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Re: [gothic-l] Re: Introduction

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  • Madhukar Vichare
    Finns (phiha means angry but wicked man), who intro­duced a birch-tree sweetener for gum, have found that the habit of chewing sticky lumps dates back
    Message 1 of 30 , Jun 5, 2008
      (phiha means angry but wicked man), who intro­duced a birch-tree
      sweetener for gum, have found that the habit of chewing sticky lumps dates back
      thousands of years. Last month, students in west­ern Finland found a piece of Stone Age birch-bark tar, be­lieved
      to have been used for chewing and to fix broken ar­rowheads or clay dishes, ar­chaeologists
      said. "Most likely the lump was used as an antique kind of chewing
      gum," said Sami Vil­jamaa, an archaeologist who led the dig near Oulu, (Aulanam - Lake) north of Helsinki (helihi -the sun; sina – a period of “No Moon” night
      when the small part of Moon is visible at certain latitudes). "But its main pur­pose was to fix things."
      Vilja­maa said the piece of Neolith­ic gum was found among arti­facts in a
      Stone Age village at the Kierikki (Kairavaḥ - Moon-lit-Night) Stone Age Center. "It's somewhere between 5,500 and 6,000 years
      old," he said. The ancient Finnish habit of chewing gum surged in the
      1980s when scientists discov­ered that gum containing xyl­itol prevented tooth


      archaeolo­gists have found what they said could be the oldest hu­man footprint
      in history in the country's western desert, the Arab country's antiquities'
      chief said. "This could go back about two million years," said Zahi
      Hawass, the sec­retary general of the Egypt­ian supreme council of an­tiquities.
      "It could be the most im­portant discovery in Egypt," he said. Archaeologists found the footprint,
      imprinted on mud and then hardened into rock, while exploring a pre­historic
      site in Shiwa (Shiva in search of water for cooling down), a desert
      oasis. Scientists are using car­bon tests on plants found in the rock to
      determine its ex­act age, Hawass said. Khaled Saad, the direc­tor of prehistory
      at the council, said that based on the age of the rock where the footprint was
      found, it could date back even fur­ther than the renowned 3­million year-old
      fossil Lucy, the partial skeleton of an ape-man, found in Ethiopia in 1974. Most archaeological in­terest in Egypt is focused on the time of the pharaohs. Previously,
      the earliest human archaeological evi­dence from Egypt dated back around 200,000 years, Saad said.


      have highlighted my views of looking at the old concepts with new insights in
      view of the new knowledge: The subject of INDOLOGY will be meaningful.              Madhukar Vichare.


      JI wrote for the “Speaking Tree” (On Religion):


      or Taaraka) Brahma wants to eman­cipate living beings, but only those who want
      liberation get liberation. When you long for liberation, the search leads you
      to the Sadguru. Every one of us has a fixed role to play. You are a character
      in a divine drama. The composer of this drama is Taaraka Brahma. An episode in
      the Maha­bharata is instructive in this regard: After battle, the battle­ground
      at Kurukṣetra became a cremation ground. At the end of the war
      some people came there from the Kauravas' side. Among them were women and a few
      elderly men. Gandhaari, mother of the Kauravas, was also there. Kuntī, mother of the Pandavas, and Krushna, Pandavas'
      friend, were present as well, along with the visually challenged Dhrutarashtra.
      Everyone was weeping. Gandhaari had lost hundred sons in the war. Krushna
      approached Gandhaari and said: "Mother, why are you weeping? Death is a
      naturallay. One who is born will die. So why cry?" Gandhaari replied:
      "Yes Krushna, you have come here to console me, but I ask you, behind this
      great event whose mind was at work? Who was the author of this great plan? Was
      it not you?" Krushna replied: "Those who have committed injustice and
      sinned have been punished. What can I do about that?" Gandhaari said to Krushna:
      "Everything you have said up un­til now is quite correct. From the worldly
      point of view, everything that has happened until now is as it should be,
      because every action must have its reaction. But my point is: You yourself are
      Taaraka Brahma; your duty is to liberate living beings. You can give libera­tion
      to whomsoever you please.


      Taaraka Brahma you can create and destroy as you wish. In this drama of yours
      you have created characters who are honest, ideological people. If one does
      virtuous deeds then one gets liberation. To teach the people you create these
      kinds of characters. And you also create sinful charac­ters to show how much a
      person degenerates because of sinful behavior. In this drama, you could have
      had my hundred sons play roles of righteousness and the Pandavas play roles of
      unright­eousness, if you had so wished. In that case my hundred sons would have
      gotten salvation. Now, after having made me cry, you come to console me!" Taaraka
      Brahma for­mulates his plan in order to create situations that lend themselves
      to illustrating values, to create awareness. For instance, if one engages in
      honest work then one moves towards eternal truth, and if one performs dishonest
      work then one moves towards untruth. Thereafter comes the other part of the


      said: "Kṛṣṇa, give me permission to curse you". Krushna
      replied: "Okay, curse me. I give you permission". Gandhaari cursed
      him: "Just as my entire lineage has been destroyed before my very eyes,
      may your Yaadava lineage be destroyed before your very eyes as well".
      "Let it be so", Krushna replied. Remember always that we are only
      actors in a universal drama. This is not our real identity. Some­one may play
      the role of a king, but he might not even have two hand­fuls of rice in his
      house. Someone plays the role of a poor man, but in real life he may be very
      rich. We ought to remember that we are only playing specific roles in a cosmic
      drama. Act according to the role given. This is a person's duty. This is a
      wrong note to end the moral of the “Cosmic Drama” – Man must keep on bettering
      his lot; learning new things, and keeping himself fit to fight against the
      odds. He must use his intelligence and apply his mind. Krushna is not
      coming to salvage your soul; man has to come up to the expectation of the Super
      Personality of Godhead- it is symbolic, you have to become Krushna.


      is in Bolivia: On the edge of the world's biggest salt desert,
      villagers optimistical­ly scrawl "salt for sale" signs on their mud
      brick homes. In backyards, mountains of the stuff are heaped like year-­round
      snow drifts. But mining salt is no longer the only way to survive in this cold,
      arid corner of south­western Bolivia. The Salar de Uyuni is becoming a must-see for
      adventurous visitors to South
      America, changing at least
      some fortunes in the poor village of Colchani. "There's nothing here apart from salt... Tourists used to arrive
      and they wouldn't buy anything, so we thought, 'How can we improve
      things?" said Fermin Villca, who now sells ashtrays and llama fig­urines
      carved from salt stone. Stretched between distant Andean peaks like a shimmer­ing
      white carpet, the Salar de Uyuni is home to pink flamin­gos, 1,000-year-old
      cacti, rare hummingbirds and hotels built entirely from blocks of salt. Earlier
      this year, leading travel publisher Rough Guides listed the Salar as one of its
      top 25 wonders of the world, along side far better-known attrac­tions such as
      the Taj Mahal, Grand Canyon and Great
      Wall of China.


      gargantuan explosion ripped apart a star perhaps 150 times more mas­sive than
      our Sun in a rela­tively nearby galaxy in the most powerful and brightest
      supernova ever observed, as­tronomers said. And there is one such star in our
      own Milky Way galaxy that appears to be on the brink of dying in just
      such a super­nova. The exploding star's dra­matic death may have come in a rare
      type of supernova reserved for "freakishly mas­sive" stars that
      astronomers had speculated about but nev­er previously witnessed. The
      supernova, designat­ed as SN 2006gy, occurred 240 million light years
      away in a galaxy called NGC 1260, and was studied using observa­tions from NASA's
      orbiting Chandra X-ray Observatory as well as earthbound optical telescopes.. The
      explosion occurred long ago but was detected last year after its light traveled
      many trillions of kilometers before it could be observed from Earth. "That
      sounds far away but it's actually quite nearby on the vast scale of the uni­verse,"
      astronomer Nathan Smith of the University of California at Berkeley, who led the research, said. A supernova marks a star's
      death in a spectacular explosion. Scientists say these events playa crucial role
      in creating heavy ele­ments through nuclear fu­sion and synthesis and then
      expelling them into space, seeding the cosmos with metals.


      travel of Manu and the great Fish, a symbolic story of the Puraana, the event
      that occurred 10,000 BCE (ca): An
      event like the one involving Noah's ark is depicted in- almost every ­ ancient
      civilization or religion: Naunet in Egyptian; Manu in Hindu; Nuwa in Chinese;
      Ziusudra in Sumerian; Atra-Hasis, Utnapishtim and Xisuthrus in Babylonian;
      Deucalion in Greek; and Toptlipetlocali in Toltec. Noah is also mentioned often
      in the Qumran, referred to as the prophet ‘Nuh’. All the names are
      the corruption of original Sanskrit words used in Vedic rituals by the Āryans.


      many scientists, the evi­dence that moral reasoning is a result of physical
      traits that evolve along with everything else is just more evidence against
      the exis­tence of the soul, or of a God to imbue humans with souls. For
      many believers, particularly in the US, the findings show the er­ror, even wickedness, of
      viewing the world in strictly material terms. And they provide for the­ologians
      a growing impetus to rec­oncile the existence of the soul with the growing
      evidence that humans are not, physically or even mentally, in a class by
      themselves. The idea that human minds are the product of evolution is
      "unassailable fact," the journal Nature said this month in an ed­itorial
      on new findings on the physical basis of moral thought. A headline on the
      editorial drove the point home: "With all defer­ence to the sensibilities
      of reli­gious people, the idea that man was created in the image of God can
      surely be put aside." Or as V S Ramachandran, a brain scientist at the University of California, San Diego, said in an interview, there may be soul in the sense
      of "the universal spir­it of the cosmos," but the soul as it is
      usually spoken of, "an im­material spirit that occupies in­dividual brains
      and that only evolved in humans - all that is complete nonsense." Belief
      in that kind of soul "is basically super­stition," he said.


      was home to a number of Paleo-Eskimo cultures in prehistory, the latest of which disappeared around the year 200
      AD. The island seems to have been uninhabited for some eight centuries till
      Icelandic settlers led by Norwegian Erik the Red found the land when they
      arrived in 982 AD. They thrived here for 450 years, after which they
      mysteriously vanished.


      term tetra-pod, from the Greek 'tetrapoda,' (Sanskrit-“totra-vetram”- weapon of
      Viṣṇu- + pada means feet) refers to vertebrate animals
      having four feet, legs or leg-like appendages. Amphibians, lizards and mammals
      are all tetra-pods. The term auto-pod, however, is used to refer to animals
      whose limbs are subdivided into hands and feet, example: Humans.


      researchers therefore believe that the capability of building limbs with
      fingers and toes existed for a long period of time, but it took a set of
      environmental triggers to make use of that capability. "Animals in the
      Late Devonian period (385 to 359 million years ago) acquired limbs with fingers
      using this primitive design, largely because their ecosystem - the small
      streams that they lived in - was new," Shubin said "It had the tools,
      but it needed the opportuni­ty as well." In yet another study on what
      killed off the beasts of the Ice Age, researchers said that an extraterrestrial
      object with a three-mile girth might have ex­ploded over southern Canada nearly
      13,000 years ago, wiping out an ancient Stone Age culture as well as mega-fauna
      like mastodons and mammoths. The blast could be to blame for a ma­jor cold
      spell called the Younger Dryas that occurred at the end of the Pleistocene
      Epoch, a period of time spanning from about 1.8 million years ago to 11,500
      years ago. Research, presented at a meeting of the American Geophysical Union
      (AGU) in Acapulco, Mexico this week, could shed light on major questions about
      the mega-fauna extinction, the disappear­ance of the Clovis people, and an
      abrupt climate change, Live-science reported. "Based on the distribution
      of mate­rial, it looks like this impact probably occurred in southern Canada near the Great Lakes, over
      what at that time would have been a major glacier, the Laurentide ice
      sheet," said one of the presen­ters, Richard Firestone of Lawrence Berkeley
      National Laboratory. They couldn't find a distinct crater, suggesting the comet
      burst in the air rather than slamming into Earth. Even an airburst should leave
      its mark, so the scientists think the Laurentide Ice Sheet absorbed much of the


      huge flood hundreds of thou­sands of years ago cut Britain off from the rest of Europe and turned it into an
      island, according to a new study that of­fers clues to how England was settled.
      Using high-resolution sonar waves, researchers mapped the floor of the Eng­lish Channel and turned up images of an enormous valley tens of
      kilometers wide and up to 50 meters deep carved into chalk bedrock. The images
      were similar to an area in the state of Washington where a mega-flood some 15,000 years ago also created
      a landscape of distinctive land formations - indicating that the same thing
      happened in Britain, the re­searchers said. Scientists said the study
      provides the best evidence yet in the de­bate seeking to explain how the English Channel formed and cut Britain off from the rest of Europe.
      "It showed us for the first time the ex­istence of this huge valley in the
      centre of the English Channel," said Sanjeev Gupta, a researcher at Imperial
      College London.


      archaeologists using ground-penetrating radar have detected underground
      chambers they believe contain the remains of Emperor Ahuizotl, who ruled
      the Aztecs when Columbus landed in the Americas. Ahuizotl (ah-WEE-zoh-tuhl), an empire-builder who
      extended the Aztecs' reach as far as Guatemala, in South
      America, was the last
      emperor to complete his rule before the Spanish Conquest. Accounts written by
      Spanish priests suggest the said area was used by the Aztecs to cremate and
      bury their rulers. But no tomb of an Aztec ruler has ever been found. Now,
      archaeologists said that they have located what appears to be a
      Six-foot-by-six-foot entryway into a tomb about 15 feet below ground, off Mexico City's Zocalo plaza. The passage is filled with water,
      rocks and mud, forcing work­ers to dig delicately. Later this year, they hope
      to enter the inner chambers - a damp, low-ceilinged space - and discover the
      ashes of Ahuizotl, who was likely cremated on a funeral pyre in 1502. Because
      no Aztec royal tomb has ever been found, the archaeologists are literally
      digging into the unknown. Radar indicates the tomb has up to four chambers, and
      scientists think they will find a host of elaborate offerings to the gods on
      the floor. "He must have been buried in solemn ceremony with rich
      offerings, like vases and ornaments," said Luis Alberto Martos, director
      of archaeological studies at Mexico's National Institute of Anthropology and History.


      signs found so far point to Ahuizotl. The site lies direct­ly below a huge,
      recently discovered stone monolith carved with a representation of Tlaltecuhtli
      (tlahl-tay-KOO-tlee), the Aztec god of the earth. Depicted as a woman with huge
      claws, the fearsome Tlaltecuhtli was believed to devour the dead and then give
      them new life. In the claw of her right foot, the god holds a rabbit and 10
      dots, indicating the date "10 Rabbit" - 1502, the year of Ahuizotl's
      death. "Our hypothesis is precisely that this is probably the tomb of
      Ahuizotl," said Leonardo Lopez Lujan, the lead government archaeologist on
      the project. "Imagine it - this wasn't just any high-ranking man. The
      Aztecs were the most powerful society of their time," Martos said.
      "That's why Ahuizotl's tomb down there is so important."        


      Aztecs is a term used for the Mesoamerican peoples of Mexico that thrived before the advent of Christopher
      Columbus in the Americas. Aztec
      culture had rich and complex mythological and religious traditions. For
      Europeans, the most striking element of the Aztec culture was the practice of
      human sacrifice which was conducted throughout Mesoamerica prior to the Spanish conquest Greenland was home to a number of Paleo-Eskimo cultures in prehistory, the
      latest of which disappeared around the year 200 AD. The island seems to have
      been uninhabited for some eight centuries till Icelandic settlers led by
      Norwegian Erik the Red found the land when they arrived in 982 AD. They thrived
      here for 450 years, after which they mysteriously vanished. Archeologists have
      discovered what they think are ruins of an Aztec pyramid razed by vengeful
      Spanish conquerors in what is now one of Mexico City's most crime-ridden districts. Construction workers
      un­earthed ancient walls in the busy Iztapalapa neighbor­hood in June, and
      government archeologists said on Wednes­day that they believe they may be part
      of the main pyramid of the Aztec city, destroyed by conquistador Hernan Cortes
      in the 16th century.


      the Gothic Bible, 'þiudans' is used of a king who goes to war:

      aiþþau hvas þiudans gaggands stigqan wiþra anþarana þiudan (vipra praana-yukta pinda) du wiganna, niu
      gasitands faurþis þankeiþ, siaiu mahteigs miþ taihun þusundjom gamotjan þamma
      miþ twaim tigum þusundjo gaggandin ana sik?

      Or what king, going to make war against another king, sitteth not down first,
      and consulteth whether he be able with ten thousand to meet him that cometh
      against him with twenty thousand?

      Luke 14:31.

      'frauja' (Praanaaha) "lord"
      is also used with no Greek model for the noun in a military context (II Tim
      2:4). I'm not sure whether 'reiks' is used anywhere in an explicitly military

      I am not a linguist but as far as I know they were reiks also when leading a
      war expedition. Their sacral king, however, was never allowed to leave his own
      territory when the people was permanently settled, but had to order a reiks (Rushis
      –wandering Sages) to take command. During the wandering, according to Getica at
      least, the þiuðans was sacral king and he used 'kings of the army' to lead
      parts of the united army (like e.g. Cniva as Wolfram suggests) but I do not
      know their title in Gothic.


      The clue to the root of the
      hypothetical Gothic form though is in Old Norse 'ugla' and especially (Old) Swedish 'uggla'. These show a sound change common to North and East Germanic
      whereby 'ww' > 'ggw', as described by Wright. In Old Norse, the medial vowel
      of the suffix has been lost, which is normal, but presumably it would have been
      present in Gothic (compare 'mawilo'
      "little girl" San – mahilaa meaning a woman), and the 'w' has
      been dropped, as always between two consonants. So, I'd reconstruct Gothic
      *'uggwilo': weak noun, feminine on-stem, i.e. declined like 'mawilo', 'tuggo',
      etc. One last clue is the Catalan word 'òliba', (San. – Ulooka) which it's been suggested may be derived from the
      Gothic word for owl

      örn "eagle" (San. – utkrosha)

      Hellquist's Svensk etymologisk ordbok. 6 is especially interesting; both roots
      are attested in Gothic. This would make a very handy addition to our
      reconstructed "modern" vocabulary. There

      is a Gothic derivative from the same root as 2 recorded, namely 'ara' "eagle",
      cognate with Old Norse 'ari', but since ON had 'örn' (San. – “ara” one going with speed) there's no reason Gothic couldn't
      have had both words too.


      no need for embarrassment! I was just thinking of it as an exercise in phonetic
      reconstruction. In other words, what would a Gothic cognate of (word descended
      from the same Proto-Germanic

      ancestor as) Modern English 'wood' look like? But you're right 'triu' does mean
      "a tree" (San. – “taru” means
      tree also wood,) or "a stick". I guess that illustrates another issue
      in reconstruction: where a word already exists in the same semantic field, how
      might that have related to the meaning of a hypothetical, reconstructed Gothic
      cognate? Does that make sense?

      In this case, it seems that the better attested early Germanic languages did
      have a few partly overlapping words in this semantic field, e.g. Old Norse has a word 'viðr' which is
      cognate with 'wood', as well as a word 'tré' congate with English 'tree'.
      So there's nothing improbably about supposing Gothic had cognates for both,
      even though only one, 'triu', is recorded.

      gist is this: initial 'b' in English corresponds to Gothic 'b' (as in Go.
      'broþar' : Modern English 'brother' Sanskrit
      is “Bhaartru”)-- no catch there. I found a comparison chart but it didn't
      tell me what to do with initial B, medial TH, or final -M, let alone the
      morpheme -AM, so I'm a little lost right now.

      other Indo-European languages (e.g. Latin 2nd declension nouns ending
      in -um, Greek in -on, Sanskrit in -am).

      3rd person singular

      (he/she/it does/is doing smth) ends in –iþ for the verbs used in the story.
      "He's sleeping" is 'slepiþ' (from 'slepan' "to sleep" San. Root is “svap” - svapiti). The
      last sentence is in subjunctive, but you can have a simpler translation.


      Some vocabulary you need: early morning – air uhtwon clothes – wasti  (Sanskrit
      – Vastra) F.-jo (that is, feminine jo-stem) staff – hrugga F.-o to push –
      stigqan to get awake – gawaknan to climb up – ussteigan to look like – wisan
      galeiks (lit. "to be like") + noun in dative ("he's looking like
      A." is 'ist galeiks A.'). Don't forget to put the A. ("owl" in
      our case) in dative.


      is, "I take" is 'nima' (from
      'niman' "to take" Sanskrit word “nirgam” means get off, get away from
      – ni-sru). The 3rd person singular (he/she/it does/is doing smth) ends in
      –iþ for the verbs used in the story. "He's sleeping" is 'slepiþ'
      (from 'slepan' "to sleep"). The last sentence is in subjunctive, but
      you can have a simpler translation.

      morning – air uhtwon; Sanskrit – ushas;

      push – stigqan; Sanskrit – saahasin; to
      climb up – ussteigan, San. – upari gama;

      *kiggwan, OE cíowan, (San. –
      ‘charvanam”) ON tyggva? 6. däggdjur "mammal"

      you are through with your Aztec torment,
      unlike me. Everyone saying that Gothic is difficult should be immediately
      reminded of the existence of Nahuatl.
      A couple remarks. Ilnâmiqui is "to remember", right? Niquilnâmiqui –  þis (or þata) [ik] ga-man? Iirc 'cân' can be
      both directional and stative. I mean weren't it better to say 'þarei' with
      'ainshun ni gaswiltiþ' and 'manna sigis nimiþ'? Is it the 'îchân tônatiuh', the
      place? An interesting parallel between 'in yâômiqui' and einherjar...

      Suibhne geilt living on trees and perhaps also the Nahuatl (Aztec) word for "demon" (= Go. skohsl) –
      tlâcatecolôtl, lit. "man-owl", used in the Anales de Cuauhtitlan of
      the gods whom human sacrifices were due to.


      --- On Tue, 3/6/08, Fredrik <gadrauhts@...> wrote:
      From: Fredrik <gadrauhts@...>
      Subject: [gothic-l] Re: Introduction
      To: gothic-l@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Tuesday, 3 June, 2008, 8:05 PM

      It's always nice with presentations so we can know a little about

      each other but why not just write some words here?

      --- In gothic-l@yahoogroup s.com, Madhukar Vichare

      <madhukar_vichare@ ...> wrote:


      > Most of my groups encourage members to share a bit about

      themselves, so I hope

      > this is ok to post here.


      > I just setup a profile on Grouply where you can see my photos,


      > interests, and a list of my groups. You can see my profile and set

      up your own

      > here: http://www.grouply. com/register. php?

      tmg=260177&amp; vt=170949


      > Look forward to seeing your profile!


      > Madhukar


      > ============ ========

      > This message was posted by a fellow group member who uses Grouply

      instead of

      > email to access this group. Grouply blocks additional invitations

      from being

      > sent to this group by anyone for 30 days. Group owners can

      permanently block

      > future invitations using Grouply Owner Controls:

      > http://blog. grouply.com/ protect#prevent_ invites .




      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


      Bollywood, fun, friendship, sports and more. You name it, we have it on http://in.promos.yahoo.com/groups/bestofyahoo/

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