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Vanguards

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  • lady_caritas
    ... that ... that ... streams ... Jacob ... I ... bliss. ... as a reflection of God,... that would undoubtedly suggest abyss/bliss conflict. He influenced
    Message 1 of 4 , Feb 5, 2004
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      --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, Mike Leavitt <ac998@l...> wrote:
      > Hello lady_caritas
      >
      > On 04-Feb-04, you wrote:
      > > Caz, thank you, this is all interesting from a Quaker viewpoint.
      > > Many might find some similarities to Gnostics in that "there is
      that
      > > of God in everyone." There are some important differences, too,
      that
      > > I see. Probably the concept of God seems to be significant to me.
      > > The Gnostic "god" classically is beyond "godbeing," beyond what we
      > > perceive as "existence," and actually is an infinite and ineffable
      > > prime source.
      > >
      > > I found the following link interesting. It describes various
      streams
      > > of theology found in Quakerism. How would you describe a modern
      > > sense of God in Quakerism in comparison to the ineffable, infinite
      > > prime source in Gnosticism?
      >
      > This might depend on the background of the Quaker. Fox admired
      Jacob
      > Boehme, and the continental quakers actually look to him as their
      > founder. My grandmother came from a continental quaker background,
      > and told me when I got older to read him, if I wanted to understand
      > the deeper side of life. Boehme talks about the evil in God, and
      > darned if this doesn't sound Gnostic in tone. Of course he is still
      > one of my heros, but I can't read to much of him at one sitting, as
      I
      > just float off into....well sometimes the abyss, and sometimes
      bliss.
      >
      > Regards
      > --
      > Mike Leavitt ac998@l...


      :-) No doubt, Mike. Considering that Jakob Boehme viewed creation
      as a reflection of God,... that would undoubtedly suggest abyss/bliss
      conflict. He influenced other theologians and writers like William
      Blake and John Wesley. I admire some of these early vanguards in
      modern Christianity who pushed a few limits. Those more "deviating"
      Protestants like Boehme and Wesley even tweaked the theology of other
      Protestants of their day. Boehme, who emphasized inner spiritual
      life, was highly regarded by John Wesley, who required his preachers
      to study Boehme's writings. Immersed in Christian culture, they
      still didn't break loose from the tethers of sin/atonement theology
      though.

      Nonetheless, I suppose this same protesting spirit of mine growing up
      found a spark in some of their ideas. I remember learning about the
      Wesleyan "quadrilateral," four influences Wesley emphasized in
      formulating Christian views. These were: Scripture, Tradition,
      Reason, and Experience. Now, of course, Wesley used this system of
      checks and balances within the context of believing the Bible was
      authoritative.

      I continued the renegade tradition, did a bit of tweaking myself and
      applied reason and experience to explore traditions and scriptures
      outside the orthodox Christian fold, thereby eventually finding a
      more suitable, nonrestrictive milieu for my continuing experiences.
      Interesting the paths we travel...


      Cari
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