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Re: Question Series #1 - Identity and the Divine Spark

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  • elmoreb
    The divine spark, in my opinion, is like the Fathers stamp of approval. It allows us to take our place in the pleroma where we belong, instead of being held in
    Message 1 of 4 , Apr 9, 2004
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      The divine spark, in my opinion, is like the Fathers stamp of
      approval. It allows us to take our place in the pleroma where we
      belong, instead of being held in the hylic ( material) world along
      with any hell or heaven manifestations the creator god has cooked
      up. Basically, in orthodox terms, the "divine spark" is the "holy
      spirit." In none of the texts ive read does it mention that your
      individuality is lost at death. Can anyone explain this better? Im
      not very good at explanations.



      --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "mheinich" <mheinich@y...> wrote:
      > I am a real newbie when it comes to Gnostism. My knowledge is
      > limited to Ehrman, some beginning readings of the Gnostic
      scriptures
      > and the articles on www.gnosis.org. There have been some
      questions
      > that have been popping up for me with no apparent answers. I
      thought
      > I would share them with you in a series of posts. About one
      question
      > every day or every other day. Some of them may seem to be very
      > simple to you but to me, they leave a hole.
      >
      > Question #1
      > Where is my identity or my "true self" in the "divine spark"?
      >
      > In the orthodox view, it is our souls that are saved and our
      earthly
      > bodies are left behind. This implies that our mental and
      spiritual
      > identity, our sense of self continues on. I do not see this in
      the
      > desciptions of the spark. This seed of light starts to sound like
      > some sort of etheral organ that once I die, continues on. What
      makes
      > me, well, "me" is left behind. If what I am is left behind then
      what
      > is the point? And this may sound like a harsh way of putting it
      but
      > Why should "I" care? The seed may continue on but "I" died along
      > with the physical body.
      >
      > If reincarantion or the destruction of the "divine spark" happens
      > instead of entry into the "All", then how is my "awareness" going
      to
      > know this?
      >
      > It is described like another entity is living inside of me that I
      am
      > suppose to nuture and grow but will eventully replace Me.
    • Mike Leavitt
      Hello elmoreb ... The fruits of your experience and what you learn that are worth keeping become one with that divine spark, but your personality with all its
      Message 2 of 4 , Apr 10, 2004
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        Hello elmoreb

        On 04/10/04, you wrote:

        > The divine spark, in my opinion, is like the Fathers stamp of
        > approval. It allows us to take our place in the pleroma where we
        > belong, instead of being held in the hylic ( material) world along
        > with any hell or heaven manifestations the creator god has cooked
        > up. Basically, in orthodox terms, the "divine spark" is the "holy
        > spirit." In none of the texts ive read does it mention that your
        > individuality is lost at death. Can anyone explain this better? Im
        > not very good at explanations.

        The fruits of your experience and what you learn that are worth
        keeping become one with that divine spark, but your personality with
        all its foibles is lost, unless it has become a perfect reflection of
        the divine. Jesus personality probably remained intact, which is why
        he was able to resurrect (spiritually, not materially even according
        to Origin and Clement, BTW). I'll be lucky if 1/16th of it makes it
        through. :-)

        Regards
        --
        Mike Leavitt ac998@...
      • mheinich
        At first, I felt that my fears were justified after reading the two replies to my question. But further reflection showed me that some of these fears are
        Message 3 of 4 , Apr 12, 2004
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          At first, I felt that my fears were justified after reading the two
          replies to my question. But further reflection showed me that some
          of these fears are unrealistic and reflect my adversion to change.

          I feel my answer or partial answer can be summed up in this phrase:
          "To travel the path is to enter the crucible and come out changed on
          the other side."

          This is a play on Leto's statement to Stilgar at the end of Children
          of Dune which uses some heavy mystical messages. Specially near the
          end. But it suits my purpose.

          We are constantly changing. And following the path causes us to
          change in a particular manner. I will not be the same person a year
          from now(hopefully) though there will be memories and experiences
          (which I am not sure are good things to lose after physical death)
          but bad habits and traits need to be pushed aside or controlled since
          these can be barriers to continuing on to further enlightenment and
          salvation.


          --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "mheinich" <mheinich@y...> wrote:
          > I am a real newbie when it comes to Gnostism. My knowledge is
          > limited to Ehrman, some beginning readings of the Gnostic
          scriptures
          > and the articles on www.gnosis.org. There have been some questions
          > that have been popping up for me with no apparent answers. I
          thought
          > I would share them with you in a series of posts. About one
          question
          > every day or every other day. Some of them may seem to be very
          > simple to you but to me, they leave a hole.
          >
          > Question #1
          > Where is my identity or my "true self" in the "divine spark"?
          >
          > In the orthodox view, it is our souls that are saved and our
          earthly
          > bodies are left behind. This implies that our mental and
          spiritual
          > identity, our sense of self continues on. I do not see this in the
          > desciptions of the spark. This seed of light starts to sound like
          > some sort of etheral organ that once I die, continues on. What
          makes
          > me, well, "me" is left behind. If what I am is left behind then
          what
          > is the point? And this may sound like a harsh way of putting it
          but
          > Why should "I" care? The seed may continue on but "I" died along
          > with the physical body.
          >
          > If reincarantion or the destruction of the "divine spark" happens
          > instead of entry into the "All", then how is my "awareness" going
          to
          > know this?
          >
          > It is described like another entity is living inside of me that I
          am
          > suppose to nuture and grow but will eventully replace Me.
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