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Re: 7 Sermons to the Dead/Jung

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  • lady_caritas
    ... Hi, Ron. Yes, it certainly is that. Here are some interesting comments from an interview with Gilles Quispel (close friend of C. G. Jung) by Christopher
    Message 1 of 10 , Jul 3 7:53 AM
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      --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "ron3702" <barroter@a...> wrote:
      > Anyone here read this one? I'm at the moment plowing through this
      > dense piece of work. Quite a bit to digest it is.


      Hi, Ron. Yes, it certainly is that.

      Here are some interesting comments from an interview with Gilles
      Quispel (close friend of C. G. Jung) by Christopher Farmer (_Gnosis
      Magazine_ #1 Fall/Winter 1985, p. 29):

      Farmer: Whereas the ancient gnostics took the alternative of the
      Unknown Father seriously, Jung certainly did not.

      Quispel: Jung was not an atheist, so he did not, nor was he a pan-
      psychologist, but he did have a very personal concept of God. As he
      would say to his friends: "I can't express myself," although he did
      once in the _Septem Sermones ad Mortuos_ (1916). And you will see
      him, in all his later works, trying to formulate what he had
      experienced then, in 1915, in a scholarly way. But he was furious,
      for example, when Martin Buber identified him with the gnostics,
      because he thought that his purpose and experience was different.
      And I think he was right. For him, light and darkness and that whole
      grim oceanic feeling which man has come from, is a real issue: making
      light out of darkness—the alchemical process.
    • Wayne
      ... The Magic of the alchemical process is not to make light out of the Darkness it is to separate the Light from, out of, the Darkness. Alchemy, the Process
      Message 2 of 10 , Jul 3 12:28 PM
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        --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, lady_caritas <no_reply@y...>
        wrote:
        > real issue: making light out of darkness—the alchemical process.


        The Magic of the alchemical process is not to make light out of the
        Darkness it is to separate the Light from, out of, the Darkness.

        Alchemy, the Process of Enlightenment, the ability to see, recognize,
        Realities that are not readily apparent, Dark Matter.

        When you separated the Light from, out of, the Darkness, your are
        bringing to light a Reality that is not Readily apparent to the
        Senses, can not be seen in the ordinary light of Reality, the Light
        of Day.

        By the Light of the Silvery Moon.---------->O
      • Mike Leavitt
        Hello lady_caritas ... Chris is an old friend of mine, and I forwarded this message to him. Hope you don t mind lady_caritas.  Of course being identified as a
        Message 3 of 10 , Jul 3 6:17 PM
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          Hello lady_caritas

          On 03-Jul-03, you wrote:

          > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "ron3702" <barroter@a...> wrote:
          >> Anyone here read this one? I'm at the moment plowing through this
          >> dense piece of work. Quite a bit to digest it is.
          >
          >
          > Hi, Ron. Yes, it certainly is that.
          >
          > Here are some interesting comments from an interview with Gilles
          > Quispel (close friend of C. G. Jung) by Christopher Farmer (_Gnosis
          > Magazine_ #1 Fall/Winter 1985, p. 29):
          >
          > Farmer: Whereas the ancient gnostics took the alternative of the
          > Unknown Father seriously, Jung certainly did not.
          >
          > Quispel: Jung was not an atheist, so he did not, nor was he a pan-
          > psychologist, but he did have a very personal concept of God. As he
          > would say to his friends: "I can't express myself," although he did
          > once in the _Septem Sermones ad Mortuos_ (1916). And you will see
          > him, in all his later works, trying to formulate what he had
          > experienced then, in 1915, in a scholarly way. But he was furious,
          > for example, when Martin Buber identified him with the gnostics,
          > because he thought that his purpose and experience was different.
          > And I think he was right. For him, light and darkness and that whole
          > grim oceanic feeling which man has come from, is a real issue:
          > making light out of darkness the alchemical process.

          Chris is an old friend of mine, and I forwarded this message to him.
          Hope you don't mind lady_caritas.  Of course being identified as a
          Gnostic could have had very negative consequences for Jung in that
          day and age, though I think he was more alchemist than gnostic
          anyway. Now Quispel was really a gnostic, whether he admitted it
          publicly or not. A couple of short conversations with him at the
          Panarion Conference at Mt. St. Mary's in the '70s convinced me of
          that. And Scholem was really a Qabalist too, and very personable,
          though he never admitted that publicly either.

          Regards
          --
          Mike Leavitt ac998@...
        • lady_caritas
          ... this ... (_Gnosis ... he ... did ... whole ... him. ...   Oh, not at all, Mike. My goodness, you know a lot of people. ;-) Feel free to share with us
          Message 4 of 10 , Jul 4 6:48 AM
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            --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, Mike Leavitt <ac998@l...> wrote:
            > Hello lady_caritas
            >
            > On 03-Jul-03, you wrote:
            >
            > > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "ron3702" <barroter@a...>
            wrote:
            > >> Anyone here read this one? I'm at the moment plowing through
            this
            > >> dense piece of work. Quite a bit to digest it is.
            > >
            > >
            > > Hi, Ron. Yes, it certainly is that.
            > >
            > > Here are some interesting comments from an interview with Gilles
            > > Quispel (close friend of C. G. Jung) by Christopher Farmer
            (_Gnosis
            > > Magazine_ #1 Fall/Winter 1985, p. 29):
            > >
            > > Farmer: Whereas the ancient gnostics took the alternative of the
            > > Unknown Father seriously, Jung certainly did not.
            > >
            > > Quispel: Jung was not an atheist, so he did not, nor was he a pan-
            > > psychologist, but he did have a very personal concept of God. As
            he
            > > would say to his friends: "I can't express myself," although he
            did
            > > once in the _Septem Sermones ad Mortuos_ (1916). And you will see
            > > him, in all his later works, trying to formulate what he had
            > > experienced then, in 1915, in a scholarly way. But he was furious,
            > > for example, when Martin Buber identified him with the gnostics,
            > > because he thought that his purpose and experience was different.
            > > And I think he was right. For him, light and darkness and that
            whole
            > > grim oceanic feeling which man has come from, is a real issue:
            > > making light out of darkness the alchemical process.
            >
            > Chris is an old friend of mine, and I forwarded this message to
            him.
            > Hope you don't mind lady_caritas.
             

            Oh, not at all, Mike. My goodness, you know a lot of people. ;-)
            Feel free to share with us anecdotes of interest anytime you'd like.



            > Of course being identified as a
            > Gnostic could have had very negative consequences for Jung in that
            > day and age, though I think he was more alchemist than gnostic
            > anyway. Now Quispel was really a gnostic, whether he admitted it
            > publicly or not. A couple of short conversations with him at the
            > Panarion Conference at Mt. St. Mary's in the '70s convinced me of
            > that. And Scholem was really a Qabalist too, and very personable,
            > though he never admitted that publicly either.
            >
            > Regards
            > --
            > Mike Leavitt ac998@l...


            I would imagine there might always be some negative consequences in
            personal and professional relationships when admitting to gnostic
            views outside the mainstream. And the degree to which this happens
            can vary depending on the social and political climate. I have to
            give all these men that you mention credit for finding ways of
            communicating what was important to them for the benefit of other
            humans without completely destroying their professional credibility.


            Cari
          • lady_caritas
            ... recognize, ... Hi, Wayne. I don t know if you ve seen this article by Stephan Hoeller, C. G. Jung and the Alchemical Renewal. It originally appeared in
            Message 5 of 10 , Jul 4 7:04 AM
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              --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne" <waynel@i...> wrote:
              > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, lady_caritas <no_reply@y...>
              > wrote:
              > > real issue: making light out of darkness—the alchemical process.
              >
              >
              > The Magic of the alchemical process is not to make light out of the
              > Darkness it is to separate the Light from, out of, the Darkness.
              >
              > Alchemy, the Process of Enlightenment, the ability to see,
              recognize,
              > Realities that are not readily apparent, Dark Matter.
              >
              > When you separated the Light from, out of, the Darkness, your are
              > bringing to light a Reality that is not Readily apparent to the
              > Senses, can not be seen in the ordinary light of Reality, the Light
              > of Day.
              >
              > By the Light of the Silvery Moon.---------->O


              Hi, Wayne. I don't know if you've seen this article by Stephan
              Hoeller, "C. G. Jung and the Alchemical Renewal." It originally
              appeared in _Gnosis Magazine_, Vol. 8, Summer 1988 and is now
              available online. The essay goes into more depth regarding Jung's
              alchemical vision.

              http://gnosis.org/jung_alchemy.htm


              Cari
            • Mike Leavitt
              Hello lady_caritas ... I just saved that one out as a text file from my browser, and dumped it into my wordprocessor and printed it to read at my leisure. It
              Message 6 of 10 , Jul 4 3:21 PM
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                Hello lady_caritas

                On 04-Jul-03, you wrote:

                > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "Wayne" <waynel@i...> wrote:
                >> --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, lady_caritas <no_reply@y...>
                >> wrote:
                >>> real issue: making light out of darkness—the alchemical process.
                >>
                >>
                >> The Magic of the alchemical process is not to make light out of the
                >> Darkness it is to separate the Light from, out of, the Darkness.
                >>
                >> Alchemy, the Process of Enlightenment, the ability to see,
                > recognize,
                >> Realities that are not readily apparent, Dark Matter.
                >>
                >> When you separated the Light from, out of, the Darkness, your are
                >> bringing to light a Reality that is not Readily apparent to the
                >> Senses, can not be seen in the ordinary light of Reality, the Light
                >> of Day.
                >>
                >> By the Light of the Silvery Moon.---------->O
                >
                >
                > Hi, Wayne. I don't know if you've seen this article by Stephan
                > Hoeller, "C. G. Jung and the Alchemical Renewal." It originally
                > appeared in _Gnosis Magazine_, Vol. 8, Summer 1988 and is now
                > available online. The essay goes into more depth regarding Jung's
                > alchemical vision.
                >
                > http://gnosis.org/jung_alchemy.htm

                I just saved that one out as a text file from my browser, and dumped
                it into my wordprocessor and printed it to read at my leisure. It is
                pretty long. :-) I have to explore our (Gnostic Sciety's) website
                more, there is so much one it. Thanks for the link to that one.

                Regards
                --
                Mike Leavitt ac998@...
              • Wayne
                ... thank you, I have not seen article, I will read it.
                Message 7 of 10 , Jul 6 3:13 PM
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                  --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, lady_caritas <no_reply@y...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi, Wayne. I don't know if you've seen this article by Stephan
                  > Hoeller, "C. G. Jung and the Alchemical Renewal." It originally
                  > appeared in _Gnosis Magazine_, Vol. 8, Summer 1988 and is now
                  > available online. The essay goes into more depth regarding Jung's
                  > alchemical vision.
                  >
                  > http://gnosis.org/jung_alchemy.htm
                  >
                  >
                  > Cari

                  thank you, I have not seen article, I will read it.
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