetzlich - zu "Cár-olus" umgeformt werden, wie ja auch die Kurzform Hario zu "Caro" romanisiert wurde. Auffällig an dieser Entwicklung ist zunächst die Unterdrückung des Fugenvokals -i- von Hari- vor vokalisch anlautender Endung beziehungsweise vokalisch anlautendem zweiten Personennamen-Glied. Der Umstand, daß man dieser Lautregel (und eine solche ist es!) keine Beachtung geschenkt hat, hat dazu beigetragen, die richtige Beurteilung der fraglichen Vorgänge und Zusammenhänge bisher zu verhindern. Untersuchen wir also zunächst die hergehörigen Fälle!



                                                Bekanntlich bleibt in zweigliedrigen Personennamen der Fugenvokal erhalten, wenn das erste Glied eine kurze Stammsilbe hat: Geba-hart, Filu-danc. Entsprechend dieser Regel heißt es auch: Cari-lef; denn das zweite Glied beginnt hier mit einem Konsonant. Nun wurde zwar bei den germanischen Personen-Vollformen vokalischer Anlaut des zweiten Gliedes grundsätzlich gemieden. Doch kann, wie wir oben in Kapitel X gezeigt haben, vokalischer Anlaut sekundär dadurch entstehen, daß ein anlautendes w- des Endgliedes (nicht nur in der Schrift, sondern auch lautlich!) erwartungsgemäß zu einem bloßen Vokal "gedrückt" wird oder ganz schwindet. In Chari-wald ist das w- noch konsonantisch; im westfränkischen Char-oald, Her-oald ist es schon vokalisch; vgl. a. 615 Cher-ulf (westfrk.); daher der Verlust des -i-. Dieser Regel entsprechend heißt es auch: Car-uin, -oin usw. Westfränkisch Car-oand 7. Jh. ist ein mit "-wand" gebildeter Vollname; auch hier erscheint das w- zum Vokal gedrückt.



                                                Bekannte altdeutsche Beispiele sind: Har-ald, Har-olt und Har-olf. Unsere Regel gilt natürlich nicht nur für "Hari-". Auch für "Garu-" finden wir westfränkisch neben Gari-wald (6. Jh.) späterhin Garold, Garald. Unsere Regel gilt, wie man sieht, auch dann, wenn auf den Fugenvokal (Themavokal) kein zweites Glied, sondern eine Ableitungssilbe folgt; also auch: Cár-olus. Von anderen Überlegungen ausgehend, gelangt G. Schramm zu dem übereinstimmenden Ergebnis: "Wo im Germanischen auf den vokalischen Auslaut eines Vordergliedes ein vokalisch anlautender zweiter Kompositionsteil folgte, scheint der Hiatus durchweg durch Tilgung des Fugenvokals behoben worden zu sein. "



                                                Da "Hari-" ursprünglich ja-Stamm ist, konnte der Hiatus auch auf dem Wege der Angleichung des -j- an das -r- mit westgermanischer Verdoppelung behoben werden. So entstand gelegentlich ein "Karrolus"; vgl. Heriand > Herrand.



                                                Vereinzelt begegnet statt des Ersatzlautes K- die stimmhafte Entsprechung G-. Eine Urkunde von St. Gallen (Ausstellungsort: Wengi, Kt. Thurgau) hat: "regnante imperatore nostro Garolo".



                                                Was uns bei der Form Cár-olus noch fremdartig anmutet, das ist der Vokal des Kosesuffixes. Denn auf altdeutschem Gebiet ging dem l-Suffix meist ein -i- voraus; in vorliegendem Falle jedoch anscheinend nie. Um das 7.-8. Jahrh. findet sich neben Car-olus oft auch: Car-ulus und Car-alus. Ein Sklave hieß Car-ellus. Das -a- des Suffixes paßt nicht zu den mit Hari- gebildeten Koseformen; und -ulus, -olus, -ellus gleichen auffallend lateinischen Suffixen. Dies fügt sich aber wiederum gut ein in das von uns entworfene Gesamtbild. Vgl. auch die westfränkischen beziehungsweise langobardischen Formen: Bert-alus, Cad-alus 8. Jh.; Gund-ulus 7. Jh.; Teut-olus 9. Jh., Hug-olus 11. Jh.; usw. - Da in romanischen Proparoxytonis die vorletzte Silbe die Neigung hat zu schwinden, so entwickelt sich Carolus ( ´- x - ` ) auch oft zu Carlus, Karlus.



                                                Hiermit sind wir an dem Punkte angelangt, wo wir uns mit der landläufigen Deutung des Rufnamens Karl auseinanderzusetzen haben. Es ist dies die - bisher wohl noch nie und von keiner Seite bezweifelte - Herleitung vom Gattungsworte "der Kerl". Dieses Gattungswort geht zurück auf germ. *kërla- (> ndl. kerel, mnd. kërle) "freier Mann nicht ritterlichen Standes". Dazu steht im Ablaut das germ. *karla- (> ahd. karal, mhd. karl) "Mann, Ehemann, Geliebter". Im Deutschen hat sich dann die ursprünglich mittel- und niederdeutsche Form "Kerl" durchgesetzt.



                                                Dieser auf germ. *kërla bzw. *karla- beruhende appellative Stamm war schon wegen seiner Bedeutung wenig geeignet, in den altgermanischen Rufnamenschatz aufgenommen zu werden. Ja, man darf getrost behaupten, daß dieser Stamm niemals und nirgends als Namenstamm verwendet worden ist (näheres s. u.). J. Lindemans weist mit Recht darauf hin, daß im Niederfränkischen einerseits "Kerl" nur als kërle, kerel erscheint, niemals als *karel, und daß anderseits der Rufname Karl nur mit "a" (Karel), niemals mit "e" begegnet. Gemeinwort und Eigenname sind hier also lautlich streng geschieden. Beide sind, wie wir gesehen haben, auch herkunftsmäßig ganz unverwandt. Zwischen den beiden besteht nur eine rein zufällige Lautähnlichkeit. Dies läßt sich schon aus der geschichtlichen und durchaus eigenartigen Verbreitung des Rufnamens Karl folgern."



                                                Greetings



                                                Manie


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